Sawyer Heights Village Developments

[flatline]

The Woodland Heights Association has posted a land use study/site plan for the new Target that is slated to go in the industrial area south of I-10 on Taylor:

http://www.woodland-heights.org/Neighborho...PLAN8-10-04.pdf

[WestGrayGuy]

Holy Outparcels, Batman!

That could be a lot of retail or restaurants.

[NYC Texan2]

Can't say I am overwhemed by the vision, or lack thereof, in that site plan. Looks like a whole bunch of freestanding Applebees.

The neighborhood is desperate for the Target though, and it can't hurt. Beats a bunch of warehouses.

[UrbaNerd]

Well, AT LEAST they are trying to fill it in a bit, sintead of making one giant strip with seas of parking. Sure, the sea may be bigger, but there are more islands.

[HeightsGuy]

I think the one thing that shines in an otherwise dreary suburban-looking design is it looks like they are keeping the hike-and-bike trail along the RR easement. That easement runs over to White Oak Bayou and beyond across the freeway and would make a wonderful route for Heights residents.

Let's hope this will spur the city to build that portion.

bike path

[BayouCityGirl]

I think the one thing that shines in an otherwise dreary suburban-looking design is it looks like they are keeping the hike-and-bike trail along the RR easement. That easement runs over to White Oak Bayou and beyond across the freeway and would make a wonderful route for Heights residents.

Let's hope this will spur the city to build that portion.

bike path

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

At least its NOT a "CVS"

[NYC Texan2]

Of course, it could quite easily be a CVS if CVS decides to purchase/lease a parcel. This is extremely suburban--basically, I think it is designed to attract enterprises that are more comfortable in a suburban setting than in an urban landscape. Whether this tract is attractive enough to convince those operators will determine if the project goes forward. Target has to be a huge attraction, since there isn't much neighborhood traffic that goes through on Taylor.

They could do something much more interesting if they wanted to, I think. They could do roof parking/a parking garage and make the development more dense. they could make a main street setting where they controlled everything on the blocks. It doesn't have to be this way . . . .

[MidtownCoog]

Suburban makes sense for this spot.

Walking next to I-10 is not exactly everyone's cup of tea.

[WestGrayGuy]

I think I have to agree with MidtownCoog. A suburban style development works for this stretch of freeway. Unfortunate as it my be for inner loop Houston, it will draw those unsure developers.

And at the end of the day, isn't a Target better than warehouses? I know I will probably go to this Target over the one on San Felipe.

[KinkaidAlum]

Suburban doesn't make sense at all. With what we now know, suburban development is unsustainable. It creates heat islands, pollution, increases flooding, and further develops our auto-dominated society.

Additionally, a huge suburban type development might actually hurt the local stores that inhabit the Heights in more pedestrian places such as along 19th Avenue.

Just because the plot of land is ugly right now and used for warehousing purposes doesn't mean we should just settle for bad development.

[flatline]

Kincaid's argument is not against suburban development in this case, but against suburban development AT ALL, in any case. I understand, appreciate, and agree with most of his arguments in a utopian world. BUT, being a realist who needs to buy toilet paper, laundry detergent, and the occasional pair of cheap sunglasses, I love Target.

I can virtually guarantee that there is not an antique shop, tea room, deli, high-end men's clothier, or beautician on 19th street that will be harmed by a Target + other development going in at I-10 and Taylor. Indeed, I would bet good money that the owners of those 19th street establishments anxiously await Target's arrival, so they can buy toilet paper and laundry detergent there.

HeightsGuy is right about the bike path. Great move. That was probably a bone that the developer had to throw to the Heights Assn. and the Woodland Heights Assn. to keep them happy.

[MidtownCoog]

That part of town needs it.

Never liked the San Felipe location. Too much bad karma from Loop 610.

I'd normally just drive from Midtown to the one near Reliant. It's like going to the UN. You'll hear TONS of languages at that place, and I am not talking about Espanol.

[HeightsGuy]

I do agree that a true urban style development may not work there, but that doesn't mean they couldn't at least make an effort with the design. The easiest no-brainer design I can think of is taking the proposed hike/bike trail, widening it through the plat and fronting the businesses to it. Sheesh, throw some cobblestones down, a few victorian street lamps, and go with a railroad theme of some sort.

Something, anything would be better than what they propose.

[MidtownCoog]

What in the world is a "true urban style development"

Where can I find one in Houston?

[flatline]

Something, anything would be better than what they propose.

Anything???? Easy, now. . .

[MidtownCoog]

Anything???? Easy, now. . .

Agree. I am starting to think y'all are smoking crack. It's a freaking Target, and people are going to drive their cars to it.

What do you expect them to do? Take the bus or rail and schlep all their goods home in a buggy? That looks good on TV, but try it in the real world.

It's next to I-10, and we all know about I-10. This fantasy land "urban target" is just that. A fantasy.

[HeightsGuy]

Hm, is this an architecture related forum or developer related forum?

How does asking for a little thought behind the design bring up such a well of pent-up frustration?

[MidtownCoog]

"How does asking for a little thought behind the design bring up such a well of pent-up frustration"

You must a the whiz at reading land use studies.

If you can actually envision the finished product from a fuzzy .pdf land use study, you are a better man than I.

[HeightsGuy]

See there, now you're adding assumptions as well. Well, if you want to go down the road of assumptions, maybe I am a whiz, maybe not, but looking at the fuzzy jpeg, I can already place it under the crystal ball on my desk and see a sea of parking lot dotted with buildings.

I happen to think this is a bad idea, so please, critique my ideas, not me.

[MidtownCoog]

We have been down this path before on the old board on this same subject.

Not sure what some people expect from a Target next to an Interstate, but keep dreaming.

Target wants to you drive to their store.

Why?

So you can load up on stuff and spends lots of money.

[NYC Texan2]

I don't have a problem with the Target itself. It is a box. I have a problem with everything else about the site plan.

Also, remember the site: It is raised about 30 feet above the freeway--no great views from the interstate of the store, except for the signs. Again, it more urban than suburban. I agree with HeightsGuy, as a guy that also lives in the Heights and drives around the area constantly.

[MidtownCoog]

Thank goodness it's elevated 30'.

White Oak Bayou is a little close for comfort.

[HeightsGuy]

Well, if it was Walmart I would totally agree. But Target has been known to do innovative things, here is at least one instance, a 2 story Target with shopping cart escalators:

Seattle Target

it won an SEGD design award:

Can't link directly, look under northgate north

I know, I know, no chance of something like this here, just wanting to make the point that it doesn't have to be this way.

[KinkaidAlum]

Where in the hell did I say I was against all suburban development?

I was speaking directly about this location.

Additionally, if people would open their minds just a little bit, they'd realize that there are different type of development that can help out Houston in many ways.

Here are just a few pertaining to this site.

1) Parking garages instead of massive paved surface parking. This will reduce the heat island effect and will also reduce potential flooding problems not to mention reduce the pollution runoff of motor oil that will undoubtedly make it's way into White Oak Bayou from the proposed lot. AND, if the developers of this cash cow are feeling neighborly, they might even add a little green space as a token to the 'hood with the leftover land.

2) Get rid of pod sites. Setting up seperate sites for every little fast food joint or other establishment just increases the typical Houstonian's laziness. Instead, add the sites onto the Target store so that people wont be idling in their cars while waiting for their SuperTacos. With how fat we've become, we could use the short walk instead.

3) Build green. Instead of just building a plain big box store, build a big box store with a green roof and/or one made of recycled materials.

AND, before anyone starts shouting about increased expenses, I KNOW THAT. But, when do we as citizens start to demand more? We have rolled over and thrown our collective legs up into the air for developers for too long. It's time we make them pay for the ass-raping they give us!

Hell, these developers could spend quadruple the amount they are planning *(assuming that they are building a typical big box site with pod sites) and still make a tidy profit. Besides the obvious demand for a store like a Target, this area is also a TIRZ area meaning these fellas will make out like bandits with the tax breaks!

[houstonsemipro]

I heard it's nothing to do in seattle. They set around drinking coffee all day.

[elecpharm]

I agree with KinkaidAlum, Just because the property sits along the interstate does not mean it can't be more aesthetically appealing. Why not model it after the one in Seattle or like the Randall's in midown with undergound parking?

[NYC Texan2]

Where is the phone number? The Heights Association should get involved in this--

[flatline]

http://www.houstonheights.org

My guess is that HHA is already involved. . .or at least kept informed.

[flatline]

From the Woodland Heights Assn. Website www.woodland-heights.org:

(excerpt from the September 14, 2004 Woodland Heights Civic Association General Meeting Minutes)

The speaker for September General Meeting was Helen Huey and Chad Moss with Property Commerce. Property Commerce is the developer and will also manage the Sawyer Heights Village (the

[WestGrayGuy]

I really think this will be a good development. I, for one, am excited about it. The area now is a wasteland.

[Talbot]

It's about time a box store developer goes pedestrian friendly. Although target is pretty good with suggestions. Unlike a Wal-Mart..

[Htowngirl]

From HBJ:

Developer assembles 12 separate tracts for new retail center

Jennifer Dawson

Houston Business Journal

Property Commerce closed on a dozen separate land purchase transactions on Oct. 29 to piece together a 24-acre retail center site just outside of downtown Houston.

Sawyer Heights Village will occupy mostly former industrial land on the south side of Interstate 10, east of Studemont and just west of Taylor/Sawyer.

A Target store will anchor the lifestyle center, which has space for several other retailers such as banks, restaurants and apparel stores.

Chad Moss, a broker with Property Commerce, says Sawyer Heights Village is a significant deal, even for the prolific Houston-based retail developer, which handles all of the Target and Home Depot developments in the area.

"This will be one of the highest profile deals we've ever developed in our 28-year history," Moss says.

The company had a party this week at Pappas Steakhouse for the 50 or so people who worked on the complicated deal.

Construction is expected to begin on Sawyer Heights Village in early 2005 and begin opening in 2006.

Property Commerce was represented by Moss on most of the recent land transactions.

Jose Porth of International Realty Group assisted the developer in buying some residential properties that will be razed for the project. None of the 12 individual landowners used a broker on their deals, Moss says.

A large chunk of the property was acquired from the Verandah Cos., which two years ago bought the land to build an upscale multifamily complex. Verandah cleared the site where Bowen Tool Co. used to operate before scrapping residential development plans altogether.

Terms of the land transactions were not disclosed.

"The land's very expensive there," Moss says. "It's 'inside the Loop' prices."

Target bought its own land in connection with Property Commerce's acquisitions two weeks ago. While the national retailer will own the land, Property Commerce expects to ground lease to other tenants that will construct their own buildings.

"We've had tremendous interest from sit-down restaurants," Moss says. "We've had great interest from many national retailers. Banks are going nuts on this site."

The property is situated near quite a bit of new residential development, including high-density homes around downtown, Midtown and The Heights.

Moss says it was a feat to put together this much land for a close-in retail project. In fact, it could have been a larger project if the developer had been able to buy a few random pieces of land that the development will now have to snake around.

"You can't assemble 24 acres inside the Loop," Moss says. "It doesn't exist."

Sawyer Heights Village will be an urban shopping center, similar in style to Highland Village and Town & Country Villages, Moss says. The developer is turning Taylor/Sawyer into a heavily landscaped boulevard with brick roadways, and has designs to make the entire project pedestrian-friendly, Moss says.

The project also will be a little more driver-friendly after some work is done by the Texas Department of Transportation.

I-10 does not have a south side service road linking Studemont to Taylor. However, the road has been planned and is expected to begin construction by early 2008, Moss says.

[NYC Texan2]

This is a great addition to the neighborhood and should support the continued growth of the Heights, the Washington corridor and downtown. The Washington corridor, in particular, could lose some of its urban wasteland feel through the addition of the retail in this development. I have yet to hear anything convincing about the design of the center, but at least they are saying the right things. I really like that Target has already bought the land, which indicates very serious interest on their end.

On the other hand, I really hate the idea of extending the service road. Why do we have to have service roads, anyway? This city is absolutely obsessed with them in a way that no other city I know of is, and I liked living in an area without it.

[dbigtex56]

From HBJ:

Jose Porth of International Realty Group assisted the developer in buying some residential properties that will be razed for the project.

This being a very old part of Houston, it seems likely that a least a few of these houses would contribute to the 6th Ward or some of the older parts of the Heights as infill. Perhaps they could be moved rather than demolished.

[jookyhc]

From the Woodland Heights Assn. Website www.woodland-heights.org:

Construction is scheduled to commence approximately in March 2005.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Anyone heard anything new about this Target?

I'm going to be priced out of the neighborhood by the time the ribbon gets cut.

[kjb434]

This is great. I won't have to go to the Target at San Felipe and I-610 anymore.

[rps324]

This being a very old part of Houston, it seems likely that a least a few of these houses would contribute to the 6th Ward or some of the older parts of the Heights as infill. Perhaps they could be moved rather than demolished.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I am not sure of the boundaries, but I don't think there are any houses over where they are putting this, just warehouses.

[Rehan]

Does anyone have a map of the boundaries for this project?

I'm familiar with the area, but I just wanted to know which buildings are going to be demolished.

[kjb434]

A section of the buildings are alread cleared. A few more need to go. I need to pass by this weekend and look.

[UrbaNerd]

Here is the site plan, if anyone wanted it:

[KinkaidAlum]

Another crap project.

How in the hell did this project get so much surface parking approved right next to the bayou?

[Subdude]

I really hate these big "lifestyle centers" with stores scattered over acres of parking. It really discourages walking between stores. You see people get in their car and drive to the other end of the parking lot to go to another store or Applebees or whatnot.

[dalparadise]

I really hate these big "lifestyle centers" with stores scattered over acres of parking.  It really discourages walking between stores.  You see people get in their car and drive to the other end of the parking lot to go to another store or Applebees or whatnot.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Although this was called a "lifestyle center" by the reporter, it looks more like a "power center" to me. The Lifestyle center that really looks interesting to me is the proposed Parks at Boulder Creek in Pearland. The "lifestyle" here calls for a pedestrian environment, townhomes on the property, two midrise office buildings, a waterway and retailers such as Williams-Sonoma, Virgin, Banana Republic, etc. It's sort of a mini-Woodlands Town Center/Market Street, by my estimation. That's closer to the lifestyle center idea, at least as I understand it.

Also, the parking for Parks at Boulder Creek seems to be garages or back-of-the-property stuff -- not on the Pearland Parkway -- cool. I'm sorry I don't have any drawings or links. I've only seen drawings in trade magazines. One caveat -- It's a Jefco development -- they of the Portofino Center in Conroe. Let's hope they use the same sense of grandeur, but a heightened sense of style in the Pearland development.

[kjb434]

Actually, that is a lot less parking that I would envision for a development of that size.

It's probably the bare minimum. Also, the city will require the planting of trees throughout the project like the Kroger on Buffalo Speedway and US 59.

Some of those trees were existing, but many or new as required by the city for new developments with large parking areas.

[GovernorAggie]

Well, I was under the impression from those who drink the Target-is-much-better-than-Walmart-for-urban-development Kool-Aid that this project would have a much better design. It's not much different than the Target development near 290/Barker Cypress.

With that said, they must be planning on several restaurants and big-time retailers with the lay-out of the parking.

[kjb434]

Good point GovernorAggie. Where is that pro-urban Target attitude that people talk about. Wal-Mart had build facilities just like the above. The good thing is that I would rather go to this Target than the one on San Felipe by the West Loop that I go to.

[kjb434]

Also, I looked at the aerial photo for the site. It seems they are keeping most of the site in tacked as for as the platting goes. Other than the one road they are going to have abandoned.

True the site plan is not in a generall pro-urban concept, but it seems no neighborhood jumped in to voice their opinions. Also, the placing of a typical commercial site on abandoned warehouses is better than nothing at all.

[BrentO]

Here's the Google Maps satellite photo of the site, and it corresponds to the site plans. Helpful for those of us who aren't so familiar with the specific warehouses:

Google Satellite Map

[Guest Professional Hornblower]

This new Target will really add urban vibrancy to the neighborhood. They could do a mixed-use project- perhaps a loft above the "electronics department", a law office above the "planted pots", or a penthouse suite above the entry canopy. This would really encourage interaction and a livability quality not felt since the mid 1940's.

A Kohls or a Mervyns would have definetly stopped all momentum.

[BrentO]

They could do a mixed-use project- perhaps a loft above the "electronics department", a law office above the "planted pots", or a penthouse suite above the entry canopy.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, this is Houston - think more along the lines of a strip club above the lingerie department.