How international is Houston

[Montrose1100]

HA HA HA HA HA!!!    

Well, why didn't you just say that before.  I mean we could have ended this a long time ago if we had known that your girlfriend is THE AUTHORITY on which cities are international ones, and why they are considered international cities.  [sarcasm]

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His girlfriend is just as much as an Authority as you are...

"Mommy! The pots calling the kettle black again!"

[tamtagon]

The Houston Pep Squad, well, they've got spunk!

Houston has many groups making great strides toward the establishment of ancestrial cultures, but it's too new. Many of the immigrants in Houston will be assimilated into American culture leaving just a faint mark on the Internatinal flavor of the metro.

Houston will eventually become a city with many cultural ties to other countries, but most of the claims here are a couple generations premature.

[HOUCAJUN]

His girlfriend is just as much as an Authority as you are...

"Mommy! The pots calling the kettle black again!"

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people think i'm bad, but this discussion is too hot for me.peace out.

[tamtagon]

But, Dallas has to potential to become as big of a melting pot as we are!

I dont think Dallas will ever "catch up" with Houston to be considered as much of a melting pot. The big airport in Dallas with a new international terminal might give the metroplex an immigration boost, but the big ship yard in Houston is a much stronger immigration magnet.

The two cities would do each other a favor if they could just get over it and officially combined efforts to attract more international business.

[h-townrep]

Tulsa, OK is known as the "Oil Capital of the World", we are known as the "Energy Capital of the World."

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That is not true, in other countries especially the OPEC nations we are called the Energy Capital of the world and the Oil capital, in fact Houston took 2 oil companies from Tulsa as well as having many on shore and off shore oil wells. Oil begats energy.

[tamtagon]

What's going to happen to Houston if North Americans stops using so much oil? Like, in 50 years, oil consumption could be a third of what it is today.

[713 To 214]

His girlfriend is just as much as an Authority as you are...

"Mommy! The pots calling the kettle black again!"

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1st of all. . .You should let other grown men speak for themselves.

secondarily. . . I never said that I am an authority on the subject. However, having lived in Houston, Dallas, New York, and D.C., I felt that I could offer a unique/educated perspective to the discussion. Can you say the same?

[713 To 214]

What's going to happen to Houston if North Americans stops using so much oil?  Like, in 50 years, oil consumption could be a third of what it is today.

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Gasp . . .oh no. . . not that. . .whatever shall we do? Well we can still call ourselves the space city . . .right?

[Houston19514]

Only in the minds of Tulsans who are living in something of a time warp is Tulsa still known as the "Oil Capital of the World."

Tulsa, OK is known as the "Oil Capital of the World", we are known as the "Energy Capital of the World."

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[jt16]

"What's going to happen to Houston if North Americans stops using so much oil? Like, in 50 years, oil consumption could be a third of what it is today."

Will never happen. Our growth in consumption will slow down, but this scenario will not happen.

[tamtagon]

Will never happen.

[713 To 214]

It is happening.

[yall_are_nutty]

When you say "oil based energy generation", what exactly are you talking about? Autos? Where do you think think those hybrid cars get their power? There are only two choices for mass markets. Fossil fuels and nuclear. That will not change in your lifetime or your kids or your grandkids.

[worldlyman]

I am a former (but still PROUD) Houstonian who lives in Southern California.

Houston has achieved in less than 25 years what Los Angeles took almost 80 plus years to accomplish in terms of garnering a relative international population in an established way.

Sure, the bean count favors older LA...but the range of diversity in Houston almost matches what's in LA. L.A. has the Polynesian/Hawaiian stuff that Houston doesn't have, but that's OK.

In Houston, you've got Filipino, Colombian, Indonesian, Malaysian, Guatemalan, Peruvian, Korean, El Salvadoran, Lebanese, Thai, Ethiopian, Persian, Russian and etc. restaurants just like LA.

Plus Houston has Nigerian and Pakistani restaurants in spades, things which are more rare here even in SoCal. I love Pakistani food and you cannot find that here in San Diego! (I hear there is a small Pakistani plaza in Orange County somewhere, an hour plus from where I am.)

I think NY's status as "most international US city" is over-rated. (LA still holds that honor in my opinion.) I had a difficult time finding a Vietnamese pho place walking around Chinatown NY, and simply wound up eating at Cafe Sambuca in bordering Little Italy. I'm sure there's pho somewhere in Manhattan, but one finds pho noodle in Houston more easily whether in downtown or the SW or NW.

Just because people in NY see each other on the pedestrian streets doesn't mean they always get along...or think highly of each other. In H-town, folks of different stripes still come together in Kemah, downtown, Galleria waterfall, Sharpstown, Med Center and such even if they have to use automobiles to get there. Houston is rather known for being the big city where the ethnic tensions are less than in others. In pedestrian Chicago and NY, those ethnic enclaves cause people to be so proud of their own ethnicities that they look down on others. In Houston, there is quite less of that strongly identified "ethnic neighborhood." In Houston, sure there are strongly collected ethnic commercial areas but working middleclass people of different cultures/races are interspersed in those juxtaposed lovely ranch houses and apartments all over Alief, Sharpstown, West Chase and West Oaks. This is not to deny the impoverished Latino and African-American slums that exist in Houston however.

Considering that Houston is young and late-starting, it has done an impressive job of almost catching up to the more established cities like LA and NY. Let us not forget that.

I do consider Houston to be in that same class as LA and NY even if those two towns are still "ahead."

[worldlyman]

Really, I'm not too sure any city in Texas meets that benchmark. Trade may facilitate interaction, but until non-business interest in an area becomes a significant visitation factor among International travelers, well, maybe Texas cities should focus on becoming great American cities first.

by tamtagon

Actually Houston more than meets that "benchmark." Internationality more than just visits Houston, it actually lives there. Houston is more than just "business."

The pan-Asian population, for example, increased by 79% from 1990 to 2000. Houston's ethnic diversity is impressive. You can find Asian goodies in NW Houston along Veteran's Memorial, in SW along Bellaire, Bissonnet and Beechnut, along Hillcroft...I mean c'mon.

By this standard, Orlando (and neighboring quarters, Kissimmee), which has a famous rodent that attracts millions of international visiters every year...is a "benchmark." I lived in Central Florida for a few years and quite frankly, Orlando is nothing compared to Dallas or Houston in terms of being great! Orlando is pretty much whitebread compared to those two great Texas cities.

I live in San Diego, but despite its diversity it carries on in a whitebread, countryclub way. In Houston, there is more pride in its diversity and does not seem to have that colonial vibe that still subtly exists here in San Diego.

According to Wikipedia, Houston and Dallas are already "3rd tier" international cities, on par with Amsterdam and the like. Lovely San Diego ("America's Finest City" as they say here) doesn't make the cut yet.

Why there are those who insist that Dallas and Houston are not "great American cities" is quite interesting.

I do get weary of this general, if not unfounded, prejudicial standard and condescension against Houston and Dallas just because they are in Texas. As if being in Texas somehow negates the awesome international populations, ethnic shops, excellent museums and arts, lively nightclub zones and the like which are easily found in those two cities.

[skwatra]

my 2 cents:

i find houston to be a very culturally diverse city. in recent years, i've lived in st. louis, and spent lots of time in manhattan, dallas, orlando, and denver. obviously houston doesn't touch nyc, but i find it to be a lot more diverse then the other cities i mentioned. i actually like denver a lot (except when it gets cold), but it's just not diverse enough for me. i have a friend who moved from LA 6 months ago and feels the same way, he hasn't had a decent thai meal since he got there and he's been looking.

when you go out in houston, you see all types of people together in the same place. we have all types of restaurants and all types of people that for the most part get along. i know a lot of cities have very diverse populations, but at least with the ones i mentioned they don't feel as integrated.

i'm not going to try and rank all these cities (i know i already kinda did), i just think houston's doing just fine.

[skwatra]

I do get weary of this general, if not unfounded, prejudicial standard and condescension against Houston and Dallas just because they are in Texas.  As if being in Texas somehow negates the awesome international populations, ethnic shops, excellent museums and arts, lively nightclub zones and the like which are easily found in those two cities.

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i couldn't agree more. i get so much crap for living here, even from friends who have moved here. they see one truck commercial and it's over.

[Guest Professional Hornblower]

I think the #1 criterion is "How many International House of Pancakes" are there?

Houston - 74

NYC - 62

LA - 48

Chicago - 19

Surprisingly, Jacksonville, Florida has 81...the most of any other North American city.

As can be seen by the number proof here, Houston is the second-most international city in North America.

[skwatra]

^nice

so mr. hornblower, do you think there is a correlation between international cities and fattest cities?

[Guest Professional Hornblower]

Probably.

Houston, New Orleans...

[713 To 214]

I dont think Dallas will ever "catch up" with Houston to be considered as much of a melting pot.  The big airport in Dallas with a new international terminal might give the metroplex an immigration boost, but the big ship yard in Houston is a much stronger immigration magnet.

The two cities would do each other a favor if they could just get over it and officially combined efforts to attract more international business.

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This was taken from the Dallas Forum:

Study: Area is international center

By Diane Smith

Star-Telegram Staff Writer

DALLAS - North Texas is an international center that draws immigrants from across the globe in search of safety and economic opportunities, according to a study released Wednesday.

"Immigrants bring energy and excitement to North Texas," said Anne Marie Weiss-Armush, president of DFW International. The North Texas organization compiled the report to assess how much immigration has grown in the region since the 2000 Census.

The group, an umbrella organization for area ethnic groups, hopes that these findings will help state and local policymakers and educators understand the region's changing demographics, Weiss-Armush said during a news conference at Dallas City Hall.

In 2002, 35 percent of North Texas residents were immigrants. Now, 40 percent are immigrants, defined as foreign-born residents and their children living in Dallas, Tarrant, Collin and Denton counties.

Immigrants were able to find work despite the sluggish economy because the Metroplex still experienced employment growth, said Bernard Weinstein, director for the Center for Economic Development and Research at the University of North Texas.

Immigrants often form new communities as they arrive, Weiss-Armush said. The area along Dallas' Greenville Avenue and east of Park Lane is called Little Ethiopia. Pakistani and Mexican markets vie for space in Arlington while a "Chinatown" has emerged in Richardson.

The study indicates that English is not the first language spoken in 26.3 percent of North Texas homes. In Arlington, 31 percent of residents don't speak English at home.

Weiss-Armush said the number of undocumented immigrants also continues to grow. Many of these newcomers are uninsured and working for subsistence wages.

Immigrants arrive even as the United States debates tighter immigration controls. Since the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, the government has increased the number of border patrol agents on the border with Canada and reassigned others to the Arizona-Mexico border, where many undocumented people attempt to cross. It has also increased remote video surveillance and the use of cameras to detect illegal crossings.

The United States has also tightened its scrutiny of international tourists.

"It has become very difficult for people to come legally to this country," said Jorge Herrera, a member of DFW International's board of directors.

Despite these controls, undocumented immigrants continue to cross into the United States searching for jobs. Herrera said the American ideal -- that hard work enables families to emerge from poverty -- is a strong draw to this region.

[worldlyman]

^nice

so mr. hornblower, do you think there is a correlation between international cities and fattest cities?

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I don't believe in that Men's Fitness "Fattest Cities" deal.

I live in San Diego, supposedly one of the 4 top "slimmest" cities but I see just as many overweight people here as in Houston, relatively speaking. It still has the strip centers, the fast food culture, freeways 'n automobile culture...all the things that are generally American with their attendant negative aspects.

I know Southern California has an overblown image to keep up but obesity and bad diet are generally an all-American problem not just that of Philly, Chicago, Detroit, Houston or cities that Men's Fitness doesn't like. I mean how does a car culture, fast-food crazy city like Los Angeles not be in the same rank as those other "fat" big cities? People take public transit and walk more in Chicago than L.A.

The bizarre sense of formulae that Men's Fitness comes up, calculating the humid days with vitamin shops among other criteria...is B.S. (Men's Fitness is a SoCal-based rag, by the way.) If we go by Men's Fitness bizarre mindset, then the fact that the In-N-Out Burger is so canonized in California while there is no one corresponding burger joint in Houston that gets Houstonians all equally stoked...should be factored in significantly.

There are x amount of people in Houston who work out, no more or less than in San Diego, and no amount of "humidity" turns away an impressive number of strollers and joggers who are out in Memorial Park on any given August day.

Heck, I see more fitness centers in Houston than in San Diego.

Lastly, a Centers for Disease Control study, more accurate than some Men's Fitness SoCal propaganda, spotted San Diego as being number 4 in terms of "obese adults" concerns while Houston was not even in the top 10.

[Houston19514]

I don't believe in that Men's Fitness "Fattest Cities" deal.

I live in San Diego, supposedly one of the 4 top "slimmest" cities but I see just as many overweight people here as in Houston, relatively speaking.  It still has the strip centers, the fast food culture, freeways 'n automobile culture...all the things that are generally American with their attendant negative aspects.

I know Southern California has an overblown image to keep up but obesity and bad diet are generally an all-American problem not just that of Philly, Chicago, Detroit, Houston or cities that Men's Fitness doesn't like.  I mean how does a car culture, fast-food crazy city like Los Angeles not be in the same rank as those other "fat" big cities?  People take public transit and walk more in Chicago than L.A.

The bizarre sense of formulae that Men's Fitness comes up, calculating the humid days with vitamin shops among other criteria...is B.S.  (Men's Fitness is a SoCal-based rag, by the way.)  If we go by Men's Fitness bizarre mindset, then the fact that the In-N-Out Burger is so canonized in California while there is no one corresponding burger joint in Houston that gets Houstonians all equally stoked...should be factored in significantly.

There are x amount of people in Houston who work out, no more or less than in San Diego, and no amount of "humidity" turns away an impressive number of strollers and joggers who are out in Memorial Park on any given August day.

Heck, I see more fitness centers in Houston than in San Diego.

Lastly, a Centers for Disease Control study, more accurate than some Men's Fitness SoCal propaganda, spotted San Diego as being number 4 in terms of "obese adults" concerns while Houston was not even in the top 10.

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Agreed. That Mens Fitness thing is total crap. It is absolutely remarkable (and shameful) that it gets all the publicity it does from "news" media. It is fraudulent to announce the "nation's fattest city" based on a bunch of fairly random criteria (criteria which is generally not very well examined at that) ONLY ONE OF WHICH is the actual level of obesity. And, as usual with bad publicity, Houston (in general, and the Chronicle specifically) buys right into it and hangs its head in shame. I, for one, refuse to buy Mens Fitness magazine because of this annual fraud. If I can't trust them on that, why would I trust them to give me fitness advice?

[worldlyman]

This was taken from the Dallas Forum:

Study: Area is international center

By Diane Smith

Star-Telegram Staff Writer

DALLAS - North Texas is an international center that draws immigrants from across the globe in search of safety and economic opportunities, according to a study released Wednesday.

"Immigrants bring energy and excitement to North Texas," said Anne Marie Weiss-Armush, president of DFW International. The North Texas organization compiled the report to assess how much immigration has grown in the region since the 2000 Census.

The group, an umbrella organization for area ethnic groups, hopes that these findings will help state and local policymakers and educators understand the region's changing demographics, Weiss-Armush said during a news conference at Dallas City Hall.

In 2002, 35 percent of North Texas residents were immigrants. Now, 40 percent are immigrants, defined as foreign-born residents and their children living in Dallas, Tarrant, Collin and Denton counties.

Immigrants were able to find work despite the sluggish economy because the Metroplex still experienced employment growth, said Bernard Weinstein, director for the Center for Economic Development and Research at the University of North Texas.

Immigrants often form new communities as they arrive, Weiss-Armush said. The area along Dallas' Greenville Avenue and east of Park Lane is called Little Ethiopia. Pakistani and Mexican markets vie for space in Arlington while a "Chinatown" has emerged in Richardson.

The study indicates that English is not the first language spoken in 26.3 percent of North Texas homes. In Arlington, 31 percent of residents don't speak English at home.

Weiss-Armush said the number of undocumented immigrants also continues to grow. Many of these newcomers are uninsured and working for subsistence wages.

Immigrants arrive even as the United States debates tighter immigration controls. Since the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, the government has increased the number of border patrol agents on the border with Canada and reassigned others to the Arizona-Mexico border, where many undocumented people attempt to cross. It has also increased remote video surveillance and the use of cameras to detect illegal crossings.

The United States has also tightened its scrutiny of international tourists.

"It has become very difficult for people to come legally to this country," said Jorge Herrera, a member of DFW International's board of directors.

Despite these controls, undocumented immigrants continue to cross into the United States searching for jobs. Herrera said the American ideal -- that hard work enables families to emerge from poverty -- is a strong draw to this region.

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Personally, I don't deny that Dallas is a diverse city. In fact, I'm downright glad it is. When I once had to drop off a friend in New Mexico and dipped down to I-20, zipping to D/FW for a grand pit stop before heading to Houston...I was glad to see Pakistanis manning the convenience store in the outer Fort Worth environs! Being of Filipino ancestry myself, it was a relief after driving through those cowtowns. But folks were nice in Abilene, Amarillo and such (maybe I was just fortunate or Texas homefolks aren't as bad as they say?).

But totally multi-faceted Houston is still "the Los Angeles" of the SE quadrant of the USA (oops Miami, the glitzy palm tree place that has no significant permanent Asian, African and Middle Eastern presence).

[tamtagon]

If anyone knows of a Houston website similar to this one for the Dallas area, I would love to know the address:

http://dfwinternational.org/index.php

While 40% of Metroplex Core County residents are immigrants, defined as foreign-born residents and their children, half of this immigrant population is from Mexico.

[Dallas, Tarrant, Collin, Denton = aprox 5 million residents; 5 x .4 = 2 million. Mexico (total) 1,000,000; (state of Guanajuato) 325,000; (state of San Luis Potosi) 250,000.].

[Houston19514]

Is anyone else just a little skeptical about that article about D-FW immigrant population? 40% of the Metroplex population are immigrants??? and that percentage has risen by 5 points in only 3years??? I'm not sure I'm buying those numbers. Note that these numbers are thrown out there by an "interest group" (and swallowed whole with no skepticism whatsoever by the "journalist".)

According to the US Census, in 2000 the percent of foreign-born population in Dallas County was 20.9%. In Tarrant County: 12.7% Collin County: 13.3% Denton County: 9.4%

[editor]

If anyone knows of a Houston website similar to this one for the Dallas area, I would love to know the address:

http://dfwinternational.org/index.php

While 40% of Metroplex Core County residents are immigrants, defined as foreign-born residents and their children, half of this immigrant population is from Mexico.

[Dallas, Tarrant, Collin, Denton = aprox 5 million residents; 5 x .4 = 2 million.  Mexico (total) 1,000,000; (state of Guanajuato) 325,000; (state of San Luis Potosi) 250,000.].

Where did you get your total Mexican population figure?

The CIA Factbook has it as 104,959,594 (July 2004 est.)

[Houston19514]

Well, the numbers could be skewed. If Hispanics make up at least 30-35%, then that would mean all other immigrants would only have to cover 5-10% to make their numbers work right?

What is it here for Houston?

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Huh? Where did you get the "Hispanics make up at least 30-35%" factoid? And even if it is correct, how is it relevant? Not all Hispanics are immigrants.

Regarding Houston, the 2000 Census for Harris County shows 22.2% foreign born.

[tamtagon]

Is anyone else just a little skeptical about that article about D-FW immigrant population?

[Houston19514]

^

Yeah, I noticed that little definitional "sleight of hand" ;-)

But I still don't think the numbers work. Overall, they are saying that the percentage is more than double what the overall percentage is for those four counties in 2000. Even allowing for children, given that a very large percentage of foreign-born persons are either already married when they come here or marry other foreign-born persons, they would have to be AVERAGING more than four children per couple.

I am trying to avoid spending all day crunching the numbers, but am I making any incorrect presumptions or calculations here?