Amtrak in Houston

[cspwal]

The big issue is the sheer amount of single track railroads combined with freight trains that don't fit on sidings.  If a freight train is coming the opposite way the the amtrak train has to stop and wait for it to pass - there's no other choice

[BeerNut]

On 10/16/2022 at 10:03 AM, cougarpad said:

If Amtrack is serious about expanding in Texas then they are going to have to updgrade their tracks and find a way to increase speeds of their trains. As of now a car trip is around the same as the train trip to San Antonio or Dallas if Amtrack adds the route. They must find a way to make the trip by train fater then car or Texans will continue to choose car over train to San Antonio and Dallas.

I can deal with it taking a little longer but the on time performance has to improve.

[cougarpad]

19 hours ago, BeerNut said:

I can deal with it taking a little longer but the on time performance has to improve.

Then Amtrack is going to have to install some passing tracks for passengers trains to pass the Freight trains. As of now it takes longer to get to San Antontio to Houston by Amtrak compared to car. They are going to have to install some bypass tracks to prevent right of way issues between freight and passenger rail. This will have to occur with the proposed Houston to Dallas line that is UP owned. People will choose car over train if it takes more than an hour more to get between cities using Amtrack.

 

https://www.tripsavvy.com/how-to-get-from-houston-to-san-antonio-4796768

Edited October 18, 2022 by cougarpad

[Ross]

37 minutes ago, cougarpad said:

Then Amtrack is going to have to install some passing tracks for passengers trains to pass the Freight trains. As of now it takes longer to get to San Antontio to Houston by Amtrak compared to car. They are going to have to install some bypass tracks to prevent right of way issues between freight and passenger rail. This will have to occur with the proposed Houston to Dallas line that is UP owned. People will choose car over train if it takes more than an hour more to get between cities using Amtrack.

 

https://www.tripsavvy.com/how-to-get-from-houston-to-san-antonio-4796768

Amtrak doesn't own any of the tracks it uses in Texas, and it's not going to spend any money building passing tracks. Amtrak is at the mercy of the freight line operators.

[ehbowen]

On 5/25/2022 at 3:14 PM, cspwal said:

Diner car is available to everyone, though you have to pay if you’re in coach. And I typically am moving between cars constantly unless I’m sleeping, though I wouldn’t want to be on there too long. 
 

I haven’t ridden it between Houston and NOLA, so if there’s no fuel stops between Houston and NOLA filling in San Antonio makes sense, just not a separate stop from the station 

The thing is UP has a major fuel rack (for their freights) just east of San Antonio, the Sunset  has to fill up somewhere between New Orleans and California, and it's a heckuva lot cheaper for Amtrak to purchase fuel from UP than it is to have a tank truck meet the train (or $$ build their own fuel facility $$) at the San Antonio station. Or the Houston station; by the way, sometimes during hurricanes or similar Amtrak will turn the Sunset in Houston and when that happens often they'll have a tank truck drive onto the platform and top up the locomotives as part of the turnaround.

[ehbowen]

On 3/26/2022 at 2:56 PM, editor said:

 

It doesn't.  The track to Chicago diverges in San Antonio.  From Houston, you can only go east or west on Amtrak, unless you take an Amtrak bus to Longview and join the Chicago-bound train there.

https://www.amtrak.com/content/dam/projects/dotcom/english/public/documents/Maps/Amtrak-System-Map-1018.pdf

I've done the Sunset Limited between Houston and Los Angeles once, the Cascades a bunch of times (Seattle ↔︎ Vancouver), the Coast Starlight several times (Seattle ↔︎ Portland), the Empire Builder more times than I can remember (Chicago ↔︎ Milwaukee, Saint Paul, Seattle), and the Chicago ↔︎ Saint Louis run more times than I can remember (I remember it being called the Cardinal back then, but now it's just called "Illinois Service," and Cardinal is used for something that goes to New York).

On The Other Hand, since capacity is constrained by the single-track railroads, there's a lot of traffic from Houston east, and as Amtrak has no scheduled station stops between Houston and Beaumont the UP dispatchers normally make Amtrak use 'directional running'. As a legacy of the megamergers Union Pacific has two parallel single-track routes between Houston and Beaumont: The ex-Southern Pacific line through Crosby and Liberty and the ex-Missouri Pacific line which runs north of it through Huffman and Hardin. Normally, these days, eastbound trains take the ex-MoPac line and westbounders take the traditional Sunset Route.

To get to the eastbound track from the downtown Amtrak station the train has to get on the former Missouri Pacific route which originally ran through Conroe and Trinity to Palestine (former route of the Houston section of the MoPac Texas Eagle). Problem is there is no direct flyover or crossover from point A to point B. So what the eastbound train has to do is to follow the Sunset Route until it's past Tower 26, then back up on the diverging track south past Lyons Avenue which puts it on the old MoPac line, and finally proceed northbound on the ex-MoPac main until it diverges east for Beaumont just past 610.

This dance takes a little time and, needless to say, throws a monkey wrench into freight movements through the area (and the feeling is mutual). But I suppose it's simpler and cheaper than double-tracking the Sunset Route or, heaven forbid, building a spur route or crossover intended primarily for passenger traffic....

Edited November 21, 2022 by ehbowen

[editor]

@ehbowen— Since you seem to know a lot about this sort of thing, can you explain this for me:

On a Sunset Limited trip to New Orleans recently, the train picked us up at the downtown Houston station, but instead of leaving by going through downtown past Dakota Lofts, it backed up for what felt like several miles into the Heights area, and went north, then east. 

Is this usual?

[ehbowen]

1 hour ago, editor said:

@ehbowen— Since you seem to know a lot about this sort of thing, can you explain this for me:

On a Sunset Limited trip to New Orleans recently, the train picked us up at the downtown Houston station, but instead of leaving by going through downtown past Dakota Lofts, it backed up for what felt like several miles into the Heights area, and went north, then east. 

Is this usual?

While unusual it's far from being unique. Reference this map (which is a few years out of date). What the dispatcher was doing was ordering your train to back up on the "passenger main" where the Amtrak station is to west of Chaney Junction, where the freight main line (which, incidentally, is the one with the graffiti-covered bridge over I-45 and I-10 north of downtown) diverges. Once on the freight main, it's a direct shot to Tower 26 and thence to Belt Junction which is where the ex-MoPac line to Beaumont and New Orleans (main line #4 on the map) leaves the terminal area.

Why do they do that? Can't say. It could be that there was heavy freight train traffic at and around Tower 26 blocking the spur lines, or perhaps track work was in progress. While the directional running I mentioned above is standard operating procedure now that can change at the drop of a hat; if major track work is underway on either main track to Beaumont all traffic in both directions will likely be diverted to the other one.