Bacchus Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 I am moving back to Houston in June and have been reading these forums, as well as paying visits to Houston to try to figure out where the best place to live in Midtown will be. After living there for three years already, I am very familiar with the area. In the past 1.5 years that I've been gone, there has been a stunning amount of development, related to both condo's and entertainment options. My question for the forum is where do you think the middle of midtown will be in the next 3-5 years? For clarity, I would define the center of the action to be an area with a residential feel, a pedestrian friendly zone, somewhere within walking distance to multiple restaurants and bars, and an area with aesthetic appeal. If I were to select that location now, I would probably say either the Oak Place condo's (just west of the AMLI midtown complex and just south of Webster Street) or the 100-300 block of McGowan (just west of Bagby). With the Farb Development of a pedestrian friendly apartment complex (similar to Post Midtown) coming to the 300 block of McGowan, this could really shift the action in Midtown a little further south, which I think is a good move. On the other hand, you've got the Edge condo's (man, there are a TON of those condo's on HAR -- wonder if they are having a hard time finding buyers...) and Camden Babgy Square coming in which moves a few people farther north . There appears to be quite a bit of condo development west of Bagby and north of Tuam, moving towards Montrose and up to Gray. This area is lacking in entertainment options (within walking distance) as you move further west and still has a lot of very low-income housing and indigents roaming the streets. However, in a couple of years, this could be a beautiful residential area, and a restaurant or two dropped into the Genesee Street area could make for a very nice area. There appear to be natural boundaries to the future growth of Midtown's pedestrian-friendly development, the most obvious being the Pierce Elevated, the Greyhound bus station (puke), the 5-lane mini-highway streets of Smith, Louisiana, Travis, etc, and the blighted area between Gray and Dallas east of Taft (drug dealer central). With this in mind, I'm thinking that the area west of Bagby and south of Gray/Webster will be the future of the residential community. The nightlife will likely continue to thrive in the area between Bagby and Smith from Elgin up to Gray. Areas east of Smith are hindered by wide streets that are heavily trafficked, and way too many old buildings that need to be torn down (and likely won't for some time). I am not optimistic that the rail line will spur pedestrian friendly development in Midtown given these issues. This is how I see Midtown developing. Since I am looking to invest in a home in this area, I would appreciate your thoughts. Disagreement is certainly welcomed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesternGulf Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 It's hard to tell right now. I would still say the area west of Bagby at Post Midtown. Plus the Edge will be coming in soon to increase ped traffic along that 2 block stretch where retail stands at Post Midtown. I see no reason why they would not go to the area since the areas are directly next door and driving will more than likely be an inconvenience.Off topic, but I wish there was an area large enough at Post Midtown on the bottom floor to hold CVS and make a better use of the full block it sits on. *I hope someone is reading this* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bacchus Posted January 10, 2006 Author Share Posted January 10, 2006 Yes, the CVS on Gray was a huge missed opportunity for that area. I think Gray could be developed to be the main 'drag' of Midtown in a similar manner to how McKinney is in Uptown Dallas. That said, McKinney has a huge Walgreens at the corner where it meets Lemmon. Ideally, a mutli-block retail village could have gone in there, similar to the West Village in Uptown Dallas. Perhaps something similar could be built just west of the Post complex on Gray or near the new Farb Development on McGowan. I'd like to see less strip centers in that area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HtownTX Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 The southern part of Midtown, around Elizabeth Baldwin Park is beginning to thrive. Once the Collective is built there should be more retail, and it's already a nice residential area (relatively). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidtownCoog Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Elizabeth Baldwin Park How's the Jackson Street project looking? Last time I was buy, it was a mess.(Jackson is the street that dead-ends into the park). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesternGulf Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Yes, the CVS on Gray was a huge missed opportunity for that area. I think Gray could be developed to be the main 'drag' of Midtown in a similar manner to how McKinney is in Uptown Dallas. That said, McKinney has a huge Walgreens at the corner where it meets Lemmon. Ideally, a mutli-block retail village could have gone in there, similar to the West Village in Uptown Dallas. Perhaps something similar could be built just west of the Post complex on Gray or near the new Farb Development on McGowan. I'd like to see less strip centers in that area. I wouldn't be surprised if one went in on that piece of land west of the Post that actually would make for an interesting design for a condo building. The vacant land kind of has a triangular shape. I wonder why it still shows no sign of being developed while every piece of land around it is taking up. You can see the land on the right side of this pic where the density is organized. This side of Midtown is one huge mess. 2222 Smith Street is the only building in the area with a decent design fit for pedestrians although it lacks amenities for non residents tat walk in the area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestGrayGuy Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 The center of the action will be, in my opinion, Gray and Bagby for the forseeable future. I am a long time resident of midtown, moved here in 98 to what was, at the time, Live Oak apartments which became Oakwood which are now Archstone. Later I moved to Camden Midtown (lived there 2 years) and now I own a townhome at West Gray and Taft area.There is enough development both North and South of this intersection (Gray and Bagby) to keep it in the center of "'where it is at". If you don't agree, try and find a parking spot on Saturday night. What is not happening is anything East of Main. So the cool boundary is Pierce elevated in the north, Main in the East and I would say Elgin on the South. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bacchus Posted January 10, 2006 Author Share Posted January 10, 2006 What plans exist for that empty block in between 2222 Smith and Post Midtown? Looks like it is cleared, with the exception of that old auto-body shop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevfiv Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 i agree withthe gray/babgy area, although greyhound, central square, and so on will prove to be big obstacles (catalysts when they move/are rehabbed/are gone) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbigtex56 Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Another consideration is development around MetroRail stations.Of the three in Midtown (McGowen, HCC/Ensemble and Wheeler), the HCC/Ensemble seems to be ahead so far as providing convenient restaurants and entertainment. Unfortunately, none of the stations have much residential in the immediate area... but perhaps that will be changing soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Hizzy! Posted January 11, 2006 Share Posted January 11, 2006 A new club/bar looks to have opened up finally on Fannin near Alabama, "Route 66". I bring this up because it seems that a lot of the new attractions in Midtown seem to be opening up in various areas rather than in a concentrated corridor. I think that if we could get a centralizing development going (like Camden's long proposed mixed-use development on the Superblock), it would help attract a critical mass of development.However, if I had to designate an area as the focal point of activity in Midtown, I agree that it would be the Post Midtown Square area between Brazos and Smith and W. Gray and McGowen.That said, don't sleep on Elgin. If we see that two-story retail project near the Calais get off the ground and the Collective gets going, I think the retail landscape of that corridor will change rapidly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globalarb Posted January 11, 2006 Share Posted January 11, 2006 A new club/bar looks to have opened up finally on Fannin near Alabama, "Route 66". I bring this up because it seems that a lot of the new attractions in Midtown seem to be opening up in various areas rather than in a concentrated corridor. I think that if we could get a centralizing development going (like Camden's long proposed mixed-use development on the Superblock), it would help attract a critical mass of development.However, if I had to designate an area as the focal point of activity in Midtown, I agree that it would be the Post Midtown Square area between Brazos and Smith and W. Gray and McGowen.That said, don't sleep on Elgin. If we see that two-story retail project near the Calais get off the ground and the Collective gets going, I think the retail landscape of that corridor will change rapidly.I agree, particularly on Elgin. That's the only redeeming part of the east side of Midtown. I sure hope the Collective works out. Anyone heard anything on it? Or Midtown Medical Center? Or Camden? Seems like a lot of stalling, as usual. If those three projects could get off the ground and help anchor different areas of Midtown, I think it would be on its way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwj Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 I'm moving to La Branch and Elgin, pretty close to the Collective in the next couple of weeks. The park is looking great these days and the Collective should bring more folks and retail. There is a nice little gym within walking distance, too. I think that stretch of Elgin shows promise of a good future. Personally, I like the lack of rentals and more focus on owned residences. That helps you get a bit of a yard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestGrayGuy Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 What gym is within walking distance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwj Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 Metamorphocise (click for map), a locally owned joint. You can see it from Elgin and Labranch if you look towards town. It is on the East side of the street and is an orangish color. They have weights, cardio, a few classes, manicure, pedicure, massages, etc. Pretty big space that looks like it will be able to grow with the population moving there. Nice owners, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidtownCoog Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 Is that one of those gyms with the happy ending like Club Houston? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwj Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 If you're asking if I think they'll be around a while, yes. I don't have any detailed info, but they seem to be wisely keeping their costs down while still providing good equipment in a nice atmosphere. That's the key to sustainment while membership picks up. They're main appeal is location for the neighborhood right there, since most members seem to walk there to work out. That's a huge perk, as I know I wouldn't go to any place I'd have to drive far to get to - and why I joined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Hizzy! Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 I can almost guarantee you that 'Coog is talking about a different "happy ending". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwj Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 any help decyphering this code, then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidtownCoog Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 So it's a legit gym, then. That's good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewMND Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 any help decyphering this code, then?I'm pretty sure Club Houston is one of those sex clubs that was on the news awhile back. So that kind of "happy ending" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citykid09 Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 Yes, the CVS on Gray was a huge missed opportunity for that area. I think Gray could be developed to be the main 'drag' of Midtown in a similar manner to how McKinney is in Uptown Dallas. That said, McKinney has a huge Walgreens at the corner where it meets Lemmon. Ideally, a mutli-block retail village could have gone in there, similar to the West Village in Uptown Dallas. Perhaps something similar could be built just west of the Post complex on Gray or near the new Farb Development on McGowan. I'd like to see less strip centers in that area.Do you guys think that the CVS thats there will be there forever, or do you think a plan of action can get CVS to consider getting rid of it and rebuilding?If CVS sees the rest of the area urbanizing, mabe people in the area can persuade them to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 Do you guys think that the CVS thats there will be there forever, or do you think a plan of action can get CVS to consider getting rid of it and rebuilding?If CVS sees the rest of the area urbanizing, mabe people in the area can persuade them to.Umm....no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citykid09 Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 Umm....no.So you don't think CVS will notice or even care that they are out of place and consider rebuilding? Why not? I have a cousin who moved to the midtown Houston area from New York City. I asked her what she thought of Houston, She said she liked it thats why she moved down here and that it was much cheaper to live. She also told me that Houston looks like it was just a small country town and now its trying to race to the top and be like cities like New York. She then pointed out that CVS and said that you would never find any think like that in New York, (which I knew) and you wouldn't even find that in suburbs (even the suburbs are urban). When my aunt and uncle came down to Houston last year from Boston (because they plan on relocating) I showed them around the downtown/midtown area and my aunt was like where are all of the people? feeling a little embarassed that Houston's urban areas could't compare to Boston's I told her that everyone was underground in the tunnel and that it was really empty because it was the weekend. But the very next day (a weekday) they decided to explore the area by them selves. Once they got back to me they told me that the area is even dead on weekdays. I couldn't explan so I said "I don't know why it was like that."She then said that Houston inner city is really kind of weird because once you step outside of downtown you see houses that look like they sould be in the boondocks. And that it all just looks out of place. Over all they liked Houston and said that they would have much more opportunities in Houston then they are having in expensive Boston. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bacchus Posted January 13, 2006 Author Share Posted January 13, 2006 It's really hard to compare Houston to New York or Boston simply because those cities are much older, plus they are naturally land constrained. Houston has the opposite problem -- too much land. Trying to create density in an area of land-abundance is a challenge, as we've seen. High fuel costs and traffic gridlock may prove to be the spark needed to create a dense inner loop (or at least west of 45). An aging population looking for lower maintenance urban living could also provide momentum. These are the factors that I'm betting on supporting my home value over time when I look to buy a townhouse/condo in the inner loop. Ziegler Cooper has a good read on their website that talks about the city becoming more dense. http://www.zieglercooper.com/urban_village.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwj Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 So you don't think CVS will notice or even care that they are out of place and consider rebuilding? Why not?$$$ - they didn't move there to be a part of the community, they moved there to make a buck. As long as the store is making money, they won't budge. Theoretically, you could try and boycott them or something, but I can't imagine that working.It is a heartbreakingly awful location, especially right across from the park. What really gets me is their oversized parking lot. As if that many people need their drugs refilled and some makeup at the same time.While the new Walgreens that is coming in just a bit further south is nothing to get excited about, the location feels a lot more appropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestGrayGuy Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 CVS is making money hand over fist until the new Wal-Greens is built. Yes midtown is a victim of the CVS/Wal-greens arms race. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citykid09 Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 CVS is making money hand over fist until the new Wal-Greens is built. Yes midtown is a victim of the CVS/Wal-greens arms race.So do you think that CVS will be there well after we are all dead and gone?I'm thinking within 10 years CVS will have a change of heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 So do you think that CVS will be there well after we are all dead and gone?I'm thinking within 10 years CVS will have a change of heart. You know, I've always looked at CVS as the drugstore with heart. I'm sure within a few years they will notice the toll they've taken in the neighborhood and pick up shop and move to Katy. They'll probably sell the land for pennies on the dollar as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houstonfella Posted January 14, 2006 Share Posted January 14, 2006 Midtown, Uptown, Downtown, etc. Go Houston Go! We are not NY. Don't wanna be. You get more bang for your bucks than up there. Relax. Folks. This is the real deal. Try getting anything in NY or SF that close to Downtown and see how many $$$$$$$$$$$ you will fork over. Houston, I love yew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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