Shell Energy Stadium

[musicman]

The Hilton has its own garage.

according to the front desk, the hilton garage is shared with toyota center and grb. i know a couple of mgrs, i will ask next time i see either of em.

[musicman]

Major League Soccer is urging Anschutz Entertainment Group to sell the Dynamo because it also owns the Los Angeles Galaxy, another MLS team.

Such a sale would not alter AEG's plan to form a private-public partnership within weeks with the city to build a downtown soccer stadium because the deal would include an agreement that the team wouldn't move, said city and Dynamo officials.

full article

Edited November 22, 2007 by musicman

[Houston19514]

according to the front desk, the hilton garage is shared with toyota center and grb. i know a couple of mgrs, i will ask next time i see either of em.

Well, it's attached to the Hilton by skywalk and that's where the Hilton guests park, not in the Toyota Center garage. I've stayed there several times.

[lockmat]

Major League Soccer is urging Anschutz Entertainment Group to sell the Dynamo because it also owns the Los Angeles Galaxy, another MLS team.

Such a sale would not alter AEG's plan to form a private-public partnership within weeks with the city to build a downtown soccer stadium because the deal would include an agreement that the team wouldn't move, said city and Dynamo officials.

full article

Why would AEG build a soccer stadium w/ its own money, then sell the team? Sounds to me like a stadium deal is far in the future, unless a new owner steps right in where they left off, which I doubt.

[DJ V Lawrence]

Major League Soccer is urging Anschutz Entertainment Group to sell the Dynamo because it also owns the Los Angeles Galaxy, another MLS team.

Such a sale would not alter AEG's plan to form a private-public partnership within weeks with the city to build a downtown soccer stadium because the deal would include an agreement that the team wouldn't move, said city and Dynamo officials.

full article

The wierd part is that KHOU has finally mentioned the first possible new owner...Oscar De La Hoya.

Why would AEG build a soccer stadium w/ its own money, then sell the team?

AEG's done that before in MLS. They normally do two things: sell the team for profit and sell the stadium operation rights for the same price they spent, or keep the operation rights, where they recieve some money from MLS games, and a majority of their money from their own concert events. Houston's deal with AEG would have to be different from the others because of the Rockets, because they have exclusive concert rights with Toyota Center until 2013, at which point there wouldn't be a violation of contract.

It also sounds from the way everyone's talking that the City Of Houston, AEG, and De La Hoya (if the reports are accurate) all are fully aware of each other's negotiations. It's going to be fun to see how this one plays out.

[tigereye]

The wierd part is that KHOU has finally mentioned the first possible new owner...Oscar De La Hoya.

AEG's done that before in MLS. They normally do two things: sell the team for profit and sell the stadium operation rights for the same price they spent, or keep the operation rights, where they recieve some money from MLS games, and a majority of their money from their own concert events. Houston's deal with AEG would have to be different from the others because of the Rockets, because they have exclusive concert rights with Toyota Center until 2013, at which point there wouldn't be a violation of contract.

It also sounds from the way everyone's talking that the City Of Houston, AEG, and De La Hoya (if the reports are accurate) all are fully aware of each other's negotiations. It's going to be fun to see how this one plays out.

Well, if you do some research, you'll find one little fact.

In regards to the sale of other MLS clubs AEG used to own, AEG did not sell those teams until a stadium deal was in place. This not only drove up the value of the sale, but IIRC, it ensured that AEG would hold promotional rights over the new venue, even after the sale of the MLS club.

So given the timing of this De La Hoya link, following on the heels of reports of a soon-to-be completed stadium deal swirling, this might be the tell-tale sign that a downtown stadium deal is complete.

Edited November 23, 2007 by tigereye

[memebag]

The wierd part is that KHOU has finally mentioned the first possible new owner...Oscar De La Hoya.

That is weird. Fishnet uniforms, anyone?

[Trae]

Check this out:

Golden Boy Partners.

[NewMND]

Yeah, from what I understand, someone new will own the Dynamo, but AEG will run the stadium and events/concerts that occur there.

[ricco67]

From what I understand it will be open air, I just hope it's engineered properly so we won't roast during the summers.

Assuming that some sort of agreement is met between toyota and MMP, I can't imagine what kind of events that could be held there that wouldn't directly compete with the offerings at the other parks.

Although, multi-day music festivals would be one, though.

[newtex]

Well consider this....

In Minneapolis, The Minnesota Twins are constructing their new 42,000 seat, 1 million square-foot ballpark on just EIGHT ACRES of land in Downtown Minneapolis.

So I think the Dynamo, the city, and architects can find a way to make this site work for a 25,000 seat-max stadium that probably be less then 750,000 square feet.

1,000,000 square feet is 23 acres.

8 acres is 600 feet by 600 feet. A soccer field by itself is 360 feet by 240 feet. I don't see any way to get the whole thing into 8 acres.

But even if you accept the 600 feet by 600 feet size constraint, that's still a parcel two blocks by two blocks. With the light rail on Capitol, Rusk, and Harrisburg it is going to be tough to get a stadium in the area near Texas and Dowling. Especially when you look at the all the new townhouse development going on south of there.

I'm guessing it can be done but it is going to be tight.

I looked at the plans for the Twins ballpark. I think the "8 acre footprint" is a bit misleading. Part of that stadium is going to be built above the existing streets and highways so it will have an 8 acre footprint but the stadium itself will cover more total square footage. You are not going to be able to do that for a Dynamo stadium with the cost constraints that the team is willing to pay. The Twins stadium is going to cost $522 million so they can get much more creative in reducing the size of the footprint.

[ricco67]

I looked at the plans for the Twins ballpark. I think the "8 acre footprint" is a bit misleading. Part of that stadium is going to be built above the existing streets and highways so it will have an 8 acre footprint but the stadium itself will cover more total square footage. You are not going to be able to do that for a Dynamo stadium with the cost constraints that the team is willing to pay. The Twins stadium is going to cost $522 million so they can get much more creative in reducing the size of the footprint.

Fascinating design, it would be interesting to see what they come up with. It would be interesting if they come up with something along these lines for the east side.

[RedScare]

The 1 million square feet is usable space, not footprint. It includes the multi-level office space, as well as multi-level concourses. Think office tower, where 1 million square feet is built on 1 acre.

As for a soccer stadium, a 4 block area would encompass approximately 600x600 feet. Excluding parking, a 25,000 seat stadium could fit in a 4 block area, but yes, it would pretty much run up to the sidewalks. Not that a Wrigley Field arrangement would be a BAD thing, though. It could be very cool looking.

[tigereye]

The 1 million square feet is usable space, not footprint. It includes the multi-level office space, as well as multi-level concourses. Think office tower, where 1 million square feet is built on 1 acre.

As for a soccer stadium, a 4 block area would encompass approximately 600x600 feet. Excluding parking, a 25,000 seat stadium could fit in a 4 block area, but yes, it would pretty much run up to the sidewalks. Not that a Wrigley Field arrangement would be a BAD thing, though. It could be very cool looking.

I'm well aware of the difference between usuable space and footprint. The way the Twins are able to fit over 1 million square feet of usuable space onto the smallest foottprint for a major league ballpark is by building the ballpark upwards, much like the office tower concept you alluded to. This is why I brought this up. While I dont know the acreage of the site, if it is indeed a tight fit for a soccer stadium, the facility could be built upwards, like the Twins Ballpark. In fact, the Twins new Ballpark at 237 ft high, will be a full 42 ft higher then the 195 ft high Metrodome. But also, this ballpark runs right up to the sidewalks as well. And I happen to like that, it gives the venue and the area around it a more true urban feel.

Now imagine Dynamo Stadium being fit into a tight space in the Warehouse District, much like the Twins ballpark or Fenway Park, to the point where the stadium runs right up to the sidewalk. I think, with all the nearby townhome developments surrounding the site, a stadium arrangement like this would create an urban neighborhood much like Wrigleyville or the area around Yawkey Way. Something like this would do wonders to changing the entire landscape of the East End area.

[lockmat]

More "reasons" to build the stadium. Some we've discussed, others we haven't.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/5326571.html

written by a former player

this is the fourth-largest city in the United States, the gateway to Mexico, Central America and South America.

With a soccer-specific stadium downtown, the Dynamo would continue to elevate national and international awareness of our city. When the Dynamo play teams from Mexico and other Central American countries, the games are broadcast to other nations.

With the NBA, NFL and MLB not involved with international competition of "meaning," the Dynamo and soccer hold an important key for bringing global attention to Houston.

More international competition will come the Dynamo's way in the future with the CONCACAF Champions' League, SuperLiga and other tournaments that provide a measuring stick and exposure for MLS teams.

Most of these games are midweek matches that can't be played at Robertson Stadium due to class schedules at UH.

Unless a stadium is built, these games will go elsewhere, costing the city revenue.

With a new stadium the Dynamo would be sure to host the MLS Cup final, All-Star Game, international competitions and collegiate and high school sports. And Houstonians would gain great joy watching professional soccer in a proper facility.

Top youth and adult soccer league events could be played in the new venue.

Edited November 25, 2007 by lockmat

[kyle]

this is the fourth-largest city in the United States, the gateway to Mexico, Central America and South America.

With a soccer-specific stadium downtown, the Dynamo would continue to elevate national and international awareness of our city. When the Dynamo play teams from Mexico and other Central American countries, the games are broadcast to other nations.

With the NBA, NFL and MLB not involved with international competition of "meaning," the Dynamo and soccer hold an important key for bringing global attention to Houston.

More international competition will come the Dynamo's way in the future with the CONCACAF Champions' League, SuperLiga and other tournaments that provide a measuring stick and exposure for MLS teams.

Most of these games are midweek matches that can't be played at Robertson Stadium due to class schedules at UH.

Unless a stadium is built, these games will go elsewhere, costing the city revenue.

With a new stadium the Dynamo would be sure to host the MLS Cup final, All-Star Game, international competitions and collegiate and high school sports. And Houstonians would gain great joy watching professional soccer in a proper facility.

Top youth and adult soccer league events could be played in the new venue.

costing the city revenue or costing the dynamo revenue?

um, the rockets don't bring global attention to houston? have you seen their website?

The rockets - milwaukee regular season game got more views than a superbowl because of china.

china is a little bit more influential than mexico.

Edited November 27, 2007 by kyle

[DJ V Lawrence]

um, the rockets don't bring global attention to houston? have you seen their website?

The rockets - milwaukee regular season game got more views than a superbowl because of china.

china is a little bit more influential than mexico.

That's not what the author's talking about. He's referring to our city facing another city outside the USA and it being a significant international game; not two teams within the United States. Basketball teams outside the NBA are not household name here.

For example: NBA teams are the only teams that we can name in America. The Rockets couldn't play against a club team from a city in England with Rockets fans knowing who that other team is because most basketball fans outside England don't watch English basketball. But if Houston Dynamo played against Manchester United, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal, etc., more people around the world would recognize both cities' teams and players, would be more familiar with the sport, and more fans from both cities playing would take the game seriously even if it were a friendly. Same goes for if Dynamo plays a team from Spain, Italy, Germany, Japan, Korea, Argentina, Mexico, Australia, Portugal, Holland, etc., all of which are very probable in the near future because of their status of being the best team in the USA.

The Milwaukee-Houston game you referred to was a major international event, but in a different way. Even though millions in China were watching, it was still millions watching two American teams.

[RedScare]

DJ, you are looking at it backwards. International exposure is getting residents of other countries to look at HOUTON, not get Houstonians to look at other countries. Houston is a household name in China because of Yao Ming. Recently, over 200 million Chinese watched the Rockets play at 4 am Shanghai time. THAT is international exposure, for whatever that may be worth. Houstonians knowing who plays on the Argentinian national team in any sport garners no exposure for Houston whatsoever.

A Houston soccer team playing in international tournaments WILL expose Houston to international viewers. However, so will international players playing for the Rockets. Both garner international exposure, but in different ways. The Astros could also gain some exposure with Latin American players. The Texans drag up the rear with virtually NO exposure for its all American roster and mediocre record.

[Jax]

I agree Red. Some Canadian Asians know Houston for Yao Ming more than anything else. Basically if you're not in the oil and gas or biomedical industries, Houston doesn't have much recognition in Canada (definitely less than LA, Chicago, NY, San Francisco, Orlando, etc - large/tourist cities). But A few times when I've gone back I've had people mention Yao Ming. Kind of weird but it's true...

Edited November 27, 2007 by Jax

[DJ V Lawrence]

DJ, you are looking at it backwards. International exposure is getting residents of other countries to look at HOUTON, not get Houstonians to look at other countries. Houston is a household name in China because of Yao Ming. Recently, over 200 million Chinese watched the Rockets play at 4 am Shanghai time. THAT is international exposure, for whatever that may be worth. Houstonians knowing who plays on the Argentinian national team in any sport garners no exposure for Houston whatsoever.

A Houston soccer team playing in international tournaments WILL expose Houston to international viewers. However, so will international players playing for the Rockets. Both garner international exposure, but in different ways. The Astros could also gain some exposure with Latin American players. The Texans drag up the rear with virtually NO exposure for its all American roster and mediocre record.

I'm also referring to the fact that the Rockets and Dynamo have a different sense of connection to the international community. Both are great and positive for the city.

[Jasonhino]

what everyone seems to forget is the fact why the dynamo moved to Houston, before they were the san jose earthquakes, the city of san jose didn't want to build them a soccer specific stadium, so they moved to A city that agreed to build them one. Also there is a rule in MLS that states all teams need their own stadium,that why all the teams are geting their own stadium.

Edited November 27, 2007 by Jasonhino

[bkjones98]

DJ, you are looking at it backwards. International exposure is getting residents of other countries to look at HOUTON, not get Houstonians to look at other countries. Houston is a household name in China because of Yao Ming. Recently, over 200 million Chinese watched the Rockets play at 4 am Shanghai time. THAT is international exposure, for whatever that may be worth. Houstonians knowing who plays on the Argentinian national team in any sport garners no exposure for Houston whatsoever.

A Houston soccer team playing in international tournaments WILL expose Houston to international viewers. However, so will international players playing for the Rockets. Both garner international exposure, but in different ways. The Astros could also gain some exposure with Latin American players. The Texans drag up the rear with virtually NO exposure for its all American roster and mediocre record.

I either partially disagree or misunderstood. Having a soccer team play competitively in the "World's Sport," will give Houston much more international exposure than one or two players. Sure, Yao gives us exposure in China--but because he is from China. Dynamo, however, could be known more globally. That is, not because a player is from X, but because the Dynamo are a soccer team. A loose analogy could be: the only reason I know Green Bay, WI even exists is because they have the Packers. I do not, however, know of any random UK towns because an American may play for them.

[RedScare]

You slightly misunderstood my point. DJ commented, as you did, that he did not know any foreign basketball teams (and you do not know any US players on foreign teams). And, I responded that we do not care about that. The intent is to get foreigners to look at HOUSTON, not get Houstonians to look at foreign teams or cities. International exposure is making Houston recognizable to others, not making Houstonians more wordly.

The Rockets, by themselves, are not internationally recognized. It is Yao that generates the interest in China. I agree that the NBA, being an INTRA-American league, is not going to draw international interest by itself. It is the international players that draw the interest. In this way, the NFL does not, and will not draw international interest, except as a curiosity to foreigners. MLS can draw interest through the hiring of international players (Beckham), and through international play (Super Liga, CONCACAAF). So, I agree that it has more potential to draw international recognition for Houston.

Left unstated is what international recognition through sports teams is worth. It may increase foreign tourism slightly, as more foreigners recognize the city. However, I do not pretend to think that a slight uptick in tourism should be a reson to build a new stadium that doubles as a concert venue. My belief is more along the lines that a $30 million investment by the City in infrastructure improvements is an acceptable price. The stadium will keep Dynamo fan dollars in Houston, as well as draw taxable revenue currently being spent outside the City in the Woodlands back into the City. If the City's investment were much higher than $30 million, it probably would not be worth it.

[bkjones98]

You slightly misunderstood my point. DJ commented, as you did, that he did not know any foreign basketball teams (and you do not know any US players on foreign teams). And, I responded that we do not care about that. The intent is to get foreigners to look at HOUSTON, not get Houstonians to look at foreign teams or cities. International exposure is making Houston recognizable to others, not making Houstonians more wordly.

***

Left unstated is what international recognition through sports teams is worth. It may increase foreign tourism slightly, as more foreigners recognize the city. However, I do not pretend to think that a slight uptick in tourism should be a reson to build a new stadium that doubles as a concert venue. My belief is more along the lines that a $30 million investment by the City in infrastructure improvements is an acceptable price. The stadium will keep Dynamo fan dollars in Houston, as well as draw taxable revenue currently being spent outside the City in the Woodlands back into the City. If the City's investment were much higher than $30 million, it probably would not be worth it.

That was not the illustration my analogy was intending to make, but that is of little consequence.

I generally agree with your second point. That is, the whole

[Guest danax]

An investment of $30 million to a very dilapidated part of town, however, may have more benefits than we are giving it credit

[lockmat]

Confirmation that Stadium won't take place of Astros parking lot:

http://swamplot.com/stanford-lofts-your-pa...amo/2007-12-06/

If the Dynamo are still searching for a spot, I'm a little worried that this might take longer than they thought.

[RedScare]

That's actually pretty old news. They reported that the Astros lot was out several months ago.

[lockmat]

So much for all our theories like them waiting to announce it after the playoffs to keep the media attention coming. It's almost Christmas, and nothing.

[musicman]

City signs letter of intent for soccer stadium land

The city took a major step towards acquiring land for a permanent home stadium for the Dynamo, Mayor Bill White said today.

City officials signed letters of intent Monday to purchase parcels of land east of 59, near the downtown central business district. Officials would not identify the exact location, but said that discussions with the Dynamos were proceeding, with the intent of having the team finance construction of the stadium.

The preferred location of Anschutz Entertainment Group, owner of the Dynamo, has been between the George R. Brown Convention Center and Minute Maid Park on the other side of U.S. 59.

"It's not going to be done the way it was done with other stadiums, where the taxpayers picked up the tab," said White said.

AEG's proposed stadium deal calls for the company to bear the preponderance of stadium construction costs, but the company has pressed the city to pay for millions of dollars for needed infrastructure improvements, Dynamo president Oliver Luck has said.

The city is also "very close" to signing letters of intent for a regional amateur soccer complex, White said. The 18-field complex would be home to the Dynamos' practice facility and to amateur clubs.

The city is considering two locations just west of 288 in southern Houston. One is immediately north of Sims Bayou and the other is north of Almeda-Genoa Road.

full article

Edited January 9, 2008 by musicman

[JJxvi]

Reading comments, it baffles me how people think renovating the Astrodome for soccer is a good idea.