My review of Dallas

[JasonDFW]

Actually i even traveled the area off Highway 114 going into Irving. That area has a little more development, but it's still so sparse and spread out, it feels like a deadspot. Doesn't feel like city between Dallas and Ft. Worth.

I wasn't talking about that area. It is almost as dead as 30, only for different reasons. I believe those areas are yet to infill, unlike most of those areas near 30 which just will never infill because of parkland etc... There are areas not far from 114 that had *nothing* just a few years ago. *IF* it continues to grow like it has in that area since the 70s, it should be all filled in at some point I would expect, and perhaps be a huge area even by Texas standards.

Jason

[TxDave]

Actually i even traveled the area off Highway 114 going into Irving. That area has a little more development, but it's still so sparse and spread out, it feels like a deadspot. Doesn't feel like city between Dallas and Ft. Worth.

It is true that there are "dead spots" between Dallas and Fort Worth.

There are a couple of barriers between the two cities, most prominently the Trinity River bottoms and DFW Airport. These do make the drive between the two city centers feel more separated than they truly are.

If you look at maps showing the distribution of housing, population, and commercial development in the areas between the two cities, you will see that it is a continuous region of development (with the previously mentioned barriers in between).

Also, given the commuting patterns of the area population, there is little doubt that the DFW region is a single metro area.

When you think about it, it is really a nice equlizer that Houston is the larger city while DFW has the larger metro. It provides a natural check and balance in the crazy competition between the two.

[Trae]

I-20 is pretty separated, too.

[HarryMoto]

Next time you're up here, you should make you're here on a weekend and check out:

1) Victory Park -- It should be fully open within the next few weeks. The ABC affiliate begins broadcasting their news and morning show from their window-on-the-world facility there Monday. Originally, everything was supposed to be up and going by the NHL playoffs Jan. 24 but don't know if that's happening.

2) Uptown/West Village -- As retail expands beyond the boundaries of the original West Village at the north end of Uptown on McKinney, there's starting to be some actual foot traffic, especially on weekends. You can take DART from downtown to the uptown station or the trolley from Lower McKinney Avenue.

3) Lower Greenville -- With the fire that destroyed the Arcadia Theater (which had been set to re-open as a dance club) leading to what will probably be more mixed-use retail, the announcement that Whole Foods is closing its Greenville Ave. store (in order to open a larger, 50,000-square foot store on Abrams in East Dallas) and my guess is that property will go mixed-use as well, and the recent opening of the Cityville mixed-use building, the nightlife emphasis on Greenville may be fading. Still, there are plenty of places to hang out, from Zubar to the Polyphonic Spree's Good Records store. You just have to avoid the drunk louts who either have been, or will be, on either "Cops" or "Cheaters."

4) Knox-Henderson -- From the Katy Trail on its western border to a few blocks east of N. Central Expressway, the Knox-Henderson corridor is turning into a yuppie playground for shopping and eating. And you'll get good-sized crowds out on weekends. There are some really good restaurants in this area, either on Knox-Henderson itself or on Travis, McKinney or Cole. Try Fireside Pies (pizza), Kozy Kitchen (for breakfast, a little piece of Austin in Dallas), The Old Monk (a very popular pub), Abacus (very expensive), Cuba Libre or Samba Room (Latin American) or Cafe Madrid (tapas). But there are many others to choose from and after eating you can shop at the Apple Store or the huge Crate & Barrel.

5) Bishop Arts District -- Off-the-beaten path for most tourists but one of Dallas' more unique areas. Located in Oak Cliff, the mix of quirky shops (The Soda Gallery, Bishop Street Market) and interesting eateries (Tillman's Corner, Hattie's) is starting to attract visitors from all over the Metroplex.

6) South Lamar/The Cedars -- This area south of the convention center downtown is really on the rise. South Lamar is or will be the home to the happening bar Absinthe, the Opening Bell coffeehouse, the new Bill's Records (the North Dallas location has closed), a revamped Gilley's that's now called The Palladium and booking name rock/pop bands now (Scissor Sisters, Los Lonely Boys), the jazz club Brooklyn, and a couple of well-reviewed relatively high-end restaurants. A ton of lofts/condos are starting to get built, which may put one of Dallas' best bars, Lee Harvey's, on the chopping block as they have an outdoor stage and roaring bonfires for those coolish North Texas night. Can't imagine whoever buys those condos going up down the street are going to want to hear alt-rock at 1 a.m.

[cowboybud]

Next time you're up here, you should make you're here on a weekend and check out:

1) Victory Park -- It should be fully open within the next few weeks. The ABC affiliate begins broadcasting their news and morning show from their window-on-the-world facility there Monday. Originally, everything was supposed to be up and going by the NHL playoffs Jan. 24 but don't know if that's happening.

That's the All-Star game actually. The playoffs start in April.

[troyboy]

I was in Houston for three days last week from Tuesday to Friday morning. And much like Dallas and many other cities, if you don't know what bars/clubs are happening during the week, the nightime scene is pretty slow. When I first moved to Dallas, I was out almost every night of the week at a different packed spot. Many of my younger (did I just say that) coworkers come in many a weekday morning after partying all night at the latest hot spot. And a I've found the weekend nightlife scene in Dallas to be very good and getting better. I still indulge....ocassionally. And FW has horrible nightlife!!! The people you saw walking around DTFW were mostly eating at one of the numerous chain restaurants and going to the movies. The nightlife there is almost non-existent. There are some new lounges in DTFW. I can't remember the name, but I tried one with a coworker after a wedding a few weeks ago, and all I can say is FW is a town that doesn't do "hip" very well.

And regarding the drive from Dalllas to FW, if you take 183 from Dallas to FW, it's surburbs all the way and very little empty space except by the airport. It makes the drive seem much shorter. And I agree, coming into the city from I-45 is horribly unattractive. I really enjoyed the greenery in Houston. But don't throw stones, Houston has no shortage of rundown neighborhoods. And I also much disagree with Houston catching up with Dallas in turns of urban projects. Althought I was pleased to see many new developments since I was in town last, I still think Dallas is urbanizing much faster, IMHO.

[tierwestah]

I was in Houston for three days last week from Tuesday to Friday morning. And much like Dallas and many other cities, if you don't know what bars/clubs are happening during the week, the nightime scene is pretty slow. When I first moved to Dallas, I was out almost every night of the week at a different packed spot. Many of my younger (did I just say that) coworkers come in many a weekday morning after partying all night at the latest hot spot. And a I've found the weekend nightlife scene in Dallas to be very good and getting better. I still indulge....ocassionally. And FW has horrible nightlife!!! The people you saw walking around DTFW were mostly eating at one of the numerous chain restaurants and going to the movies. The nightlife there is almost non-existent. There are some new lounges in DTFW. I can't remember the name, but I tried one with a coworker after a wedding a few weeks ago, and all I can say is FW is a town that doesn't do "hip" very well.

And regarding the drive from Dalllas to FW, if you take 183 from Dallas to FW, it's surburbs all the way and very little empty space except by the airport. It makes the drive seem much shorter. And I agree, coming into the city from I-45 is horribly unattractive. I really enjoyed the greenery in Houston. But don't throw stones, Houston has no shortage of rundown neighborhoods. And I also much disagree with Houston catching up with Dallas in turns of urban projects. Althought I was pleased to see many new developments since I was in town last, I still think Dallas is urbanizing much faster, IMHO.

Forgive me, but i don't see what Dallas is doing that's so much different than Houston other than what's happening in Dallas's Uptown/Victory areas. Both cities are experiencing Urban renewal. I do remember saying that Dallas is ahead of us in terms of Urban Renewal/Planning. But like it or not, Houston is catching up. From all the new apartments that have been built up in Older 4th Ward, Part of Midtown. Also close to Old China Town, they've begun to really spring up in that area.

As far as nightlife in both cities, i still think Houston's scene is more visible. Houston has pockets of nightlife action in different areas. More Commercial Blvds where city action can be seen better.

Also, i never said that Houston doesn't have a shortage of rundown areas. We all know Houston has them all over. I was just saying that Dallas has its share too. It's not all peaches and creme. Take care

tierwestah jones

[713 To 214]

As far as nightlife in both cities, i still think Houston's scene is more visible.

LMAO. . .Where? and as compared to what area(s) in Dallas? I'm tired of people with limited to no experience inside DFW and/or outside Greater Houston contrasting the two. Most of the time I just read the posts quietly, without responding, because some of the stuff stated is so absurd that I decide to give the poster a "pass" because of the comic relief value of the post. However, in this case, I have to call bulls#*&. tierwestah I can respect the fact that you are just stating your opinion. However, next time you come to Dallas, pm me or something, and if you think you're up to it, I'll show you what nightlife is really all about. Take it from someone who PARTIES in both Dallas and Houston every month (from Southpark to Galleria Area to Midtown to Downtown to the Northside). . .Houston's got some catching up to do. You just need the right tourguide next time.

[tierwestah]

LMAO. . .Where? and as compared to what area(s) in Dallas? I'm tired of people with limited to no experience inside DFW and/or outside Greater Houston contrasting the two. Most of the time I just read the posts quietly, without responding, because some of the stuff stated is so absurd that I decide to give the poster a "pass" because of the comic relief value of the post. However, in this case, I have to call bulls#*&. tierwestah I can respect the fact that you are just stating your opinion. However, next time you come to Dallas, pm me or something, and if you think you're up to it, I'll show you what nightlife is really all about. Take it from someone who PARTIES in both Dallas and Houston every month (from Southpark to Galleria Area to Midtown to Downtown to the Northside). . .Houston's got some catching up to do. You just need the right tourguide next time.

I'm going to echo the comment scarface said earlier. When you go to a big city, you shouldn't have to look under a rock to find the nightlife/party scene. Just because i'm giving Houston a plus over Dallas on nightlife is no reason to get offensive. I give Dallas a plus on a lot of things over Houston. Sounds like some of you Dallasites gotta have the cake and eat it too on everything.

I did say that i'll try lower Greenville area next time i go, but that still doesn't change my perception. Houston's nightlife scene seems way more prominent.! I expect YOU to say Houston has some catching up to do because YOU live in and favor Dallas. So i'ma call a bullsh%% on you!

[713 To 214]

I'm going to echo the comment scarface said earlier. When you go to a big city, you shouldn't have to look under a rock to find the nightlife/party scene. Just because i'm giving Houston a plus over Dallas on nightlife is no reason to get offensive. I give Dallas a plus on a lot of things over Houston. Sounds like some of you Dallasites gotta have the cake and eat it too on everything.

I did say that i'll try lower Greenville area next time i go, but that still doesn't change my perception. Houston's nightlife scene seems way more prominent.! So i'ma call a bullsh%% on you!

That's fine. I don't have to have my cake and eat it too. It's not about that, anyway. For me, the situation IS what it IS. I'm not trying to sugarcoat anything. You keep stating that you think Houston's nightlife scene is more prominent. For comparison's sake, I'm just asking you (again), which areas in each city are you comparing? After all, you started this thread. I'm just trying to help you out. If you don't want to respond here, I'll understand. Send me a pm. But, for the record. . .one doesn't have to "look under a rock" to find "nightlife atmosphere" in Dallas. Don't get me wrong. South Beach, Las Vegas, or Bourbon Street in N.O., Dallas is not. We don't party in the streets, if that's what you mean, but the number of clubs, lounges, bars, restaurants, and after-hours in the highly concentrated entertainment district aren't hard to find, by any mean. Next time I'm out in both cities, I'll try to remember to take my camera, so I can post some visual evidence, that will finally put this falicy to rest.

[tierwestah]

Next time I'm out in both cities, I'll try to remember to take my camera, so I can post some visual evidence, that will finally put this falicy to rest.

Yes, Please do that. Take pictures because i'd love to see some.

Houston nightlife scenes that i know of:

I'm a start in my home neighborhood of 3rd Ward (some of yall might not like these because you might call these places " hood or ghetto".

I forgot the names of some of these joints but as soon as i find the names, i'll edit my post w/ the names.

1)Club Reminisce

2) The Club right next door to reminisce

3) The Club behind reminisce

4) Red Rooster

5) Eddie's

Leaving 3rd Ward now

6) Midtown (Post Midtown Square Action) (Same type of action in Dallas)

7) Downtown Main Street (Full of Clubs and night action)

8) Club Riddims

9) Club Metropolis

10) Club 713

11) Club Coco Loco/H-Town live

12) Maxis

13) Reggae Hut

And since you Dallasites wanna claim restaurants:

14) Fox Sports Grill (Uptown)

15) Chachos (Uptown)

16) Boudreaux's Cajun restaurants (Always a gang of people hanging out there)

That's all i can think of right now. Haven't really partied in Houston since i last lived there in Sept 05. These are mainly the ones I KNOW. I know there's more, i just got writers block right now

I might take you up on your offer in PMing you because i'll be back in BigD soon enough. Hell, i might even be moving there. There's a 30% chance of my internship moving out there and a 20% chance i'll be coming back home to Houston and a 50% chance i'm a stay put here in San Antonio.

But if you think Houston's night scene needs to catch up to D's, maybe you're the one who needs to be shown a good time next time you're in Houston.

[713 To 214]

Yes, Please do that. Take pictures because i'd love to see it.

Houston nightlife scenes that i know of:

I'm a start in my home neighborhood of 3rd Ward (some of yall might not like these because you might call these places " hood or ghetto".

I forgot the names of some of these joints but as soon as i find the names, i'll edit my post w/ the names.

1)Club Reminisce

2) The Club right next door to reminisce

3) The Club behind reminisce

Leaving 3rd Ward now

1) Midtown (Post Midtown Square Action)

2) Downtown Main Street

3) Club Riddims

4) Club Metropolis

5) Club 713

6) Club Coco Loco/H-Town live

7) Maxis

That's all i can think of right now. Haven't partied in Houston since i last lived there in 05. I know there's more. Just got writers block

I might take you up on your offer in PMing you because i'll be back in BigD soon enough. Hell, i might even be moving there. There's a 50% chance of my internship moving out there and a 20% chance i'll be coming back home to Houston and a 30% chance i'm a stay put here in San Antonio.

But if you think Houston's night scene needs to catch up to D's, maybe you're the one who needs to be shown a good time next time you're in Houston.

Well, now I see what your standards are. Is that all you can think of. . .10 spots? Most, if not all, of those places you listed are predominately frequented by African Americans. You might want to try to broaden your scope of nightlife, and who you party with. I wouldn't even count Reminisce, the club next door to it, the club around the corner from it, nor the sports bar down the street from it (at OST & 288). . .they're all hole in the walls. Don't get me wrong, if I want a real, real, grimy experience followed by the opportunity to buy a bar-b-que link sandwich in the parking lot, I'll consider going to one of those places, again. You have to have a "pass" get in those spots. They aren't for everyone.

[tierwestah]

Well, now I see what your standards are. Is that all you can think of. . .10 spots? Most, if not all, of those places you listed are predominately frequented by African Americans. You might want to try to broaden your scope of nightlife, and who you party with. I wouldn't even count Reminisce, the club next door to it, the club around the corner from it, nor the sports bar down the street from it (at OST & 288). . .they're all hole in the walls. Don't get me wrong, if I want a real, real, grimy experience followed by the opportunity to buy a bar-b-que link sandwich in the parking lot, I'll consider going to one of those places, again. You have to have a "pass" get in those spots. They aren't for everyone.

Like i said, those are just a few spots i know of. Since i grew up in 3rd Ward, my list started there. I know in Houston, there's way more than that. So what does your list entail of? I'm sure its places mainly of the Caucasion race. So what? Nightlife is Nightlife. And i see you have a problem counting. I listed 16 spots alltogether. Downtown Main street has well over 30 spots in itself.

Does Dallas have an area like Main Street? Does it have a whole mile long street that has Club after Club? Please don't say West End because that's mainly restaurants. Granted some of the clubs on Main Street have gone down but there's new ones opening up all the time.

This list i gave alone does not indicate that these are the standards i go by. But then again, everyone has their own.

[713 To 214]

Does Dallas have an area like Main Street? Does it have a whole mile long street that has Club after Club? Please don't say West End because that's mainly restaurants. Granted some of the clubs on Main Street have gone down but there's new ones opening up all the time.

This list alone does not indicate that these are the standards i go by. But then again, everyone has their own.

Let me state that Main Street in DT Houston DOES NOT have, nor has it EVER had club after club for a mile. I am pretty much familiar with every square inch of that area, including the Warehouse District, Skyline District, Ballpark District, and Theater District. To say that the Main Street Corridor DT has club after club for even a quarter mile, is a serious stretch. You obviously haven't been to DT Houston at night, EVER. To answer your question, in short, YES, Dallas has a similar area called Greenville Avenue, which has far more history/longevity as an Entertainment District than Main Street in Houston, which basically exploded around the opening of the METRO rail line. I will provide you with a more comprehensive response to your question later (complete with maps, lists of establishments, etc.).

[2112]

Let me state that Main Street in DT Houston DOES NOT have, nor has it EVER had club after club for a mile. I am pretty much familiar with every square inch of that area, including the Warehouse District, Skyline District, Ballpark District, and Theater District. To say that the Main Street Corridor DT has club after club for even a quarter mile, is a serious stretch. You obviously haven't been to DT Houston at night, EVER. To answer your question, in short, YES, Dallas has a similar area called Greenville Avenue, which has far more history/longevity as an Entertainment District than Main Street in Houston, which basically exploded around the opening of the METRO rail line. I will provide you with a more comprehensive response to your question later (complete with maps, lists of establishments, etc.).

There are a bunch though:

DOWNTOWN HOUSTON

Clubs, Bars, Pubs, Restaurants

and other destinations

Total Bar/Restaurant Count: 115

NORTH DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT:

MARKET SQUARE (14):

La Carafe (Oldest bldg. in Houston)

Twelve Spot

Cotton Exchange Bar

Blu Torch

Les Givrals (French Vietnamese Fusion)

La Tapatia bar and grill

Club Paesanos

Warrens

Market Square Bar and Grill (Great patio at back)

Treebeards Restaurant (limited hours)

CharBar (tailor by day, bar by night)

Red Cat Jazz Cafe (restaurant/bar)

Wasabi (Japanese)

Kim Son (Vietnamese)

FRANKLIN AVENUE/COMMERCE AVENUE (14):

Six Degrees Lounge (Formerly Dusk)

New Orleans Cajun Kitchen (formerly Kairo Caf

[2112]

Let me state that Main Street in DT Houston DOES NOT have, nor has it EVER had club after club for a mile. I am pretty much familiar with every square inch of that area, including the Warehouse District, Skyline District, Ballpark District, and Theater District. To say that the Main Street Corridor DT has club after club for even a quarter mile, is a serious stretch. You obviously haven't been to DT Houston at night, EVER. To answer your question, in short, YES, Dallas has a similar area called Greenville Avenue, which has far more history/longevity as an Entertainment District than Main Street in Houston, which basically exploded around the opening of the METRO rail line. I will provide you with a more comprehensive response to your question later (complete with maps, lists of establishments, etc.).

Here are some shots of several night time scenes in Downtown Houston, during some street parties. (Holloween, big sporting nights, etc.) I was also there this last Saturday night. It was raining and cold, and, surprisingly, there was a crowded scene all around the historic district and market square. Plenty of sweet young thangs in short skirts and thongs and such. Life is good. Anyways:

[tierwestah]

Thanks for the back up 2112. And to 713-214, I've only been downtown Houston at night like 1000 times. Maybe its not quite a mile, but it is a long stretch of clubs. You think someone who lived in Houston all his life in 3rd Ward never made time to go downtown ? Now the club scene is starting to spill over from Main Street over to Franklin Street. I also didn't mention Houston's Theatre district and Bayou Place. Although not favorites of mine but there's been plenty of times i've driven over there and scene crowds of people at night. It's just not an everynight thing though, i'll admit.

[The Great Hizzy!]

Who you gonna believe? Your lying eyes or...

[tierwestah]

Who you gonna believe? Your lying eyes or...

Who was that directed at and what do you mean?

[The Great Hizzy!]

It was directed at the people who are trying to tell you that what you observe here and there isn't true. They're funny people. Then when the evidence contradicts (like 2112's list and the accompanying photos), the argument changes.

It's funny and typical.

[KDubRedRaider]

It is supposed to be really impressive, like nothing you would have ever thought to be in a Wal-Mart (sushi?). I really wished Wal-Mart with all there money and new stores opening would adopt it. Plano is SO lucky to get this.

I went this summer and was really not all that impressed. You can tell it's different from regular Wal-Mart Supercenters in other parts of the country, but it still looks like a Wal-Mart. The signage is a bit different, and the skylights are nice, but it really is no big deal. A new Wal-Mart opened in Lubbock at the intersection of Ave. Q and 4th Street, and they used the same signange.

[houstonfella]

Great photos 2112. It shows a very vibrant downtown Houston.

[tierwestah]

It was directed at the people who are trying to tell you that what you observe here and there isn't true. They're funny people. Then when the evidence contradicts (like 2112's list and the accompanying photos), the argument changes.

It's funny and typical.

Oh alright. I got it now. Thanks Hizzy!

[banking214]

I love downtown Houston, don't ever go anymore though. My family has owned a few different bars around the area. My dad just complains that downtown really is only a big draw on special nights or events. He recently sold one business and is going to re open in a location around Westheimer and Kirby. Yes, Houston's nightlife is really amazing compared to 10 years ago, but it is not bumper to bumper crowds like the pictures above suggest. Atleat, not every weekend.

[WestTexan]

Who you gonna believe? Your lying eyes or...

Houston Street Party

Dallas Street Party

The level of discourse on this forum has reached a new high.

[banking214]

Houston Street Party

Dallas Street Party

The level of discourse on this forum has reached a new high.

OMG

I am rolling on the floor laughing.

[The Great Hizzy!]

LOL! You're wrong for that, West Texan. LOL!!

[C2H]

Oh please West Texan, that was a March or Rally in Dallas. Or was that part of the joke?

[RedScare]

This was the scene at lunchtime yesterday outside my Main Street office.

[texastrill]

and all I can say is FW is a town that doesn't do "hip" very well.

So,should anyone from FW,who wants to be "hip",move inside Dallas city limits?Or is inside Dallas county good enough?