METRORail North Line

[CoolBuddy06]

Back on topic, I'm excited about this extension and the development that I hope comes with it. And personally, it gives my brother-in-law more flexibility in picking his classes at HCC without me having to drive him around.

[kylejack]

That's not what I said. I said Metro shouldn't be financially responsible for rebuilding a street or sidewalks for that matter.

Also riding a train will be much smoother than a bus for people in the north line area.

 

They're only responsible for building the streets they themselves took apart. If I damage my neighbor's sidewalk then I owe him to fix it.

[mfastx]

It would be better if it were elevated the entire length, and if the downtown segments were underground. 

 

Still support and thankful for what we have though. 

[august948]

It's admirable that Houston's new lines are going into low income areas. Many times such projects go into flashy areas for developers to jump on, which is good, but doesn't help the people that need this kind of infrastructure the most. I think part of this is that these neighborhoods aren't morons like Afton Oaks that protest against it.

 

Was that altruism on METRO's part of just because it's cheaper and gets less flack from the neighborhoood (plus being good for the developers who can get adjoining land cheaper)?

 

[bachanon]

It's admirable that Houston's new lines are going into low income areas. Many times such projects go into flashy areas for developers to jump on, which is good, but doesn't help the people that need this kind of infrastructure the most. I think part of this is that these neighborhoods aren't morons like Afton Oaks that protest against it.

 

Was that altruism on METRO's part of just because it's cheaper and gets less flack from the neighborhoood (plus being good for the developers who can get adjoining land cheaper)?

 

Government funding has strings attached. I think one was regarding existing utilized bus routes. It would stand to reason the low income areas nearest downtown, users of mass transit, would fit the bill.

[Slick Vik]

Was that altruism on METRO's part of just because it's cheaper and gets less flack from the neighborhoood (plus being good for the developers who can get adjoining land cheaper)?

A smart neighborhood which realizes the value of being close to a rail line unlike afton oaks who fought tooth and nail to avoid it.

[livincinco]

Government funding has strings attached. I think one was regarding existing utilized bus routes. It would stand to reason the low income areas nearest downtown, users of mass transit, would fit the bill.

 

It's going to be really interesting to see what the impact on bus service is going to be.  Is this designed to augment existing bus routes or is it designed to replace them?

 

[livincinco]

It's going to be really interesting to see what the impact on bus service is going to be.  Is this designed to augment existing bus routes or is it designed to replace them?

 

 

Never mind.  Answered my own question.  The number 15 bus route will be discontinued because it duplicates the route of the North line.  The current average workday ridership of the number 15 route is 2,281 and it saw a 10.3% increase in ridership over the last 12 months.  I would argue that any consideration of ridership numbers for the North line should consider that amount as a shift in existing transit ridership rather than an increase.

 

The projected ridership at opening is 17,400 average weekday boardings which would be a net increase of approx. 15,000.  Interested to see the actual numbers.

 

http://www.fta.dot.gov/documents/TX_Houston_North_Corridor_LRT_complete_profile.pdf

 

Edited October 29, 2013 by livincinco

[august948]

Never mind.  Answered my own question.  The number 15 bus route will be discontinued because it duplicates the route of the North line.  The current average workday ridership of the number 15 route is 2,281 and it saw a 10.3% increase in ridership over the last 12 months.  I would argue that any consideration of ridership numbers for the North line should consider that amount as a shift in existing transit ridership rather than an increase.

 

The projected ridership at opening is 17,400 average weekday boardings which would be a net increase of approx. 15,000.  Interested to see the actual numbers.

 

http://www.fta.dot.gov/documents/TX_Houston_North_Corridor_LRT_complete_profile.pdf

 

I'm curious how they came to an average of 17,400 weekday bordings when the current bus route has 2,281.  Does that represent changed bus routes to force riders onto the rail line?  Is some of it people already on the existing line, just continuing on to destinations on the new segment?  Or did they pull it out of their posterior?

 

[livincinco]

I'm curious how they came to an average of 17,400 weekday bordings when the current bus route has 2,281.  Does that represent changed bus routes to force riders onto the rail line?  Is some of it people already on the existing line, just continuing on to destinations on the new segment?  Or did they pull it out of their posterior?

 

 

Don't know what kind of science went into those numbers.  It'll be fun to watch the actual numbers when they come in though and see what the impact is on impacted bus lines.  (Yes, I realize that qualifies me as a nerd to say that).

[mfastx]

Never mind.  Answered my own question.  The number 15 bus route will be discontinued because it duplicates the route of the North line.  The current average workday ridership of the number 15 route is 2,281 and it saw a 10.3% increase in ridership over the last 12 months.  I would argue that any consideration of ridership numbers for the North line should consider that amount as a shift in existing transit ridership rather than an increase.

 

The projected ridership at opening is 17,400 average weekday boardings which would be a net increase of approx. 15,000.  Interested to see the actual numbers.

 

http://www.fta.dot.gov/documents/TX_Houston_North_Corridor_LRT_complete_profile.pdf

 

I too am anxious to see the APTA report for the line.  We may have to wait around a year or so for ridership to reach full short-term potential (the original line took about a year to reach ~35,000 boardings. 

 

I'm curious how they came to an average of 17,400 weekday bordings when the current bus route has 2,281.  Does that represent changed bus routes to force riders onto the rail line?  Is some of it people already on the existing line, just continuing on to destinations on the new segment?  Or did they pull it out of their posterior?

 

 

Some of the ridership comes from new transit riders who didn't ride the bus before.  Then you have a lot of ridership from people who rode similar (parallel) bus routes before the rail line opened.  Basically what the rail line does is transport many bus route's worth of people and consolidating them into one line.  This allows for greater efficiency long-term and also allows METRO to deploy hundreds of buses elsewhere in the fleet to bolster other lines. 

[livincinco]

I too am anxious to see the APTA report for the line.  We may have to wait around a year or so for ridership to reach full short-term potential (the original line took about a year to reach ~35,000 boardings. 

 

Some of the ridership comes from new transit riders who didn't ride the bus before.  Then you have a lot of ridership from people who rode similar (parallel) bus routes before the rail line opened.  Basically what the rail line does is transport many bus route's worth of people and consolidating them into one line.  This allows for greater efficiency long-term and also allows METRO to deploy hundreds of buses elsewhere in the fleet to bolster other lines. 

 

The question of new transit riders is a big one in my mind because that it is one of the key stated benefits for trains.  I think that it's going to be especially interesting to see how much of an impact that has in a lower income area which probably had a higher rate of transit ridership already.

 

To your point, we should be able to see an impact on ridership on parallel lines and get some feel whether people will bypass a bus station to ride the train. 

 

[musicman]

Too bad the 39 rail cars they bought are way behind schedule with a delivery date of TBD.

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=news/local&id=9303951

You are paying a Spanish company $150 million to make the cars. The first one was supposed to be here in July. Then it slipped to November. Now propulsion issues and a failed leak test are forcing METRO to say there is no scheduled date for delivery.

Edited October 29, 2013 by musicman

[mfastx]

The question of new transit riders is a big one in my mind because that it is one of the key stated benefits for trains.  I think that it's going to be especially interesting to see how much of an impact that has in a lower income area which probably had a higher rate of transit ridership already.

 

To your point, we should be able to see an impact on ridership on parallel lines and get some feel whether people will bypass a bus station to ride the train. 

 

 

I watched an interview with one of the board members and he said that they would be restructuring the bus lines around the rail line to make them more perpendicular as opposed to parallel to the rail line, so it would be a little tough to measure ridership decline in neighboring bus routes. 

 

Although I will say that, according to METRO, around 20,000 of the daily boardings on the Red Line are "new transit riders."  I have no idea where that number comes from or how METRO arrived to that conclusion, so I'd take it with a grain of salt. 

[livincinco]

I watched an interview with one of the board members and he said that they would be restructuring the bus lines around the rail line to make them more perpendicular as opposed to parallel to the rail line, so it would be a little tough to measure ridership decline in neighboring bus routes. 

 

Although I will say that, according to METRO, around 20,000 of the daily boardings on the Red Line are "new transit riders."  I have no idea where that number comes from or how METRO arrived to that conclusion, so I'd take it with a grain of salt. 

 

That makes sense to restructure the lines, but I think that the numbers will still provide interesting data.  Those lines will essentially become feeder lines to the rail line, so I think that it's reasonable to assume that the majority of those riders would ride the bus and the rail.

 

I've saved a copy of the current METRO alignment for future reference.

 

Regarding the new riders on the Red Line, sounds like that's an extrapolated number from a survey.  It depends on the sample size, but I would agree that it's pretty sketchy. 

[IronTiger]

Although I will say that, according to METRO, around 20,000 of the daily boardings on the Red Line are "new transit riders."  I have no idea where that number comes from or how METRO arrived to that conclusion, so I'd take it with a grain of salt. 

[Slick Vik]

Saw this on the side of a bus yesterday

 

Party at Moody Park to celebrate opening of Metro North Line December 21

 

http://www.ridemetro.org/News/Pdfs/Events/NorthLine-Launch-Save-the-date112613.pdf

[Slick Vik]

Going to the celebration?

What: Metropolitan Transit Authority free concert to mark opening of the North Line rail route.

When: 11:30 a.m. to 5 p.m. Dec. 21.

Where: Moody Park, 3725 Fulton St.

Performers: A.B. Quintanilla III y Los Kumbia King All Starz, Mango Punch, Fama, Támar Davis.

[rsb320]

Why are some of the pay stations being removed from some existing stations?  Are they being moved to the new platforms?

[Triton]

This is the future of Houston mass transit... And I mean this station. Don't mean to start an argument here but everything seemed so.. so... un-Houston actually. This Burnett station alone feels like a true mass transit hub.

 

 

Going towards the platform

 

Elevators to send me up

 

Elevators viewed from the second floor

 

Walking towards the platform on the second level

 

North view

 

South view

 

The view from the platform itself

 

Art on the platform

 

Looking from the middle platform

[Howard Huge]

Dont fall on that third rail, Ramo!

[HtownWxBoy]

This is the future of Houston mass transit... And I mean this station. Don't mean to start an argument here but everything seemed so.. so... un-Houston actually. This Burnett station alone feels like a true mass transit hub.

 

 

 

 

North view

 

 

South view

 

Agree! 

[august948]

Anyone got pics as the train goes by Walmart and Northline Commons?  Good to see downtown and museum district residents will have better access to big box stores now.  At least that's a little progress.

[mfastx]

Anyone got pics as the train goes by Walmart and Northline Commons?  Good to see downtown and museum district residents will have better access to big box stores now.  At least that's a little progress.

 

I think this is pretty neat as well.  In Boston the nearest WalMart is quite a hike from public transportation.

[nativehoustonion]

When all the lines are done.  Everyone will see has importing to get cars off the road.  I saw the interview with Mr. Garcia he said we need an extension down I-10 to connect with the Galleria Area.  Once the other lines are running.  Residents can see how rail works.  I like it I will ride it to have some good Mexican food there. 

[IronTiger]

Anyone got pics as the train goes by Walmart and Northline Commons? Good to see downtown and museum district residents will have better access to big box stores now. At least that's a little progress.

That's pretty cool, but unless it was only a small amount (1-2 bags), it would be a pain to bring lots of bags inside of a train. A Walmart is fine and good, but the light rail particularly falls flat when they put it near upscale shopping and expect both of those to be utilized at the same time, which is good, since Houston has no such thing.

[Slick Vik]

That's pretty cool, but unless it was only a small amount (1-2 bags), it would be a pain to bring lots of bags inside of a train. A Walmart is fine and good, but the light rail particularly falls flat when they put it near upscale shopping and expect both of those to be utilized at the same time, which is good, since Houston has no such thing.

Houston has no upscale shopping?

[IronTiger]

Houston has no upscale shopping?

I should clarify--new outdoor shopping centers ("lifestyle centers"), often developed on the spot of a failed mall. We're not talking something like CityCentre either...we're talking glorified shopping centers with some office space thrown into make it "mixed-use".

[Howard Huge]

That's pretty cool, but unless it was only a small amount (1-2 bags), it would be a pain to bring lots of bags inside of a train.

Nope.

I can fit almost a full shopping cart worth of merchandise in this bad boy, and its not a pain at all, its actually easier than carrying bags by hand. Me and the wifey have been waiting for the north line to open so we could finally start taking the train to walmart instead of driving. It was awesome. The best part was saving gas money and helping the environment.

[IronTiger]

On the flip side, since bringing a basket inside the train is both bulky and a bit obnoxious to other passengers, I am forgetting that people take trips differently in urban areas. While I am not a suburbanite per se, going to stores is usually a once a week affair. You can compensate (urban dwellers usually do) by taking more trips but less merchandise per trip.

[DrLan34]

Nope.

I can fit almost a full shopping cart worth of merchandise in this bad boy, and its not a pain at all, its actually easier than carrying bags by hand. Me and the wifey have been waiting for the north line to open so we could finally start taking the train to walmart instead of driving. It was awesome. The best part was saving gas money and helping the environment.

 

Also great for Condo living if that is your deal

[Howard Huge]

On the flip side, since bringing a basket inside the train is both bulky and a bit obnoxious to other passengers

Yea, no.

Lots of people bring these on the trains, they are neither bulky nor obnoxious. Have you ever seen one of these baskets in person? Theyre not as big as you seem to be imagining them.

I guess going by your standards, people in wheelchairs are also "bulky and obnoxious" since they are bigger than my basket. And people who bring their bicycles on the train, oy vey, they must be the anti-christ according to you.

Then again, youve probably never even been on the train, seeing as to how you are unaware how NONE of the above are bulky or obnoxious, and are in fact encouraged.

[Howard Huge]

Also great for Condo living if that is your deal

^ exactly

We bought that because we lived in Houston House for 8 years, its a god send when you have to take groceries from a parking garage, up an elevator, down a long hallway to your unit.

[IronTiger]

I've only been on Houston METRO twice (four if you count return trips) but I am probably imagining one of those baskets as far bigger than they really are.

[Reaper88]

Nope.

I can fit almost a full shopping cart worth of merchandise in this bad boy, and its not a pain at all, its actually easier than carrying bags by hand. Me and the wifey have been waiting for the north line to open so we could finally start taking the train to walmart instead of driving. It was awesome. The best part was saving gas money and helping the environment.

If MetroRail connects to IAH and Hobby, I wonder those light rail cars have spaces for luggages.

 

 

[HoustonIsHome]

If MetroRail connects to IAH and Hobby, I wonder those light rail cars have spaces for luggages.

Don't want to sound harsh, but people fit bicyles and wheel chairs on the rail, you don't think suit cases will fit?

Not accusing you off anything but people who have ridden the rail know that entire seats were removed years ago to make room for bulky items such as bicycles

Edited January 8, 2014 by HoustonIsHome

[mollusk]

I routinely use public transportation for that last stretch from the airport to my destination when it's a viable alternative.  BART in the SF area has cars with a similar layout and available room to what we have with our rail, and I generally don't have a bit of trouble - not even the stink eye from my fellow passengers for taking up too much room.

 

A few years ago BART was extended to SFO, where it has a station in the international terminal w/ connections to the others via the internal train system.  Currently one uses airBART, a shuttle bus, to get to the Coliseum Station from OAK, but an automated rail connector is due to come on line this year.

[Specwriter]

 

A few years ago BART was extended to SFO, where it has a station in the international terminal w/ connections to the others via the internal train system. 

 

and, as I remember, BART tickets for two people from SFO to the middle of town cost a fraction of the cost of a cab ride. I did have to schlep my wife's REALLY heavy luggage up five blocks to the hotel though (and I do mean UP!).

 

[skwatra]

$5 BART vs $35-40 cab ride. But yeah can be a pain to have to walk even a few blocks with a lot of stuff depending on what incline!

[innerloop]

But yeah can be a pain to have to walk even a few blocks with a lot of stuff depending on what incline!

 

We in Houston don't have many inclines, but we do have heat!  I conducted a series of tests downtown a few years ago where I determined that the maximum distance a normal weight man in a suit can walk without getting inappropriately sweaty for the meeting he's going to is five blocks.  More than that and you have to take the tunnels or show up early enough to give yourself time to stop sweating.  I'm being totally serious here.  When I visit New York and London, I never drive, I use the trains and subways.  But Houston is always going to have the problem of heat and sprawl to deal with when it comes to public transport, by that I mean how is any system going to be able to drop people off close enough to their destinations that walking the rest of the way in 90 to 100 degree heat is not a problem?

[Naviguessor]

Then we should stop wearing suits.  Added bonus.

[102IAHexpress]

I don't want to be a Debbie downer about the light rail. But just because you mentioned this station and I wanted to share my observations... I have ridden the light rail everyday this week in the morning, and I have yet to see one person board or exit this station. I hope this is not the future of Houston mass transit...

 

Northline Transit Center and Quitman seem to have the most activity. But again this is just my observation.

 

 

This is the future of Houston mass transit... And I mean this station. Don't mean to start an argument here but everything seemed so.. so... un-Houston actually. This Burnett station alone feels like a true mass transit hub.

 

 

Going towards the platform

 

Elevators to send me up

 

Elevators viewed from the second floor

 

Walking towards the platform on the second level

 

North view

 

South view

 

The view from the platform itself

 

Art on the platform

 

Looking from the middle platform

 

[IronTiger]

But Houston is always going to have the problem of heat and sprawl to deal with when it comes to public transport, by that I mean how is any system going to be able to drop people off close enough to their destinations that walking the rest of the way in 90 to 100 degree heat is not a problem?

There is the tunnel system, you know...

I don't want to be a Debbie downer about the light rail. But just because you mentioned this station and I wanted to share my observations... I have ridden the light rail everyday this week in the morning, and I have yet to see one person board or exit this station. I hope this is not the future of Houston mass transit...

If/when they finish the Hardy Yards redevelopment, expect to see more traffic.

[cloud713]

I don't want to be a Debbie downer about the light rail. But just because you mentioned this station and I wanted to share my observations... I have ridden the light rail everyday this week in the morning, and I have yet to see one person board or exit this station. I hope this is not the future of Houston mass transit...

Northline Transit Center and Quitman seem to have the most activity. But again this is just my observation.

That's odd.. My buddy and I were up there taking photos a week or two ago at around 10pm (on a Sunday i believe.. I had previously been under the impression that the trains didn't run that late on Sundays) and both times the train stopped at the station while we were up there, at least 5-10 people got off or on.

And like iron tiger said, once the Hardy Yards site is developed, and the high speed rail line preferably terminates at Hardy Yards, then traffic will be bustling at that station.

[102IAHexpress]

If/when they finish the Hardy Yards redevelopment, expect to see more traffic.

 

Metro spending scarce resources on a station for a project that may or not be developed is not surprising. We really should just abolish metro and start from scratch.

 

[Chi-Char-Hou-Dal]

Magic Johnson is counting his stacks....When hardy yards and the high speed bullet train to Dallas comes in my son's first daughter will have just been born and I will be 120 years old. I will sit in my hospital bed at Memorial Herman 102 story med center tower and watch as 100s of people climb those stairs. Or

In more like 20 years - hopefully this technology will be outdated. There was a reddit thread saying by 2020 in 6 short years cars will be driving themselves.

Apologies in advance for those I offend. Back to my scotttttchhhhhhh

[Triton]

I don't understand why they still have buses running along light rail here.

[JamesL]

I don't understand why they still have buses running along light rail here.

 

They didn't want to make too many changes when it opened since System Reimagining will be proposing a complete restructuring of the bus network later this year. 

 

http://transitsystemreimagining.com/

[cloud713]

Interesting.. I would of guessed it's because the north line is still getting limited service... Or is it not? I thought they had to turn cars back at UHD because they didn't have the new cars in yet..

[IronTiger]

The bus system clearly needs work, but man do some of the roads need help. I'm pretty sure parts of Richmond haven't been touched since the 1970s, and it shows. Indirectly, the construction of the light rail created nice smooth roads that have been altered for light rail use.