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Dallas's Victory Project Vs. HPavilions/East dt development


Dallas Victory Project VS Houston Pavilions  

117 members have voted

  1. 1. which will be hotter

    • Dallas Victory
      60
    • Houston Pavilions
      57


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"On Earth ???!?!?!

You $#$%^&*@$%&.

It's the greatest city in the galaxy. Dallas gets no respect."

Maybe I'm missing something. But, wasn't that obvious sarcasm?

Just go back and review his previous posts in the past and you'll see why i made that statment. Judging from his history of jumping on anybody who says anything about Dallas, i know the comment couldn't have been sarcasm.

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SpaceCity no disrespect but why don't you pack up and move to Dallas. Leave your name/ title behind because you sure do be on Dallas's nutsack!

Is this more sarcasm or are you serious? Why would I want someone to claim that Dallas is the best city, not on Earth, but in the Galaxy?

Do you actually know of a city that is not on Earth? I certainly don't. For my statement to be taken as true, you have to believe, not only in extra-terrestrial life, but that there are real cities out there on Mars, Venus, Pluto that people know about and can compare with Dallas. So please list the cities that exist on other planets and then we'll debate if they have a larger MSA than Dallas.

And this time, I am serious.

:blink:

I'll start. Dallas' Central Expressway is so much better than Klingon-54's level 3 Meelock Hwy #8253-235! Their meeloids are so inferior!

Edited by SpaceCity
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Is this more sarcasm or are you serious? Why on would I want someone to claim that Dallas is the best city, not on Earth, but in the Galaxy?

Do you actually know of a city that is not on Earth? I certainly don't. For my statement to be taken as true, you have to believe, not only in extra-terrestrial life, but that there are real cities out there on Mars, Venus, Pluto that people know about and can compare with Dallas. So please list the cities that exist on other planets and then we'll debate if they have a larger MSA than Dallas.

And this time, I am serious.

:blink:

I'll start. Dallas' Central Expressway is so much better than Klingon-54's level 3 Meelock Hwy #8253-235! Their meeloids are so inferior!

:lol:

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  • 2 weeks later...

I'm somewhat disappointed in Victory. I was under the impression that Victory was going to be a great urban meeting space with energy and excitement that would become the heart and pulse of the city.

Instead it looks like a town center/lifestyle center development that caters only to the rich with giant TV's.

Dallasites, are you happy with how Victory has turned out?

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I like Victory... it's a cool place to people watch. The plaza is interesting... photos don't to it justice as it is about being "surrounded" by the lights and video and sound that make the experience complete. Most of the traffic is still dependent on activities at the arena but it's becoming more active each time more shops open up. The TV studio draws crowds standing by the windows every evening. When the park and cafes surrounding it open it will be a nice place to be in good weather.... but for now there is still a lot of construction.

Edited by njjeppson
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This thing is still in its very infancy...give us ten years and then we'll let you know

I can't wait to see DOWNTOWN HOUSTON in 10 years! Should be an awsome mix of towering office buildings, residential developments, lots of retail, restaurants, entertainment complexes, sports stadiums, parks, etc.... all within walking distance to one another... all DOWNTOWN! :wub:

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Victory is getting up and going like many have stated. Today is some big grand opening, they had the big kick off on the March 23 for Victory Plaza. Now just from watching the media and being in this area at times after work, Victory plaza usually has something going on before and after the games. Its filling up and many fans stay afterwards for Channel 8's news cast. We only have a couple pieces of the puzzle in place with a couple more pieces are coming along. Cirque is about to top out in the next couple of weeks, and Victory Park will be open hopefully by May. Oh...some other discussions. Jonas Woods of Hillwood was quoted as saying something to the effect that high end stores and restuarants account for something like 1 billion sales a year, all the while mid level accounts for 100 billion per year, so in the next stage they plan having more mid level retail and restuarants. I'll try to find the article

This from an email; sorry no link:

"LFT

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I'm somewhat disappointed in Victory. I was under the impression that Victory was going to be a great urban meeting space with energy and excitement that would become the heart and pulse of the city.

Instead it looks like a town center/lifestyle center development that caters only to the rich with giant TV's.

Dallasites, are you happy with how Victory has turned out?

You can't go based upon what you see right now. It's still in construction phase.

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ROFLMAO

I asked a very simple question which you have still refused to even attempt to answer. If all you know is that some company has acquired a bunch of land around Toyota Center, then your initial post truly amounted to nothing, and only showed how little you truly know, since you apparently were unaware that one company has owned most of the subject land for a very long time. Did your super secret inside informant not even hint at whether these purchases were recent? If they weren't recent, your "inside" information could not be more worthless (or less "inside" as it has been published in the Chronicle; yes, even the clueless folks at the Chronicle know about it).

(and by the way, it was quite clear that I did not expect you to go search the public records. I only mentioned the public records because you should be free to convey any supposedly inside information that is public record.)

One more thing: You seem to be rather full of yourself to think I have "turned my sights on you" in order to try to chase you off. With respect, you aren't worth the effort. ;-)

Why dont you leave him alone? Is it a life and death matter?

Okay, so maybe he didnt know. Why do you keep arguing with him?

Some of you guys act younger than your age.

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It IS funny to read. One thing for sure about Houston19514, he doesn't discriminate. Whether we're talking about Dallas or Houston, you'd better come with the facts or he'll call you on it.

So dallasites, take this as an example that when the forumers ask for facts, that doesn't just apply to when talking about Dallas. Many of the dallasites try to make it seem like Dallas is being singled out, and that's not the case.

I have a lot of respect for Houston19514. He named his dog after our city, and he lives in another state (both of them). Also, he is the only one I know that has purposely taken himself into a pretty scarry ghetto in Houston, because I suggested a really good taqueria there once. He reported back to me that he did indeed enjoy the tacos (They were tacos, right? I cant remember if you had that or the chalupas.). Mr. 514 is indeed a person of conviction, if you ask me. But then again, no one asked me. (They never do.)

[sound of gallups as 2112 rides away on his llama]

Edited by 2112
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Victory is getting up and going like many have stated. Today is some big grand opening, they had the big kick off on the March 23 for Victory Plaza. Now just from watching the media and being in this area at times after work, Victory plaza usually has something going on before and after the games. Its filling up and many fans stay afterwards for Channel 8's news cast. We only have a couple pieces of the puzzle in place with a couple more pieces are coming along. Cirque is about to top out in the next couple of weeks, and Victory Park will be open hopefully by May. Oh...some other discussions. Jonas Woods of Hillwood was quoted as saying something to the effect that high end stores and restuarants account for something like 1 billion sales a year, all the while mid level accounts for 100 billion per year, so in the next stage they plan having more mid level retail and restuarants. I'll try to find the article

This from an email; sorry no link:

"LFT

Edited by 2112
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begin RANT;

A fashion terminal? I dont know, but that just sounds very snooty. It's like the phrase "cultural district". As if "Fashion is found HERE", and "come HERE to be cultured." I hope Houston never brands areas like that. It's bad enough someone went to the trouble of coining "NoDo", which I absolutely dispise. Things need to be organically made. When one here's "The Montrose", it's real because history made that phrase. It wasnt instantly coined.

end RANT;

:lol: When I was in Dallas around January, they were toting some fashion show coming to town. WFAA TV said these exact words..."New York, Los Angeles, Milan, Dallas?!?" They then starting talking about how Dallas is just like those cities in the fashion industry. My sister, who is into that fashion stuff, bust out laughing (she is 11).

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:lol: When I was in Dallas around January, they were toting some fashion show coming to town. WFAA TV said these exact words..."New York, Los Angeles, Milan, Dallas?!?" They then starting talking about how Dallas is just like those cities in the fashion industry. My sister, who is into that fashion stuff, bust out laughing (she is 11).

I'm not sure if I would place Dallas along with those cities but I think you seriously underestimate it's place in the Fashion Industry.

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The "Dallas Look" is extremely popular all over the world right now. Everyone wants their clothes to look like they were designed in Dallas. I hear, all the budding superstars in the fashion industry make it their life's goal to move to Dallas some day, but only the very fortunate few ever actually make it. NYC and Paris have to settle for the losers that can't make it in the Dallas fashion scene. :rolleyes:

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The "Dallas Look" is extremely popular all over the world right now. Everyone wants their clothes to look like they were designed in Dallas. I hear, all the budding superstars in the fashion industry make it their life's goal to move to Dallas some day, but only the very fortunate few ever actually make it. NYC and Paris have to settle for the losers that can't make it in the Dallas fashion scene. :rolleyes:

And your right again!!! > :)

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The "Dallas Look" is extremely popular all over the world right now. Everyone wants their clothes to look like they were designed in Dallas. I hear, all the budding superstars in the fashion industry make it their life's goal to move to Dallas some day, but only the very fortunate few ever actually make it. NYC and Paris have to settle for the losers that can't make it in the Dallas fashion scene. :rolleyes:

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: nice! ;)

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Yeah i was just in Dallas this past weekend and i have to say that Victory looks great. It looks even better in person. My fiance and i went up to the Reunion tower and we were astounded on how well you can see the Victory Screens from way up there. It's starting to resemble a NYC. Sorry to say but i was a tad bit envious.

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Yeah i was just in Dallas this past weekend and i have to say that Victory looks great. It looks even better in person. My fiance and i went up to the Reunion tower and we were astounded on how well you can see the Victory Screens from way up there. It's starting to resemble a NYC. Sorry to say but i was a tad bit envious.

It sounds like an awsome project... I am sure it looks amazing. I still stand by my opinion, however, that Houston Pavilions, though a lot smaller, will, in the end, do a lot more for Downtown Houston than Victory will do for Downtown Dallas. B)

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It sounds like an awsome project... I am sure it looks amazing. I still stand by my opinion, however, that Houston Pavilions, though a lot smaller, will, in the end, do a lot more for Downtown Houston than Victory will do for Downtown Dallas. B)

I agree with you. I mean HP will definitely have more entertainment and proximity advantages to Discovery Green Park, Main Street, and others. It's just that Visitors like to see that WOW factor when they visit a city. It just seems that flashy stuff such as the stuff in Dallas, NYC, and Las Vegas tend to get more attention from Visitors. Some people on here might disagree but I don't think it would kill Houston if it was just a tad bit more flashy.

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I agree with you. I mean HP will definitely have more entertainment and proximity advantages to Discovery Green Park, Main Street, and others. It's just that Visitors like to see that WOW factor when they visit a city. It just seems that flashy stuff such as the stuff in Dallas, NYC, and Las Vegas tend to get more attention from Visitors. Some people on here might disagree but I don't think it would kill Houston if it was just a tad bit more flashy.

I can see where you are coming from, but I am more interested in myself being able to enjoy the city I live in as opposed to caring if visitors are impressed. Don't get me wrong, I think we should try to attract visitors, but I am excited about HP b/c I am exicted to be able to go Downtown and shop and eat and walk around and go to the park... all in an "urban" environment surrounding by tower skyscrapers. I would like to live in a city with an urban, dense downtown core... and I see Downtown Houston becoming that before Downtown Dallas. B)

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I can see where you are coming from, but I am more interested in myself being able to enjoy the city I live in as opposed to caring if visitors are impressed. Don't get me wrong, I think we should try to attract visitors, but I am excited about HP b/c I am exicted to be able to go Downtown and shop and eat and walk around and go to the park... all in an "urban" environment surrounding by tower skyscrapers. I would like to live in a city with an urban, dense downtown core... and I see Downtown Houston becoming that before Downtown Dallas. B)

You're half right. It's not so much about caring what visitors think but wanting Houston to become better known as a World Class and a destination type city. I talk to alot of people at my internship from other places and they say "I didn't know Houston was so big" or "I thought Dallas was the only big city in Texas".

Speaking from a personal standpoint, I just don't want outsiders to just think "Dallas" when they think of Texas, I want Houston to get recognized too. Even though It's already started to get some recognition, i think it would help Houston a little bit more if they show a little more "bling, bling"! You Feel me?

That's why I am hoping HP has some flashy HDTV's on its side.

I wouldn't count on it. Believe me, i'm hopin' too but Denver Pavilions doesn't have it, i wouldn't expect it here. Let's see if this so called "City Centre" will actually become reality and add the TVs in their plan

Edited by tierwestah
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You're half right. It's not so much about caring what visitors think but wanting wanting Houston to become better known as a World Class and a destination type city. I talk to alot of people at my internship from other places and they say "I didn't know Houston was so big" or "I thought Dallas was the only big city in Texas".

Speaking from a personal standpoint, I just don't want outsiders to just think "Dallas" when they think of Texas, I want Houston to get recognized too. Even though It's already started to get more recognized. i think it would help Houston a little bit more if they show a little more "bling, bling"! You Feel me?

I totally understand... everyone who visits me always says that they never knew Houston was such a bit city. But still, above everything, I would like mycity to be "urban"... then we can work on attracting people here.

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  • 2 weeks later...
I can see where you are coming from, but I am more interested in myself being able to enjoy the city I live in as opposed to caring if visitors are impressed. Don't get me wrong, I think we should try to attract visitors, but I am excited about HP b/c I am exicted to be able to go Downtown and shop and eat and walk around and go to the park... all in an "urban" environment surrounding by tower skyscrapers. I would like to live in a city with an urban, dense downtown core... and I see Downtown Houston becoming that before Downtown Dallas. B)

I find your vision/desire interesting: "to go Downtown and shop and eat and walk around and go to the park... all in an "urban" environment surrounding by tower skyscrapers". I would love to be able to do the same things.

In both Houston and Dallas there are currently neighborhoods adjacent to downtown where you can do many, if not all, all of these things - except you are not surrounded by, but rather in the shadows of, the "towering skyscrapers". Moving that urban environment into the core is something both cities seem to be aggressively pursuing.

One thing I noticed that you omitted (perhaps inadvertently) from your vision was the "living" component. More people living downtown will greatly facilitate many of your other desires. That is where, I think, Houston and Dallas may be differing slightly.

In its current state, Downtown Houston is fairly strong -- very large employment base, great attractions (ballpark/arena), and some scattered residential projects (although not yet near its overall potential, in my opinion). New projects such as Houston Pavilions, the new park, and residential tower will definitely help strengthen the area, but the possibilities downtown are so much greater.

On the other hand, Downtown Dallas has been (and remains to be) consistently behind Houston in its CBD revitalization. As a result, I feel that the weaker employment base and more dire situation in Dallas has, instead, forced the city to start by focusing on making downtown more of a "neighborhood" with numerous residents, rather that an existing thriving city center where some people happen to live.

The difference is subtle, but I think significant.

Houston does have several existing loft buildings, condos, and a new residential tower under construction; but I think the numerous large building conversions completed/underway in Downtown Dallas will have a larger impact on the transformation of its downtown area into an "urban" environment.

I have no doubt that Houston will only continue to strengthen its thriving urban core, but I also believe that the emphasis on residential development in Dallas will accelerate the creation of the type of downtown "urban" community/neighborhood that you envision.

Edited by TxDave
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Houston does have several existing loft buildings, condos, and a new residential tower under construction; but I think the numerous large building conversions completed/underway in Downtown Dallas will have a larger impact on the transformation of its downtown area into an "urban" environment.

I have no doubt that Houston will only continue to strengthen its thriving urban core, but I also believe that the emphasis on residential development in Dallas will accelerate the creation of the type of downtown "urban" community/neighborhood that you envision.

No, I've got to disagree with this. The only thing that conversions create is more people and perhaps a more polished facade...eventually (but not immediately) they can bring about some convenience-oriented retail offerings. But it doesn't add much of anything physical to the built environment.

As a result of downtown Houston's tightening office market, we not only are creating more demand for urban living, but it has nowhere else to be placed than in new construction, which is precisely what we're seeing.

Btw, and I'm not trying to annoy Houston19514, but I'm hearing a lot of insider buzz now about projects throughout downtown. If only the folks on this forum knew, how gleeful they would be!

Edited by TheNiche
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No, I've got to disagree with this. The only thing that conversions create is more people and perhaps a more polished facade...eventually (but not immediately) they can bring about some convenience-oriented retail offerings. But it doesn't add much of anything physical to the built environment.

Actually I was not addressing growing the built environment, but rather creating a downtown "urban" environment. I agree that conversions by themselves will not create anything new.

But I do feel that the large number of conversions in Dallas is establishing a population base that creates an urban neighborhood that requires more than just the convenience-oriented retail offerings.

A growing population of (generally) affluent residents should continue to draw more "trendy" retail and dining establishments (along with all of the 'followers' from the rest of the city - ala Uptown).

My real hope is that all of these new residents will also drive the creation of "non-trendy", comfortable, neighborhood establishments downtown as well. I really am concerned about downtown becoming too much of an upscale/'elite' type of neighborhood that reinforces the perception of which Dallas is so notorious

Edited by TxDave
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Btw, and I'm not trying to annoy Houston19514, but I'm hearing a lot of insider buzz now about projects throughout downtown. If only the folks on this forum knew, how gleeful they would be!

I'm gleeful just hearing second hand insider buzz rumors! Tell me, do any of the projects you're hearing about sound realistic to you? Please tell me that Houston City Centre (Texas and Main) is one of them.

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Actually I was not addressing growing the built environment, but rather creating a downtown "urban" environment. I agree that conversions by themselves will not create anything new.

But I do feel that the large number of conversions in Dallas is establishing a population base that creates an urban neighborhood that requires more than just the convenience-oriented retail offerings.

A growing population of (generally) affluent residents should continue to draw more "trendy" retail and dining establishments (along with all of the 'followers' from the rest of the city - ala Uptown).

My real hope is that all of these new residents will also drive the creation of "non-trendy", comfortable, neighborhood establishments downtown as well. I really am concerned about downtown becoming too much of an upscale/'elite' type of neighborhood that reinforces the perception of which Dallas is so notorious

I've only driven through downtown Dallas once in my adult life, and it was on a Saturday morning while on my way to an establishment in Deep Ulm, so I'm far from familiar with any seedy aspects that downtown Dallas might have. If it is at all similar to Houston, though, there is a bit more grit and grime than the newer areas such as Victory and Uptown (or the perception thereof as influenced by urban canyons without sunlight, bums, and older earth-tone buildings), and I do recall noting that retail options were extremely limited.

If my assumption that both downtowns have the same issues affecting them is accurate (and correct me if it isn't), and about the only difference is economic growth, then the same social trends would apply. And that's the root of a big problem, because older householders that can afford to live in highrises tend to prefer the highly-amenitized and cleaner environment, especially one in which your views are unincumbered by other towers. Younger folks seem to be more willing to embrace the grit, but they tend not to have the means to support their preferences, and it is exceptionally hard to justify downtown living if they don't also work there...and that is where downtown Dallas' office market creates problems on the residential side, too.

I'm gleeful just hearing second hand insider buzz rumors! Tell me, do any of the projects you're hearing about sound realistic to you?

Yes, absolutely.

Please tell me that Houston City Centre (Texas and Main) is one of them.

No comment.

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Damn you, Niche!

:D

No disrespect to Niche, but i can't stand having people throwing out information without any hints or clues as to what it might entail. It also annoys me for people to just post these claims without sources. I don't get excited or even hopeful. I would rather not hear any information at all if no more information can be given than that.

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No disrespect to Niche, but i can't stand having people throwing out information without any hints or clues as to what it might entail. It also annoys me for people to just post these claims without sources. I don't get excited or even hopeful. I would rather not hear any information at all if no more information can be given than that.

Agreed. Niche's propensity for this behaviour has been covered extensivly in this thread as well as others. It's more like the little boy who cryed wolf.

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I find your vision/desire interesting: "to go Downtown and shop and eat and walk around and go to the park... all in an "urban" environment surrounding by tower skyscrapers". I would love to be able to do the same things.

In both Houston and Dallas there are currently neighborhoods adjacent to downtown where you can do many, if not all, all of these things - except you are not surrounded by, but rather in the shadows of, the "towering skyscrapers". Moving that urban environment into the core is something both cities seem to be aggressively pursuing.

One thing I noticed that you omitted (perhaps inadvertently) from your vision was the "living" component. More people living downtown will greatly facilitate many of your other desires. That is where, I think, Houston and Dallas may be differing slightly.

In its current state, Downtown Houston is fairly strong -- very large employment base, great attractions (ballpark/arena), and some scattered residential projects (although not yet near its overall potential, in my opinion). New projects such as Houston Pavilions, the new park, and residential tower will definitely help strengthen the area, but the possibilities downtown are so much greater.

On the other hand, Downtown Dallas has been (and remains to be) consistently behind Houston in its CBD revitalization. As a result, I feel that the weaker employment base and more dire situation in Dallas has, instead, forced the city to start by focusing on making downtown more of a "neighborhood" with numerous residents, rather that an existing thriving city center where some people happen to live.

The difference is subtle, but I think significant.

Houston does have several existing loft buildings, condos, and a new residential tower under construction; but I think the numerous large building conversions completed/underway in Downtown Dallas will have a larger impact on the transformation of its downtown area into an "urban" environment.

I have no doubt that Houston will only continue to strengthen its thriving urban core, but I also believe that the emphasis on residential development in Dallas will accelerate the creation of the type of downtown "urban" community/neighborhood that you envision.

I didn't mean to omit anything. One reason Downtown Houston lacks residents is b/c there is not a lot or retail.... no grocery store... a lot of stuff closes at 5pm... stuff like that that people want around where they live. Well, with HP we have tons of new retail coming with restaurants... an upscale bowling alley... House of Blues, etc. The new residential tower will have a small grocer on street level along with a cafe... add this to the new park being built which will have restaurants... all of this in the center of Downtown Houston where thousands of people work. I believe all of this will lead to more people wanting to live Downtown... which in turn will lead to more retail / restaurants / entertainment, etc... this will lead to more residents... etc etc. I believe it will be sort of like a snowball effect... ALL DOWNTOWN! :D

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No disrespect to Niche, but i can't stand having people throwing out information without any hints or clues as to what it might entail. It also annoys me for people to just post these claims without sources. I don't get excited or even hopeful. I would rather not hear any information at all if no more information can be given than that.

I get where you're coming from, but I mean only to convey a sense of optimism. I think that's warranted.

Agreed. Niche's propensity for this behaviour has been covered extensivly in this thread as well as others. It's more like the little boy who cryed wolf.

The little boy who cried wolf? Jeez, if you're trying to insult me, at least use an analogy that makes sense. After all, the whole point of insulting someone is to discredit them, not yourself. I'd expect more from someone as artistically-inclined as yourself.

...and then you'll say, as you have in the past to this same come-back of mine that I'm not worth the time and creativity. ...and then I'll say, "what, I wasn't worth the time for you not to make an ass of yourself?" I'll then use the wacko smiley, like this: :wacko:

:lol:B)

Edited by TheNiche
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I get where you're coming from, .
Btw, and I'm not trying to annoy Houston19514, but I'm hearing a lot of insider buzz now about projects throughout downtown.

No. You are spreading rumors. Now if you truly have real info, spill it. This will make you more credible than trying to spin "I'm hearing a lot of insider buz" into "but I mean only to convey a sense of optimism."

If you had just said that instead of inserting your usual BS about insider knowledge which you never share, you wouldn't get ragged on everytime you pull this stunt. That's a form of crying Wolf.

As far as insulting you, why bother when others have proven to be far more skillful...including your worse enemy: yourself.

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No. You are spreading rumors. Now if you truly have real info, spill it. This will make you more credible than trying to spin "I'm hearing a lot of insider buz" into "but I mean only to convey a sense of optimism."

If you had just said that instead of inserting your usual BS about insider knowledge which you never share, you wouldn't get ragged on everytime you pull this stunt. That's a form of crying Wolf.

I have information, but I won't be bullied into spilling it. You are correct that it'd make me a more credible source, but them's the breaks. I share what little I can, and if all you get is unqualified optimism, well you're just going to have to live with it. Believe it or not, some people actually like to feel good about the progress their city is making. So crawl back into your pit of cynicism and read up on your children's stories. Next time, get the analogy right.

If I purposefully lie and cry "crane" and it generates a lot of buzz but there is no crane, and do it again and generate a lot of buzz, then the third time, there will be no buzz. That would be analogous to the boy who cried wolf. But I'm not crying "crane" because there is no crane. I'm crying "insider buzz" because there is insider buzz. That you do not know what it is does not negate its truth, oh non-omnipotent one.

As far as insulting you, why bother when others have proven to be far more skillful...including your worse enemy: yourself.

Oh, how original! :lol: Polly want a cracker? :lol:B)

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Btw, and I'm not trying to annoy Houston19514, but I'm hearing a lot of insider buzz now about projects throughout downtown. If only the folks on this forum knew, how gleeful they would be!

Not annoyed in the least... but HIGHLY AMUSED. Anyone who reads the papers, or follows Mayor White's statements, or even follows this forum, already knows there is a lot of "insider buzz" about projects throughout downtown.

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I think you guy's are being a little hard on Niche. He's either lying or telling the truth, and I don't think he's a liar.

We've already run off Houston Development with a barage of rudeness, let's not run Niche off to.

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I think you guy's are being a little hard on Niche. He's either lying or telling the truth, and I don't think he's a liar.

We've already run off Houston Development with a barage of rudeness, let's not run Niche off to.

Truth or lie; it doesn't really matter. . . Niche has told us exactly nothing, and has rarely, if ever, shown any evidence of having any truly inside information. It doesn't exactly take Sherlock Holmes to know that there are a lot of exciting developments brewing for downtown Houston.

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I agree with Gary. Be nice to Niche.

A little optimism never hurt anyone. People won't be disappointed if they take everything they read on the internet with a little skepticism and common sense instead of as the gospel truth or anything other than the opinion that it is. It's not like what people post around here makes a whole lot of difference whether something gets built or not. But if someone thinks it could hurt their credibility at work by revealing inside stuff - I respect that.

How much one chooses to believe around here as actual fact is their own responsibility. With that being said, keep posting what you can, Niche. I like reading that you think the projects you are hearing inside info about (that will make us all gleeful) are real. You don't need sources to post opinion. Of course, it would be nice. :)

How about a time table??? - WHEN will we be gleeful?

I'm hoping the "trick the info out of him" method will work better than the "pissing him off" approach - which is getting us nowhere. :)

Edited by Mister X
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