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quietstorm

Pedestrian Downtown

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Suddenly and with no warning, all mentions of the city of Dallas in a thread about pedestrian experiences in Houston cease never to return.

 

...And there is much rejoicing... 

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Posted (edited)

@ Barn

 

LOL. Dallas has no major tourist attractions. Everything you listed are boring little things that can be found in just about every city. Come on, Farmer's Market? Right. Dallas 'tourist' attractions are as mundane as Indianapolis' tourist attractions.

Edited by Response

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3 minutes ago, Response said:

@ Barn

 

LOL. Dallas has no major tourist attractions. Everything you listed are boring little things that can be found in just about every city. Come on, Farmer's Market? Right. Dallas 'tourist' attractions are as mundane as Indianapolis' tourist attractions.

 

Mundane? Maybe, but tourist attractions nevertheless. 

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1 hour ago, Jbarn said:

 

The Winspear opera house, Wily theatre, and Moody performance hall, all in the arts district, are also quite nice. Hamilton would have played at the Winspear, but there was a struggle amongst the arts groups and the music hall group won. 

 

It just seemed strange that you “lived” in Dallas for 4 years and didn’t  know the proper name for Deep Ellum. 

It's not that I didn't it's called auto-correct on your phone

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2 minutes ago, j_cuevas713 said:

It's not that I didn't it's called auto-correct on your phone

It’s actually called you never lived in Dallas. 

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Jbarn said:

 

Mundane? Maybe, but tourist attractions nevertheless. 

I think you have a very broad definition of the term 'tourist attraction'. People aren't traveling to Dallas in any great numbers to see any of the things on your list.

 

 

Edited by Response

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Just now, Jbarn said:

It’s actually called you never lived in Dallas. 

Lol whatever you want to believe bud. Keep defending that garbage excuse for a city. 

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Just now, j_cuevas713 said:

Lol whatever you want to believe bud. Keep defending that garbage excuse for a city. 

😆

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Pfft everyone knows that Millennial tourists are only interested in the city with the best Instagram spots and ethnic food options 

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2 hours ago, Response said:

A 5-minute Metrorail will get you to the greatest museum district in the state (please don't make me list all 150 of them), Hermann Park, the zoo, the Miller Outdoor Theatre, Rice University, the Texas Medical Center 1,2 and soon to be 3 (also exploding with development) and that stadium where they have the Superbowl sometimes. All of that can be done without a car.  A 5-minute Uber will get you to Montrose, the Heights and the Kirby area (also exploding with development) ect. ect. ect. Let's not forget Uptown Houston isn't really that far away either. 

 

Central Station Main to Museum District station on the Metrorail will take you about 14 minutes, almost triple the 5 you mention.  And you won't get to the Kirby area from the middle of downtown in a 5 minute Uber.  At least 15, and more like 25 if there's any traffic.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, rechlin said:

 

Central Station Main to Museum District station on the Metrorail will take you about 14 minutes, almost triple the 5 you mention.  And you won't get to the Kirby area from the middle of downtown in a 5 minute Uber.  At least 15, and more like 25 if there's any traffic.

 

Whatever. The point is there is a lot of cool stuff that a person without a car can get to from Downtown Houston - even if you are riding on a train that is 9 minutes late.

 

38fdc8585ebf6d2fc1d474604cd515dc.jpg

 

 

Edited by Response
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On 2/7/2019 at 3:24 PM, kbates2 said:

 

HOUSTON%20MAIN%20AT%20FRANKLIN%201928.jp

 

Not sure how long it has been there but you can kind of see the two buildings that were there before on the left in this photo.  One was a bank (the far one), and not sure of what the three story building was next to it.

 

Images from NRHP Inventory - Nomination Form

200 Main.PNG

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Best picture of the Pink Pussycat that I've seen since it was actually there (***sigh...***).

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On 4/9/2019 at 11:18 AM, Reefmonkey said:

Smearing me in absentia to try to distract from the fact that you're making a fool of yourself in yet another discussion - you're a gutless tool.

 

I already schooled you in two other threads, looks like we're going to have a three-peat. 😊

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Reefmonkey said:

^^^^The Dunning-Kruger Effect displayed in real life^^^^^

 

and on the internet too...which is on here forever. At least if this was in real life we would probably forget about it in the coming years. But nope. Its here...forever.

 

EDIT: I say this also because there are things that I remember posting on this forum that I look back at and say...wow I was an idiot and why did I put that on something that will be there forever? Its why you should always be very careful with how you conduct yourself even if you are online. Unfortunately its something that must be learned through wisdom and not through knowledge.

Edited by Luminare
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On 4/18/2019 at 9:23 PM, Luminare said:

 

and on the internet too...which is on here forever. At least if this was in real life we would probably forget about it in the coming years. But nope. Its here...forever.

 

EDIT: I say this also because there are things that I remember posting on this forum that I look back at and say...wow I was an idiot and why did I put that on something that will be there forever? Its why you should always be very careful with how you conduct yourself even if you are online. Unfortunately its something that must be learned through wisdom and not through knowledge.

 

The internet isn't as forever as you may think. 

 

I can't find my geocities page anywhere.

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On 4/24/2019 at 9:36 AM, samagon said:

 

The internet isn't as forever as you may think. 

 

I can't find my geocities page anywhere.

 

have you looked under oocities.com? That's where mine is archived.

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Posted (edited)
On 4/24/2019 at 9:36 AM, samagon said:

 

The internet isn't as forever as you may think. 

 

I can't find my geocities page anywhere.

 

If people can find bad photos in yearbooks, or bad writing in old newspapers...that one actually has to seek out and find in real life, then imagine that but even more online. It is there. For instance I just deleted my facebook, but was sure to download everything I ever did on there, so I know exactly what I did and where I did it. But the fact that all that data is weblinks that bring you to a page in your browser to view the file means that the data even if you delete your account is going to be flying and hiding somewhere on some server until the right link is found, case in point with my yearbook and bad writing examples. With the spoken word in everyday use we eventually forget 75-85% of our day to day experiences and whats left mutates over time (like a game of telephone). What you put in print in all forms doesn't change though. It stays that way forever and when you revisit it it will be the same words as it was written then as you read it today. Thats why I say one should choose their words carefully because even if you remember the context and circumstances of every single interaction or word typed...nobody upon their first encounter with it will.

Edited by Luminare
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4 minutes ago, CaptainJilliams said:

 

 

4 minutes ago, CaptainJilliams said:

 

 

4 minutes ago, CaptainJilliams said:

Looks great, but what's up with the weird doll/child lying near the fountain in the second photo? 

It was in the backpack of the guy standing there. No one seemed to notice or care.  It’s stuff like this I love about urbanity. People from all walks life doing their own thing. 

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1 hour ago, quietstorm said:

 

 

It was in the backpack of the guy standing there. No one seemed to notice or care.  It’s stuff like this I love about urbanity. People from all walks life doing their own thing. 

 

Oh me too, I was just concerned for a brief moment that it was a real baby 😂

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20 hours ago, CaptainJilliams said:

 

Oh me too, I was just concerned for a brief moment that it was a real baby 😂

😂

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I was downtown this past Saturday night late, and the crowds were decent. There was a youth volleyball tournament going on at GRB, lots of parents and kids walking around. 

 

Also saw one obviously disturbed homeless guy come stand about a foot behind a mom and two young daughters when they were waiting to cross Walker @ Main opposite me; they ducked into the $0.99 store to get him off their tail as he followed them. This is the stuff that everyone hates about "urbanity" that the city needs to do something about. While downtown on net is getting better, the homeless problem is getting worse. 

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1 hour ago, Luminare said:

 

Peoples encounters with homeless increasing is different from the number of homeless increasing. The number of homeless here is not only one of the smallest considering our size, but also going down. Its encounters that are going up, but thats because more people are living in downtown than before which means more encounters with homeless. Besides it doesn't seem to stop people from moving in or people from going into town which is also increasing meaning that there are many more upsides to living in an urban environment than cons. Every city has homeless and they will always be among us. What will improve is how we deal with homeless everyday and know how to be more careful around them as our city becomes more urban. Thats the best we can hope for.

 

I pretty much agree with everything you said, Houston does have a relatively small homeless population in comparison to other major cities in the US. I mean, look at cities like Los Angeles, San Francisco, and Seattle. I often visit other development forums to check on news in other places, and I've found multiple threads describing just how bad it has become in these places. I just had a conversation with someone visiting on business from San Francisco who commented on how it was almost a day and night difference in terms of the sight of homelessness in Dallas and Houston compared to his hometown. Other videos like "Seattle is Dying" also showcase the problems these other cities are running into.

 

That being said, my wife and I visited downtown 2 weeks ago to get some food and walk around and there were a decent amount of homeless loitering around Market Square Park. My first encounter was a man straight up asking me for money, to which I ignored completely and attempted walking a completely different direction to avoid him. The second encounter was witnessing a homeless man trying to interfere with a young woman's photo shoot. A man that was with the photographer began yelling at the homeless man and started tailing him as he walked away. I may have just imagined things as well, but during the exchange, the man who was with the photographer pulled out what looked like a .22 and aimed it at the homeless man (in an attempt to deter him). As he followed the homeless man, he tried calling someone on his phone (assuming it was the policy) while keeping his hand on his holstered weapon.

While these events were not frequent, they definitely made me feel uncomfortable to say the least, especially since my pregnant wife was with me (funny enough, the homeless events really did not bother her at all).

 

Besides these incidents, the experience downtown was rather pleasant. Main Street was busy on that Saturday, and there were plenty of young people out and about either bar hopping or socializing.  

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1 hour ago, Luminare said:

 

Peoples encounters with homeless increasing is different from the number of homeless increasing. The number of homeless here is not only one of the smallest considering our size, but also going down. Its encounters that are going up, but thats because more people are living in downtown than before which means more encounters with homeless. Besides it doesn't seem to stop people from moving in or people from going into town which is also increasing meaning that there are many more upsides to living in an urban environment than cons. Every city has homeless and they will always be among us. What will improve is how we deal with homeless everyday and know how to be more careful around them as our city becomes more urban. Thats the best we can hope for.

I agree. Also I’ve noticed many families from the burbs come in to town on the weekends and because they aren’t used to the daily life of living in the city, they are easily affected by the homeless. I’m so damn used to it, if someone approaches me I’m ready to either tell them I don’t have anything or I ignore them and mind my own business. 

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9 minutes ago, CaptainJilliams said:

 

I pretty much agree with everything you said, Houston does have a relatively small homeless population in comparison to other major cities in the US. I mean, look at cities like Los Angeles, San Francisco, and Seattle. I often visit other development forums to check on news in other places, and I've found multiple threads describing just how bad it has become in these places. I just had a conversation with someone visiting on business from San Francisco who commented on how it was almost a day and night difference in terms of the sight of homelessness in Dallas and Houston compared to his hometown. Other videos like "Seattle is Dying" also showcase the problems these other cities are running into.

 

San Francisco is the first place I thought of when this thread appeared. No matter how much of a homelessness issue people may think we have here, we are pretty far removed from needing an app to report excrement on sidewalks

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I think comparing Houston's homeless population to those west coast cities is similar to comparing your house (currently with a small grease fire on stove) to someone else's house down the road that has the whole roof on fire.  The problems on the west coast are bad, getting worse, and the solution that is needed (a lot more houses at all price points) is being fought by pretty much everyone.  Our problem is that some people, for whatever reason, find themselves without a home.  There's still so few homeless people that the city could theoretically put them all up in a shelter if that was prioritized.  I think the west coast cities are beyond that point.

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, cspwal said:

I think comparing Houston's homeless population to those west coast cities is similar to comparing your house (currently with a small grease fire on stove) to someone else's house down the road that has the whole roof on fire.  The problems on the west coast are bad, getting worse, and the solution that is needed (a lot more houses at all price points) is being fought by pretty much everyone.  Our problem is that some people, for whatever reason, find themselves without a home.  There's still so few homeless people that the city could theoretically put them all up in a shelter if that was prioritized.  I think the west coast cities are beyond that point.

 

Yeah I wish it was that simple. In the west coast example its because its becoming so expensive to live there (I think San Fran is now the most expensive to live in the world), along with other reasons for homelessness. Here its more baseline reasons for homelessness (meaning we through our values as liberal, open, ultra free market society, we have been able to eradicate undo homelessness). While I do agree with part of your statement about housing, this is based on the premise that the way to happiness and fulfillment in life is by the acquisition of material possessions (money, housing, food, etc...). In other words, baseline essentials for life, but if that were the case then people that win the lottery would be happy and living a fulfilled life, but many go broke or homeless so afterward. Now this side of the conversation does have a point, but its not the only one. The other side says they are homeless because they have no job or work to make them fulfilled, but if that were the case then why do some go homeless after getting work yet choose to live on the street instead? So while that side has a point, it isn't just because they are lazy or don't work hard. I remember talking to my brothers Fiance about this, who is a nurse, and she broke it down to just how complicated it is and how there is only so much we can do as a society to help them. She pretty much straight up said that she has encountered the full spectrum of homeless while working at hospitals, and the reason why this issue is such a an anomaly/glitch in our system is that they literally refuse to be a part of the system, and live completely outside of it. Whether that be for financial reasons, reasons due to meaning, or trapped in their own mind, and maybe all above, if they refuse to be a part of our society/system there is very little of what our society can provide will even satisfy them. You can't appease a quasi-anarchist and thats what they are. This is why I was say that the best we can do is learn how to conduct ourselves around, while making sure the number of homeless is as small as possible, and understanding that there will always be homeless among us because there will always be those who refuse to participate in society and the system at large. At that point the only ones that can help them are themselves.

 

EDIT: Phrasing and Better Sentence Structure

Edited by Luminare
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Posted (edited)

I have worked downtown for almost 20 years, and it's my impression that the increased interaction runs both ways. I think there are more homeless people on the downtown streets because there are more non-homeless people to whom they are attracted for various reasons, including perhaps most principally handouts. That and Houston just keeps growing, so the volume of homeless grows right along with everything else while geographically, downtown stays the same. 

 

It is absolutely not an easy issue to solve, and people will have varying reactions to having to interact with them, but foul smelling people accosting you and children isn't going to be tolerated by many, and it will put a cap on what the city can be.  There's a reason you see very few children in cities with worse homeless issues than Houston, and while that particular dynamic can work, it is limiting.  People that peacefully camp under bridges or get their food from soup kitchens are much less of a problem than the people that get kicked out of shelters and/or choose not to go in the first place because they can't manage living within anyone's structure. The micro-level anarchist description seems apt, though perhaps it would be more accurate to call them involuntary anarchists, either by their own mental health issues, or their chemical dependency (or both). 

 

The cost of housing issue is a red herring, at least in my example from earlier. The West coast cities prove the point.  They are boutique economies for those that can afford them, but people that couldn't afford a rented room in Portland, Texas show up in Portland, Oregon in droves for the generous public/charity services provided to the indigent. The folks that are down on their luck don't go from affording San Francisco to harassing people that can. If you get priced out of Santa Monica, you move to Glendale or Riverside or Bakersfield, you don't don't start literally crapping on Venice Beach.  

 

For people filling lower skilled jobs that are in demand in big cities, that's where the housing cost issue comes in, but that gets solved by raising the wages of those lower paying jobs until they attract people that can live in the area. Starbucks and Marriott would much rather have taxpayers subsidize their labor costs though, they are good at dodging taxes. 

Edited by Nate99
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Posted (edited)
16 hours ago, mkultra25 said:

 

San Francisco is the first place I thought of when this thread appeared. No matter how much of a homelessness issue people may think we have here, we are pretty far removed from needing an app to report excrement on sidewalks

 

We're way behind SF, clearly, but that type of filth is appearing DT, I don't recall seeing it at all prior to a year or two ago. That's anecdotal though, just my impression. 

Edited by Nate99
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Posted (edited)

Temperatures  are heating up, but downtown pedestrian activity is holding steady. Here are a few updates from Friday around lunchtime.  Main Street Corridor, Discovery Green and Market Square are the busiest. Dallas St, while aesthetically pleasing, is still a pedestrian dead zone. 

113FC82A-28C0-4664-8B8B-8A1F8A367F05.jpeg

9359129B-11F8-493E-8996-CF6C013F6E0F.jpeg

D4F8D5BE-215A-4860-BF0C-D87DE66CCB7D.jpeg

Edited by quietstorm
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Thursday evening...a good mix of convention goers and locals. There was a UHD sponsored concert Sunday Discovery Green as well. DT, in some pockets, has become a mini-destination 

F162EF45-42E6-4320-AAA9-AB02E9E45555.jpeg

CDAFC3D7-2ACC-4F47-B972-91370DBD5C86.jpeg

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2 hours ago, quietstorm said:

Thursday evening...a good mix of convention goers and locals. There was a UHD sponsored concert Sunday Discovery Green as well. DT, in some pockets, has become a mini-destination 

F162EF45-42E6-4320-AAA9-AB02E9E45555.jpeg

CDAFC3D7-2ACC-4F47-B972-91370DBD5C86.jpeg

 

That top photo really looks like one of those architectural renderings with people all about in different, somewhat unrealistic poses. All it took was a comic convention for it to play out in real life. Nice!

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Posted (edited)

We really just need some retail to line West Dallas St. And by retail I mean dry goods. That will really tie in the neighborhood. 

Edited by j_cuevas713

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11 hours ago, j_cuevas713 said:

We really just need some retail to line West Dallas St. And by retail I mean dry goods. That will really tie in the neighborhood. 

Dallas would be ideal for pop-up retail like farmers markets, art fairs, etc. The wider sidewalks have the room for that. With so many buying online, even dry goods retail may not be sustainable long term. I think an H&M and Zara might work. 

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On 6/17/2019 at 12:40 PM, quietstorm said:

Dallas would be ideal for pop-up retail like farmers markets, art fairs, etc. The wider sidewalks have the room for that. With so many buying online, even dry goods retail may not be sustainable long term. I think an H&M and Zara might work. 

 

I’ve read on here in multiple threads about the “City Target” concept ... I always thought people were referring to the type of store close to the Staples Center in LA (i.e., simply a Target located downtown). I think I might have just seen my first “City Target” in Chapel Hill, NC. Looks like a footprint not that much larger than a typical Walgreen’s or CVS (it does have the CVS Pharmacy) ... it’s 22,000 square feet (evidently typically CVS is 15,000 square feet).  There’s a market and dry goods section. All self-checkout but there is (ironically) a manned desk for online order pickup that also monitors the self-checkouts and I guess also works as the “service desk.”

 

Seemed like a much better and way more useful use of space than a CVS or Walgreen’s, especially if in walkable neighborhoods.  Guess for it to be attractive they’d need a distribution center in Houston (I don’t think they have one) with multiple deliveries throughout the day to the brick-and-mortar store.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2017/07/11/target-chapel-hill-franklin-st-carolina-square.amp.html

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6 hours ago, mattyt36 said:

 

I’ve read on here in multiple threads about the “City Target” concept ... I always thought people were referring to the type of store close to the Staples Center in LA (i.e., simply a Target located downtown). I think I might have just seen my first “City Target” in Chapel Hill, NC. Looks like a footprint not that much larger than a typical Walgreen’s or CVS (it does have the CVS Pharmacy) ... it’s 22,000 square feet (evidently typically CVS is 15,000 square feet).  There’s a market and dry goods section. All self-checkout but there is (ironically) a manned desk for online order pickup that also monitors the self-checkouts and I guess also works as the “service desk.”

 

Seemed like a much better and way more useful use of space than a CVS or Walgreen’s, especially if in walkable neighborhoods.  Guess for it to be attractive they’d need a distribution center in Houston (I don’t think they have one) with multiple deliveries throughout the day to the brick-and-mortar store.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2017/07/11/target-chapel-hill-franklin-st-carolina-square.amp.html

 

Do they have a distribution center in Chapel Hill?

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On 6/16/2019 at 11:38 PM, j_cuevas713 said:

We really just need some retail to line West Dallas St. And by retail I mean dry goods. That will really tie in the neighborhood. 

This is precisely what the city promised that the 10s of millions of dollars that they spent on that street improvements 3 years ago would do.  Didn’t work.  Has there been a single retail business open fronting along Dallas since construction ended 2 years ago?  Maybe, but I can’t think of one.   Remember those renderings the city trotted out showing a vibrant retail district?  Remember the “plan” created for the city by a bunch of developers that said, essentially, “gee, if the city spends a whole bunch of cash on upgrades to this street, it can be a great retail environment”.

 

 So far, it’s money down the new storm drains under Dallas street.  Maybe that will change.  Or maybe not.

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3 hours ago, UtterlyUrban said:

This is precisely what the city promised that the 10s of millions of dollars that they spent on that street improvements 3 years ago would do.  Didn’t work.  Has there been a single retail business open fronting along Dallas since construction ended 2 years ago?  Maybe, but I can’t think of one.   Remember those renderings the city trotted out showing a vibrant retail district?  Remember the “plan” created for the city by a bunch of developers that said, essentially, “gee, if the city spends a whole bunch of cash on upgrades to this street, it can be a great retail environment”.

 

 So far, it’s money down the new storm drains under Dallas street.  Maybe that will change.  Or maybe not.

 

Last I checked, Thanos isn't running the city. You can't just snap your fingers and then it will immediately be a vibrant place. Just like putting LRT or BRT won't immediately spring the city to life or putting new pavers and lighting. Improved infrastructure, historically, does lead to improved results over time. The city, so far, has a proven track record of not only putting their money where their mouth is, but maintaining focus and pushing what they want. People didn't think the incentives for residential were going to work, yet with time Downtown has become a living hub again. Houston Center is getting a revival. Older buildings are reinvigorating their lobbies. Its happening. If you can't stand to be patient then try snapping your fingers and see if you get the immediate results you crave. 

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5 hours ago, UtterlyUrban said:

This is precisely what the city promised that the 10s of millions of dollars that they spent on that street improvements 3 years ago would do.  Didn’t work.  Has there been a single retail business open fronting along Dallas since construction ended 2 years ago?  Maybe, but I can’t think of one.   Remember those renderings the city trotted out showing a vibrant retail district?  Remember the “plan” created for the city by a bunch of developers that said, essentially, “gee, if the city spends a whole bunch of cash on upgrades to this street, it can be a great retail environment”.

 

 So far, it’s money down the new storm drains under Dallas street.  Maybe that will change.  Or maybe not.

I agree with Luminare. The financial investment the city made isn't just going to make something pop up because we want it to. They created a plan and it's starting to really pay off. It also has to do with the downtown population being large enough to support soft goods. We're not there yet but we're getting very close. 

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8 hours ago, Luminare said:

 

Last I checked, Thanos isn't running the city. You can't just snap your fingers and then it will immediately be a vibrant place. Just like putting LRT or BRT won't immediately spring the city to life or putting new pavers and lighting. Improved infrastructure, historically, does lead to improved results over time. The city, so far, has a proven track record of not only putting their money where their mouth is, but maintaining focus and pushing what they want. People didn't think the incentives for residential were going to work, yet with time Downtown has become a living hub again. Houston Center is getting a revival. Older buildings are reinvigorating their lobbies. Its happening. If you can't stand to be patient then try snapping your fingers and see if you get the immediate results you crave. 

Is 3 years immediate?

 

ok, let’s say it is.

 

when will it no longer be immediate?  5 years, 10 years or 35 years?

 

The entire point of redoing Dallas at huge expense was to bring retail.  I happily engaged in some of the neighborhood meetings to listen and learn from the design ideas for the street.  All those great renderings of shopping and pedestrians along Dallas.  Exciting stuff.  Nothing yet though.

 

within 2 miles of downtown there is a large and affluent growing resident population.  But still no dry goods retail, yet.

 

there has been huge investment in downtown...... to turn it into a destination/recreation/event hub.  It worked!  Lots of restaurants  and bars.  No dry goods retail.

 

100,000 commuters come to 1 square mile every day and, no dry goods retail.

 

hundreds of thousands of conventioneers come every year on top of that.  No dry goods retail.

 

On your non-immediate time table, when can we call the investment in Dallas street .... the published purpose of the street redo was to attract dry goods retailers..... a success or failure?  5 years? 10? Or 35?  

 

 

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3 hours ago, UtterlyUrban said:

Is 3 years immediate?

 

ok, let’s say it is.

 

when will it no longer be immediate?  5 years, 10 years or 35 years?

 

The entire point of redoing Dallas at huge expense was to bring retail.  I happily engaged in some of the neighborhood meetings to listen and learn from the design ideas for the street.  All those great renderings of shopping and pedestrians along Dallas.  Exciting stuff.  Nothing yet though.

 

within 2 miles of downtown there is a large and affluent growing resident population.  But still no dry goods retail, yet.

 

there has been huge investment in downtown...... to turn it into a destination/recreation/event hub.  It worked!  Lots of restaurants  and bars.  No dry goods retail.

 

100,000 commuters come to 1 square mile every day and, no dry goods retail.

 

hundreds of thousands of conventioneers come every year on top of that.  No dry goods retail.

 

On your non-immediate time table, when can we call the investment in Dallas street .... the published purpose of the street redo was to attract dry goods retailers..... a success or failure?  5 years? 10? Or 35?  

 

 

 

Not going to lie, but you are being a big baby about this.

 

You people are all the same. I hear the same thing in the Pierce Elevated thread. Always complaining and waiting for someone else to do it for them, and at the same time asking them to speed things up. Its so incredibly selfish.

 

If this is such a passion of yours then run for city council, or approach the various authorities involved in this. Drop the keyboard and actually do something. If you really want to prove the industry wrong and open up a dry-goods store on Dallas St. then go ahead.

 

Whether you go for city council, go to an organization, or open your own enterprise I will legitimately support you all the way! I would totally have your back. I'm actually being serious here. You think I like things taking a long time? I work in an industry where its normal for an idea to take YEARS to develop before it even gets funding and then onto paper, and thats before construction. Quit your whining. Its embarrassing. Unlike what I said prior, I will not support you rampaging with keyboard in hand whining and complain that you aren't getting something done on your subjective, hypothetical schedule which nobody knows about.

 

Sitting at home and typing it out here isn't going to make it go fast enough for you anyway. Go where your voice can be heard and matter and take action if it you wish it.

 

I would caution you though, that these are all complicated and complex issues and industries to deal with, and what you propose isn't that simple or easy to implement. It does take time. Maybe you might prove all of us wrong though. Go and give it a try.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, UtterlyUrban said:

Is 3 years immediate?

 

ok, let’s say it is.

 

when will it no longer be immediate?  5 years, 10 years or 35 years?

 

The entire point of redoing Dallas at huge expense was to bring retail.  I happily engaged in some of the neighborhood meetings to listen and learn from the design ideas for the street.  All those great renderings of shopping and pedestrians along Dallas.  Exciting stuff.  Nothing yet though.

 

within 2 miles of downtown there is a large and affluent growing resident population.  But still no dry goods retail, yet.

 

there has been huge investment in downtown...... to turn it into a destination/recreation/event hub.  It worked!  Lots of restaurants  and bars.  No dry goods retail.

 

100,000 commuters come to 1 square mile every day and, no dry goods retail.

 

hundreds of thousands of conventioneers come every year on top of that.  No dry goods retail.

 

On your non-immediate time table, when can we call the investment in Dallas street .... the published purpose of the street redo was to attract dry goods retailers..... a success or failure?  5 years? 10? Or 35?  

 

 

Again you’re missing the overall need for STABLE/CONSISTENT pedestrian traffic. Convention goers and a few business people traveling in from the burbs every day isn’t enough to convince a developer that their store will succeed. You have to think about the casual every day person after 5pm living and becoming a part of the downtown fabric. We haven’t reached the tipping point where developers are now confident the downtown population can support a store. Yeah 3 years isn’t much time considering how far behind we were in overall infrastructure and development. Especially for being the 4th largest city, our downtown was very outdated and neglected. Now that Post HTX is kicking off and Houston Center is redeveloping, it’s a welcome sign letting us all know that downtown is really starting to take off. There really is not set time. Downtown is obviously showing new signs of life as each new project takes off and many more continue to finish. This also isn’t the nearsightedness we saw for so many years back in the late 70’s through the 90’s. Houston is finally developing in a more organized cohesive way with more thought in to overall quality of life. Not to mention the more noticeable national spotlight that this city has missed out on for so long.

Edited by j_cuevas713
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Why does anyone really desire dry goods retail? Just so you can look at the store front and not go inside? There are a few exceptions, but that ship has largely sailed. I’m perfectly happy with a street lined with restaurants and bars. 

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