Discovery Green At 1500 McKinney St.

[quietstorm]

17 hours ago, UtterlyUrban said:

"Balance"? There is no balance.  Every year for at least the last several large areas of the lawns turn to dirt due to the stress of over-programming in the park. For the record, two years ago I sent an email to park management suggesting that the condition of the lawns were a direct result of over-programming.  They sent me a similar response to the above.  In two years the "balance" they have struck continues to result in fields of dust.....  Great balance for a place called Discovery GREEN.

I would agree. The grass on the Miller Outdoor Theater hill seems to be "stronger". Seems as if there could be a different type of grass used that could better withstand the wear. The green areas around Chicago's Millennium Park and Central Park in NYC seem to do much better. We can do better as well.

[lockmat]

2 minutes ago, quietstorm said:

I would agree. The grass on the Miller Outdoor Theater hill seems to be "stronger". Seems as if there could be a different type of grass used that could better withstand the wear. The green areas around Chicago's Millennium Park and Central Park in NYC seem to do much better. We can do better as well.

 

Good observation. I'm not sure Miller has the same amount of traffic as DG but I still agree with you. Is Miller's grass st. augustine? I'm not a grass expert but the grass in DG is better for looking at and not so much traffic. It's too fine and soft. Its not as pretty but I think they'll eventually have to go to St. augustine. 

[quietstorm]

1 hour ago, lockmat said:

 

Good observation. I'm not sure Miller has the same amount of traffic as DG but I still agree with you. Is Miller's grass st. augustine? I'm not a grass expert but the grass in DG is better for looking at and not so much traffic. It's too fine and soft. Its not as pretty but I think they'll eventually have to go to St. augustine. 

I agree - St. Augustine is the way to go.  

[Moore713]

Oddly enough there are whole section of DT that could be converted to massive urban park..

[BeerNut]

16 hours ago, lockmat said:

 

Good observation. I'm not sure Miller has the same amount of traffic as DG but I still agree with you. Is Miller's grass st. augustine? I'm not a grass expert but the grass in DG is better for looking at and not so much traffic. It's too fine and soft. Its not as pretty but I think they'll eventually have to go to St. augustine. 

 

It's definitely not St. Augustine on the hill at Miller.

[HOUCAJUN]

Who would I need to talk to to get the " WE LOVE HOUSTON" sign moved to Discovery Green. People   would love to take a picture with it and it would become an iconic symbol   for Houston . Let's   get the ball rolling  on  this  

 

[Houston19514]

5 minutes ago, HOUCAJUN said:

Who would I need to talk to to get the " WE LOVE HOUSTON" sign moved to Discovery Green. People   would love to take a picture with it and it would become an iconic symbol   for Houston . Let's   get the ball rolling  on  this  

 

Not a bad idea.  It would be nice to have that sculpture in a more accessible spot.

 

Discovery Green Conservancy seems like a good place to start, or maybe one or more of the Conservancy's board members or officers. 

 

Wouldn't hurt to contact the Mayor too.

Edited May 16, 2016 by Houston19514

[lockmat]

44 minutes ago, Houston19514 said:

Not a bad idea.  It would be nice to have that sculpture in a more accessible spot.

 

Discovery Green Conservancy seems like a good place to start, or maybe one or more of the Conservancy's board members or officers. 

 

Wouldn't hurt to contact the Mayor too.

 

Maybe somewhere in Buffalo Bayou would be better? DG is kind of packed already

[kbates2]

Throw it up on a downtown block with only one building and a large plaza such as Chase.

[BeerNut]

18 hours ago, HOUCAJUN said:

Who would I need to talk to to get the " WE LOVE HOUSTON" sign moved to Discovery Green. People   would love to take a picture with it and it would become an iconic symbol   for Houston . Let's   get the ball rolling  on  this  

 

This is actually a good idea.  I'm not a selfie, Instagram, snapchat person but people really get into these things.  I'll admit even I took a picture of my reflection in 'The Bean.'

[tigereye]

On May 16, 2016 at 4:47 PM, HOUCAJUN said:

Who would I need to talk to to get the " WE LOVE HOUSTON" sign moved to Discovery Green. People   would love to take a picture with it and it would become an iconic symbol   for Houston . Let's   get the ball rolling  on  this  

 

 

Great idea. In addition to Discovery Green Conservancy, I'd recommend DowntownHouston.org

 

While you're at it, I've always felt David Adickes' Fab Four belonged somewhere downtown. Sure the Beatles have no connection to the city but it's a cool sculpture and should be displayed in a prime spot. And IIRC, it's still without a home, currently in storage at his Nance St office. 

 

 

On May 16, 2016 at 5:36 PM, lockmat said:

 

Maybe somewhere in Buffalo Bayou would be better? DG is kind of packed already

 

Sculpture Hill. Bulldoze the hill for this? 

 

"We Love Houston" sign here could serve as a gateway for visitors being across the street from both Marriott Marquis & GRBCC. 

Edited May 18, 2016 by tigereye

[Moore713]

I have always felt that sam Houston statue was being wasted and it would look great Downtown. ..there a gap between the highway  along the buyou that would look great coming into downtown 

[bobruss]

Lets leave Sam back home in Huntsville. I think we have enough Addick's sculptures inside the loop.

[UtterlyUrban]

Large sections of Discovery Green near the kids fountains were fenced off and inaccessible the other day while crews installed new turf grass to replace the dust.  Nice job with that "balance" Discovery Green!  I mean, fencing off the kids section right at the start of summer is good "balance", right?

 

 

[BigFootsSocks]

So let me get this straight...you want them to perform routine maintenance while kids are playing without roping off the areas that are being replaced? I mean...you said it in your post...they're replacing turf; you think that's going to take all summer? What other option do they have? Leaving it as a brown pile of dust, or taking a few days to replace some turf? 

[UtterlyUrban]

11 hours ago, BigFootsSocks said:

So let me get this straight...you want them to perform routine maintenance while kids are playing without roping off the areas that are being replaced? I mean...you said it in your post...they're replacing turf; you think that's going to take all summer? What other option do they have? Leaving it as a brown pile of dust, or taking a few days to replace some turf? 

I want them to "balance" the activities in the park so that they don't kill all the grass in the first place through over scheduling of events.  That IS the option.  Don't kill the grass in the first place via over use of planned activities.

 

quite simple, actually.

 

 

[Texasota]

Except that a lot of people like the current amount of planned activities. How do you propose finding a balance between those people and your perspective?

[Avossos]

6 minutes ago, Texasota said:

Except that a lot of people like the current amount of planned activities. How do you propose finding a balance between those people and your perspective?

 

A new downtown park to share in the work load. When the sink 69/45 into the ground, they need to add a park without question.

[UtterlyUrban]

1 hour ago, Texasota said:

Except that a lot of people like the current amount of planned activities. How do you propose finding a balance between those people and your perspective?

I am quite certain that many people like the current amount of planned activities.  I am also certain that many, including myself, don't.  

 

The park needs to reassess its mission.  It was, from the start, envisioned to be an "active" space.  If it intends to continue to be as active (or even more active) as an event space, then it needs to repurpose itself and define itself as an event space first and a park second.  In doing so, it could have much less "green space" and much more "hardscape" space that would tolerate the events.   It could define itself more around catering to those who want to pay to use it for big events or corporate and less around a free public space for families.  That would be fine.

 

Alternatively, it could pull back from hosting as many events and could keep the park more focused on families and greenspace.  That would be fine too and it would inform different decisions on landscaping, people flow, usage, etc.

 

where the park sits right now is that each spring and summer for at least the last several, large portions of it is dust due to over use (by events).  The events have come and gone but the dust remains.  That is unsustainable. Hopefully park management is actively and deeply considering which way it wishes to go because, right now, the "balance" that they seek isn't working.

 

 

[samagon]

On 6/4/2016 at 10:51 AM, UtterlyUrban said:

I want them to "balance" the activities in the park so that they don't kill all the grass in the first place through over scheduling of events.  That IS the option.  Don't kill the grass in the first place via over use of planned activities.

 

quite simple, actually.

 

 

 

That is ONE option. Another option is they could format less and charge everyone for entry. It's not a regular public park, they have to pay for the park somehow.

 

It does seem silly though, why wouldn't they have replaced the grass prior to HISD being let out for summer? Maybe that was the plan, but rain?

[quietstorm]

On 6/4/2016 at 5:23 PM, UtterlyUrban said:

I am quite certain that many people like the current amount of planned activities.  I am also certain that many, including myself, don't.  

 

The park needs to reassess its mission.  It was, from the start, envisioned to be an "active" space.  If it intends to continue to be as active (or even more active) as an event space, then it needs to repurpose itself and define itself as an event space first and a park second.  In doing so, it could have much less "green space" and much more "hardscape" space that would tolerate the events.   It could define itself more around catering to those who want to pay to use it for big events or corporate and less around a free public space for families.  That would be fine.

 

Alternatively, it could pull back from hosting as many events and could keep the park more focused on families and greenspace.  That would be fine too and it would inform different decisions on landscaping, people flow, usage, etc.

 

where the park sits right now is that each spring and summer for at least the last several, large portions of it is dust due to over use (by events).  The events have come and gone but the dust remains.  That is unsustainable. Hopefully park management is actively and deeply considering which way it wishes to go because, right now, the "balance" that they seek isn't working.

 

 

I agree with this.  Houston, generally lacks long-term vision/purpose for public spaces. We're getting better in terms of focusing on green/outdoor spaces, but I would agree that form should follow function.

[elecpharm]

Houston Transformation Conference – Panel 1: Mary Margaret Jones - Discovery Green

 

Changes and improvements coming

[UtterlyUrban]

Seems that the Billionaires Boys Club has left the city.  They are all counting their green.  Sadly, the families and children of Houston are left with a park that is about 50% closed.  I wonder if the Billionaire Boys Club paid for any of this restorative work?

 

to be fair, it seems that the Disco folks are using the heaps of dead grass to bring in some good soils/compost as part of the reseeding.

 

 

[cspwal]

Oh my god

The grass around the water sculpture is just gone

[Urbannizer]

Roller Skating coming to Disco Green from March 3rd through 25th:

 

http://m.chron.com/life/article/Discovery-Green-hosts-first-outdoor-roller-rink-10879754.php

 

[UtterlyUrban]

5 hours ago, cspwal said:

Oh my god

The grass around the water sculpture is just gone

Yes.  They have seeded the entire area.

 

About 2/3 of all the lawn areas are either closed or under significant repair.  Parts of the park without lawn area are still open.  

Edited February 20, 2017 by UtterlyUrban

[cspwal]

I'm curious - what could be done to try to prevent this from happening in the future for big events?  Is the answer more hardscape public places? Or is this an unavoidable part of having large events in a park?

[Texasota]

The Mall in DC seems like the obvious precedent, since it's mostly grass but regularly hosts massive crowds of people. I think they use these temporary plastic things to protect the grass. 

 

Edit: here's an article on the pretty in-depth thinking going into protecting the Mall's grass: https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/home/once-barely-surviving-the-grass-on-the-mall-gets-a-serious-makeover/2016/09/19/c815b8d2-792b-11e6-ac8e-cf8e0dd91dc7_story.html?utm_term=.c935cf50438e

 

It doesn't go much into the temporary decking, but you could see it in the inauguration size comparison photos that were all over the place a month ago. 

Edited February 20, 2017 by Texasota

[cspwal]

I wonder if that turf system would make any sense for discovery green.  Using the plastic panels that let the grass grow still would be a plus - a must have for these big events

[UtterlyUrban]

IMO, as much as I don't like the Billionaires Boys Club and how they seemingly have no issue convincing the dupes we call "politicians" about the "economic benefit of the "big game", The grass at Disco was essentially dead before the Billionaires arrived.

 

as I have said earlier in this post, Disco needs to either:

 

1) stop hosting as many large events or

2) change the park to more hardscaping ... make it an "entertainment venue" not a "park"

 

right now the folks that run Disco have allowed the park to have the grass die, dead, each year for the last several due to overscheduling of activities.  It is time to either change the mission and keep the grass or change the surfaces to support the current mission.  Having half the park closed for several weeks now following the same thing happening during the final four and a summer with nothing but dust is not a sustainable story.

[urbanize713]

Before we further discuss this topic I think its important to understand what discovery green is and the directive. The quote below is direct from their website with a key part in bold.

 

"Discovery Green exemplifies a successful public-private partnership between the City of Houston, the Houston First Corporation and Discovery Green Conservancy, the nonprofit 501(c)(3) organization that operates and maintains the park.  The Conservancy produces hundreds of free events each year and receives no direct city funding."

 

Being a resident of midtown and a worker in downtown I frequent this area quite a bit. I would love for the park to be in pristine condition year round but like everything there is a cost. Many of the times I go to the park it is because there is a special event.

 

I think complaining about the number of events is a non starter as one of the conservancy's main goals is events. The national mall example I think is the best way I have heard to address the issue. For any of us that may know someone associated with the Discovery Green Conservancy I think we should bring this example to their attention.

Edited February 21, 2017 by urbanize713

[UtterlyUrban]

4 hours ago, urbanize713 said:

 

I think complaining about the number of events is a non starter as one of the conservancy's main goals is events. The national mall example I think is the best way I have heard to address the issue. For any of us that may know someone associated with the Discovery Green Conservancy I think we should bring this example to their attention.

This is a great point and a key point.  

 

What is at issue is NOT whether the park should be an "active" park.  That is its mission.  The point in question is whether it is currently an "active PARK" or an "Event venue" (i.e. Not a "park" for families or to read a book on a sunny day but rather a place to attend a concert or a private corporate event).

 

the existence of events is NOT the issue.  Rather the NUMBER and SIZE of the events actually are what needs to be understood.  Once that is understood, decisions can be made regarding hardscapping or other mechanisms to keep the land looking appropriate whether the land is considered a "park" or an "event space".  If the Disco folks want to turn away families more often and have more corporate events, fine (I guess).  But the needs of the land will be very different if one wants to have 12 concerts  and three private events requiring a function tent a week vs green space for family picnics and 2 concerts per week.

 

 

 

[iah77]

This technically is not even a publicly funded park and a majority of inhabitants of the surrounding zip codes are not even traditional nuclear "families" so sound a bit entitled. A lot of people don't enjoy being around a bunch of people's screaming children so shouldn't there be amenities that address their interest?

[hindesky]

Grass is coming back strong with the mild temps we are having.

[Purdueenginerd]

Okay so it took about 20 days for the grass to recover naturally. I'd imagine in the summer time with more light, and more favorable weather conditions--- this is probably even faster. 

 

I dont know. I like the events at discovery green, and the short duration of dead grass doesnt really bother me too much. I'm no grass expert, but perhaps a different breed of grass can take the 'punishment' of foot traffic better? 

[cspwal]

The main lawn was still just dirt when I went there yesterday

[UtterlyUrban]

4 hours ago, cspwal said:

The main lawn was still just dirt when I went there yesterday

Yep.

 

about a three weeks and counting.   We'll see when the ropes come down across the park.  I'm guessing that it will be close to 6 weeks before the park is restored.

[cloud713]

Did they ever release estimates from the visitor count over the Super Bowl Live event? They were originally anticipating close to a million people I believe, which is almost as many visitors as the park typically averages over the course of an entire year.

[hindesky]

Disco Green again.

[kdog08]

On 2/19/2017 at 6:06 PM, UtterlyUrban said:

Seems that the Billionaires Boys Club has left the city.  They are all counting their green.  Sadly, the families and children of Houston are left with a park that is about 50% closed.  I wonder if the Billionaire Boys Club paid for any of this restorative work?

 

to be fair, it seems that the Disco folks are using the heaps of dead grass to bring in some good soils/compost as part of the reseeding.

 

 

 

 

Why keep replacing the grass.... Maybe Discovery GREEN wouldn't live up to it's name as much, but maybe switch to gravel in most places. 

[quietstorm]

Grass is back.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 11, 2017 by quietstorm

[hindesky]

[hindesky]

The reason they drained the pond, it was losing water and leaking into the garage.

 

[UtterlyUrban]

21 minutes ago, hindesky said:

The reason they drained the pond, it was losing water and leaking into the garage.

 

Wow!

[Nate99]

I guess I didn't realize that the garage extended under the pond.  Kind of had to assume this was going to happen eventually, right?

[cspwal]

I wonder what caused it

[H-Town Man]

1 hour ago, cspwal said:

I wonder what caused it

 

I guess when you put a bunch of soil on top of a garage, it settles and shifts a bit more than if you just built a pond on ground that had been there a long time. Hopefully they can hire an engineer and get this right.

 

 

[Fortune]

Did any kind of wild life live in that pond? Like fish or turtles 

[hindesky]

1 hour ago, Fortune said:

Did any kind of wild life live in that pond? Like fish or turtles 

Yes, I saw a turtle leaving the area after it was drained and there was a giant Koi fish that was mysteriously placed in the pond but transferred when they drained it.

http://www.houstonchronicle.com/life/article/Big-Poppa-A-big-fish-story-11289120.php?cmpid=gsa-chron-result#photo-13244218

 

They knew he was big.

For years, staff and visitors at Discovery Green have seen a large fish swimming in the park's 1-acre lake.

"If you walk along the pier, the fish would follow you, like a dog or a pet," says William Flowers, the park's site manager. "They really became part of the culture."

The arrival of the fish is one of the park's greatest mysteries, as the concrete-bound lake was never actually stocked with fish. But while there were several fish calling Discovery Green home, one larger-than-life koi emerged as a fan favorite.

 

"We started calling him Big Poppa because he was bigger than the bass and all the other goldfish," says Flowers.

He'd slip away from view for days at a time as he rested among the muck in the lake's bottom, a habit of koi. The longer he returned to his bottom-feeder habits, the higher tensions grew among his fans.

"After a few days, when we'd see him, we'd be like, 'Yay!' We'd have fish die every once in a while - turtles would get them or something - but we were always afraid that it would be him," says Flowers. "And he was a favorite - the only fish that had a name."

 

What's the difference between koi and goldfish?

 

 

Koi (Cyprinus carpio) and goldfish (Carassius auratus) are both in the same family: Cyprinidae. All koi have the same body type and can vary in color. They can also grow up to 2 to 3 feet in length. Most goldfish are orange, with a few types that also have black, white and calico coloring. They come in a variety of body shapes and stay relatively small in size.

How big do koi get?: Japanese koi usually grow 22 to 26 inches long. Jumbo-size koi grow up to 36 inches long.

 

 

Big Poppa has called Discovery Green home for at least six or seven years (maybe someone set him free in there, or maybe a bird dropped him, Flowers speculates). But earlier this month, the park had to drain the lake to repair a leak. That meant catching Big Poppa.

"Slowly, over the course of about two weeks, our operations team netted the fish and put them in their own containers, very carefully," says Ren Mitchell, a marketing manager for the park.

They constructed aerated systems to help the fish breathe in their containers, and made plans to relocate them to Katy to live in a retirement pond, since a pH change in the park's lake water could have far-reaching health consequences for Big Poppa and others.

This meant a chance to see the usually slippery Big Poppa up close. And Mitchell couldn't believe her eyes.

"We knew he was big. But we didn't know exactly how big he was," she says. "We'd been visually guesstimating. But he filled up - from tip to tail - an entire Tupperware box."

He had to have been more than 2 feet long, she says.

 

"He was super big and super heavy. I'm not sure, but he had to have been close to 100 pounds."

Really?

"Maybe 60," she couches. Flowers would know better.

"I didn't measure him," says Flowers. "I honestly was trying to be as gentle and careful with him as I could. But we bought some heavy-duty storage tubs, and they're about 2-and-a-half feet long, and that's about how long he was."

But what about weight?

"If I had to guess, I'd say he was probably 20 pounds," he says. "Yeah, about 20 pounds."

The folks at Nelson's Water Garden in Katy, who took Big Poppa in, would likely have a better estimate, he says.

Mary Gonzales, the indoor manager at Nelson's, has seen plenty of koi fish in her day. At the shop, there's a koi pond next to a gumball machine stuffed with fish food, where customers drop a quarter before sprinkling fish treats on the water's surface. The result is a school of koi who have grown big, fat and happy over the years. But even these guys have nothing on Big Poppa, she says.

"It took two guys to pick him up when he arrived," she says. "And that was with the water in the container as well, which throws off the exact weight."

So she doesn't have an estimate on what he weighs. And they didn't risk pausing to measure him before sliding him into the waters of her home-based retirement pond, where he's chilling with perch, bass and minnows.

"He was really stressed from the move, so we did our best to get him out as quickly as we could," says Gonzales, a fish expert whose parents own the water garden where she works.

But she got an eyeball on him, up close and personal. And one thing's for sure:

"He's one of the biggest koi we've ever seen," she says. "Three-and-a-half feet."

Edited July 23, 2017 by hindesky

[Fortune]

Thanks for the info