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Is this Uptown? I know some folks that might not think so...

Let us also not forget that a retail component of this size is no small feat as of right now (today), but that the market will be even more competitive as this nears completion. This will be no walk in the park.

BLVD Place is Uptown, judging by the flying saucers hanging from the intersections. Oaks District doesn't have the UFOs hovering, so perhaps not. Considering its proximity to West Loop as well as Highland Village/River Oaks, however, its situated pretty well.

Edited by buildingunbuildingrebuilding
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BLVD Place is Uptown, judging by the flying saucers hanging from the intersections. Oaks District doesn't have the UFOs hovering, so perhaps not. Considering its proximity to West Loop as well as Highland Village/River Oaks, however, its situated pretty well.

I must admit, it is situated pretty well even if it isn't in Uptown...but then again, so are its prospective competitors that are in Uptown.

I won't count it out, but I'm cautious on this one.

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Why is it that your comments in every thread have to be catty and egotistical? You make yourself appear to be stuck up and elitist. Neither is appreciated on HAIF.

you seem very soft-skinned like one of those realtor-men or something. don't read it if you don't want to. thanks sweetie !

i think everyone knows what a grocery store is, and i don't dispute that or the fact that everyone eats food rich or poor,etc. i am thinking more in terms of highest and best use coupled with sophistication. my understanding is that this was targeted towards high end tenants, not grocers, and cleaners that i am sure we all agree are desireable tenants in retail centers. However, in my estimation the highest and best use at this time for that particular property, specifically the Saks portion would probably have to be Class "A" office space. A grocery store just doesn't seem to be a "fit" for high-end use, but if thats what they are going to have to "try" to ride in with then great, if it even makes it to ground-breaking in the first place.

ps-

it does make me giggle when people try to compare this first of all to a project that has actually broken-ground (houston pavilions), but not only that has a far more sophisticated feel in terms of truly one of a kind national credit tenants, design, and has a 200,000 sf office building on top of the high-end retail. the grocery store just doesn't cut the mustard because it's not quite as sexy as having an office building, house of blues, lucky strike, etc. word.

Edited by what
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What-

Whole Foods is the store that everyone wants to include in their developments nationwide. As far as groceries go, it doesn't get any higher ended. Additionally, this wont be a typical Whole Foods store. This will be HUGE and will include a large prepared foods area, coffeeshop/cafe, and other amenities that will appeal to not only the area's wealthy grocery shoppers but also the THOUSANDS of people who work in the area for lunch and dinner.

Additionally, you apparently haven't read much about the BLVD Place project. It isn't a retail outlet only. It is an integrated mixed-use space that will include retail (yes, that includes Whole Foods), condos, a hotel with condos attached, apartments, and OFFICE SPACE. If you think that a Whole Foods wont attract condo buyers, renters, and employees of the hotel and office towers, then you are NUTS.

Why do you think Mr. Finger is touting his high-end market/wine store in his One Park Place apartment tower?

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What-

Whole Foods is the store that everyone wants to include in their developments nationwide. As far as groceries go, it doesn't get any higher ended. Additionally, this wont be a typical Whole Foods store. This will be HUGE and will include a large prepared foods area, coffeeshop/cafe, and other amenities that will appeal to not only the area's wealthy grocery shoppers but also the THOUSANDS of people who work in the area for lunch and dinner.

Additionally, you apparently haven't read much about the BLVD Place project. It isn't a retail outlet only. It is an integrated mixed-use space that will include retail (yes, that includes Whole Foods), condos, a hotel with condos attached, apartments, and OFFICE SPACE. If you think that a Whole Foods wont attract condo buyers, renters, and employees of the hotel and office towers, then you are NUTS.

Why do you think Mr. Finger is touting his high-end market/wine store in his One Park Place apartment tower?

I think thats great. I just kind of think that grocery stores tend to get just so neat and while they attract apartment dwellers, condos, and residential types, but not sold on it attracting high-end retailers ? Central market is groovy and it has foods area or what we call "delis" in Houston. In fact lots of Grocery stores in Houston and all over the country have these "delis" that you are talking about and they even have "coffee-shop" "cafes" called "Starbucks", so I don't think this will be as much of a novelty for some as you might find it to be. It seems this project is currently being centered around a grocery store as you pointed out that will have a " deli/coffee-donut-sandwich-shop-boutique-for wealthy-people-only". Eatzi's ? i don't think there has ever been anything so amazing to come to Houston ? i bet this grocery store/deli isn't even a sure thing yet. i just think its nuts as you put it to have a grocery store as the thrust of a project as you put it. Once again Fingers is happening, Pavilions is happening and this has not/may not and that's the reality of it. Fingers can because it is actually happening and your point is what exactly ? Hello ???

Edited by what
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I think thats great. I just kind of think that grocery stores tend to get just so neat and while they attract apartment dwellers, condos, and residential types, but not sold on it attracting high-end retailers ? Central market is groovy, but it seems this project is currently centered around a grocery store (maybe) and not much else, and i would bet that is contingent upon a lot of other factors materializing first i'm sure...i just think its nuts as you put it to have a grocery store as the thrust of a project as you put it. Once again Fingers is happening, this has not/may not and that's the reality of it. Fingers can because it is actually happening and your point is what exactly ? Hello ???

Yeah, this is just one big Whole Foods and little else...

BoulevardPlace_lg.jpg

The Whole Foods will contain 100,000 square feet of space

There will be 400,000 thousand square feet for other retail/restaurant space

There will be a 225 room luxury hotel

There will be EIGHT HUNDRED high-rise condos

And yet, all you see is a grocery store. Unbelievable.

Edited by KinkaidAlum
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And yet, all you see is a grocery store. Unbelievable.

And a convenient one too, one that the 800 condo dwellers can visit to shop for groceries without getting in a car! :D

I'm anxious for this project to get started, I want afton oaks to get swamped with traffic. :)

Are you posting this everywhere? :P

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Whole Foods is the store that everyone wants to include in their developments nationwide. As far as groceries go, it doesn't get any higher ended. Additionally, this wont be a typical Whole Foods store. This will be HUGE and will include a large prepared foods area, coffeeshop/cafe, and other amenities that will appeal to not only the area's wealthy grocery shoppers but also the THOUSANDS of people who work in the area for lunch and dinner.

IIRC, when the Central Market site was first razed, it was supposed to make room for Central Market plus a lot of smaller retail spots -- much smaller scale than the BLVD Place plan, but not entirely dissimilar (maybe more like Uptown Park). In the end, it turned into a Central Market with an enormous parking lot. Now, I'm optimistic about BLVD Place as a comprehensive mixed-use project -- BUT while this flagship Whole Foods may be a little more upscale than Central Market, it sounds more like Saks vs. Nordstroms than Saks vs. Sears. Why should we be more confident that a flagship Whole Foods can be a much more successful lure for upscale retail than Central Market?

(Don't get me wrong -- I'm not a complete skeptic like What. I think and hope that the slightly better location, better name recognition, better planning will help. I want to believe in this place, but I don't want to get my hopes up too high.)

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Yeah, this is just one big Whole Foods and little else...

BoulevardPlace_lg.jpg

The Whole Foods will contain 100,000 square feet of space

There will be 400,000 thousand square feet for other retail/restaurant space

There will be a 225 room luxury hotel

There will be EIGHT HUNDRED high-rise condos

And yet, all you see is a grocery store. Unbelievable.

What i see is more coming soon banners being hung up eventually. maybe the ground-breaking of this can be coordinated with the demasis banner being removed from the window downtown. all show..no go.

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neat. there really is a show to watch. maybe there will be one showing how wealthy consumers select rotisserie chicken in the deli. word is that Walmart has deli's in their european and asian stores with rotisserie chickens and coffee shops...

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BLVD PLACE

40bo6kh.jpg

HOUSTON PAVILIONS

2csi2l3.jpg

I am more excited about BLVD place now than I am about the Pavilions.

The Pavilions is looking more and more like Fame City/Fun Plex of the 80's

86245.jpg

Thank god BLVD Place did it right and included residential and a grocery store, TRUE live/work/play envirionment!

That is what a mixed-use/life style center should be! ^_^

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What i see is more coming soon banners being hung up eventually. maybe the ground-breaking of this can be coordinated with the demasis banner being removed from the window downtown. all show..no go.

I hope you're willing to eat your words like semipro did concerning HP once this project breaks ground. Otherwise your rants and whines are truly useless here.

Edited by ProHouston
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People expect things to just go up over night.

Calm down, people. It takes years to acquire the properties, wait for leases to expire, facilitate the needs of existing restaurants and stores so that they have as little disruption as possible, work with the city/county to get the necessary permits to CLOSE A CITY STREET, buy out individual home owners on that street, work with the architecture/design/engineering firms to get the project out of the ground, develop a marketing strategy, etc...

This is a MASSIVE undertaking on one of the busiest interesections in town.

The last thing we need are a bunch of skeptics piping in that this will never happen (ala the Houston Pavilions thread) because it doesn't fit their timeframes regardless of the fact that they have NO CLUE.

Wulfe is a BIG TIME DEVELOPER. This will happen. I was right on the Mosaic thread and the H.P. thread because a development has as much to do with the developers' reputation and skill as anything else.

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BLVD PLACE

40bo6kh.jpg

HOUSTON PAVILIONS

2csi2l3.jpg

I am more excited about BLVD place now than I am about the Pavilions.

The Pavilions is looking more and more like Fame City/Fun Plex of the 80's

86245.jpg

Thank god BLVD Place did it right and included residential and a grocery store, TRUE live/work/play envirionment!

That is what a mixed-use/life style center should be! ^_^

once again...Did what ? What's to get excited about when there is Nothing even there and may never be. i have never seen so much excitement about a grocery store that has a deli. some people really could stand to get out a bit. Secondly, wasn't the Fame/City Fun Plex concept (that you apparently are very familiar with) used by the same realtor-men handling Blvd Place today that ultimately ran Saks Center in the ground shortly after Radler(sp) bought it ? Now it is slated to be torn down. right ? maybe ?

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I am new to this list but I could not resist replying. I am amused by the questions raise about the impact of the Whole Foods market in Blvd. Place. THe national press, namely the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal, have published several articles on developers who solicit Whole Foods to take space in their residential/office/retail developments, and the postive impact Whole Food's presence has on sales/rental prices and the speed space is rented.

As far as the appropriatness of a grocery with a little deli in a major mixed use project, take a look at the massive project at Columbus Circle in Manhattan where a "flagship" Whole Foods anchors the project, which includes upscale retail and restaurants, as well as residential and office space. The dining/take-out section in this Whole Foods makes Eatsi's look like the food counter in the corner Mini Mart.

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neat. there really is a show to watch. maybe there will be one showing how wealthy consumers select rotisserie chicken in the deli. word is that Walmart has deli's in their european and asian stores with rotisserie chickens and coffee shops...

HAHAHAHHAAHAHA

ROFL!!!

I think it had something to do with listening to the video peresentation with that serious voice commentator, then following up with this post latent with all the chicken references.

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As far as the appropriatness of a grocery with a little deli in a major mixed use project, take a look at the massive project at Columbus Circle in Manhattan where a "flagship" Whole Foods anchors the project, which includes upscale retail and restaurants, as well as residential and office space. The dining/take-out section in this Whole Foods makes Eatsi's look like the food counter in the corner Mini Mart.

Exactly. Whole Foods TWC is constantly packed with breakfast, lunch and dinner patrons in addition to afternoon commuters taking home a quality meal. This could be on a smaller yet similar and profitable scale at the San Felipie/Post Oak location.

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I am new to this list but I could not resist replying. I am amused by the questions raise about the impact of the Whole Foods market in Blvd. Place. THe national press, namely the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal, have published several articles on developers who solicit Whole Foods to take space in their residential/office/retail developments, and the postive impact Whole Food's presence has on sales/rental prices and the speed space is rented.

As far as the appropriatness of a grocery with a little deli in a major mixed use project, take a look at the massive project at Columbus Circle in Manhattan where a "flagship" Whole Foods anchors the project, which includes upscale retail and restaurants, as well as residential and office space. The dining/take-out section in this Whole Foods makes Eatsi's look like the food counter in the corner Mini Mart.

That's a fair point. However in researching the WSJ articles specifically with regard to whole foods,

it seems having whole foods was in much greater demand back in 2005. They also seemed to be actually located within the first floor of high-rise condos in other cities. I think timing is important, and sometimes by the time a development actually materializes several years have passed and so have the likes and dislikes of people, and what was in then, may actually be way out by the time a project materializes. I am not saying this is the case, but i have heard about this saks project for a years now...i don't think it is fair to piggy-back off of Houston Pavilions success in breaking ground and moving ahead with their project. Houston has not seen a trophy property like this developed in years from a retail standpoint... Houston Pavilions did a great job of not name-dropping all along the way. Houston Pavilions came and bought the property and it appeared from their drive that failure was not an option. They are the Real Deal. Generally, in cities where House of Blues go in they are really the buzz in the town. Grocerys just aren't quite as sexy, and I don't anticipate any buzz about it. Now moving forward I have not heard much about the "Whole-Foods Avenue" project in terms of securing any other "real" tenants other than the grocery store, nor have I heard about a date for ground-breaking.

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Exactly. Whole Foods TWC is constantly packed with breakfast, lunch and dinner patrons in addition to afternoon commuters taking home a quality meal. This could be on a smaller yet similar and profitable scale at the San Felipie/Post Oak location.

Similar, smaller, profitable like Eatzi's ? Didn't Eatzi's go out of business ? i read somewhere that people couldn't get their meals on Turkey-Day at Eatiz's because they had been closed down un-expectedly. What would make this a better location all of a sudden now for other small grocery store chains ? Even the much nicer and larger center across the street from this center seems to be struggling to get places filled. Then you have the high-end Rice grocery right across from this place and that store doesn't seem to get an over-whelming amount of business either and it is immediately across the street from those 2 super-high-rise condo Four-Leaf buildings, and there already is no lack of neighborhoods in this area that i'm aware of. a good tenant mix might make all the difference in the world, but when there is already so much duplication in tenants already you might have to take a grocery store instead of a book store, or a chester-chicken instead of a cafe express, etc. LOL !

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I am new to this list but I could not resist replying. I am amused by the questions raise about the impact of the Whole Foods market in Blvd. Place. THe national press, namely the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal, have published several articles on developers who solicit Whole Foods to take space in their residential/office/retail developments, and the postive impact Whole Food's presence has on sales/rental prices and the speed space is rented.

As far as the appropriatness of a grocery with a little deli in a major mixed use project, take a look at the massive project at Columbus Circle in Manhattan where a "flagship" Whole Foods anchors the project, which includes upscale retail and restaurants, as well as residential and office space. The dining/take-out section in this Whole Foods makes Eatsi's look like the food counter in the corner Mini Mart.

I agree with you wholeheartedly. If anyone ever goes to DT Austin look at the impact the Whole Foods has there. That grocery store brings so much foot traffic and basically anchors that area of DT. Additionally, residential is happening in that area. The good thing about Whole Foods is they make the store a destination. This is why they are so successful. In Austin around lunch time, there is a ton of traffic in and out of the store. Not to mention the concerts occurring there, and the push of the stores to become a part of the neighborhood.

As for the stores being more in demand in 2005, go to the store on West Alabama and see if the demand there has slacked off. My wife and I have to wake up early on the weekend just to be able to ensure we get a parking spot. I just wish they would build in Midtown!

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I agree with you wholeheartedly. If anyone ever goes to DT Austin look at the impact the Whole Foods has there. That grocery store brings so much foot traffic and basically anchors that area of DT. Additionally, residential is happening in that area. The good thing about Whole Foods is they make the store a destination. This is why they are so successful. In Austin around lunch time, there is a ton of traffic in and out of the store. Not to mention the concerts occurring there, and the push of the stores to become a part of the neighborhood.

As for the stores being more in demand in 2005, go to the store on West Alabama and see if the demand there has slacked off. My wife and I have to wake up early on the weekend just to be able to ensure we get a parking spot. I just wish they would build in Midtown!

If the demand is as great as some think then Whole Foods might decide to find another better location that is a sure thing, so they can go ahead and get started. Go to the one on Westheimer, always parking...I don't believe it changed up the entire area. I think more people go to HEB?Central Market anyway...and they would probably do the same at this location too if it even breaks ground or if they don't end up somewhere else first. In fact, I think bellaire would be a great area for Whole Foods with much more demand than Midtown and with fewer quality stores. There are a lot of properties along S. Rice,near Sams...very close to the Galleria.

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Where is there a Whole Foods on Westheimer?

I know there is one on Kirby near West Alabama and there is one on Woodway near Voss but I am unaware of one of Westheimer. Additionally, the Woodway Store will close once the new one is built. Whole Foods doesn't saturate the market with stores unlike most other chains.

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I don't think that will be a problem in that particular part of town. as the area gets more densely populated, people would be less inclined to drive further than necessary. plus you're actually talking about 3 different markets, demographically they're the same, but different neighborhoods. :)

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it seems having whole foods was in much greater demand back in 2005.

They have simply matured as a company, just like nearly every other successful retail chain before them. That's how a product cycle works. Introduction is tough, but it gains appeal. They roll out the format to new test markets, slowly at first, then building in speed as the concept is proven, and then they enter a period of rapid expansion. At a certain point, they tap out most of their core demographic, and slow down the pace of new store openings, taking care to choose sites that are at least marginally profitable. At some point, things level off. Depending upon the appeal of the brand, it may last a few years or for decades, but it'll likely decline at some point due to mismanagement (from operational inefficiencies, failure to adapt to changing consumer preferences, failure to quash the imitators, etc.).

The point is, though, that they've just gotten to the point that most of the viable markets are tapped. That doesn't mean that their concept is any less in demand, just that they've satiated the market and now have emerging competition.

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Where is there a Whole Foods on Westheimer?

I know there is one on Kirby near West Alabama and there is one on Woodway near Voss but I am unaware of one of Westheimer. Additionally, the Woodway Store will close once the new one is built. Whole Foods doesn't saturate the market with stores unlike most other chains.

I believe it was actually the second store Whole Foods opened in Houston and it has been located at Westheimer/Wilcrest for over 7-10 years now...across the street from Randalls.

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Prediction on BLVD Place:

Wulff (sp?) waits too long and misses the market for the upscale hotel he has been trying unsuccessfully to court for the past 2+ years. He realizes the land prices in the market have increased so dramatically that he (gasp!) ends up selling off out parcels to other developers who are willing to actually develop the site.

I know, I know. He has a plan and has everything under control, yet under wraps.

I know Whole Foods is a done deal. Hanover (allegedly) is a done deal. However, nothing else seems to be moving.

The longer nothing happens, the more this deal smells.

Greetings and salutations.

TNJ

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