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Montrose Collective: Office building with Retail Coming to 888 Westheimer

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1 minute ago, Houston19514 said:

 

The Chronicle reported the news of Hsu's Houston office back in August.  And the office had its grand opening about 6 weeks ago.

 

Been a bit behind as far as the Chron goes. I'll have to look more into that. We just had someone at my office who left to help open up that new office. So I guess its not insider info any longer, but thought it was worth mentioning on a MH project since it hasn't yet to my knowledge.

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41 minutes ago, crock said:

 

all i see is that it's going to be harder for me to casually get southside coffee on saturday mornings.  

I'm also really unsure who is going to come here?  Montrose has already been effectively priced out for millennials, so it doesn't have the same sort of foot traffic as even areas of the Heights do.  Haven't two shops already closed in the brand new strip center across from Uchi already in less than a year?  

 

 

How old do you think millenials are? Montrose has definitely lost a lot (though not all) of its cheap rental stock, but that more affects the post-millenial generation I would think. I don't think I would say that Montrose is meaningfully more expensive than the Heights. 

 

As to who will come here? That will depend on the tenants. This is still a good, central, relatively easy to get to location. 

 

What will really make a difference is the redevelopment of the Tower shopping center though. I wonder what the status on that is...

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Just now, Texasota said:

 

How old do you think millenials are? Montrose has definitely lost a lot (though not all) of its cheap rental stock, but that more affects the post-millenial generation I would think. I don't think I would say that Montrose is meaningfully more expensive than the Heights. 

 

As to who will come here? That will depend on the tenants. This is still a good, central, relatively easy to get to location. 

 

What will really make a difference is the redevelopment of the Tower shopping center though. I wonder what the status on that is...

 

As a millenial myself this is a constant perception that older generations seem to have. "Oh, don't y'all have all this debt, aren't y'all unable to afford to live in the city?" (sidelining the fact that we have that debt because of previous generations upping the costs of education), but all I can say is that this isn't the case. Millenials are not only making it work, but are doing it while juggling their debt, and the changing of housing stock from single family res to townhomes and apartments is actually making it easier for Millenials to move closer to the city. That wouldn't be the case if the only housing stock was single family residential. Actually the new construction is dropping the price or keeping the price of older stock stagnant. In the part of Montrose I live in I pay $925 for a house which was converted to apartments. I actually expected my rent to go up this year, but was suprised when it didn't.

There is truth to what Crock says, but its only in parts of Montrose. Montrose is such a weird neighborhood that you can't just make blanket statements on the entire hood and expect it to hold true. Its probably one of the most diverse in regards to income level in the city.

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On 12/30/2019 at 1:16 PM, Luminare said:

 

As a millenial myself this is a constant perception that older generations seem to have. "Oh, don't y'all have all this debt, aren't y'all unable to afford to live in the city?" (sidelining the fact that we have that debt because of previous generations upping the costs of education), but all I can say is that this isn't the case. Millenials are not only making it work, but are doing it while juggling their debt, and the changing of housing stock from single family res to townhomes and apartments is actually making it easier for Millenials to move closer to the city. That wouldn't be the case if the only housing stock was single family residential.

 

With the possible exceptions of Medicare and Social Security, single family zoning may be the most effective form of inter-generational wealth transfer from low-net-worth millenials to high-net-worth boomers this country has. 

 

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2 hours ago, Angostura said:

 

With the possible exceptions of Medicare and Social Security, single family zoning may be the most effective form of inter-generational wealth transfer from low-net-worth millenials to high-net-worth boomers this country has. 

 

 

For long-term prospects, of course. I completely agree. However, due to the amount of debt many hold, the pay off of that debt has ended up replacing the single family home as the main focus of long-term viability. That amount of money which could have gone to a single family home instead now goes to pay off debt. Most Boomers in their late twenties and early thirties didn't have this issue at all, so many of their first encounters with this kind of debt was a mortgage on a home. For the millineal generation it was education. Though the jury is still out on whether for most it was a sound investment. Just like after the housing crisis many questioned amongst boomers whether investment in the single family home was a worthy investment. Both are risky, and both are dumb decisions if one doesn't plan for the future in a way that actually will work in most instances.

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On 12/30/2019 at 9:22 AM, crock said:

 

all i see is that it's going to be harder for me to casually get southside coffee on saturday mornings.  

I'm also really unsure who is going to come here?  Montrose has already been effectively priced out for millennials, so it doesn't have the same sort of foot traffic as even areas of the Heights do.  Haven't two shops already closed in the brand new strip center across from Uchi already in less than a year?  

 

 

montrose has just as much foot traffic as any part of the heights or any other part of the city... what are you talking about? two restaurants closed but how many more have opened? 

 

btw about 75% of the office space for this project has already been preleased as has some of the retail space so clearly they think some folks will show up.

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6 minutes ago, swtsig said:

 

montrose has just as much foot traffic as any part of the heights or any other part of the city... what are you talking about? two restaurants closed but how many more have opened? 

 

btw about 75% of the office space for this project has already been preleased as has some of the retail space so clearly they think some folks will show up.

 

Impressive pre-leasing numbers. How much of that has to do with the location, and how much has to do with the design?

 

I think @bobruss said this in another thread. Montrose blvd desperately needs to be redone (like Kirby) so this can be a grand street.

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1 minute ago, Avossos said:

 

Impressive pre-leasing numbers. How much of that has to do with the location, and how much has to do with the design?

 

I think @bobruss said this in another thread. Montrose blvd desperately needs to be redone (like Kirby) so this can be a grand street.

 

probably more design driven than location but the office tenant is a particularly good fit for this part of town a well. purely from a location standpoint, though, this isn't the easiest spot to get to if you have employees coming from all over town.

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If I had to rate the best foot traffic areas in Houston i would start with Westheimer from Smith to 610. There is more action on Westheimer and continuous retail, service and residential on Westheimer than any street in Houston. It also has a considerable amount of activity and vitality.

I would put the whole Rice Village area in at #2, and 

a couple of areas in the Heights right up there also.

Eado could develop into a more walkable retail and entertainment area once they have finished dissecting it with freeway plans.

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Posted (edited)
On 12/30/2019 at 10:08 AM, Texasota said:

 

How old do you think millenials are? Montrose has definitely lost a lot (though not all) of its cheap rental stock, but that more affects the post-millenial generation I would think. I don't think I would say that Montrose is meaningfully more expensive than the Heights. 

 

 

huh? I am a millennial.  Everyone in my friend group lived in Montrose 10 years ago,  literally none of them live there now.  I will say that @Luminare is right, you can still rent in Montrose affordably, but as soon as you want to buy....  

Montrose is meaningfully more expensive than the heights.  You can still get decent houses on the eastside of the heights for 400-500k, you're paying 700k+ for that house in the montrose.  

Edited by crock
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18 hours ago, bobruss said:

If I had to rate the best foot traffic areas in Houston i would start with Westheimer from Smith to 610. There is more action on Westheimer and continuous retail, service and residential on Westheimer than any street in Houston. It also has a considerable amount of activity and vitality.

I would put the whole Rice Village area in at #2, and 

a couple of areas in the Heights right up there also.

Eado could develop into a more walkable retail and entertainment area once they have finished dissecting it with freeway plans.

 

 

I think any list that doesn't have the CBD and Midtown at #1 and #2 is probably a little off.

 

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23 hours ago, Luminare said:

 

Most Boomers in their late twenties and early thirties didn't have this issue at all, so many of their first encounters with this kind of debt was a mortgage on a home. For the millineal generation it was education. Though the jury is still out on whether for most it was a sound investment. 

 

Observing the income premium from having a college education and concluding that we need to send everyone to college was a very "wet streets cause rain" moment. As was observing that home ownership correlated with good economic outcomes and concluding that we need to make everyone a homeowner. The latter caused the 2008 financial crisis. The full reckoning of the former has yet to come.

 

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On 1/2/2020 at 6:32 AM, Angostura said:

 

With the possible exceptions of Medicare and Social Security, single family zoning may be the most effective form of inter-generational wealth transfer from low-net-worth millenials to high-net-worth boomers this country has. 

 

 

Multi-family zoning has to be up there. Millennial pours money into apartment rent, never building any equity. Baby boomer who has invested in the REIT that owns the apartment chuckles softly as he watches his share value increase and his net worth go up. The millennial might avoid the wealth transfer if and only if he takes all the money that he saves from not paying a mortgage and invests it. More likely though he is spending some or most of it on food halls, microbrews, and other drains on net worth.

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Texasota said:

Ah yes, that infamous drain on net worth, "food."

 

Absolutely. $500/month on eating out and gourmet food items invested in a mutual fund will be a pretty hefty chunk of change in 10 years. Enough for a nice down payment, which then puts you in the driver's seat for more net worth growth. Little things turn into big things financially over time (something an old man once told me).

 

Edited by H-Town Man

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49 minutes ago, LBC2HTX said:

3ad.jpg

 

Eh, I'm closer in age to millennials than to Baby Boomers. Just calling it as I see it. Wasted a lot of my own money on this stuff. I guess I could have answered Angostura's post with, "Young man whines at old man," but instead I said something informative.

 

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No, you really didn't.

 

Every generation spends money on food and entertainment. What's changed (quite dramatically) is the cost of housing, transportation, and education, and the relationship of those costs to a stagnant household income that hasn't matched inflation, much less the ballooning costs of attending college.

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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, Texasota said:

No, you really didn't.

 

Every generation spends money on food and entertainment. What's changed (quite dramatically) is the cost of housing, transportation, and education, and the relationship of those costs to a stagnant household income that hasn't matched inflation, much less the ballooning costs of attending college.

 

If you read my initial post, what I said was that apartment renters can avoid the wealth transfer if they take the money they save on renting vs. a mortgage and invest it rather than spending it on things like sophisticated food and drink. Let's keep this in the context of what I said. But to answer your comment, actually millennials are spending a lot more than baby boomers on eating out and gourmet items, and the difference becomes very substantial over time. There are books written about this. Google "latte factor."

 

Also, if college costs too much, don't go. You can become wealthy without attending college. It is incredible how little knowledge is required to develop the habits that create wealth. It's doing what you're supposed to do that's difficult. Take a Dave Ramsey class. They're free at most places, you just pay for the kit. And then do what the class teaches you to do.

 

 

Edited by H-Town Man

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13 minutes ago, Texasota said:

 

Helaine Olen wrote a challenge to the original bestselling book and her challenge has since been rebutted, and she has probably rebutted the rebuts, etc. Just because Slate.com says something is a myth doesn't mean it's a myth. There will always be people saying "Ignore these tips, they don't work." Have to try and see for yourself. I guess the fact that Dave Ramsey has a radio show in which he answers people's questions about money means you shouldn't take advice from him? You still haven't addressed my initial argument, which really wasn't about food, it just used food as an example of how people waste their money. Baby boomers did uncool things like cutting coupons and buying offbrands; millennials buy Belgian beer and stand in line for overpriced barbecue and snap at anyone who suggests these may not be good fiscal habits.

 

 

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I was in the middle of drafting a response when you posted architeckton, and I'm glad you did. You are correct, and in particular this has nothing to do with 888 Westheimer. 

 

I do think there is plenty of pedestrian traffic already in this area - what will also help is the planned alterations to Westheimer. If the City actually has funding for east of Montrose, I'd rather they go ahead and do that than wait on funding for the western portion to start the project.

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Oh my

 

you have hit on one of my hot button issues............what was a fully funded improvement project from Bagby to Montrose made into a partially funded improvement project from Bagby to Shepherd??  
I wonder if  the Harvey recovery effort made better by the use of it.
 

 

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On 1/3/2020 at 9:21 AM, H-Town Man said:

 

Multi-family zoning has to be up there. Millennial pours money into apartment rent, never building any equity. Baby boomer who has invested in the REIT that owns the apartment chuckles softly as he watches his share value increase and his net worth go up. The millennial might avoid the wealth transfer if and only if he takes all the money that he saves from not paying a mortgage and invests it. More likely though he is spending some or most of it on food halls, microbrews, and other drains on net worth.

 

How do I report bullying? 😆

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4 minutes ago, CraneHunter said:

It looks like the tenants are beginning to vacate, I drove by this morning and there were moving trucks with workers. 

Can't vacate soon enough

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Posted (edited)
On 12/30/2019 at 9:46 AM, Luminare said:

So some interesting insider industry info. Recently learned that the architect responsible for this design, Michael Hsu Office of Architecture, is opening up a Houston office. They have already established themselves as the next big player in town regarding commercial architecture. Expect to see their name on more projects to come, and have an influence on Houston's mixed-use scene as well as commercial architecture aesthetics.

I walk that area daily because my job is on 18th. I’ll have to walk by the offices tomorrow. 

Edited by j_cuevas713
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Wow. What a great place to pick up guys! Especially rendering #8. A one stop party plaza in the middle of Montrose. Can't wait to hang out here from morning till midnight. We need 4 more of these at the intersection of Westhiemer and Montrose with apartments on top instead of offices so I never have to leave!

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On 1/8/2020 at 11:17 PM, Urbannizer said:

"Rendering package" added to the retail listing:

 

https://images1.loopnet.com/d2/1_MdAcEb6d5lsBhUKq6-oVKNevXGyDmFRu29t78gD2Q/document.pdf

 

Also added all images to the very first post of this thread.

 

Just wow. These designs rank among the top for Houston architecture.

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Drove by this weekend and the existing restaurant and police station look ready to be torn down with all signage on the building gone and for the most part emptied.

 

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Someone should start a recycling nursery. Contract with developers to clear unwanted shrubbery and trees and recycle them. Manicure them and sell them for projects.

It just seems like such a waste to just cut it all down, and throw it in the landfills.

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4 hours ago, bobruss said:

Someone should start a recycling nursery. Contract with developers to clear unwanted shrubbery and trees and recycle them. Manicure them and sell them for projects.

It just seems like such a waste to just cut it all down, and throw it in the landfills.


most wouldn’t survive being removed and the labor cost to get them out would be high. It’s a nice idea though... some things would have a better chance at surviving than others. These materials are best grounded up and used as mulch.

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6 hours ago, cityliving said:

Some activity happening on this project this morning, trees and shrubbery have been removed. 

0738C374-FA90-4DE9-B39A-4B616A4E27FC.jpeg


I, for one, am absolutely THRILLED to see this eyesore being removed.

 

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6 hours ago, hindesky said:

7lYAQv6.jpg

12881K0.jpg

 

well I'm already impressed to see that patch they are doing because...

 

5 hours ago, bobruss said:

Nice patch!

 

 

they actually aren't required to do this. So yeah its very nice. Of course its also good PR, but even if its for selfish reasons its a smart thing to do that is also a nice thing to do. Hopefully this can become the norm.

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looks bulldozer ready to me!!! bring it! 🙋‍♂️

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Honestly since this is being done, i wonder if they will begin to make all the surrounding (and eventually all of lower Westheimer) sidewalks better? hopefully! 

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1 minute ago, gene said:

Honestly since this is being done, i wonder if they will begin to make all the surrounding (and eventually all of lower Westheimer) sidewalks better? hopefully! 

It could provide some incentive to rebuild lower Westheimer sooner. 

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2 minutes ago, gene said:

Honestly since this is being done, i wonder if they will begin to make all the surrounding (and eventually all of lower Westheimer) sidewalks better? hopefully! 

 

There's a great plan in place! It's just been kicked down the road to at least 2023 again.

 

https://www.houstonarchitecture.com/haif/topic/37468-lower-westheimer-reconstruction

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