Shell Energy Stadium

[MidtownCoog]

From the article:

The number of youths that would be positively affected far surpasses the number currently golfing at Gus Wortham Park.

That's becuase illegal aliens don't play Golf. This would end up being a soccer field for grown men.

[TJones]

From the article:

That's becuase illegal aliens don't play Golf. This would end up being a soccer field for grown men.

BINGO! Way to take up the fight Ms. Alvarado !

[DJ V Lawrence]

From the article:

That's becuase illegal aliens don't play Golf. This would end up being a soccer field for grown men.

R U saying that U.S. citizens in East End don't play soccer?

I would probably say though that more people play soccer for recreation in the Houston-area (including East End), than golf.

[Guest danax]

R U saying that U.S. citizens in East End don't play soccer?

I would probably say though that more people play soccer for recreation in the Houston-area (including East End), than golf.

I agree with Coog based on my casual observations in Mason Park, where a $600K City-funded soccer field complex is under construction, that the players are all adults who speak Spanish, which leads one to deduce they many are not natives, and that many are likely here illegally.

At a recent Super Neighborhood meeting nearby, when the Gus Wortham possible conversion was discussed (and one person mentioned that he had info that the idea was "dead") one woman mentioned the City's Park Master Plan, and how the East End was the only area that already had enough soccer fields. The official vote/position of the Super Neighborhood members in attendance, which was going to be forwarded to the appropriate City officials, was unanimously against the Wortham conversion, but was for having it in the East End, just somewhere else that would be a positive change, not a negative one.

[DJ V Lawrence]

I'm just being realistic. Keeping Gus Wortham for "historical" purposes as is, is like keeping the Astrodome for historical purposes as is. Both are under-utilized and aren't making money for the city/county. Gus Wortham is meant to be a community location, not private. If it suits that area for soccer fields, so be it, and if more people in that area want to play golf there, so be it. How does losing golf or not having soccer fields at Gus Wortham mean that golf or soccer is diminishing in Houston? Neither are. Just have something there that the immediate community in East End would more appreciate between the two, that's all.

Where is the arguement here? It's not that big a deal. Both a soccer complex and the current golf course are nice in East End. Ask the residents there which one they would more likely use, listen to the community, and make it happen. And if they said "I'd rather play soccer than golf", call it the Gus Wortham Soccer Complex. No integrity lost.

[MidtownCoog]

the players are all adults who speak Spanish

This is how it was when I lived in Big D. At least on the south side.

To say "The number of youths that would be positively affected far surpasses the number currently golfing at Gus Wortham Park" is not nearly enough.

Do these youth attend school? Is there a soccer field at their school? Somebody has an agenda here. Just becuase soccer is gaining popularity does not mean we need to make any rash decisions.

Edited February 16, 2007 by MidtownCoog

[DJ V Lawrence]

This is how it was when I lived in Big D. At least on the south side.

To say "The number of youths that would be positively affected far surpasses the number currently golfing at Gus Wortham Park" is not nearly enough.

Do these youth attend school? Is there a soccer field at their school? Somebody has an agenda here. Just becuase soccer is gaining popularity does not mean we need to make any rash decisions.

The issue here is more about the future of the Gus Wortham golf site than about soccer. If there were higher occupancy the past few years there, there probably wouldn't be an arguement. Even after a $6 Million renovation for the golf site, would more people play there?

I personally think there's not enough quality youth/adult fields for quite a number of sports in some areas of Houston including soccer. Football for example. Some youth leagues have a problem finding places for their kids to practice. Baseball and basketball at time, too. Not everyone can play when they want. Soccer is probably has the most popular youth-leagues of all sports, so I'm guessing that's why they call it a soccer project even though a baseball field is included in the talks.

[TheNiche]

Terrible idea. In addition to the soccer fields being developed at Mason park, the City should be looking to develop fields at the park that will be developed at the east side of Wayside at the Buffalo Bayou or around where the big rail junction is near old Harrisburg. The BBP also owns an industrial facility adjacent to Tony Marron Park, which would be well-suited for redevelopment into sporting fields.

The golf course should stay, although I'd like to see it more opened up, like the Hermann Park course is. If it were more integrated into the park system along Braes Bayou, it could be a real asset to the surrounding community.

[ricco67]

While I'd hate to see the golf course go, I think it will be better utilize as a stadium with additional fields. It's a massive piece of land, so I can't see why they can't just keep a 9-hole course.

While some people on here derided a 9 hole golf course as pointless, perhaps I should point out to "mulligan's" over by Jones @ 1960 that seems to do quite well up there for the past 20 years or so. It can be a great place for beginners who can't afford the green fee's of a larger course to play as regularly.

[HistoricalGusWortham]

At a community meeting tonight in Glenbrook, it was brought up by one of Carol Alvarado's assistants that there is a move afoot to take out the golf course at Gus Wortham and replace it with a soccer field. Has anybody else heard about this? I think that would be a terrible move for the area.

As everyone now knows, they are most definately considering replace Gus Wortham with soccer fields. Every neighborhood around it is firmly opposed to the idea. The course is under utilized because the city has never made the repairs to it that it has needed for so long. In addition the repairs to remedy the flooding of Brays Bayou has also interfered with one of the holes. On a beautiful day such as today the course is packed. Contrary to what many people think, the Latino population does use the course as do all the other nationalities that live in the East End. We are not a bunch of thugs living over here and we will not let the city destroy the golf course that our neighborhoods were built around.

[TJones]

As everyone now knows, they are most definately considering replace Gus Wortham with soccer fields. Every neighborhood around it is firmly opposed to the idea. The course is under utilized because the city has never made the repairs to it that it has needed for so long. In addition the repairs to remedy the flooding of Brays Bayou has also interfered with one of the holes. On a beautiful day such as today the course is packed. Contrary to what many people think, the Latino population does use the course as do all the other nationalities that live in the East End. We are not a bunch of thugs living over here and we will not let the city destroy the golf course that our neighborhoods were built around.

It is great to have someone insightful on this subject, since it appears that you actually live in the area and apparently keep tabs on what is going on in your community. Bravo on your first post here, and welcome to the Forum.

[DJ V Lawrence]

It is great to have someone insightful on this subject, since it appears that you actually live in the area and apparently keep tabs on what is going on in your community. Bravo on your first post here, and welcome to the Forum.

I'm with TJones; welcome to HAIF

Are you sure that "Every neighborhood around it is firmly opposed to the idea" of having soccer fields on Gus Wortham instead of a golf course? I've talked to a couple friends in the East End area, and it sounds more like a 50-50 split. They all wanted more soccer fields in the area, but the Gus Wortham site itself sounds more like a "depends on who you ask" than a "everyone here is opposed or supporting it"

[bruno]

Pearland has a shot getting a soccer stadium for the Dynamo and will also be used for high school football.

[Trae]

Pearland isn't that far out, so I actually wouldn't mind.

[DJ V Lawrence]

It's a stupid idea. In an area like Pearland, if they had a Houston-named professional team in the same stadium as one or some of their own high-school football teams, they would probably try to claim it football-first, soccer second, totally defeating the purpose.

The soccer stadium needs to be near Houston's center, and should be used for Houston events when soccer isn't being plaed there. And these days, Dynamo's playing more months a year and more major tournaments than any other team in Houston, so the stadium would be highly used. But this is Houston's team, not Pearland's.

[MexAmerican_Moose]

i'm all for it...let the City of Pearland pay for the stadium

[TheNiche]

I'm with TJones; welcome to HAIF

Are you sure that "Every neighborhood around it is firmly opposed to the idea" of having soccer fields on Gus Wortham instead of a golf course? I've talked to a couple friends in the East End area, and it sounds more like a 50-50 split. They all wanted more soccer fields in the area, but the Gus Wortham site itself sounds more like a "depends on who you ask" than a "everyone here is opposed or supporting it"

Perhaps the question should be posed to your friends in two parts: 1) do you want more soccer fields, and 2) do you want to keep the golf course? It isn't as though there aren't a fair number of tracts of vacant land and vacant warehouses nearby that would make a good substitute. Soccer fields and golf courses are not mutually exclusive of one another.

[Subdude]

There were two topics on this so merged threads.

[ricco67]

Then how about this:

There is already a substantial park over by the bayou near 70th street (the name escapes me, I think it's Mason park), perhaps a tree lined plaza or some sort of family park by the stadium? I REALLY do want to keep part of the course.

It is my hope that kids will be able to attend the soccer games, and be exposed to Golf, or at least see and question people playing golf.

The players (of golf) can find a place to relax there as well.

I really don't know, I'm almost beside myself as to what would be fit and fair for the city as far as this location goes.

[MidtownCoog]

Soccer in the East End is great goal

[Subdude]

Note merged two additional Dynamo stadium proposal topics into this one.

[tigereye]

Hate to burst everyone's bubble about Dynamo and inner-city renewal but, after constructing 3 new facilities, the scope of AEG's Houston plans were just too big for the city....

Its time to shift your focus south for the future location of AEG's sports and entertainment complex.

For Dynamo...the land of Pears beckons.......

(I really wanted to say "the land of Pears Beckhams" but that might get people thinking a litle too hard)

[DJ V Lawrence]

Hate to burst everyone's bubble about Dynamo and inner-city renewal but, after constructing 3 new facilities, the scope of AEG's Houston plans were just too big for the city....

Its time to shift your focus south for the future location of AEG's sports and entertainment complex.

For Dynamo...the land of Pears beckons.......

(I really wanted to say "the land of Pears Beckhams" but that might get people thinking a litle too hard)

If the Astros, Texans, or Rockets knew they couldn't have as high attendance in an another city like Pearland while calling it "Houston", how or why would Dynamo even consider it? That'd be the dumbest business decision in the history of Houston-area sports.

[musicman]

If the Astros, Texans, or Rockets knew they couldn't have as high attendance in an another city like Pearland while calling it "Houston", how or why would Dynamo even consider it? That'd be the dumbest business decision in the history of Houston-area sports.

it's all about making a good deal and some of our suburb cities have money to offer that.

[T 2 THA C]

If the East End project dose not work out, then why not rebuild Del Marr stadium with HISD. I would rather have the stadium in the vicinity of Downtown, but the land prices, and the opposition on the east seems to make this a no win.

Cy-Fair has the Berry Center, Katy has theirs, and HISD just completed their new HQ building. NW mall is fading away, as well as the surrounding area. I think with HISD they could make this work with the fields and all, plus HISD could rebuild that piss stinking basketball Gymnasium. This could help resurrect NW Mall and the surrounding area.

They are rebuild 290, with toll road down Hempstead that is directly behind the mall and runs by Del Marr, with commuter rail, and direct connections to 610 and most likely the NW TC, so mass transit would no be a problem. I am a Little biast seeing I live on Mangum right down the street, and I have friends that remember that Golf course since the beginning of their time.

I defiantly would want the stadium in the city limits, and I'm not entirely opposed to the east end site, but i do not know the traffic situation in that area per say, but I do know the infrastructure over there needs improvement

Edited February 19, 2007 by T 2 THA C

[DJ V Lawrence]

If the East End project dose not work out, then why not rebuild Del Marr stadium with HISD. I would rather have the stadium in the vicinity of Downtown, but the land prices, and the opposition on the east seems to make this a no win.

Cy-Fair has the Berry Center, Katy has theirs, and HISD just completed their new HQ building. NW mall is fading away, as well as the surrounding area. I think with HISD they could make this work with the fields and all, plus HISD could rebuild that piss stinking basketball Gymnasium. This could help resurrect NW Mall and the surrounding area.

They are rebuild 290, with toll road down Hempstead that is directly behind the mall and runs by Del Marr, with commuter rail, and direct connections to 610 and most likely the NW TC, so mass transit would no be a problem. I am a Little biast seeing I live on Mangum right down the street, and I have friends that remember that Golf course since the beginning of their time.

I defiantly would want the stadium in the city limits, and I'm not entirely opposed to the east end site, but i do not know the traffic situation in that area per say, but I do know the infrastructure over there needs improvement

I think if any high school stadium were to be converted to be Dynamo's new home, it'd be Delmar because of their location. And I think it's a much better deal for soccer AND Houston if it were there than in a suburb where it takes at least 25 minutes to get there from Downtown.

That being said, the stadium has to be soccer-specific, football-second, and the high schools calling it home would have to respect that by understanding that the team gets priority when it comes to scheduling. But having it football-first would be pointless to build and a waste of money if the high school teams already have a stadium.

That's why it's probably better if it's a soccer/concert/convention stadium in Houston with no regular-season football involved. Dynamo would probably play there nine months a year, and exibitions/tournaments could take place there year-around when it isn't the US vs. Mexico, major EPL tours, or major cups coming to town (in those cases, it'd have to be in Reliant)

[ricco67]

I think if any high school stadium were to be converted to be Dynamo's new home, it'd be Delmar because of their location. And I think it's a much better deal for soccer AND Houston if it were there than in a suburb where it takes at least 25 minutes to get there from Downtown.

I don't really how it would be a boon for houston for it to be held 25 minutes outside of downtown? It makes no sense at all.

That's why it's probably better if it's a soccer/concert/convention stadium in Houston with no regular-season football involved. Dynamo would probably play there nine months a year, and exibitions/tournaments could take place there year-around when it isn't the US vs. Mexico, major EPL tours, or major cups coming to town (in those cases, it'd have to be in Reliant)

Perhaps it would be better if it was built in the east side or in downtown, it would have more opportunities for concerts and festivals if it was held closer in.

[westguy76]

While I'd hate to see the golf course go, I think it will be better utilize as a stadium with additional fields. It's a massive piece of land, so I can't see why they can't just keep a 9-hole course.

While some people on here derided a 9 hole golf course as pointless, perhaps I should point out to "mulligan's" over by Jones @ 1960 that seems to do quite well up there for the past 20 years or so. It can be a great place for beginners who can't afford the green fee's of a larger course to play as regularly.

there is an article in the latest issue of golf digest about the growing popularity of nine hole golf courses and the origin of the current 18 hole standard. There are plenty of times when i'd like to get out and play golf and do it for 2 and a half hours as opposed to 5. this all being said i have never played gus wortham. I understand it is a hassle to get on at memorial(but i would like to do it) and i have played herman several times and enjoyed it.

this all being said whats wrong with the astrodome location? couldn't we demolish that relic and put in a world class soccer stadium. there is all that existing suface parking.

[DJ V Lawrence]

there is an article in the latest issue of golf digest about the growing popularity of nine hole golf courses and the origin of the current 18 hole standard. There are plenty of times when i'd like to get out and play golf and do it for 2 and a half hours as opposed to 5. this all being said i have never played gus wortham. I understand it is a hassle to get on at memorial(but i would like to do it) and i have played herman several times and enjoyed it.

this all being said whats wrong with the astrodome location? couldn't we demolish that relic and put in a world class soccer stadium. there is all that existing suface parking.

I think soccer in Reliant Park would be a big success for soccer(Astrodome or another stadium), but the question would be how AEG would get naming rights money for the stadium if they played at the county-owned Dome. This is another reason why it's important to know the fate of the Dome-hotel plan in the next few weeks. If that falls through, something has to be done, and perhaps the best bet would be to revamp the dome with $100 Million instead of paying for demolition. I'm sure more Houstonians want to see the Dome revamped than tore down, and with MLS's major surge this past off-season, they could turn the Dome into a 30,000 soccer-specific stadium with room for major internal expansion.

I think for that to happen, AEG would have to buy out the dome from the county.

[nmainguy]

Just for informational purposes: an editorial, letters and a blog.

I don't have a dog in this hunt but I'd hate to see Wortham leveled when there is still a huge chunk of land at 290 and 610 [Delmar] potentially available.