Jump to content

The 2008 Presidential Race thread


DJ V Lawrence

Recommended Posts

This is mainly for the Republicans out there but of course anyone is free to respond: Do any of you think Guiliani has a chance at the nomination considering many of stands on social issues are anathma to the far-right? I'm not asking whether or not you are for him; I'm asking if you think he can get through the fire of the primaries.

I know-the election is around 22 months away but for political junkies like myself this is an intriquing topic.

BTW, FWIW, I think he could be a real winner...I just don't think the Republican Party is going to give him a chance.

I'm Independant, but I'll say this: The Republicans will take anyone in 2008 that can give them a shot at winning the GOP regardless of how much they agree with them. So long as Guliani's not Democrat, they don't care, yo. Bush's approval ratings are still mad low, and two big-name politicians may be representing the Democrats in the '08 GOP (Clinton and Obama).

Perfect example: John McCain. He's ran for the Republican GOP more times than Dan Quayle running for chairman of the Spellling Comiteee. He's NEVER had a shot at winning that office because of his bipartisan style, and other big-name Republicans with a stronger Convervative approach would always have McCain in 3rd or 4th place in primaries across the states. He hasn't changed, yet all of a sudden, if Guliani doesn't run, McCain would be the biggest-name running for the Republican spot.

It's all about conformity, yo. May the best man or woman married to a man that other women love win...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 176
  • Created
  • Last Reply
This is mainly for the Republicans out there but of course anyone is free to respond: Do any of you think Guiliani has a chance at the nomination considering many of stands on social issues are anathma to the far-right? I'm not asking whether or not you are for him; I'm asking if you think he can get through the fire of the primaries.

I know-the election is around 22 months away but for political junkies like myself this is an intriquing topic.

BTW, FWIW, I think he could be a real winner...I just don't think the Republican Party is going to give him a chance.

Guiliani may very well be our goto guy, but, I can't see wasting the spot on him, when you can use a candidate like McCain, to lose to the Democrat runner this time around. Guiliani isn't ready, New York state can't be won with Hilary in the race, I don't care how much they like the mayor, they like the senator better because she is Bill's wife. BIG SURPRISE ! I wouldn't want to see Guiliani go through the same thing Kerry did, a wasted spot when the next time around would have been a wiser decision, but nobody but Kerry was dumb enough to open their big mouths. Hilary could have ran last time, but didn't because she knew she couldn;t beat Bush. Although it was a close race last time. It is very hard to beat a President while a war is going on. You just don't change midstream on something like the Presidency, and Hillary's handlers knew that. Now, it's all wide open, and it won;t be a matter of will the Dems. win, it will be a matter of which Dem. do you want. Good lookin, inexperience ? Or roadhard putaway wet, knows the ends and outs of Washington politics ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guiliani may very well be our goto guy, but, I can't see wasting the spot on him, when you can use a candidate like McCain, to lose to the Democrat runner this time around. Guiliani isn't ready, New York state can't be won with Hilary in the race, I don't care how much they like the mayor, they like the senator better because she is Bill's wife. BIG SURPRISE ! I wouldn't want to see Guiliani go through the same thing Kerry did, a wasted spot when the next time around would have been a wiser decision, but nobody but Kerry was dumb enough to open their big mouths. Hilary could have ran last time, but didn't because she knew she couldn;t beat Bush. Although it was a close race last time. It is very hard to beat a President while a war is going on. You just don't change midstream on something like the Presidency, and Hillary's handlers knew that. Now, it's all wide open, and it won;t be a matter of will the Dems. win, it will be a matter of which Dem. do you want. Good lookin, inexperience ? Or roadhard putaway wet, knows the ends and outs of Washington politics ?

You know, I came across a Hannity interview with Guiliani earlier tonight and watched the greater part of it. I like him. The only thing I'm unclear on is the gun issue; the assault weapons ban was a load of bull, and anyone with even a basic knowledge of the law or what was left available on the market would understand that it was a ban on 'mean-looking' weapons. But otherwise, I generally like the approach of letting states and municipalities handle it.

My only other criticism is that he keeps referring back to his experience as mayor of NYC. That could get to be annoying pretty quickly, just like Kerry reminding people of his veteran status.

I think that Guiliani can get it, and if he gets it, he's going to win, hands down. I say this because 1) he's pro-business, which means that fundraising won't be difficult, and 2) weak opponents. I also think that he might just be able to take New York state. After all, if NYC of all places can elect him as a very popular mayor, and he's also got upstate New York behind him, then it's just in the bag. He might not get very good turnout from religion-motivated voters, but he'll easily take people off the fence, left and right.

When it comes down to it, I think DJ is right. The GOP will take whoever can win. Guiliani can win, if for no other reason than that Hillary scares people. She's got a history of being a shrill *****, and it'll haunt her every step of the way. Guiliani is warm, sensitive, and protective. He'll go over well with women voters, stripping the Democrats of their most important base of supporters.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guiliani may very well be our goto guy,

He ought to be your go-to guy but I just don't see it happening.

Every NY state poll shows Clinton wiping up the ground with him state-wide. That means he can't even win his own state. She is hugely popular state-wide.

I'll simply refer you to her election numbers:

2000

Clinton 55%

Lazio 43%

2004

Clinton 67%

Spencer 31%

He'll never accumalate the numbers and cash Clinton has and will continue to have.

His pro-choice stance, support for gays and serial marriage/divorce history will never sit well with the religious right-which still holds huge sway over the Republican Party.

Speaking of, the Republican's second best hope is Romney but he'll never get over the hurdle because of his flip-flopping over social issues plus he's not a Christian.

Your idea of throwing McCain under the bus may be the best choice for the Republicans at this point. However, don't forget the election is 22 months away and we all know anything can-and will-happen between now and then.

B)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

When it comes down to it, I think DJ is right. The GOP will take whoever can win. Guiliani can win, if for no other reason than that Hillary scares people. She's got a history of being a shrill *****, and it'll haunt her every step of the way. Guiliani is warm, sensitive, and protective. He'll go over well with women voters, stripping the Democrats of their most important base of supporters.

I don't think Guliani is a sure bet for NY if facing Obama and Clinton. For GOP, yes, because I think his 9-11 response will be the key element, and he's the hometown guy. But for President, no. I think it will still come down to the issues, and what he plans to do in the future rather than his past. The question will also be asked how NYC saw Guliani prior to 9-11. In the end, that will become irrelevant also. Iraq as it is today wasn't going on when he was mayor, so his opinion about America's Iraq stance present-day will be closely watched by voters, as it will be with the Democratic GOP.

Speaking of, the Republican's second best hope is Romney but he'll never get over the hurdle because of his flip-flopping over social issues plus he's not a Christian.

Things like this piss me off royally. I can't believe I'm hearing this in the 21st century. It's not you, Nmainguy; it's America's taboo with a person that's not a white-Christian-man being in office. But statements like "Obama may have studied Islam", "Romney's not a Christian", and "I'm not sure if Hilary is a man or a woman" or whatever just scares me. Is America still prejudice? Once again, I'm not knocking on anyone in particular here on HAIF, I'm just asking a question. Are Americans really scared of the thought of having a President that's a woman, black, hispanic, asian, jewish, muslim, etc.? Have we not gotten past that yet?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Things like this piss me off royally. I can't believe I'm hearing this in the 21st century. It's not you, Nmainguy; it's America's taboo with a person that's not a white-Christian-man being in office. But statements like "Obama may have studied Islam", "Romney's not a Christian", and "I'm not sure if Hilary is a man or a woman" or whatever just scares me. Is America still prejudice? Once again, I'm not knocking on anyone in particular here on HAIF, I'm just asking a question. Are Americans really scared of the thought of having a President that's a woman, black, hispanic, asian, jewish, muslim, etc.? Have we not gotten past that yet?

I hear you, DJ. But the reality remains. There are many who won't vote for a woman, minority or non-christian. The odd thing is the majority of those that used to vote would vote for any of the above mentioned...but they no longer vote. Those who are elected are elected by the minority because most people do not vote...and that's the most pathetic thing of all.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, Gov. Richardson-(D) wants to finally make "Cock Fighting" illegal in NM, calm down Nmain, it ain't what you think :P;):lol: I guess the Gov. is going for the PETA vote ? A little late, and now that it is an issue in his state, I am sure his opponents will show his voting record on the issue as ammo. It's not like he is a factor in this thing anyways, but since we keep talking about "morals", I thought it pertained to the conversation as ethical is a synonym for moralistic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, Gov. Richardson-(D) wants to finally make "Cock Fighting" illegal in NM, calm down Nmain, it ain't what you think :P;):lol: I guess the Gov. is going for the PETA vote ? A little late, and now that it is an issue in his state, I am sure his opponents will show his voting record on the issue as ammo. It's not like he is a factor in this thing anyways, but since we keep talking about "morals", I thought it pertained to the conversation as ethical is a synonym for moralistic.

I think Richardson would make a great president, but I just can't see him winning the primaries over people like Clinton and Obama. He ahs a pretty good history when it comes to foriegn relations, UN peace talks, and being a voice in international negotiations, which impressed me seeing that he's governor of New Mexico; a state that normally doesn't make political news.

I could see him as a cabinet member should a Democrat or McCain win.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

New Mexico is a welfare state, getting a Gov. to be your President from such a state is a bad policy in general.

I'd probably have assumed Arkansas a similar kind of state, but it produced a pretty good president, Bill Clinton (speaking of cock fighting). It may be home to another president too, since one candidate is Clinton's wife, and another is a Republican from Bill Clinton's home town.

Most governors aren't known for their roles in foriegn policy; that's usually Congress-people and cabinet members. But Richardson made a name for himself as one who was more directly involved, and as a result, he has just as much knowledge in the foriegn-arena as many in Washington. That could be a strong point for him. He could even make a great Vice-President for Clinton or Obama if either one were to win the Democratic ticket. Many on both sides (Rep and Dem) like him.

I predict that the primaries will be more of a popularity contest within each party, and the presidential votes from the people will be more for the issues than a popular name. If Richardson were to win the Democratic ticket, he'd have just as good a chance at winning as Clinton, Obama, McCain, or Guliani. But I just can't see him winning the Democratic ticket. His name is just not as popular and known to the American public as the two Democrats I mentioned.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd probably have assumed Arkansas a similar kind of state, but it produced a pretty good president, Bill Clinton (speaking of cock fighting).

.

Thanks for proving my point DJ.

Govenors that have no knowledge in how to create jobs or motivate people to go get a job is someone we don't need to run a Capitalist country west20.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Aaaw man. I didn't want to read some boring goverment document. I was hoping you could just sum it up for me.

Ok, i'll sum it up, but then you have to go read it. Number 1 in poverty, needing the most Govt. help and programs to get by. How is that for summing it up.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Kinda like Bush...your point is well proven.

I am gonna shut you down fast this time. :P:lol:

http://www.washtimes.com/commentary/200701...03432-9181r.htm

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-jobs...a-home-business

http://money.cnn.com/2007/02/01/markets/ma..._0405/index.htm

Yeah, bush doesn't know how to stimulate growth huh ? Get your head out of the sand bro !

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Kinda like Bush...your point is well proven.

What are you talking about? He's created lots of jobs through military enlistment and Haliburton. C'mon, give George W. Cheney and Dick Bush some credit, yo.

Thanks for proving my point DJ.

Govenors that have no knowledge in how to create jobs or motivate people to go get a job is someone we don't need to run a Capitalist country

I'm not really sure what you're reffering to here. We've had a former governor-turned-president in office for the past 15 years in America (GWB for Texas, Bill Clinton for Arkansas). It's nothing new. Guliani was a mayor, and he's a front-runner.

I think govenors get to much credit and scrutiny when it comes to their offices. They don't have as much power as state legislator. Even when Ann Richards and George W. Bush were Texas govenors, everyone considered the most powerful voice in Austin to be Lloyd Benson. U don't nearly have half as much power as governor of a state as a congressperson does. It's easier for you to be overruled by legislator as a govenor than as a President with congress and it's veto powers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am gonna shut you down fast this time. :P:lol:

http://www.washtimes.com/commentary/200701...03432-9181r.htm

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-jobs...a-home-business

http://money.cnn.com/2007/02/01/markets/ma..._0405/index.htm

Yeah, bush doesn't know how to stimulate growth huh ? Get your head out of the sand bro !

Maybe its not him who needs to get the head out of the sand. How are we going to pay the deficit? Even if we assume it is true that it is a bush stimulated growth, whatever we gain from the economy is just borrowed money that would not even cover a fraction of the deficit.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Maybe its not him who needs to get the head out of the sand. How are we going to pay the deficit? Even if we assume it is true that it is a bush stimulated growth, whatever we gain from the economy is just borrowed money that would not even cover a fraction of the deficit.

Riddle me this, Since the tax cuts were enacted in 2003, how much of the deficit was shown to have been cut in 2006 ? Would you say about HALF ? I don't know non-believer. Read this then tell me how I am wrong.

http://www.americanshareholders.com/blog/2...lion-lowest.php

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Riddle me this, Since the tax cuts were enacted in 2003, how much of the deficit was shown to have been cut in 2006 ? Would you say about HALF ? I don't know non-believer. Read this then tell me how I am wrong.

http://www.americanshareholders.com/blog/2...lion-lowest.php

Did you just acknowledge that the other half is not eliminated? Doesn't that side with my main point, that this is not really growth, but borrowed money that has to be returned?

Perhaps one shouldn't throw around comments like 'heads in the sand' so easily when we are still losing more than we are gaining.

Just a thought.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As a political junkie, this has always been an intriquing topic for me: What about Guliani? In the past few days I have seen him artfully NOT dissavow his position on a woman's right to choose and for equal federal rights for gays in order for them to become first class citizens.

I have also seen some anti-choice and anti-equal rights for gays groups saying "well...we're not crazy about that but maybe we could live with it if it got a Republican in the White House.

Then I see the far-right "Christian" conservative wing saying no deal. No deal on Guliani. No deal on the flip-flopping McCain. No deal on the non-Christian, cultist, flip-flopping Romney. The fact there is they usually control the primaries.

I'm curious what HAIFers and HAIFettes think where the Republican Party is headed.

My personal opinion is their train-wreck of hypocritical "family values", social, borrow and tax and spend economic politicians they have supported might come to an end if they told the Taliban wing of their party to kiss off and embrace a Guliani [who I might consider voting for]. I don't see Romney as a possibility because he really is a cultist trying not to act like a Christian and not a cultist and McCain is just a fraud by anyone's measure.

So come on...inquiring HAIFers want to know.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


All of the HAIF
None of the ads!
HAIF+
Just
$5!


×
×
  • Create New...