New Dart Lines Get $700m Pledge

[slfunk]

New DART lines get $700M pledge

Federal aid is 'a big deal for Dallas,' will help build NW-SE rail route

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dw...nt.61a4622.html

08:17 AM CST on Wednesday, February 8, 2006

By TONY HARTZEL / The Dallas Morning News

"DART's light-rail expansion plans got a major boost Tuesday when federal officials announced that they will support the transit agency's $700 million funding request to help build the northwest and southeast rail lines."

".....the largest grant devoted to a single transit agency in this year's new funding agreements. DART will get the initial installment of $80 million next fiscal year...."

"..."This is a big deal for Dallas," said Sandy Bushue, deputy administrator of the Federal Transit Administration....Ms. Bushue said that she and other federal officials were impressed with Dallas Area Rapid Transit's commitment to also spend $700 million of its own money to build the 21 miles of rail from Pleasant Grove to Farmers Branch. "It's positive for DART and the citizens of Dallas. It shows the citizens have made a commitment to transit."..."

"....Although federal budgets continue to tighten, most FTA funding requests encounter little or no opposition by the time they reach Congress. "...."

"...."Today's announcement cements DART as a national transit leader," Ms. Johnson said in a statement. "FTA's decision brings us one step closer to improving the overall quality of life for the entire North Texas region."..."

DART's role, impact

"DART's role in moving people around North Texas and in station-area economic development were keys to getting the funding approval, said Chris Paulitz, spokesman for Republican Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchison. "

"..."DART has demonstrated exactly how these projects should be done," he said."

"DART has spent about $500 million in federal funds for its existing system. Several years ago, it received federal approval to spend $60 million that it had saved by coming under budget on part of the red line, which runs from west Oak Cliff to Plano. The agency used the money on items including expansion of a Bush Turnpike station parking lot and the purchase of more light-rail vehicles. "

"The pace of new rail construction should pick up dramatically starting this summer after a three-year lull during which DART built only one mile of light rail. "

Expansion plans

"The 21 miles of light rail that will be built with the help of federal money is less than half of DART's planned expansion over the next seven years....By 2013, if DART's schedule holds, rail lines also will reach Carrollton, Irving, Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport and Rowlett. When those phases are complete, DART's existing 45-mile rail network will double in size. Three more miles of rail are scheduled to open in south Oak Cliff in 2018.....When complete, the new rail lines will connect with the current system to provide access to two major airports, Dallas' hospital district, American Airlines Center, downtown Dallas, Fair Park and many businesses in surrounding suburbs...."It's not just new rail lines, but it's how they contribute to ridership throughout the entire DART system," said Sean Libberton, the FTA chief of the agency's analysis division...."

Other regions with new funding agreements to be approved this year include Salt Lake City, which will receive $489 million; Portland, Ore., which will receive $334 million; and Denver, which will get $290 million.

[Talbot]

I wish we could get that here in Houston.

The federali's are a bunch of losers.

[houstonsemipro]

Houston is some dumb MoFo's!

[The Great Hizzy!]

How do you know they're dumb?

The process of receiving federal dollars is intricate. Dumb Mo-Fo's don't build their own rail line with their own money with greater results (and efficiency) than everyone else who used federal money. Cut 'em some slack.

Politics. And red tape. That's what's kickin'.

But that's not even as relevant as the fact that DART has been working to secure these monies for said projects for a while now, for about as long as before METRO even started construction on its fledgling rail line. You don't ask the Feds for hundreds of millions of dollars and expect them to give it up in just a couple of years. It takes time to do the proper research to make the right presentation and then muscle your way in line for said funds.

Only $1.5 billion was allotted. Chump change when you have dozens of transit agencies competing.

[Talbot]

Actually Houston is doing almost all they can to get some funding. It's more like the FTA is some dumb mofo's.

Of course though Semi, we know with you whatever goes wrong it's most likely that it's the fault of Houston being one big dumb mofo.

[tierwestah]

Good point Great Hizzy! The City of Houston has done the best work with what little resources they had.

To Semipro: Even though sometimes i share your frustration with Houston, i gotta call you out on this one. There's four different directions you can use to hightail out of this city! What's keeping you here?

[firstngoal]

I wish we could get that here in Houston.

The federali's are a bunch of losers.

Good for Dallas... and I mean that. They continue to win, win, win in capturing federal and state dollars for their city. I gotta hand it to them.

This is an example of what strong leadership - and a commitment to a plan - can do for a city. Houston has spent the last 20 years arguing about plans, voting on rail over and over, and letting elected officials (Delay, Culberson, etc...) repeatedly sidetrack any momentum on transportation initiatives.

So, now we sit with a mere 7.5 miles of rail, no commuter rail system whatsoever, and countless clogged arteries. Our streets are in horrible shape - and many of our most important freeway corridors have many years of construction ahead of them. I really like Houston - but am continually frustrated by our lack of planning, and although I hate to admit it, our pathetic leadership. We should all be outraged at how few federal dollars come back to our city - while Washington continues to ship millions and millions to Dallas, Atlanta, Denver, etc...

I just got back from Denver... check out their plans. http://rtd-denver.com/ Amazingly proactive, well-planned, and very popular among citizens and leaders. It is plans like this - and seeing what Dallas has done - that should light a fire under our reps in DC. But I won't hold my breathe.

[banking214]

Good for Dallas... and I mean that. They continue to win, win, win in capturing federal and state dollars for their city. I gotta hand it to them.

This is an example of what strong leadership - and a commitment to a plan - can do for a city. Houston has spent the last 20 years arguing about plans, voting on rail over and over, and letting elected officials (Delay, Culberson, etc...) repeatedly sidetrack any momentum on transportation initiatives.

So, now we sit with a mere 7.5 miles of rail, no commuter rail system whatsoever, and countless clogged arteries. Our streets are in horrible shape - and many of our most important freeway corridors have many years of construction ahead of them. I really like Houston - but am continually frustrated by our lack of planning, and although I hate to admit it, our pathetic leadership. We should all be outraged at how few federal dollars come back to our city - while Washington continues to ship millions and millions to Dallas, Atlanta, Denver, etc...

I just got back from Denver... check out their plans. http://rtd-denver.com/ Amazingly proactive, well-planned, and very popular among citizens and leaders. It is plans like this - and seeing what Dallas has done - that should light a fire under our reps in DC. But I won't hold my breathe.

Denver does have a great system. I never thought I would ride a DART train, but to be honest, I use it all the time now. I can walk out my office door, head up a few stations, meet friends for lunch and then back to work. The even better thing is that soon I will be able to leave my house, walk a few blocks, jump on the DART and get to American Airlines center, downtown, South Dallas. I look forward to the line to the airports.

Growing up in Houston it just seemed to me that everyone argued, never did anything. They spent money for a line from downtown to Reliant. One reason: SUPER BOWL. It is time to stop the fighting and move on with rail lines. I would love to have seen a sunken 1-10 (Katy Freeway) with a rail line down the middle. I think Houston did the right thing when the buried part of Southwest Freeway. I think that is a great drive with the bridges. I am a 3rd generation Houston and I am really ready to see some change.

[TxDave]

I will not pretend to know the truth or details behind this claim, but I have heard that part of Houston's struggle to get rail going has been due to Tom Delay using his power to aggressively block Houston rail plans in favor of highway construction in his district.

If this is true, is there a possibility that given Delay's current troubles, the noose could be loosened around funding for MetroRail?

This discussion may belong (or may already be covered) in another thread, but thought it relevant to this topic.

[houstonsemipro]

Since DART is so successful, while Metro isn't. Let's get DART here in Houston, maybe then we could stop fighting over funds.

Damn, is everything that Houston do is slow? And were the 4th largest city in the nation? Hell, Dallas act more like the 4th largest city then Houston, and you could take that to the bank.

[Talbot]

Since DART is so successful, while Metro isn't. Let's get DART here in Houston, maybe then we could stop fighting over funds.

Damn, is everything that Houston do is slow? And were the 4th largest city in the nation? Hell, Dallas act more like the 4th largest city then Houston, and you could take that to the bank.

Obviously you ignored everyones post, so I guess there's no getting through to you.

[The Great Hizzy!]

Oh, let him bellyache. Maybe its therapeutic.

[VelvetJ]

Good for Dallas... and I mean that. They continue to win, win, win in capturing federal and state dollars for their city. I gotta hand it to them.

This is an example of what strong leadership - and a commitment to a plan - can do for a city. Houston has spent the last 20 years arguing about plans, voting on rail over and over, and letting elected officials (Delay, Culberson, etc...) repeatedly sidetrack any momentum on transportation initiatives.

So, now we sit with a mere 7.5 miles of rail, no commuter rail system whatsoever, and countless clogged arteries. Our streets are in horrible shape - and many of our most important freeway corridors have many years of construction ahead of them. I really like Houston - but am continually frustrated by our lack of planning, and although I hate to admit it, our pathetic leadership. We should all be outraged at how few federal dollars come back to our city - while Washington continues to ship millions and millions to Dallas, Atlanta, Denver, etc...

I just got back from Denver... check out their plans. http://rtd-denver.com/ Amazingly proactive, well-planned, and very popular among citizens and leaders. It is plans like this - and seeing what Dallas has done - that should light a fire under our reps in DC. But I won't hold my breathe.

This post was absolutel RIGHT ON!!!!!! Houston shouldn't really have anything to say about other smaller cities getting more money. WE put ourselves in this situation. It's time Houston got leaders with some legitimate VISION and it only magnifies the setback Houston suffered with the election of certain leaders of our past. I've said this many many times about how Houston always seem to be a step behind. We always seem to understand after everyone else has understood. We seem to have lost our "edge" on some issues and totally think like we are a small town.

Dallas' progress in certain areas will only magnify our deficits in those areas, and rail is a prime example of that. Again, I say good for them.

[RedScare]

Umm...would any of you Houston/Metro bashers change your minds if you realized that this $700 million was only a "pledge"? If Houston sucks for not getting a "pledge" this year, are they great for getting a $1 Billion "pledge" last year?

DART is getting $80 million this year. METRO got $245 million in July, plus an additional $10 million in November. Does this make Houston and METRO 3 times as "VISIONARY" as Dallas and DART?

I am glad DART is getting some federal dollars to add onto their system. But, to say that shows Houston and METRO failed because they did not get any money this year, shows more ignorance on the part of the posters than lack of planning on the part of METRO.

Read the article before you jump to conclusions.

[banking214]

Umm...would any of you Houston/Metro bashers change your minds if you realized that this $700 million was only a "pledge"? If Houston sucks for not getting a "pledge" this year, are they great for getting a $1 Billion "pledge" last year?

DART is getting $80 million this year. METRO got $245 million in July, plus an additional $10 million in November. Does this make Houston and METRO 3 times as "VISIONARY" as Dallas and DART?

I am glad DART is getting some federal dollars to add onto their system. But, to say that shows Houston and METRO failed because they did not get any money this year, shows more ignorance on the part of the posters than lack of planning on the part of METRO.

Read the article before you jump to conclusions.

You have to have money and vision, METRO has not vision in my mind. I was born here and raised here and METRO has never changed in my opinion.

[I will contradict you]

Umm...would any of you Houston/Metro bashers change your minds if you realized that this $700 million was only a "pledge"? If Houston sucks for not getting a "pledge" this year, are they great for getting a $1 Billion "pledge" last year?

DART is getting $80 million this year. METRO got $245 million in July, plus an additional $10 million in November. Does this make Houston and METRO 3 times as "VISIONARY" as Dallas and DART?

I am glad DART is getting some federal dollars to add onto their system. But, to say that shows Houston and METRO failed because they did not get any money this year, shows more ignorance on the part of the posters than lack of planning on the part of METRO.

Read the article before you jump to conclusions.

First of all Red I'd like to declare a truce(I know we started out bad). Second Dart has been around much longer than the Houston Metro, meaning it got its start up funding just like the Metro. Also the DArt is more profitable as of this moment, once again because it as been around longer and has lines that are as of this moment more available for use than the Metro. Dart getting this pledge of 700 million dollars proves that the Federal Government believes that Dart is a profitable and a good light rail system. Now I'm not saying the Metro is bad, but it has some catching up to do. Also once again Dart does not need a billion dollars because they're profitable for the time being.

[RedScare]

First of all Red I'd like to declare a truce(I know we started out bad). Second Dart has been around much longer than the Houston Metro, meaning it got its start up funding just like the Metro. Also the DArt is more profitable as of this moment, once again because it as been around longer and has lines that are as of this moment more available for use than the Metro. Dart getting this pledge of 700 million dollars proves that the Federal Government believes that Dart is a profitable and a good light rail system. Now I'm not saying the Metro is bad, but it has some catching up to do. Also once again Dart does not need a billion dollars because they're profitable for the time being.

NO transit agency is profitable...period. They are not designed to be, nor are they expected to be. A well run transit system may cover 25% of it's expenses through fare revenue. Further, both DART and METRO rely on a one cent sales tax to subsidize their operations. Even that is not enough. They rely on federal grants to purchase busses, rail cars and build track. Both DART and METRO have passed bond referendums to help build their systems as well.

Houston's METRO was created by the voters in 1978. DART voters did not approve DART until 1983, so DART is not older. DART did however, begin their rail system several years sooner. They also are farther along in planning for the extensions that the FTA pledged to support. Houston's North ans Southeast sections are not far enough along in design to warrant funding.

Neither the age of DART, nor it's "profitability" had anything to do with it's funding pledge. The advanced stage of engineering and design had everything to do with it.

[I will contradict you]

NO transit agency is profitable...period. They are not designed to be, nor are they expected to be. A well run transit system may cover 25% of it's expenses through fare revenue. Further, both DART and METRO rely on a one cent sales tax to subsidize their operations. Even that is not enough. They rely on federal grants to purchase busses, rail cars and build track. Both DART and METRO have passed bond referendums to help build their systems as well.

Houston's METRO was created by the voters in 1978. DART voters did not approve DART until 1983, so DART is not older. DART did however, begin their rail system several years sooner. They also are farther along in planning for the extensions that the FTA pledged to support. Houston's North ans Southeast sections are not far enough along in design to warrant funding.

Neither the age of DART, nor it's "profitability" had anything to do with it's funding pledge. The advanced stage of engineering and design had everything to do with it.

You really don't want to make peace, if you want to go on the offense, I'll give you some 1995 Cowboy's defense and you can use your crappy Texan's defense.

If Houston's Metro rail was approved in 1978 as you said, they must be really bad at planning i mean thats pretty embarrassing to take 26 years to build light rail system. That doesn't sound to planned out to me. Also the age of the Dart's rail can be factored into the pledge because age can you tell how much has been done and how much experience something might have. Also by profitability I meant the development the Dart spurred, some 3.3 billion. I haven't heard how much the Metro's rail has spurred. Once again the Dart Rail is older the Metro Rail like I said in my previous post which you were not paying attention to. Dart Rail was completed in 1996, while the Houston Metro was completed in 2004. Unless you can't do math it seems to me the Dart Rail is 8 years older than the Houston Metro. Also Dart 43 miles compared to Metro's 12 miles.

Once again I am willing to declare peace and set aside differences, but If your not willing keep obeying your violent mind.

[RedScare]

I'm not sure what this truce talk is all about. I assume that your 2 deleted posts were attacks. I never read them.

I have no gripe with you, but I am entitled to respond if I think your post is inaccurate. The Federal Transportation Admin does not give grants based on how much development a rail line spurs, nor does it matter how large your system is. The grants are based on how much the new line costs versus projected ridership. If the ridership is too low, or the cost too high, you won't get money.

But, assuming the things you mention ARE important, can you explain why METRO was pledged one billion dollars in July, and DART was only pledged $700 million? Is it because Houston's rail line is better?

[I will contradict you]

The Dart's rail line has recieved over a billion dollars over the years, as much Dallas would like this grant of one billion dollars it does not need it. Also the Dart does not need a rapid development at once but rather small step development because it already has done an all at once development. The Metro is a new train line and needs a full all out major development all at once before it can secure the baby step pace. I'm not sure if this makes sense I'm only 14 after all. Yet I'm trying to say Dallas does not need a billion dollars all at once because it has already built half of its rail plan. Metro on the other hand has only built a small portion of it master plan and needs to do a major expansion of its rail, just like Dart did in 2002.

[nmainguy]

The Dart's rail line has recieved over a billion dollars over the years, as much Dallas would like this grant of one billion dollars it does not need it. Also the Dart does not need a rapid development at once but rather small step development because it already has done an all at once development. The Metro is a new train line and needs a full all out major development all at once before it can secure the baby step pace. I'm not sure if this makes sense I'm only 14 after all. Yet I'm trying to say Dallas does not need a billion dollars all at once because it has already built half of its rail plan. Metro on the other hand has only built a small portion of it master plan and needs to do a major expansion of its rail, just like Dart did in 2002.

I'll take your word that you are only 14 YO and give you a pass.

This is not a Dallas vs. Houston thing nor is it a Red vs. I will thing. It's about how dollars are allocated and why. Sometimes they are allocated on merit and unfortunatly many times they are allocated based on political finese. I suggest everyone read the facts-they are there to be found-and fight our fights with those facts.

On a personal note, Red will have to get behind me in the line of people who wouldn't lower themselves to using the Texans stats for squat.

[firstngoal]

Umm...would any of you Houston/Metro bashers change your minds if you realized that this $700 million was only a "pledge"? If Houston sucks for not getting a "pledge" this year, are they great for getting a $1 Billion "pledge" last year?

DART is getting $80 million this year. METRO got $245 million in July, plus an additional $10 million in November. Does this make Houston and METRO 3 times as "VISIONARY" as Dallas and DART?

I am glad DART is getting some federal dollars to add onto their system. But, to say that shows Houston and METRO failed because they did not get any money this year, shows more ignorance on the part of the posters than lack of planning on the part of METRO.

Read the article before you jump to conclusions.

I was raised in this city, have always defended Houston, and pay a great deal of taxes to try and keep it going strong. I did not bash Houston - I merely stated that we do not -and have not - historically gotten our share of federal dollars that we send to Washington. Dallas has gotten much more back through time - look at their infrastructure for evidence of that! And since I knew someone would say I'm favoring Dallas (and I admit - I like it, too!), I also gave the example of Denver. That metro area has half the population of Houston - half - but has aggressively developed a plan, gathered support of their voters, and then had the people's will fought for by dedicated leaders in Denver and Washington. I would hope people would take a look at their FasTracks project to realize that it does take a concensus - and follow through by leaders - to address transportation issues (and funding). Denver is in the midst of planning, building, and implementing one of the most aggressive transportation plans in U.S. history. Meanwhile, Houston's "plans" continue to change and shrink. We haven't had synchronicity in Houston - period - and we have not gotten our share of the pie as a result. Can anyone really argue that fact?

Houston's voters did approve rail a long time ago, but OUR will has been continually derailed by suburban interests and Congressmen with huge egos over the past two decades. How sad that METRO's biggest advocate on the national level is Kay Bailey Hutchinson - the Senator from, you guessed it, Dallas. Thank God she has gone to battle for H-town countless times in order to get transportation dollars - at the same time our local reps did everything they could to prevent federal dollars from coming here. Year after year... vote after vote... this same thing happened. And when we FINALLY get approval to build our first rail line, we have to finance the whole thing locally! No fed money went into that... and that is wrong. Houston - by the choice of its own leadership - has been treated differently than any other major metropolitan area in the country. And it is that fact that not only ticks me off, but makes me want to go to fight for this town and get our share. So, you are wrong when you call me a "basher" - I just want what is best for our town. And there is no need to go further by calling other posters ignorant... c'mon, let's be civil.