Angostura Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Which means GID is paying property taxes on $50M+ of vacant land. An optimist would say that it's likely someone like Hanover or Midway buys up the land and does something similar with it, but I think we should be prepared for something far crappier. Most likely: a couple of residential towers. If we're lucky they may have some GFR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triton Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 2 hours ago, Angostura said: Which means GID is paying property taxes on $50M+ of vacant land. An optimist would say that it's likely someone like Hanover or Midway buys up the land and does something similar with it, but I think we should be prepared for something far crappier. Most likely: a couple of residential towers. If we're lucky they may have some GFR. I'm hoping I'm wrong. The alternative is they are going back to the drawing board on this project, similar to what Gulf Coast Commercial had to do for Lower Heights District. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOMIKA! Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Met with a contractor today who is bidding on “major” infrastructure work on the site. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgriff Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 16 minutes ago, TOMIKA! said: Met with a contractor today who is bidding on “major” infrastructure work on the site. Maybe they took the website down in anticipation of a new one going up. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgriff Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 17 minutes ago, TOMIKA! said: Met with a contractor today who is bidding on “major” infrastructure work on the site. Maybe they took the website down in anticipation of a new one going up. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 18 hours ago, jgriff said: Maybe they took the website down in anticipation of a new one going up. whatever the reason, the thread lives on! 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmat Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) I've been out of the loop for a long time now, not keeping up with new projects like I used to, but it feels like we haven't had many new projects announced (I know a few have started recently). Are things slowing down? I know this project is a horrible barometer for health of new developments. Edited January 17, 2019 by lockmat 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_cuevas713 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 18 minutes ago, lockmat said: I've been out of the loop for a long time now, not keeping up with new projects like I used to, but it feels like we haven't had many new projects announced (I know a few have started recently). Are things slowing down? I know this project is a horrible barometer for health of new developments. Things are probably slowing down but a lot is kicking off this year that’s really going to change the landscape pretty drastically. The next buildout will bring some great density. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmat Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 33 minutes ago, j_cuevas713 said: Things are probably slowing down but a lot is kicking off this year that’s really going to change the landscape pretty drastically. The next buildout will bring some great density. Sweet. But I'm just wondering if this project possibly being axed is a lagging indicator that development is slowing down. The possible cancellation could be the result of a million things. Just speculating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triton Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 6 hours ago, lockmat said: Sweet. But I'm just wondering if this project possibly being axed is a lagging indicator that development is slowing down. The possible cancellation could be the result of a million things. Just speculating. Well, quite honestly, we don't even know if this project has been "axed." I just simply noticed the main site is gone... whatever that may mean. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Angostura Posted January 18, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted January 18, 2019 10 hours ago, lockmat said: Sweet. But I'm just wondering if this project possibly being axed is a lagging indicator that development is slowing down. The possible cancellation could be the result of a million things. Just speculating. This thread turns 12 next week. This project has been on the drawing board through the housing crisis in 2008/9, the oil boom in the early 2010's, the oil crash in 2015-7, and now the recovery from that crash. Whatever this project is an indicator of, economy-driven development cycles ain't it. 13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 15 hours ago, lockmat said: Sweet. But I'm just wondering if this project possibly being axed is a lagging indicator that development is slowing down. The possible cancellation could be the result of a million things. Just speculating. 4 hours ago, Angostura said: This thread turns 12 next week. This project has been on the drawing board through the housing crisis in 2008/9, the oil boom in the early 2010's, the oil crash in 2015-7, and now the recovery from that crash. Whatever this project is an indicator of, economy-driven development cycles ain't it. They may have 999,999 problems, but economy-driven development cycles ain't one. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMU1213 Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 They're currently redesigning the master plan. It's going to have more residential and less retail (still plenty). They've said they plan on starting this year but who knows how real that is. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 14 minutes ago, SMU1213 said: They're currently redesigning the master plan. It's going to have more residential and less retail (still plenty). They've said they plan on starting this year but who knows how real that is. welcome and thanks for the info, but do you have sources? Do you work for the developers or architects involved? You don't have to name names, but would be great to know if this was just a rumor you heard or you are an actual insider involved. Helps with context. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triton Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 2 hours ago, Luminare said: welcome and thanks for the info, but do you have sources? Do you work for the developers or architects involved? You don't have to name names, but would be great to know if this was just a rumor you heard or you are an actual insider involved. Helps with context. Too much fake news nowadays. Last thing we need is a Buzzfeed News incident at HAIF. /s 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-Town Man Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 (edited) Not surprised if they are reducing the retail, non-grocery retail is not high on investors' lists these days. There may also be a competitive supply issue with River Oaks District. Edited January 23, 2019 by H-Town Man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobruss Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 My sources tell me this is dead for now and it might be a long time before anything happens to the Regent Square property. My source was working directly with the development firm. I believe they are from Boston. They were his client and he told me this weekend that it looks dead. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMU1213 Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 1 hour ago, bobruss said: My sources tell me this is dead for now and it might be a long time before anything happens to the Regent Square property. My source was working directly with the development firm. I believe they are from Boston. They were his client and he told me this weekend that it looks dead. It's GID out of Boston. They were still planning on going forward with it when I met with them a month ago. The "old plan" is dead but the development is still going forward. They claim they are starting by the end of the year but I won't believe them until I see shovels in the ground. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triton Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 1 hour ago, SMU1213 said: The "old plan" is dead Katyville 2.0 here we come!!!! 👹👹 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 1 hour ago, SMU1213 said: It's GID out of Boston. They were still planning on going forward with it when I met with them a month ago. The "old plan" is dead but the development is still going forward. They claim they are starting by the end of the year but I won't believe them until I see shovels in the ground. Is the entire "old plan" dead? Is it just the massing? Is it just the design of each building? Is the park dead? I'm sure at this point 10 or so years down the road they would definitely have to reexamine the building layouts and design aesthetics. The Neo Historicist look was really a thing of its time when developers were trying to figure out how to recreate these urban settings, but a fresh contemporary look would do nicely. Plus when this was pitched, ideas like City Centre were in its infancy. Now they are everywhere in Houston and would be an easy product to sell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triton Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 6 hours ago, Luminare said: The Neo Historicist look was really a thing of its time Thought the design was perfect, quite honestly. Had a warm and inviting feel to it. Looked like a place I could see myself visiting weekly. Plus it was different... wasn't another River Oaks District or City Centre. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 (edited) 9 hours ago, Triton said: Thought the design was perfect, quite honestly. Had a warm and inviting feel to it. Looked like a place I could see myself visiting weekly. Plus it was different... wasn't another River Oaks District or City Centre. I actually agree with you. As an interpretation of that movement it was quite successful. If they decided to do the same style, and executed it well, then I wouldn't have a problem. As you stated it would be unique because we don't really have a full fledged area with that kind of look. It also didn't look cartoony or what I've come to dub as the "theme park look". That being said, it is of a particular time whether it looks good or not. If they are going to sit on their butts for this long and change the plans up then its good time to change the aesthetics as well. They probably could get just as much of an impact if not more with something that is more contemporary. Edited January 24, 2019 by Luminare Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmitch94 Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 What I don't get is how they can afford to sit on all this land, the tax burden must be huge. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angostura Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 The site layout and "urban planning" of the project, setbacks, RoW widths, pedestrian realm, ground floor transparency, landscaping, etc., are far more important than the actual architectural details. As long as you build with zero setbacks on relatively narrow rights of way, prioritizing pedestrian comfort and with plenty of street engagement (and preferentially narrow frontages), the result is going to be pretty good whether the style is steel-and-glass modern, red-brick colonial, hill-country limestone or even timber-frame. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobruss Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 I'd just like to see boots on the ground! No Excuses. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 1 hour ago, bobruss said: I'd just like to see boots on the ground! No Excuses. Yeah the project is dead to me until I see a bulldozer on site. Maybe an updated site / renders.....maybe. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-Town Man Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 2 hours ago, Angostura said: The site layout and "urban planning" of the project, setbacks, RoW widths, pedestrian realm, ground floor transparency, landscaping, etc., are far more important than the actual architectural details. As long as you build with zero setbacks on relatively narrow rights of way, prioritizing pedestrian comfort and with plenty of street engagement (and preferentially narrow frontages), the result is going to be pretty good whether the style is steel-and-glass modern, red-brick colonial, hill-country limestone or even timber-frame. I was with you until you said "hill country limestone," which is trash. 4 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston19514 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 (edited) On 1/23/2019 at 12:05 PM, H-Town Man said: Not surprised if they are reducing the retail, non-grocery retail is not high on investors' lists these days. And yet . . . "Shopping center space is hard to find in Houston, despite the store closures by a number of troubled retailers. The occupancy rate in Houston hit 94.9 percent at year end, the highest retail occupancy rate in many years, according to CBRE." Edited January 25, 2019 by Houston19514 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-Town Man Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Houston19514 said: And yet . . . "Shopping center space is hard to find in Houston, despite the store closures by a number of troubled retailers. The occupancy rate in Houston hit 94.9 percent at year end, the highest retail occupancy rate in many years, according to CBRE." This does not have to do with supply in the Houston market. This has to do with what attracts investors and what sort of rate of return you can get. Investors are still hungry for grocery-anchored retail and shops that meet internet-proof needs such restaurants, nail salons, fitness, etc. They are not hungry for apparel or anything that can also be bought online. That is why cap rates have been trending upward for non-grocery-anchored retail centers for the past three years, and fewer are being built. Meanwhile, apartments are selling at far lower cap rates than any type of retail, given that there is no end in sight for demand there. So something like Regent Square, which was conceived in 2007 based on the market demands then, would look drastically different today, with more apartments and less retail (and probably a different mix of retail). Edited January 25, 2019 by H-Town Man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgriff Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 I talked to my neighbors about this and the Hanover site. Their biggest concern is that something like a Wal-Mart will happen if the Regent Square project is abandoned. I couldn't imagine that happening on a site this expensive. Am I right? Would Wal-Mart or another big box retailer build in Houston on land that's worth around $160 a square foot? I'm always surprised at how most people are so anti-development. It seems many people in the neighborhood are not even happy with Hanover replacing the abandoned detention center and the other buildings North of West Dallas. They also complained about the lack of parks! We are about 1300 feet from Buffalo Bayou Park! Apparently crossing Allen Parkway is not possible. 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CREguy13 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Considering there is a Walmart 2 miles away and its the only one inside the loop, I'd say the chances are 0%. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triton Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Yea all the big box stores apparently want to be close to I-10. Plus, there are a few even on West Gray and Dunlavy. Can't imagine what else is missing that would want to go here... There isn't a Nordstorm Rack in the area but I heard that was rumored for Lower Heights District but that was marketed for the older design. Edit: Total Wine is missing too. Im sure someone is about to prepare a full list for me but a number of those big box stores were rumored for Lower Heights District. We'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-Town Man Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Yeah, $160/SF is too expensive for a Walmart. Look at what's been/being developed up and down Allen Parkway and Memorial Drive to get an idea of the highest and best use of this site. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 (edited) 23 hours ago, H-Town Man said: This does not have to do with supply in the Houston market. This has to do with what attracts investors and what sort of rate of return you can get. Investors are still hungry for grocery-anchored retail and shops that meet internet-proof needs such restaurants, nail salons, fitness, etc. They are not hungry for apparel or anything that can also be bought online. That is why cap rates have been trending upward for non-grocery-anchored retail centers for the past three years, and fewer are being built. Meanwhile, apartments are selling at far lower cap rates than any type of retail, given that there is no end in sight for demand there. So something like Regent Square, which was conceived in 2007 based on the market demands then, would look drastically different today, with more apartments and less retail (and probably a different mix of retail). Agreed. Though the person you are responding too also has a point, but more along the lines of, if occupancy is constantly hitting at near capacity and there is demand for large scale urban developments then the demand should push the supply. Of course we know its not always that simple. Its a base driver. Your argument is actually why a few posts prior I also addressed that the aesthetics should also be vastly updated. It too was conceived in a time when the market for a particular aesthetic was completely different today. I think West Ave (now Arrive RO) was part of that same generation in terms of styling. Now look at the looks coming into the market now especially with developments on Kirby. The market is different for both and because they have waited so long they will almost have to rethink their ideas because it just a different market place all around. I still think that this development is incredibly unique even in this moment of large scale urbanscape development, but I'm sure the logistics and looks and money that actually go into is a nightmare to figure out if one has held out for so long. EDIT: To but it this way. Its like. Imagine if you went into a coma after 2007 and then all the sudden woke up in 2019. A lot has happened in this town. This metaphorical coma would take a while to gather ones thoughts and come to terms with whats going on before one could even move forward. Edited January 26, 2019 by Luminare 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilcal Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 No Alamo Drafthouse anymore: https://www.houstonchronicle.com/business/real-estate/article/Regent-Square-moving-forward-but-with-no-Alamo-13851493.php?utm_campaign=CMS Sharing Tools (Premium)&utm_source=t.co&utm_medium=referral The owner of a 24-acre parcel across Allen Parkway from Buffalo Bayou Park announced plans Thursday to build a 600-unit apartment complex and 50,000 square feet of retail space on the site, the latest development phase within a larger project known as Regent Square. Boston-based GID Development Group said it intends to start construction this fall on the buildings, which will occupy eight acres at West Dallas and Dunlavy streets. GID announced plans to develop Regent Square in 2007. At that time, the property housed the Allen House Apartments, which GID had owned for decades. Most of the apartments were demolished, but the project stalled until a 21-story apartment tower was developed on part of the site at 3233 W. Dallas. That building, called the Sovereign, was completed in 2015. "Our goal for Regent Square is the creation of an exemplary, urban mixed-use district in the heart of Houston. Phase 2, the core of the masterplan, is poised to establish the project as a dynamic, walkable place as it weaves high quality restaurants, retail and residential into the fabric of the surrounding neighborhoods," James Linsley, GID Development Group's president. Several years ago, Alamo Drafthouse Cinema, an entertainment concept that combines a movie theater and dining, said it was planning a location in Regent Square. A GID spokesperson said those plans were off. Boston architecture firm CBT is designing the new buildings. Apartment floorplans will range from studios with separate sleeping alcoves to large two-bedroom units. The shops will ring a central plaza designed by Houston-based OJB Landscape Architecture. JLL has been tapped to oversee retail leasing for the entire mixed-use district, which will eventually span 24 acres along West Dallas Street between College Memorial Park Cemetery and Waugh Drive, GID said. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Money Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 That looks like the southwest portion, facing west down Dallas street. That portion was originally slated for low/mid rise apartments, retail, and the theater. It’s about 1/3 of the total land for regent square. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swtsig Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 it's not bad... certainly better than nothing. one has to assume they're saving the park facing portion for at least a couple of high rises. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_cuevas713 Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 (edited) IT'S ALIVE!!! 🧟♂️ This coupled with Hanover's development, East River, Buffalo Heights District, Lower Heights District, MKT, TMC3, and the Innovation DIstrict. Is it safe to say Houston is about to become a lot more walkable? Edited May 16, 2019 by j_cuevas713 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainJilliams Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 Wow, this is great news! Granted the design isn't anything spectacular, but it still creates those neighborhood connections that allow for more walkability. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skooljunkie Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 My eyes are not seeing a north-south street connecting to Woodhead in this rendering. The original plan had one. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 (edited) Here is what I can see from the render. Since these guys can't bother to put up a site plan (because they know it will go against what they think is "walkable"): 2019 version Previous version: Have a guess which is more walkable. For $hits and giggles lets look at Hanover: One knows what they are doing. One sat on their a$$ for a decade and missed the plot, and then need to save face. It would be one thing if the courtyards they are making here were publicly accessible, but I bet they will be private property which doesn't make this development walkable. Now if the reverse is true then this might be interesting, but for a team that took over a decade to do anything, I don't exactly expect them to be that clever. Glad something is happening, but laughably pathetic considering where they started. EDIT: Made a quick ninja edit. Edited May 17, 2019 by Luminare 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 4 hours ago, j_cuevas713 said: IT'S ALIVE!!! 🧟♂️ This coupled with Hanover's development, East River, Buffalo Heights District, Lower Heights District, MKT, TMC3, and the Innovation DIstrict. Is it safe to say Houston is about to become a lot more walkable? True. Though disappointed by the final product. What was a deadzone is now all the sudden a neighborhood overnight. Its definitely something unique about this city. Sudden things can sprout quickly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houstontexasjack Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 18 minutes ago, Luminare said: True. Though disappointed by the final product. What was a deadzone is now all the sudden a neighborhood overnight. Its definitely something unique about this city. Sudden things can sprout quickly. With GID’s track record, I’ll believe “a neighborhood” is coming when I see framing start to go up. 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LBC2HTX Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 https://www.bizjournals.com/houston/news/2019/05/16/long-awaited-phase-of-mixed-use-project-near.html HBJ regurgitating the Chron article. No new info. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobruss Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 This is really sad. To look at their early renderings and a neighborhood of 10 -15 story buildings in a mixed use development reduced to two story stucco apartment buildings is really disappointing. They could have left the old apartments that were there and it would be about the same and much lower rents for a while longer. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 8 minutes ago, bobruss said: This is really sad. To look at their early renderings and a neighborhood of 10 -15 story buildings in a mixed use development reduced to two story stucco apartment buildings is really disappointing. They could have left the old apartments that were there and it would be about the same and much lower rents for a while longer. I mean it is 5 stories, but what was impressive about the last one was the dedication to more "fine grain" development with varying heights. The fact that its more monotonous in height, materials, and volume is pretty bland. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston19514 Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Luminare said: I mean it is 5 stories, but what was impressive about the last one was the dedication to more "fine grain" development with varying heights. The fact that its more monotonous in height, materials, and volume is pretty bland. 6 stories, but who's counting? 😉 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilcal Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 On 1/24/2019 at 12:39 PM, jmitch94 said: What I don't get is how they can afford to sit on all this land, the tax burden must be huge. Was curious so had to look it up. HCAD just has 5 years of values... but OUCH. 2019 is almost $4,000/day in property taxes. So how much property tax has been "squandered" since 2007? $10 million? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobruss Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 Ouch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shasta Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 (edited) This is drastically different than the original layout from 10 years ago. Will this be on the same blocks as those or is this a different block? Edited May 17, 2019 by shasta 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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