islandofmind

Yeah it doesn't really go into detail on what the tracks would be made out of, or the trains them selves.  The whole design hinges on the trains needing to be light weight I suspect

I went to the site and read their assumptions about structure and assembly and such. They're living on Fantasy Island. As shown, this wouldn't resist a gentle breeze much less a loaded car - even one made of an ultralight material would still have the load of the people inside. Looks like a 2nd year student design project. Conceptually interesting in any case.

Structure is impossibly lightweight. Unless this was designed for a new city on the moon. Maybe the cars are made of paper? Gravity spoils everything!

To clarify, the line to the Northwest Transit Center that was included in the vote was the Uptown Line.  Yes, it did technically connect downtown by rail to the Northwest Transit Center, but it would be a long ride.  Uptown Line to University Line to Red Line.

 

This would be a tortured route to downtown assuming a mode change BRT/Rail and a couple of other line transfers. Long ride indeed.

This is true, to the fact that at least as a few years ago, the Baytown Best Buy stores deliberately put iPods and other consumer electronics close to the front because they're often visited by international visitors who spend their limited shore time buying consumer electronics that are substantially more expensive elsewhere. But HSR stations aren't international, they connect with Dallas, unless you consider Dallas to be another country.

 

I'm pretty sure that some of the "The station should be downtown" sentiment stems from the fact that Dallas has theirs downtown, but besides things like access and all, it still wouldn't work in Houston's favor because the downtowns aren't comparable. Instead of comparing Downtown to Uptown, if we compared the Dallas Downtown to Houston Downtown, it's not a contest. Dallas Downtown has museums, performing arts spaces, actual shopping (Neiman Marcus, at least), American history (Dealey Plaza), and a farmer's market, all within reasonable walking distance. Houston's downtown has a bunch of skyscrapers, some bars, the tunnels (one of my favorite things about Houston's downtown, personally, but shut after 3 pm and on weekends), performing arts spaces, and a bunch of often-empty stadiums surrounded by parking lots. That's not to say Dallas is better than Houston (we are not getting into that) but downtown to downtown, no contest...a downtown Houston station could still come across as inferior.

 

That's why I think that the NW Mall/Uptown connection is a better bet overall. Change the playing field and don't compete directly.

This issue is transportation. Uptown is as connected as it can be assuming the BRT is completed.

The lack of a connection to Downtown is the problem.

Aside from that, your assessment of the amenities available in Downtown Houston is lacking but those have already been enumerated ad nauseam.

I love the vision.. I agree it would make for a pedestrian paradise, and I'm normally all for rail, but Washington Ave is the only through corridor between Memorial Drive and i10. Thats the width of almost a mile. If you look at downtown/the streets stretching through downtown/midtown you'll see that there are at least 4 other 3-4 lane streets going in either direction within a few blocks that you have the option of taking instead of having to traverse that 2 lane span of Main St. Washington Ave is only 4 lanes wide, and they can get pretty narrow with no room for expansion. If we could figure out a way that to re-route the traffic to other roads then i agree Washington Ave makes the most sense for a straight shot from downtown to the area of the TCR station, and rail would have all sorts of additional benefits for pedestrians/urbanization. I envisioned a downtown connector being commuter esque rail though. Light rail along Washington Ave would be painfully slow after hopping off the HSR train.

So a commuter line along the tracks North of Center St? That could be interesting. I'm not sure I see how that serves the needs of the local neighborhoods of the future if there aren't many places to get on board. I guess by Commuter esque you mean some sort of hybrid.

Also, the speed into downtown doesn't seem all that slow if I consider the length of time on the Red Line between say Hermann Park and Downtown. There are quite a few stops but they don't last very long. Relative to 200 mph? Well yeah.

I need to study the map with more care in order to understand the obstacles and possible routes you're suggesting, the removal of the Pierce elevated opens up a wealth of opportunity at the East end of the route but navigating through the Rice Military area and points further along the way needs a lot of study.

Why has this turned into a Downtown v. Uptown topic? 

It's hasn't. Or at least I agree that it shouldn't have.

Since there is a declared preference by Texas Central for a station at/near NW Transit Center, there (probably) will be a connection to Uptown via the BRT. So that connection is done - in theory at least.

Is this sufficient? I think not. There needs to be an efficient high volume link to the rail system which is centered downtown. The arguments have been about whether or not the Galleria area is suitable as the primary endpoint for a rail line that is designed to bring large volumes of people into town. I've outlined my opinions as to why I believe it would be less than ideal.

What is up with this ridiculous competition between the Galleria and Downtown.  Comparisons are fine, but so many of the statements being made in this thread are frankly so ignorant as to not even pass the straight face test.  What is the driving the impulse of posters to make such over-the-top statements in support of their preferred city center?  For goodness sake, it's all central Houston. 

 

Every one of Houston's international visitors stays in the Galleria area?  How can one type that, post it, and expect to be taken seriously?

 

Suggesting the Galleria is dying because all malls are dying?  Equally ignorant and ridiculous (but that was Slick Vic's post and I doubt many people have taken him seriously for a very long time).

 

"There is very little fun to do downtown, especially after dark"?  Only if your only fun consists of shopping. What, pray tell, do all of these international visitors do after dark (and after the mall closes) in the Galleria, that they could not do downtown?

 

"Don't see [the Galleria] thriving like it did when I was a kid"?  Equally ridiculous.  I don't know when you were a kid, IslandofMind, but it's hard to see any evidence that the Galleria not thriving better than ever.  Brand new, larger Saks Fifth Avenue under construction, and pretty steady announcements of new retailers.

So the point of the thread is the question of where to put the station. But now that the station is generally located - it appears that the more important question is where to put the passengers. I think people will come for Conventions, Sports, Concerts, Business and Medical Treatments. They could come in volumes of 400 at a time and as many as 68 times each day. Our most car-centric neighborhood is not the place for every one of them to go - that would be a nightmare in my opinion.

In a broad sense Galleria and Downtown are components of a larger City Center, I agree, but there's no question in my mind, that the appropriate destination for rail passengers is Downtown. Reason: Facilities, Transportation network connecting efficiently to said facilities. Uptown is a wonderful place but it lacks much by comparison and the traffic is horrendous with very little relief in sight. In any event Uptown will by proximity, be linked to the HSR - the problem is that Downtown will not.

Personally I love the Galleria but it definitely is not what it once was. I've been witness to it's growth since it opened.

It is curious that Saks is expanding - I presume that their new store will be even more vacuous than their present one. Of course in the cannibalistic business of retail it helps a lot that The Galleria is the biggest cannibal in town but I don't view that as evidence that it's thriving. I've noticed that every time a new retailer is heralded with blaring trumpets, another former retailer is slinking out the back door with very little fanfare. So it may be hard to see the evidence but it's nearly impossible if you're not observant. 

OK, so they did have a single event.

Another thing about the Galleria, it's convenient for foreign visitors who are here for work. If the company they work for has offices Uptown - many do - they stay at hotels near the Galleria. There's not a lot of other stuff to get into around here. You eat, shop and walk around the mall. I work for an engineering firm and I see it all the time.

What about nightclubs?

or the Theater, Opera, Ballet?

or a Concert, Soccer Match, Baseball? Basketball?

Hell the Galleria doesn't even have a Movie theater.

I met a lady from Amman Jordan, where? Downtown. She came for a convention, quilting. Also met several people from Scotland and one from South Africa. None of them hated Downtown but I was embarrassed at the state of our pedestrian infrastructure, it really needs work.

You are so funny, Slick. The Galleria isn't going to close any time soon. It's a tourist destination, and extremely popular. It's also a whole lot more fun than Downtown, and will remain so for some time to come.

 

Well, I work at the Williams Tower and I go to the Galleria very frequently. I really don't see it thriving like it did when I was a kid. It's true that it's very popular with overseas visitors which is great but to call it "extremely popular" is a little bit of a stretch and would be news to many of the merchants there.

On the other hand, My girl and I like to do staycations downtown from time to time and that can be a very busy place. Our last two trips are good examples. One was the night of an Astros vs Rangers series game during a pennant race. There was a concert at the Toyota Center the same night. Discovery Green was busy with activity and the clubs and restaurants were busy if not packed.

The other night was during the Quilting Convention at GRB , I don't even remember what all else was happening but again there was a lot of activity in spite of the rain that washed out an Arts Fair on Discovery Green.

My Point: We've built the majority of our major facilities along a line from Downtown through the Med Center, It includes all four major sports facilities, the Rodeo, Convention Center, Concert venues, and a large share of the hotel and office markets. All anecdotes aside, the Galleria does not outweigh that and once you've been there a few times - it's not all that much fun either.

No rail down Washington!! We've seen what it did to Main St in downtown. There is no major parallel artery to redirect vehicular traffic here like there was on every other street downtown.. Not to mention how many stops would surely be on that line and how long it would take to get from the TCR station to downtown. Either bring rail down to Memorial Drive and over into downtown, follow the Hempstead rail line into downtown, or follow i10. But please, not down Washington.

Washington Ave. definitely needs work. As popular as it's become as a club scene, it's a nightmare for pedestrians. Some urban design work that reduces the number of cars and allows some urbanity to flourish would be very welcome in my opinion. Nothing changes without some pain but the results can be wonderful. Denser housing is going to happen, if we can simultaneously promote the idea of living without a car and using transit and bicycles, at least the place won't be stacked up with cars both moving and parked. I think the Light Rail contributes positively to that vision.

I think the NW Mall site or the transit center both work provided there is a light rail line along Washington Ave. to connect passengers to downtown and the rest of the Metro rail system. If it's at the Mall then they'll also need a connection to the BRT at the transit center. If these guys are prepared to build an iconic station that straddles an interstate highway in Dallas, they should have no objections to making significant contributions to getting their passengers to the place where they can most readily access the major points of interest without renting a car.