Turnberry Galleria Luxury High-Rise At 5048 Hidalgo St.

[TheNiche]

Personally, I believe some hi-rises should be built for those that make LESS than a few million a year.

I mean, would it be bad to make a highrise for the person can afford at about $100-175k?

Mosaic's approach seems to have been going for the low-end market. Their 1BR units start around $150k.

Unfortunately, though, building costs rise geometrically with altitude above the ground. There are only so many people that even want to live in a high-rise, and of those, many fewer still that can afford it. It has very little to do with whether it is good or bad...the costs and preferences just are what they are.

I dont understand why these people keep building these highrises, when many stand empty.

Wheres the logic?

Where are these vacant buildings? You do know that the year is 2006, not 1988, right?

Seriously, though, the very few vacant buildings with residential potential of which I am aware are in the downtown submarket. Downtown land is so expensive that the market automatically builds in a place premium that is sufficiently high to prevent any people other than the upper middle class and upper class from living there (Harris County Jail, not withstanding). But at that price level, people have so many other options throughout the Houston area that downtown's market share is very limited. So where there are vacant building or vacant lots, residential growth into those spaces is occuring, but at a very slow rate.

Meanwhile, outside of downtown, there really aren't that many vacant buildings with residential potential, but there's still plenty of demand. The Galleria area is an excellent case in point, as is the greater Montrose area, the Museum District, and the Texas Medical Center area.

[shinoda28107]

But does any one know anything (else) about this?

New Highrise

Edited October 8, 2006 by shinoda28107

[TheNiche]

But does any one know anything (else) about this?

New Highrise

This is actually a duplicate thread to one that we've already been working on. The sales office is apparently under construction. Nothing else is known. I suspect that they'll put out a bunch of press releases once the sales office is built out and staffed.

Moderators, please merge.

[The New Juniper]

QUOTE(ricco67 @ Sunday, October 8th, 2006 @ 7:59am)

Personally, I believe some hi-rises should be built for those that make LESS than a few million a year.

I mean, would it be bad to make a highrise for the person can afford at about $100-175k?

Mosaic's approach seems to have been going for the low-end market. Their 1BR units start around $150k.

If Mosaic is selling a unit for $150K, then it must not be more than 500 square feet. The construction costs alone in a high rise are $200 psf. That doesn't take into account any other costs, much less profit.

[TheNiche]

If Mosaic is selling a unit for $150K, then it must not be more than 500 square feet. The construction costs alone in a high rise are $200 psf. That doesn't take into account any other costs, much less profit.

Their official advertised number as a minimum is $165k, but all is negotiable. And yes, I think that the units start in the 500s of square feet.

[shinoda28107]

This is actually a duplicate thread to one that we've already been working on. The sales office is apparently under construction. Nothing else is known. I suspect that they'll put out a bunch of press releases once the sales office is built out and staffed.

Moderators, please merge.

Where is this thread?

[Houston19514]

Their official advertised number as a minimum is $165k, but all is negotiable. And yes, I think that the units start in the 500s of square feet.

According to their website, I believe their smallest unit is 672 square feet, plus balcony, for a total of 733 square feet.

[Pumapayam]

Where is this thread?

Your looking at it buddy, you created a new thread yesterday with the same article you linked from uptown Houston.

This is the thread, no if's, and's, or but's about it !

[shinoda28107]

Your looking at it buddy, you created a new thread yesterday with the same article you linked from uptown Houston.

This is the thread, no if's, and's, or but's about it !

Sorry for my ignorance...I'm still relatively new to this forum.

[feufoma]

Any info on this? I haven't had a chance to visit the site. It's my understanding that some type of structure is being built near the water wall. Are there any indications of what it's going to be (sales/ construction office)?

[abarr2001]

Personally, I believe some hi-rises should be built for those that make LESS than a few million a year.

I mean, would it be bad to make a highrise for the person can afford at about $100-175k?

Why pay $175k for 733 sqft when one can buy 2,000 sqft for the same price plus a yard 30 minutes (on avergae) away in beautiful and exciting Pearland, TX? That is the argument high rise developers must answer to a select few in order to build more buildings. Unfortunately, it is a very, very, select few citizens who prefer to live this way here in Houston.

[Scharpe St Guy]

Personally I would not live in a high rise however I wonder about the baby boomers? Those that do live in Pearland and are getting close to retiring, no longer wanting nor needing the yard or upkeep associated with.

I would think that quite a few baby boomers will take into consideration the High Rise market due to the amenities and perks associated with them. Ie.. Gyms, Pool, Hot Tub, Valet Service, etc... The ability to catch a shuttle to the airport and jet off to places unknown and not have to worry about anything. Once these high rises also contain in house medical care facilities/offices they will take off. After all Houston is #2 to New York for Theater/Arts from what I have read and then you can run downtown to catch a Baseball, Basketball, Hockey, or shop at Houston Pavilions.

My .02cents,

Scharpe St Guy

Why pay $175k for 733 sqft when one can buy 2,000 sqft for the same price plus a yard 30 minutes (on avergae) away in beautiful and exciting Pearland, TX? That is the argument high rise developers must answer to a select few in order to build more buildings. Unfortunately, it is a very, very, select few citizens who prefer to live this way here in Houston.

[houstonfella]

Personally I would not live in a high rise however I wonder about the baby boomers? Those that do live in Pearland and are getting close to retiring, no longer wanting nor needing the yard or upkeep associated with.

I would think that quite a few baby boomers will take into consideration the High Rise market due to the amenities and perks associated with them. Ie.. Gyms, Pool, Hot Tub, Valet Service, etc... The ability to catch a shuttle to the airport and jet off to places unknown and not have to worry about anything. Once these high rises also contain in house medical care facilities/offices they will take off. After all Houston is #2 to New York for Theater/Arts from what I have read and then you can run downtown to catch a Baseball, Basketball, Hockey, or shop at Houston Pavilions.

My .02cents,

Scharpe St Guy

"Unfortunate" or "Fortunate" would be the question. I think choices are all that!

[bachanon]

i'm sure that there are some on haif that are more privy to the numbers, but i've come across alot of info pertaining to empty nesters and retirees wanting the condo/hi-rise lifestyle. it does not surprise me that 50 and 60 somethings want to be near friends and family while eliminating home ownership responsibilites, increasing security and so on.

i think that developers are anticipating this trend, or are behind it in some markets.

[TheNiche]

i'm sure that there are some on haif that are more privy to the numbers, but i've come across alot of info pertaining to empty nesters and retirees wanting the condo/hi-rise lifestyle. it does not surprise me that 50 and 60 somethings want to be near friends and family while eliminating home ownership responsibilites, increasing security and so on.

i think that developers are anticipating this trend, or are behind it in some markets.

There's a lot of talk about urban professionals and empty nesters, but I have yet to come across a local source that reliably estimates the proportions of these groups that prefer highrise living to other housing products, much less broken further down by annual income. So the concept is very intuitive, but hasn't been verified empirically in any useful way.

[bachanon]

niche, couldn't the enormous size of the baby boomer market be some sort of barometer?

[TheNiche]

niche, couldn't the enormous size of the baby boomer market be some sort of barometer?

Yeah, but what are their preferences, especially at the local level? Not every single one of them is going to want to live in a highrise as compared to another kind of home of similar value, and of those that do, how many can afford it? In other words, how large is the market? These are questions to which I don't have answers. Intuitively, I'm strongly inclined to believe that it'll justify more product, but it is impossible to say how much without some pretty hardcore consumer research.

[ricco67]

Personally I would not live in a high rise however I wonder about the baby boomers? Those that do live in Pearland and are getting close to retiring, no longer wanting nor needing the yard or upkeep associated with.

I would think that quite a few baby boomers will take into consideration the High Rise market due to the amenities and perks associated with them. Ie.. Gyms, Pool, Hot Tub, Valet Service, etc... The ability to catch a shuttle to the airport and jet off to places unknown and not have to worry about anything. Once these high rises also contain in house medical care facilities/offices they will take off. After all Houston is #2 to New York for Theater/Arts from what I have read and then you can run downtown to catch a Baseball, Basketball, Hockey, or shop at Houston Pavilions.

My .02cents,

Scharpe St Guy

There is quite a bit to be said in living in a high density area, or even in a high rise. Having lived in one, I found it most convienent to be able to not worry about the yard, the roof, the fence, and all the other headaches that come to mind when owning/renting a home in pearland or any of the subburbs. Just call me lazy that way.

You would not believe how nice it is to simply walk into your "home" and shut yourself in without the additional worries/hassles that are included in home ownership.

In addition to the amenities that you stated (gym, valet, shuttles) there is also the added security that comes to mind. The added bonus for me, would also be the fact that I would be able to attend more baseball games.

There is also something to be said of merely walking a few feet to your garbage chute in your underwear when it's 30 degrees and raining.

In subburbia (which I have also lived in) it was a major pain to get into town to enjoy the sports, theaters, and concert venues.

Does living in a high rise make you feel like you're living in a bee-hive? Possibly, but most people don't take advantage of their surroundings in the subburbs. Most simply nest and rarely venture out to meet their neighbors. So you're basically doing what a high-rise occupant does, but in a larger home and with a longer commute.

[marc]

[Yeah, but what are their preferences, especially at the local level? Not every single one of them is going to want to live in a highrise as compared to another kind of home of similar value, and of those that do, how many can afford it? In other words, how large is the market? These are questions to which I don't have answers. Intuitively, I'm strongly inclined to believe that it'll justify more product, but it is impossible to say how much without some pretty hardcore consumer research.

Maybe, in addition to all that, marketers are also trying to provide comparable urban styles to those people moving to Houston from more urbanly dense cities. I know some would probably be attracted to Houston's massive urban sprawl (i.e. shopping malls, one's own lawn etc.) but i wonder if most are attracted to the amenities offered by more urbanly dense areas, i.e. Galleria, DT and TMC. What do you think? I know people are leaving places like Cleveland, Detroit, Pitts. and are moving SW. Houston is one of the cities benefitting from this trend. Maybe that's why there is such a market now for highrises all over the city??

[Trae]

Any news on this one yet?

[marc]

Any news on this one yet?

Unfortunately...........nuthin. I cannot find anything more current than the April 2006 announcement.

I hope it is not scrapped. Maybe they are just biding their time to see how the market holds. I HOPE.

[houstonfella]

Turnberry is just getting started on this thing. NO, it isn't scrapped. I think we will see a world class high rise that will be the envy of many other cities. Not that it is unusual for H-town to have 40-story high rises; they are a dime a dozen here. I wouldn't give up my back yard with pool, spa and detached garage for that "urban" living; but lots of folks would. I might, give me a few years when I think about retirement. Otherwise, I'll keep my back yard paradise.

[ricco67]

I drive by this site almost daily, but I've only had a chance to take a quick pic yesterday.

[Trae]

Ah, so it isn't scrapped.

[Montrose1100]

They are just building a "grand" sales office.

[TheNiche]

Maybe, in addition to all that, marketers are also trying to provide comparable urban styles to those people moving to Houston from more urbanly dense cities. I know some would probably be attracted to Houston's massive urban sprawl (i.e. shopping malls, one's own lawn etc.) but i wonder if most are attracted to the amenities offered by more urbanly dense areas, i.e. Galleria, DT and TMC. What do you think? I know people are leaving places like Cleveland, Detroit, Pitts. and are moving SW. Houston is one of the cities benefitting from this trend. Maybe that's why there is such a market now for highrises all over the city??

Yeah, you just hit on one of the demand drivers for Houston's midrise and highrise housing products. I had the priviledge to look over some demographic data for a particularly expensive highrise apartment building last year. It was crawling with ex-Manhattanites and was also very well-represented by other citizens of NYC, Boston, Chicago, and from many international cities. It seems that people moving from urban areas tend to gravitate toward housing with which they're familiar. Anecdotal evidence from my own personal experience also suggests that although Houstonians of moderate incomes may balk at rental rates in midrise and highrise apartments, many folks from the northeast see our 'upscale' urban apartments as inexpensive and will shell out the money for them without a second thought.

[ProHouston]

I drive by this site almost daily, but I've only had a chance to take a quick pic yesterday.

This is what I don't understand, we know they aren't building a 42 story wood frame building, why are they building such a large wood frame building on this site? That building looks way bigger than a sales office needs to be.

[Montrose1100]

This is what I don't understand, we know they aren't building a 42 story wood frame building, why are they building such a large wood frame building on this site? That building looks way bigger than a sales office needs to be.

Look 2 posts up

[marc]

Thanks Niche for the insight. You seem to be in the know...........want to take a stab at how this Turnberry Tower may look? I have seen other Turnberry projects and am inspired, BUT i am afraid it may end up just being a taller tan/beige/yellow/earthtone highrise which seems to have become very popular in that area.

What do you think? Also, regarding the post earlier; i also wonder if those urbanites are attracted to Houston high rise living because of the facets you described in addition to the fact that we are not so dense yet, and most highrise residents still have stellar views of the city without having to look straight across into another highrise. I do love looking at the goings on in NY and Chicago, BUT i wonder if the charm of highrise living gets a bit stale when one's view in across at another window instead of the lakefront or river or over the city itself. Make sense? Houston may not have a lakefront or mountains per se, but she still is very green and provides some really spectacular views of parks and foliage. The lack of density may be a bonus for those wanting highrise living???

Edited October 29, 2006 by marc

[TheNiche]

Thanks Niche for the insight. You seem to be in the know...........want to take a stab at how this Turnberry Tower may look? I have seen other Turnberry projects and am inspired, BUT i am afraid it may end up just being a taller tan/beige/yellow/earthtone highrise which seems to have become very popular in that area.

What do you think? Also, regarding the post earlier; i also wonder if those urbanites are attracted to Houston high rise living because of the facets you described in addition to the fact that we are not so dense yet, and most highrise residents still have stellar views of the city without having to look straight across into another highrise. I do love looking at the goings on in NY and Chicago, BUT i wonder if the charm of highrise living gets a bit stale when one's view in across at another window instead of the lakefront or river or over the city itself. Make sense? Houston may not have a lakefront or mountains per se, but she still is very green and provides some really spectacular views of parks and foliage. The lack of density may be a bonus for those wanting highrise living???

I think that the best indicator for Turnberry's aesthetic will probably be their past projects in other cities. Unfortunately, I don't have insider information on this particular project.

I'd have to agree about the quality of the views, but then that is offset by the fact that, as you pointed out, we aren't very dense. Do Houston's views make up for our general lack of a walkable pedestrian-oriented environment with a good selection of shops at the street level, as is common in NYC and Chicago? That'd be very much a matter of individual preference.