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Subdude

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Ever will be? Time to take that broken crystal ball of yours in for a tune up. I think your kidding yourself if you are judging the future popularity of soccer on what you and your friends like.

Next, wxman will be trying to convince us that Galveston won't build anymore hotels because he doesn't like it either. Get over yourself.

My grandchildren love soccer. It is the only sport they care about. My kids enjoy basketball and we love the NFL. Times change. We need great soccer stadiums and not to make too many enemies here, but Texas A&M has a fabulous soccer stadium and one of my grandsons has a scholarship to same, so I'm seeing soccer as a big deal in a few years when all the youngsters grow up. We even have a big soccer field in our little town and the kids really turn out. No doubt in my mind, soccer is the game of the future.

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You guys are kidding yourself if you think that soccer is popular or will ever be popular in America.

1. When the United States hosted the World Cup in 1994, to this day, USA stadiums holds the record for highest average-attendance.

2. When the US Women beat China for the 1999 World Cup at the Rose Bowl, over 90,000 fans showed up

3. Reliant Stadium sold over 140,000 tickets for two soccer Gold Cup events less than 14 days ago. The Gold Cup Final in Soilder Field in Chicago sold out in less than 2 days, and Giants Stadium also sold out in the Mexico-Honduras upset in the first round.

4. Over 3 Million households in America watched the quarterfinal Mexico-Costa Rica/Honduras-Guadelupe game at Reliant Stadium last week. The semifinal and finals numbers aren't out yet, but chances are that the ratings could be higher than any NBA Finals 2007, Stanley Cup 2007, or World Series 2006 game.

5. There are more soccer-only channels (in english) available on American cable packages than any other sport.

So yes, the soccer is already popular in America. The difference is that MLS isn't as big in America yet as soccer is, but the league's still growing, and much more stablized for long-term success.

Edited by DJ V Lawrence
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So what's wrong with Robertson?

I watched a Dynamo game on ESPN2 the other night. It was 15% full.

Umm, actually, you are not even close. It was 44% full. Not bad for late June.

The reason Robertson will not work longterm is the same reason that the Texans needed a new stadium, the Astros needed a new stadium, and the Rockets needed a new stadium. In today's pro sports financial world, revenue comes from everywhere. Tickets, concessions, parking, permanent seat licenses, club seats, luxury boxes....AND stadium rental to other groups. A big part of the MLS plan is the design of soccer specific stadiums that can also function as outdoor music venues. This allows revenue to be generated even when the team is not playing.

The MLS owners recognize that pro sports leagues take time to generate a following. The big TV contracts will follow the people. For MLS to survive short term, the teams must be able to generate revenue from non-sports activities in the short term. Robertson Stadium gives the team a beautiful place to play, but not to generate needed revenue, since UH gets all non-MLS revenue.

A 25,000 stadium can actually be more useful than Reliant Stadium. It costs $200,000 to crank up Reliant for an event. If the event is not large enough, it cannot afford Reliant. A smaller venue could handle the myriad of smaller events without bankrupting the promoter.

Note to wxman: The Woodlands has not paid any money to Houston. It has not even voted on the issue yet. By the time it does, this deal will already be done, meaning it is funded by Houstonians. Furthermore, it is likely that Houston's contribution would be land already owned by the City, so no actual cash money would be used at all. If any cash is spent, it would probably be money spent to build the Astros a parking garage. Under your guidelines for public spending for sports arenas, I suppose parking garages for baseball teams would be OK, wouldn't it?

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Here is another problem with soccer in the US. When I was a kid my primary sport was soccer with my dad as the coach. But as I grew up I ended up playing baseball, basketball and football finally settling on football in high school.

I think many kids in the US go this path. Most parents including myself will put their kids in non harmful sports such as soccer when they are kids....but when they grow older most kids will play football, basketball and baseball. You throw in hockey up north.

Let me cut to the point. So down in the south soccer is at best a #4 sport...baseball, football and basketball are not going anywhere. Up north soccer is a #5 sport with hockey being added in. The rest of the world soccer is #1. What this means simply is that our best athletes do not play soccer. If they did we probably would have one of the better leaguse in the world, but that is not happening in my lifetime.

Go look at any HS and I guarantee you the best athletes are not on a soccer field. There is the problem for long term success....end of story.

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There is the problem for long term success....end of story.

US Wins CONCACAF Gold Cup

Gee, how did THAT happen?

Shady, while some of the best athletes do indeed go into football and basketball (baseball has this same complaint), soccer gets some pretty good athletes on its own. One of the biggest challenges to soccer is corporate money, requiring soccer to supplement its income from other souces. If the business side is played right, it will survive and thrive.

On a national scale, the US soccer team's biggest problem is not that they are not good...they are considered some of the best "technical" players out there...it is that their technical style of play is seen as boring. They are the San Antonio Spurs of soccer. I enjoyed watching some of the Euros and South American teams last year more than our own US team.

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Here is my point...in this country fans take to sports that have the "Michael Jordan" factor....I know all of you guys are going to bring up Beckham at this point but he is 32 with maybe two good years left...soccer is not an old man's game....let MLS get a prime player in his 20s and then we will talk.

Many people forget the NASL got Pele, one of the greatest players in the world (better than Beckham) but the league folded a few years later.

I know good players play soccer in the states I am just saying that in the US we are spoiled we like to see the best athletes in our professional sports. Maybe if I had not watched soccer teams in Europe and Brazil play I would think MLS is fine....but is not even in the same stratosphere.

It is the same arguement as saying I love NFL Europe because I live in Germany...fine I respect that but realize the players you watch in NFL Europe could not sniff the jock of a majority of players in the NFL.

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So what's wrong with Robertson?

I watched a Dynamo game on ESPN2 the other night. It was 15% full. Seems like Robertson is able to accomodate the number of fans who want to watch this stuff.

Against Chivas last Thursday, there were over 16,000 fans in attendance. i saw the number on the Dynamo website.

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there are a lot of things wrong with Robertson on top of what Red mentioned above.

Scheduling conflicts with UH - we had to play a home game at A&M because it was on a weekday. There were still 4300 in attendance for a Thursday night game over two hours away.

During the football season, the yardlines are down on the field which is very distracting for players and fans.

The deal they have financially doesn't make sense in the long run. Dynamo are getting screwed out of profits for concessions, parking, etc.

Its not a soccer specific stadium, and could never draw what AEG/Dynamo want.

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That girl is fine, but soccer will be popular in America. It already is gaining in popularity.

Heck you know it's gaining popularity when I was in the Jim Rome type camp and didn't even use to consider it a sport, but now I actually like it.

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Does Jim Rome still hate soccer? I know his son plays it (he was talking about it before). I'll have to tune into him today before he goes off (I think he already did), or on ESPN today.

Not sure. I don't really listen to him much anymore, but I did the other day. He was going over his past with sports, saying how he used to hate NASCAR and now he loves it, and I thought he said he hated soccer and still does, so.

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Umm, actually, you are not even close. It was 44% full. Not bad for late June.

The reason Robertson will not work longterm is the same reason that the Texans needed a new stadium, the Astros needed a new stadium, and the Rockets needed a new stadium. In today's pro sports financial world, revenue comes from everywhere. Tickets, concessions, parking, permanent seat licenses, club seats, luxury boxes....AND stadium rental to other groups. A big part of the MLS plan is the design of soccer specific stadiums that can also function as outdoor music venues. This allows revenue to be generated even when the team is not playing.

The MLS owners recognize that pro sports leagues take time to generate a following. The big TV contracts will follow the people. For MLS to survive short term, the teams must be able to generate revenue from non-sports activities in the short term. Robertson Stadium gives the team a beautiful place to play, but not to generate needed revenue, since UH gets all non-MLS revenue.

A 25,000 stadium can actually be more useful than Reliant Stadium. It costs $200,000 to crank up Reliant for an event. If the event is not large enough, it cannot afford Reliant. A smaller venue could handle the myriad of smaller events without bankrupting the promoter.

Note to wxman: The Woodlands has not paid any money to Houston. It has not even voted on the issue yet. By the time it does, this deal will already be done, meaning it is funded by Houstonians. Furthermore, it is likely that Houston's contribution would be land already owned by the City, so no actual cash money would be used at all. If any cash is spent, it would probably be money spent to build the Astros a parking garage. Under your guidelines for public spending for sports arenas, I suppose parking garages for baseball teams would be OK, wouldn't it?

That would be ok as long as the Astros fund it. I don't think Dynamo should have to fund the Astros parking garage. However if the Stadium is to be built so close by, they need to be good neighbors and share their parking spaces for Astros games...if it is going to sit on land currently used for parking at Astros games.

Edited by wxman
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That would be ok as long as the Astros fund it. I don't think Dynamo should have to fund the Astros parking garage. However if the Stadium is to be built so close by, they need to be good neighbors and share their parking spaces for Astros games...if it is going to sit on land currently used for parking at Astros games.

the current plan as i understand it is the Astros would be giving up their current STH parking lot for the Dynamo Stadium. Then the city would help them build a garage for the Astros season ticket holders, and the city would use the garage as well. Drayton and the Dynamo are getting along, and there seem to be no issues on that front. Problem right now is that the Dynamo stadium would be used as a concert venue as well by AEG, and Les Alexander has a non-compete clause in his contract with the city that no other venues with capacity greater then 5K would be within X miles of the Toyota Center.

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Here is my point...in this country fans take to sports that have the "Michael Jordan" factor....I know all of you guys are going to bring up Beckham at this point but he is 32 with maybe two good years left...soccer is not an old man's game....let MLS get a prime player in his 20s and then we will talk.

Well, MLS DOES have Landon Donovan. Perhaps the best player in American history. He's tied Eric Wynalda's national team record for most goals in his career. Wynalda was 31, and Donovan is now 25. But I agree with you with the name factor issue. Once Beckham gets here, the secret is to create more big names in the league, because there is already some really good talent throughout.

Many people forget the NASL got Pele, one of the greatest players in the world (better than Beckham) but the league folded a few years later.

I keep hearing this Beckham/Pele comparison. Wasn't Pele like, 38 when he played in NASL? And I think he played 3 semi-retirement seasons, not 5 season like Beckham is, while trying to stay on England. Beckham's 32, around the same age as Allen Iverson, Peyton Manning, etc., and is still playing for the England National Team. Though Pele was one of the greatest ever, I seriously doubt that Pele at 38 was as in his prime coming to the Cosmos as Beckham, who just led Real Madrid to it's first La Liga in 4 years just a few weeks ago.

I know good players play soccer in the states I am just saying that in the US we are spoiled we like to see the best athletes in our professional sports. Maybe if I had not watched soccer teams in Europe and Brazil play I would think MLS is fine....but is not even in the same stratosphere.

Regardless of other countries, there's no denying that MLS is the biggest and best league soccer in the USA. It's not one of the biggest leagues in the world yet, but it's far from the worst, and the attention the league is recieving worldwide is not seen with every league in the world.

And we have a really good team. 5 game winning streak, MLS Champs, beat the South American champs in CCC 2-0 at home a few months ago. So it's not like Dynamo will never be a top-tier team one day. But they have a great foundation talent-wise, and have to keep growing. Part of that comes from being financially stable with their own stadium, and building their young fanbase year after year.

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5 game winning streak, MLS Champs, beat the South American champs in CCC 2-0 at home a few months ago.

Pachuca are not really the South American champs. Pachuca are the reigning Copa Sudamericana champions which is like the UEFA cup winner in Europe (as opposed to the Champions league). It is a continental championship, but is not the true continental club championship. Boca Juniors are the current Copa Libertadores holders and thus South American Champions. In Europe Sevilla won the EUFA Cup but are not European Champions (AC Milan won the Champions League)

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This is too easy...lol

Well, MLS DOES have Landon Donovan. Perhaps the best player in American history. He's tied Eric Wynalda's national team record for most goals in his career. Wynalda was 31, and Donovan is now 25. But I agree with you with the name factor issue. Once Beckham gets here, the secret is to create more big names in the league, because there is already some really good talent throughout.

Landon Donovan...he had to come back to the states because he could not cut it in Germany...go read about it.

I keep hearing this Beckham/Pele comparison. Wasn't Pele like, 38 when he played in NASL? And I think he played 3 semi-retirement seasons, not 5 season like Beckham is, while trying to stay on England. Beckham's 32, around the same age as Allen Iverson, Peyton Manning, etc., and is still playing for the England National Team. Though Pele was one of the greatest ever, I seriously doubt that Pele at 38 was as in his prime coming to the Cosmos as Beckham, who just led Real Madrid to it's first La Liga in 4 years just a few weeks ago.

Pele was 34 ( a whole 2 years older than Bechham )

Regardless of other countries, there's no denying that MLS is the biggest and best league soccer in the USA. It's not one of the biggest leagues in the world yet, but it's far from the worst, and the attention the league is recieving worldwide is not seen with every league in the world.

Keep your hopes and dreams alive....as long as we promote MLS I am all for starting minor league baseball, hockey, basketball and arena football forums.

And we have a really good team. 5 game winning streak, MLS Champs, beat the South American champs in CCC 2-0 at home a few months ago. So it's not like Dynamo will never be a top-tier team one day. But they have a great foundation talent-wise, and have to keep growing. Part of that comes from being financially stable with their own stadium, and building their young fanbase year after year.

Hate to break it too you but I am in my 30s...all of my friends played soccer when we were kids. Once we were in high school we all played other sports.

Edited by shady 75
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Ignoring all the kiddy bickering, thanks for the update. I'll keep my eyes peeled for news updates in mid-late July.

Houston getting in on one of the fastest growing sports in the country only makes sense. Also they are always throwing out that line about getting the Olympics, this cant hurt.

--Cheers

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Keep your hopes and dreams alive....as long as we promote MLS I am all for starting minor league baseball, hockey, basketball and arena football forums.

we'll start one of those forums for you when a minor league team in houston draws over 19K in average attendance for a season and has a deal in the work with the city for their own stadium.

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Honestly...***JUST MY OPINION***, I think that building a soccer stadium in Houston or anywhere in America for that matter is a HUGE waste of money. I don't like soccer. My friends don't like soccer. My family does not like soccer. I have a feeling that there are many others out there who feel the same way. I don't intend to cause contraversy on here, but that's just the way I feel. Half the people I talk to didn't even know we had a soccer team. And the name Dynamo...can't they have come up with something a little better than that? I mean for having almost all our sports teams with a space theme, except for the Texans (another bad name), you'd think they'd follow in the footsteps.

Yea, that's reason enough to not build a stadium. :rolleyes:

I have never been to a game, though I would like to go. Most people I know don't go to the games, though ENOUGH people do go to support the team. If we are going to have a team, we need a stadium.

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This is too easy...lol

Aight, let's see what we have here B) ....

Landon Donovan...he had to come back to the states because he could not cut it in Germany...go read about it.

Then he ends up coming back to LA Galaxy and becomes a better player than in Germany. Not just for Galaxy, but really a better player. Don't believe me? See how many goals he scored for the USMNT when he was playing for Germany. 0. Then see what he's done for the USMNT since going back to Galaxy. He scored more goals than a Lakewood Church service...

Pele was 34 ( a whole 2 years older than Bechham )

My mistake there. I wasn't alive when Pele was with the Cosmos, so I don't know how good he was at his age. But Beckham is well in his prime still and is playing some of the best football (soccer 4 the global translation) in his career right now. What he did at La Liga and for England the past 3 months was unbelievable.

Keep your hopes and dreams alive....as long as we promote MLS I am all for starting minor league baseball, hockey, basketball and arena football forums.

So there is a bigger soccer league in America than MLS? Nice try. The amount of players in MLS currently representing their national countries (including Beckham next month) is well high. They are certainly not minor-league quality players. If they were, they'd probably be in a league you've never heard of.

Hate to break it too you but I am in my 30s...all of my friends played soccer when we were kids. Once we were in high school we all played other sports.

You don't have to play the sport in your 30s to be a sports fan (including soccer), or a fan of your city or country.

Now, to show the potential of the sport in this country...

The Gold Cup soccer final between the United States and Mexico on Sunday drew a bigger TV audience than the Stanley Cup final.

Univision said Tuesday that its telecast received a 2.5 preliminary rating, which equates to about 2.8 million households and 5.3 million viewers. The Ducks' 6-2 win over Ottawa in the final game of the Stanley Cup earned a 1.8 rating

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Okay, I'll take your word for it. Sure did look like a lot of red, though.

i was there, crowd was pretty good. actually quite impressive given it was a weekday, and the USA-Canada GOLD cup game was ending as the Dynamo game was starting, and the Mexico game was starting half way through. The Front Office did put together a viewing party for the Gold cup games on four 42" plasmas outside Robertson, which was cool. I know a lot of people that stayed afterwards to watch the Mexico game.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Not too sound like a racist, but you sound like a fairly ignorant honky. :)

HAHHAHAHA!!!

Thanks for the laught Kink. I havent heard the phrase "honkey" since the meathead references in "all in the family"! I do agree that this is a city of Houston issue for the most part. I love living in the city of Houston, and think this would be a great addition to a more vibrant downtown scene. I hope it happens. Although I now live most definitely in the suburban side of the city (bay area), I still live in the city of Houston, am proud of this city, and support anything that makes it better. I hope the new stadium gets built.

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So, it's almost mid July. We should be hearing something about the stadium pretty soon, right?

Good question. That deadline's not too long from now.

Meanwhile, DC United unveiled their stadium renderings for Washington D.C. across the river from the Nationals' new baseball stadium.

_w-hotel_nsm.jpg

It's a 27,000 seater / expandable to 35,000. Complete with a hotel, practice fields, centrally located, the whole shibangabang...

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Oliver Luck was on the Dynamo Power Hour tonight...

Some key points that he talked about...

- The negotiations may need to be extended on the new stadium ... He mentioned their has been great progress but dollars and cents still need to be work out.

- Everything has been agreed on with the Astros and Rockets.

- The mayor is on board with the Dynamo.

- The stadium will be ready for the 2010 season.

It sounds like the stadium will be just east of DT and key issues have been agreed on but the final agreement about who pays for what still needs to be finished.

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The DC United new stadium will be on the Potomac River. It is in the middle of a new urban village they are building. I wouldn't mind the Dynamo's stadium on the Buffalo Bayou with that new Buffalo Bayou Plan. It would still be near Downtown, and you could still have a great view of the skyline.

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