Camden McGowen Station & Midtown Park At 2727 Travis St.

[TGM]

homeless people are human beings too are you God to say you're above another human being?

I said they are my best customers. I'll leave their biological classification to field anthropologists.

[DrLan34]

One place where mixed use would work is along Main Street next to what will be Midtown's biggest and most central park. There are thousands of residential units nearby, rail access, easy car access, and even some employers around. Having retail on the "superblock" makes a lot more sense then adding retail to High Street in my opinion.

Edit

Edited November 16, 2012 by DrLan34

[TxDave]

It would be nice if there was retail in the adjacent apartment building, but that’s not absolutely necessary for this park to anchor a mixed use area.

For a park this size and stature, it seems that it would also work to have visible retail nearby with easy pedestrian access.

Having the park in place at all will be a huge amenity for this area, and the people who will benefit the most will likely be willing to use any services that are nearby.

[Howard Huge]

Maybe im missing something but, in the video, Deborah Wrigley said "its not just apartments, its restaurants and retail as well...."

So then it WILL be mixed use?

[DrLan34]

http://www.bizjourna...ther-plans.html

"But with the local development environment now in an upswing, Camden Property Trust (NYSE: CPT) and Midtown Development Authority are finally working out plans to break ground on the Midtown Superblock property in the third quarter of 2013."

"Initial plans for the park include 8,500 square feet of retail, with 250 underground parking spaces to support those businesses. Thibodeaux said groundbreaking plans will likely begin to roll out in March."

Edited January 9, 2013 by DrLan34

[Joke]

Awesome, looking forward to the park. However, Midtown is losing its best spot for throwing around an Aerobie.

[Howard Huge]

Wow. No retail under the most significant apartments on the most significant block in midtown directly on the light rail line. Epic failure.

This goes against EVERYTHING we are trying to accomplish in midtown, everything that post midtown HAS accomplished along west gray, everything the light rail was supposed to support, EVERYTHING, IT GOES AGAINST EVERYTHING.

Is it awesome theyre building something instead of leaving a gigantic empty block in midtown? Sure.

Is it what we envisioned and the best use of the superblock and up to its full potential? **** no.

If there is a way to to get at Ric Campo, email him to death, make a stink about this, do SOMETHING, we cant just accept this without a fight.

How many friggin parks do we need for christs sake?! The original project had this ENTIRE BLOCK full of apartments, then in typical houston fashion, the project is scaled back by 50% and the retail component is scrapped. Oh right, theirs gonna be "retail" in the park. Yea, like the "retail" at disco green, so cutting edge.

Son, I am disappoint.

/rant. For now.

[Pleak]

Wow. No retail under the most significant apartments on the most significant block in midtown directly on the light rail line. Epic failure.

This goes against EVERYTHING we are trying to accomplish in midtown, everything that post midtown HAS accomplished along west gray, everything the light rail was supposed to support, EVERYTHING, IT GOES AGAINST EVERYTHING.

Is it awesome theyre building something instead of leaving a gigantic empty block in midtown? Sure.

Is it what we envisioned and the best use of the superblock and up to its full potential? **** no.

If there is a way to to get at Ric Campo, email him to death, make a stink about this, do SOMETHING, we cant just accept this without a fight.

How many friggin parks do we need for christs sake?! The original project had this ENTIRE BLOCK full of apartments, then in typical houston fashion, the project is scaled back by 50% and the retail component is scrapped. Oh right, theirs gonna be "retail" in the park. Yea, like the "retail" at disco green, so cutting edge.

Son, I am disappoint.

/rant. For now.

Easy two-step processt to fix this.

1. Contact Camden. Use your millions to offer to buy the property from them so they make enough return on their investment that they are satisfied to move on.
   
2. Develop it with all the ground floor retail and complete lack of park space to your heart's content.
   

Voila - you have your dream!

Oh - wait. You don't have millions and you're not a developer? So you are just whining on an internet board about how somebody else is spending their own money?

Never mind. I thought I was replying to a useful post.

[rci2145]

Anyone expecting this park to be much more than a hangout for bums is going to be disappointed. I live in Midtown and I can see no reason for ever going to the Superblock park. Almost everything near the light rail faces substantial challenges because in that area, the rail is merely a homeless transportation system from Midtown to downtown. I know because I used to ride it into downtown every morning and was the only one that ever paid to ride it. They should tear up the tracks and leave the Med Center section.

[infinite_jim]

The park itself will have some retail/restaurant commerical element in addition to a parking garage. Why directly compete against the Post's commercial area? Further, why compete against downtown retail? We need LESS retail and more residential NOW. Retail will follow. For about 8 out of 12 months, most people would not walk from the Superblock to the Post area anyways. Not to mention the area around McGowen already has some nice bars and restaurants despite the homeless and assorted "others."

Edited January 18, 2013 by infinite_jim

[rci2145]

My post was overly negative and dramatic. (As was the one before mine!) There are a few cool places in that area. But I don't blame developers for being skittish. Greyhound station + light rail = nightmare for businesses in that area. When I envision a park there, I just can't imagine it as a real option for people to want to use it. Maybe they should just turn it into a massive dog park.

[Houston19514]

My post was overly negative and dramatic. (As was the one before mine!) There are a few cool places in that area. But I don't blame developers for being skittish. Greyhound station + light rail = nightmare for businesses in that area. When I envision a park there, I just can't imagine it as a real option for people to want to use it. Maybe they should just turn it into a massive dog park.

Still overly negative and dramatic ;-)

[Houston19514]

Wow. No retail under the most significant apartments on the most significant block in midtown directly on the light rail line. Epic failure.

This goes against EVERYTHING we are trying to accomplish in midtown, everything that post midtown HAS accomplished along west gray, everything the light rail was supposed to support, EVERYTHING, IT GOES AGAINST EVERYTHING.

Is it awesome theyre building something instead of leaving a gigantic empty block in midtown? Sure.

Is it what we envisioned and the best use of the superblock and up to its full potential? **** no.

If there is a way to to get at Ric Campo, email him to death, make a stink about this, do SOMETHING, we cant just accept this without a fight.

How many friggin parks do we need for christs sake?! The original project had this ENTIRE BLOCK full of apartments, then in typical houston fashion, the project is scaled back by 50% and the retail component is scrapped. Oh right, theirs gonna be "retail" in the park. Yea, like the "retail" at disco green, so cutting edge.

Son, I am disappoint.

/rant. For now.

Do we actually know that Camden's apartment development will not include any retail?

[kbates2]

I was at a breakfast where Campo was the speaker. He said that mixed use is not in Camden's strategy in Houston. He said it didn't work in Houston and they had no plans to try.

This was a little over a year ago though.

[KinkaidAlum]

Yeah, parks are a terrible idea and never attract development.

Regards,

Discovery Green Park

Go read that thread. 75% of posters said it would be a massive failure... it would be a waste of money... it would become a Bum Alley Hilton...nobody would ever use it...blah, blah, blah.

[rci2145]

This park seems nothing like Discovery Green. It's a lot more like the bum hangout on Gray across from Buffalo Wild Wings except that the Superblock location is much worse.

[Houston19514]

This park seems nothing like Discovery Green. It's a lot more like the bum hangout on Gray across from Buffalo Wild Wings except that the Superblock location is much worse.

That's exactly the sort of thing that was said about Discovery Green prior to its opening.

Furthermore, with regard to your concern of it becoming a bum hangout, this park will be a lot more like Discovery Green than the "bum hangout on Gray".

This park is proposed to have programming (like Discovery Green and unilke your "bum hangout"), and restaurant/retail (like Discovery Green and unlike your "bum hangout").

Bums do not tend to hang out in parks that have programming and retail/ restaurant space.

Edited January 18, 2013 by Houston19514

[samagon]

That's exactly the sort of thing that was said about Discovery Green prior to its opening.

Furthermore, with regard to your concern of it becoming a bum hangout, this park will be a lot more like Discovery Green than the "bum hangout on Gray".

This park is proposed to have programming (like Discovery Green and unilke your "bum hangout"), and restaurant/retail (like Discovery Green and unlike your "bum hangout").

Bums do not tend to hang out in parks that have programming and retail/ restaurant space.

It's not the programming or the retail/restaurant space that keeps the bums out, it's the private security guards that rove around that keep the people they don't want to be there from being there.

I have a feeling if there wasn't the strong presence of security guards there'd be people camped out on park benches and asking for money.

[barracuda]

I think the best defense against becoming a "bum hangout" is for the park to be actively and frequently used. I've noticed the occasional bum or two at many inner-loop parks (Baldwin Park, Hermann, Eleanor Tinsley, White Oak/Stude, etc.), but these parks are all fairly active, and I wouldn't consider them bum hangouts.

I find bums to be less of an inconvenience than groups of people who walk side-by-side and block 90% of the sidewalk, even when others are trying to get by. I bet there will be more of those people using this park than bums.

[infinite_jim]

People who are scared of bums don't have Jesus in their life.

[Slick Vik]

Parks have nothing to do with retail, it's a walkable green space, which is always a good thing.

[kbates2]

People who are scared of bums don't have Jesus in their life.

Did the Randall's employee who was forced to play tag with a bum holding a knife the other day not have Jesus in his life?

I got scared the other day when a pissing bum yelled at me that he would kill me, but that was because I didn't want to have bum aids in my life. That is one of the worst kinds of aids.

[rci2145]

A friend of mine got mugged at Randall's 3 years ago, I guess she didn't have enough Jesus. Personally, Im not scare of bums. But I chose to buy a home in this neighborhood and I have no problem saying that less is better, in every possible way.

[infinite_jim]

Did the Randall's employee who was forced to play tag with a bum holding a knife the other day not have Jesus in his life?

I got scared the other day when a pissing bum yelled at me that he would kill me, but that was because I didn't want to have bum aids in my life. That is one of the worst kinds of aids.

Oh your going to willfully be ignorant of what really happened there eh? Hint: the employee had it coming to him when he followed the bum to engage him after he was shoe'd off of the property. Why? B/c the bum said something about his mommy!

LOL

[infinite_jim]

A friend of mine got mugged at Randall's 3 years ago, I guess she didn't have enough Jesus. Personally, Im not scare of bums. But I chose to buy a home in this neighborhood and I have no problem saying that less is better, in every possible way.

Bums = Muggers?

Now that I've got your IP, I'll know who to send the bums to.

[rci2145]

Too late, my house was already broken into this year while my girlfriend and I were sleeping. Stole a bunch of things and smeared blood on my couches. But it's nice to know you are lurking the interwebs defending the bums of Midtown. How righteous you are InfiniteJim.

[infinite_jim]

Well, your GF and you sound like you're ok and it's just stuff. Most burglars are not homeless and have good, reliable transportation.

BTW I've befriended a few homeless folks in the neighborhood over the years, that's not self-righteous that's defending my friends from unwarranted demonizing.

Let's not forget this park is on private land. Fears of bums taking over (as is the actually case with Butte park) are way overblown.

[Purdueenginerd]

Too late, my house was already broken into this year while my girlfriend and I were sleeping. Stole a bunch of things and smeared blood on my couches. But it's nice to know you are lurking the interwebs defending the bums of Midtown. How righteous you are InfiniteJim.

 

Thats awful to hear. Glad youre okay.

 

The only crime Ive experienced in Midtown was my Yakima Roof Rack (for bikes) was crowbared off the top of my car and stolen. Middle of a Sunday. The thing had 5 locks too... I was pissed! 

 

Speaking of which, if anyone hears/sees anything in regards to this... let me know.  That thing was 700 bucks. 

[arrodiii]

I find bums to be less of an inconvenience than groups of people who walk side-by-side and block 90% of the sidewalk, even when others are trying to get by. I bet there will be more of those people using this park than bums.

 

This is so true - especially on the weekends at DG when I am trying to walk my dog. 

[MidtownMan]

Houston Met Dance company has started to renovate its new location:

 

http://www.houstonmetdance.org/2012-2013-patron-packages

 

This will be a great addition to Caroline street and with the new complete street redo; both will make the street safer and less crowded with homeless people.