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JJ18

Evacuating

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As I type my Girlfriend is driving I'm in The Woodlands its taiknen 5 and 1/2 hours just to get from South West Houston to here. If yall havent evacuated trough 45 towards Dallas its caos nothing is moving people are out of gas and people stop in the middle of the road to eat streach and just not do nothing....

I think they should have opened up the other lanes to just make the freways a one way, I still haven't reach Conroe so I don't know how "fast" its moving hopefully this won't be somenthing we have to look back at and tell ourselves "we could have done this or that" I'm pissed because as I drive people with children are outside because thres nothing you can do but wait and hope u don't run out of gas .....

Nice people are giving out water, HOT DOGS, and I anything they can give away

C'onm 5 million people trying to get out ONE CAN ONLY WAIT...........

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Yeah, we went to San Antonio and it took us 13 hours. Every where on the way was out of gas except a few places, but the lines were backed up forever. People were driving contra flow, on the access roads, on the shoulder, and in the grass and it was still backed up and was pretty much one big parking lot.

I went on I-10 btw. it was just chaos, I would hate to see what would happen if something serious really did happen.

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if a category five were to hit directly, besides flooding and wind damage, who knows how long any of houston would be without power...i suppose evacuating is a good alternative to that...

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Ah yes, the big "IF".

An "IF" if so big, that I really think some people should just leave Houston forever, starting today.

It's not a question of "IF", but "When", the big one comes. I still think many were too scared to be without power, so they high-tailed it to Dallas to party with friends.

I was without power for two weeks during Alicia, and I lived to tell about it.

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Some serious education needs to be given to people about who should evacuate and who should wait out the storm. There's often no reason for people in areas that are not subject to storm surge or flooding to leave town. Yes, being stuck with no power after the storm is uncomfortable, and if you can't bare that, you can always get out after the storm has passed.

One of these days we are going to be hit with a really serious storm, and I'd wager good money that people who shouldn't have evacuated will get stuck in traffic and die on a freeway or highway someplace because they couldn't get to safety. And many of them will probably have homes that survive the storm intact enough that anyone who took shelter in them in a central room away from windows would have come through unharmed.

Had I been in Houston this past week I would have evacuated, but only because I live on the ground floor of my building and I'm right on Brays Bayou. If I did not live so close to the bayou, and within the flood plain, I probably would have stayed.

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I am 99% sure I heard 740 AM slip on a couple of occasions, and say "the entire city of Houston was under mandatory evacuation".

I know the reporters and anchors were tired, but one slip and a Simple Simon could fall into panic mode.

My hood (77 miles from Galveston) was a ghost town. I could not belive my eyes seeing them flee in a freenzy.

It's time to revise our emergency plans. We should all take this as a lucky lesson learned.

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It's time to revise our emergency plans. We should all take this as a lucky lesson learned.

Agreed! Did any of the people who died trying to evacuate even need to evacuate? The bus fire and the elderly person who slipped and fell at a car wash come to mind. Not to mention countless pets.

I'm sure the nursing home administrator in Bellaire was scared to death of the liability he/she would face if they *didn't* evacuate, but when even my fellow downtowners are fleeing their mid-rises for Dallas and Austin, then hype has truly overwhelmed common sense.

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I evacuated TO Houston. We live in borderline storm surge area in Pasadena - technically not in any of the three zones, but very close to one of them. I had made backup reservations in north Houston for Friday and Saturday night. Then found out that the whole city of Pasadena was under mandatory evacuation. I wasn't sure what to do, but was actually able to find a room at the downtown Hilton for Thursday night, then moved out north for Friday.

As of Saturday, the hotel out north had no power, and I don't think our power ever went off in Pasadena, so we came home.

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Hindsight is so 20/20. The prospect of our two giant oak trees smashing our 40s-era home In Garden Oaks with no interior room, caused us to flee to Austin. That and we had tickets to ACL Fest :P

Not sure if we'll do it again next time though. 15 hours to Austin was pretty rough.

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I think this is all part of the "puppy" factor...i.e., America has become a bunch of puppies. There were evacuees that were worried about being uncomfortable if the power went out, as MidtownCoog said, so they clogged up the freeway for real evacuees. They are probably the biggest whiners about the evacuation, too. Their SUVs probably get shitty gas mileage while sitting in traffic with max ac on.

Unfortunately, I doubt any amount of "education" will convince these selfish bastards to stay put. Maybe if we make gensets the new "it" item to have in Houston, they'll stick around and show them off. <_<

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two giant oak trees

And herein lies the problem...

You live 60 miles from the coast. Houston should be able shelter people like you who live in questionalbe structures IN the city.

No need to impede the evacuation of people who are truly in harms way.

We have huge oaks in my hood, but we do have a safe room in our house.

If I were you, I think I'd call the tree service.

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Generally, everyone was afraid of what a Cat 5 hurricane would do to their houses. It didn't help that there was a lot of fear-mongering going on. I was watching KHOU's forums while Rita was still a Cat 5. A lot of people were posting - for example - they live out in Katy and that they were afraid. Then some jackholes kept responding with messages like "run for your life!" I blame the media too. They gave so much information about the worst-case scenarios in the most vulnerable areas, people living further out had no idea what to expect.

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Initially I was NOT going to leave my downtown high rise apartment. Since I live in this awful high rise I had to take some precautions. I know that the higher you are winds speeds are stronger.

On Wednesday I was watching the news and Rita was a Cat 5, but projected to go to a Cat 4 and the eye was to hit south of the Galveston. The eastern part of the storm then would be hitting Houston and Galveston. I got on the road it took me 8 1/2 hrs to get to family in Lufkin.

Shamefully, I cut a lot of the time by driving through medians, the free way shoulders, store parking lots, 59 business highways that go through certain towns, back roads, and one dirt road. Otherwise, I think it would have taken me about 15 hours to drive what usually takes 2 hours.

By the time I got there the storm had shifted, now I would have driven back into Houston, but I had no idea if and when counter-flow lines would be opened on the 59 for evacuees. Plus my family did not want us to go back.

Redscarem, do you think I am a puppy for leaving?

I kind of have to say maybe, but in my defense I was influenced by the media and my family.

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That's a tough call, eelimon, but overall, I would say no, you weren't pussing out. Knowing what Alicia did to downtown, it's hard to blame anyone for getting out of downtown while staring at a CAT 5. However, where was the education about how your building would hold up? How can you make an educated call, if no one is explaining to you whether it is safe to stay?

My bigger gripe is with those further north, who live in homes built to withstand 110-120 mph winds, and were not subject to flooding. But, overall, I will say that it is hard to blame anyone for leaving on Wednesday, when the forecast said CAT 5 aiming at Freeport. Hardly anyone knows what their house can withstand.

Education is key.

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We live in SE Houston 13 miles from the bay, and about 2 or 3 miles from Pasadena, which had a mandatory evacuation. We are about 2 miles outside of storm surge zone C. So technically, we should not have evacuated. But our home, off of Edgebrook, flooded during Allision. So we left anyways.

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Agreed! Did any of the people who died trying to evacuate even need to evacuate? The bus fire and the elderly person who slipped and fell at a car wash come to mind. Not to mention countless pets.

you don't think people should be taking their pets? would that really cause more problems with traffic. i didn't see any dogs driving their own vehicles, but maybe i missed it.

i was annoyed to see all the people driving alone. my friends and i fled in a two-door accord. they were all hurricane virgins. one just started a rotation at UTMB, i just helped the poor guy move in to a condo on 4th street last week, and he had to leave two days later. my other friend and i literally live on clear lake, so we packed up our cars and headed to another friend's who just bought a house in pearland. i was tempted to ride it out, but the others were scared and didn't want to take chances. we had no idea how the house would hold up, or if it tended to flood. we had a place to stay in austin so we took off at 3am thursday. thankfully our neighbor let us keep our cars in her garage, which helped out a lot.

4 of us in a coupe with no air-conditioning, 10 hours and 9 gallons later we were there. i don't regret leaving, at the time given the track, i think it was the right thing to do.

but i do know people who fled from spring which i don't get. most of my parents friends who live in cinco ranch stuck around.

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Education is key.

even if you know what your house can theoretically withstand, how much does that mean? at one point, they were predicting 120mph winds in sugarland. even if your house is built to withstand that, i can understand people wanted to leave, given the scenario as of wednesday.

and since we didn't get hit hard, the only education we can get out of Rita, is how to evacuate. open contra-flow earlier. close entrances to 45 to allow people from close to the gulf to evacuate first.

use the media to clearly convey a staggered evac. that you will not be able to get on a freeway if you live here, until this time.

you can call them puppies if you want, but bottom line is people are free to leave if they want, and when they want. the only hope would be to try to keep order and let them know they don't need to leave until a certain time.

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if you can't bare that

Last time I 'bared that' I got arrested.

(sorry, ssullivan - cheap shot! :D )

Seriously...there's no answer. If The Big One hits, we cannot evacuate everyone. Some of us are going to die. Sorry!

Big cities are...well, BIG. To pick up and move such a huge number of people at a moment's notice just isn't practible. We cannot plan our cities around Doomsday scenerios. Life goes on, to coin a phrase. We make our choices, and we take our chances.

Each of us can help himself. Keep a few cans of food, a couple gallons of water in reserve, always. It's a cheap investment.

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use the media

The media is a mixed bag and should not be trusted 100% simply becuase they are human, and humans make mistakes. In a REAL emergency, should we have a Civil Defence radio station as the offical news source?

I ask this only becuase some stations are too busy trying to put on a show instead of reporting the facts.

Do we REALLY need to see Wayne Dolcefino standing in the wind trying to become the next Dan Rather?

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Knowing what Alicia did to downtown, it's hard to blame anyone for getting out of downtown while staring at a CAT 5. However, where was the education about how your building would hold up?

I know for a fact my place would have been safe. But I didn't know what the situation downtown would be after the storm. Could I leave downtown if I had to? Would the infrastucure be torn up? Could the flooding be so bad downtown it would be like an island ie.Alison storm. Then I have mom calling me telling me to leave and knowing she will be worried sick about me.

Once they stated the hurricane would drop to a Cat 3 I decided to stay for good.

Edited by ToolMan

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Responding to a few points made...

Many of the vehicles had one occupant, due to the fact that 2 car families were taking BOTH vehicles, doubling the clogging of the road. Totally chicken____, IMO, that saving an extra SUV takes precedence over evacuating people.

As to the western and northern residents? Yes, they are free to leave, and individual circumstances dictate that some should, especially those near flood prone areas. And yes, the rest of us are entitled to call the rest of them puppies, or more accurately, self-centered pricks.

For those that do feel the need to leave, maybe the government officials should block entrances in the northern areas until the designated evacuation time. This may move more people faster, since entrance ramps cause the most congestion.

Whatever happens, these discussions are long overdue, and will be helpful for the next one.

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(DAMN! I'm old!)

I'm 48, OK? When I was a kid in the early 60's, there was a huge national effort to protect its citizens. It was called Civil Defense, and in every city you'd see signs on buildings which designated them as Civil Defense shelters. Food and water were stockpiled, usually in the basements. At that time, the concern was nuclear weapons; it was the height of the Cold War. Scary times! Little things like hurricaines were the least of our worries.

Since we're spending billions of dollars on...what's it called? Homeland Security? - I'd like to see some concrete bang for our bucks. Yes. Let's spend some of that money in your neighborhood. Better yet, encourage people to stockpile a few days' essentials in their own homes, always. Always. Not just when it's fashionable.

Call me Gloomy Gus. Go ahead, I dare ya. But tell you what; we've been very lucky. The brief inconveniences of Rita should serve as a warning. 'It' (hurricaine? terrorist attack? avian flu?) is inevitable.

In the mean time, life goes on, and we can enjoy it and be prepared at the same time.

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Yup, I agree. I used to play in those shelters. Why can't northern and western residents go to those $65 million schools they are building, instead of blocking the freeways with 2 cars?

Plan for it, learn about it, then do it. If our construction materials and methods are so great, let's put them to good use.

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The evacuation car of choice - From a Houston Chronicle Blog

"My wife and I were part of the horde of people who left town last Thursday to avoid Hurricane Rita. Driving a Toyota Prius hybrid car, we made about 45 miles in nine hours time before turning back. During that time we consumed less than two gallons of gasoline, all the time in the comfort of an air conditioned car. I can't say too much for the Prius as the ideal evacuation car."

Another:

"FYI, Renee and I finally got to Palestine, TX at about 5:45 AM -- 30 hours after leaving our house in Clear Lake. The Prius still has about 1/4 tank of gas..."

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i was annoyed to see all the people driving alone

No kidding. Pack the family and pets in one car, and leave the rest behind. Seems like everyone has a SUV anyway, so there should be plenty of room for two adults, a few kids, and a dog. Your autos are insured. Take one and leave the others behind and deal with the aftermath later! Getting everyone who does need to leave out safely before the storm comes in is infiniely more important than rescuing more than one vehicle and a bunch of personal belongings.

Since we're spending billions of dollars on...what's it called? Homeland Security?

Homeland Security = Biggest waste of taxpayer money of the century. Very little of what's happened in that department has improved our safety and security. In some ways, the DHS has made things worse than they already were.

I must say I got a great laugh when I was told that one of the President's biggest supporters in my hometown was raising a huge fuss the other day when FEMA hadn't arrived with fuel trucks yet and her luxury SUV was so low on gas that she couldn't leave town to go to a hotel someplace where they had electricity. She is one of the biggest "security moms" I knew in the last election, and totally bought into the whole "we have to reelect Bush to save our families from the terrorists" BS. Now she's just like everyone else, stuck in the same boat, waiting on Bush's inept leadership to respond.

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inept leadership doesn't adhere to party lines...bush, however, does happen to be our beloved president :rolleyes:

Edited by sevfiv

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Blame your Senators and Represenatives on how the Homeland Security money is distributed.

Don't you folks understand how Government works?

FWIW, The Port of Houston just recived the largest alocation of Homeland Security funds of any port in the USA.

Maybe we should just give it all back since it's such a waste.

Don't be a Simple Simon.

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Blame your Senators and Represenatives on how the Homeland Security money is distributed.

Don't you folks understand how Government works?

FWIW, The Port of Houston just recived the largest alocation of Homeland Security funds of any port in the USA.

Maybe we should just give it all back since it's such a waste.

Don't be a Simple Simon.

That would be the Republican controlled Senate and House, wouldn't it?

Simple Simon, indeed.

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Trust me, everbody got their pork. I am no Rep, but if they are all so wrong, then why do they control both houses and the Presidency? I'd love to see some Dem leadship, but right now I don't see any, and apparently, neither do most Americans.

Watch the news tonight. FEMA is now blaming Lousyanna. I think they were called "dysfunctional".

Back to the subject. Another lesson learned that Houston needs to

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Blame your Senators and Represenatives on how the Homeland Security money is distributed.

Don't you folks understand how Government works?

FWIW, The Port of Houston just recived the largest alocation of Homeland Security funds of any port in the USA.

Maybe we should just give it all back since it's such a waste.

Don't be a Simple Simon.

I just wish the party of "fiscal responsibility" would show some. When Tom Delay says "we've cut all we can" was he serious or does he really think the American people are that stupid? I don't know how they are going to do it but the moderately good economy we have now is going to tank if they don't cut somewhere.

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I did watch the news tonight. Mike Brown becomes a bigger idiot every time he opens his mouth. Amazingly, FEMA had aplan to go into overwhelmed disaster areas without being asked. So, not only did New Orleans not follow ITS plan, Louisiana didn't follow ITS plan and FEMA didn't follow ITS own plan.

In retrospect, it's amazing that only 1,000 died.

BTW, Beaumont's mayor is screaming that FEMA isn't helping his city either. It'll take more than firing Mike Brown to fix this clusterf*ck of an agency. How about dismantling DHS? It seemed to work better the old way.

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The direction this thread has taken is exactly why our institutions are becoming increasingly dysfunctional.

Politics first, people second.

The institutions we count on are not infallible.

Things need to change for the better.

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I don't see that happening for awhile, Coog. The lust for power by those who enter politics far outweighs any desire for community service. Worse, the voters seem to reward this behavior, as long as the power monger is from their favorite party.

The politicians then reward their supporters with government appointments, thinking if they can run a campaign, they can run a government. When their bureaucratic incompetence inevitably shows its ugly face, the politicians put the slimy spin machine to work, trashing the victims before the bodies have even bloated.

The party that is out of favor then jumps on the incompetents, in a lame attempt to suggest they would have done better. Meanwhile, the victims are starving, thirsty, homeless and wondering why the world's only superpower cannot even protect it's own citizens.

The citizenry, as it has been trained to do, lashes out at each party, as if natural disasters, and the response to them, has some sort of political solution. When the citizenry puts competence above party affiliation, change will occur. Until then, go buy your own generator and water, and hope that the poor and infirm can hang on.

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I blame Bush in large part because he's the one who appointed the leadership of many of the agencies that are suffering from piss-poor leadership. I am not saying it's a Republican problem, and I agree that incompetency crosses party lines. However we have had huge disasters before without some of the issues we have had in the last month after these two hurricanes. I am disgusted when a President who was reelected largely on a platform of making this country safer and improving our response to emergencies has done such an incredibly bad job at making us safer. And it's not like this is the only thing he has seriously botched up.

As for simple simons, many of the ones I know are the ones who voted for this current President and Congress. I'm not accusing anyone on this board or saying that all Republican supporters fall into that category, but there are far too many people who would rather fall into the party line than think for themselves. All they hear is the trumped up fear mongering of the right, combined with them screaming "family values" from the mountaintop, and they fall in line and refuse to see how poorly things are being run.

Now for a good laugh -- NPR this morning was reporting that FEMA has rehired Mike Brown as a "consultant." What the hell can he be consulting them on? How to screw things up even more? :rolleyes:

I am just thankful that at least my family members who are caught in the middle of this thing are in one of the few towns that supplies arrived in quickly, and that they have a relatively undamaged house, and the financial means to come through this okay. However they are in the minority. This may not be another New Orleans, but it's still pretty damn bad.

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Something needs to be fixed...

lavstx9un.jpg

What does the Galveston evacuation have to do with Republican leadership? Nowhere could I find Lyda Ann Thomas' party affiliation. Isn't mayor of Galveston a non-partison position?

Edited by west20th

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Guest danax
Yup, I agree. I used to play in those shelters. Why can't northern and western residents go to those $65 million schools they are building, instead of blocking the freeways with 2 cars?

Plan for it, learn about it, then do it. If our construction materials and methods are so great, let's put them to good use.

Right. We need to prepare our city and homes, not for mass evacuation. I read that the Asians are laughing at our idiocy of running. They have built infrastructure to handle most typhoons.

How many millions of Chinese do you think are shuddering in their silk slippers and readying up the rickshaws just because big, bad Typhoon Longwang is on the way? They've had to learn to "hunker" since most still only have bikes. Now that would be a funny scene. And while they respect the power of nature, they seem to mock the storms by giving them funny names.

:lol:

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Right. We need to prepare our city and homes, not for mass evacuation. I read that the Asians are laughing at our idiocy of running. They have built infrastructure to handle most typhoons.

How many millions of Chinese do you think are shuddering in their silk slippers and readying up the rickshaws just because big, bad Typhoon Longwang is on the way? They've had to learn to "hunker" since most still only have bikes. Now that would be a funny scene. And while they respect the power of nature, they seem to mock the storms by giving them funny names.

:lol:

By golly there really was a Typhoon Longwang. Imagine the fun we could have if they named hurricanes like that.

:lol:

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I think this is all part of the "puppy" factor...i.e., America has become a bunch of puppies. There were evacuees that were worried about being uncomfortable if the power went out, as MidtownCoog said, so they clogged up the freeway for real evacuees. They are probably the biggest whiners about the evacuation, too. Their SUVs probably get shitty gas mileage while sitting in traffic with max ac on.

Unfortunately, I doubt any amount of "education" will convince these selfish bastards to stay put. Maybe if we make gensets the new "it" item to have in Houston, they'll stick around and show them off. <_<

The only reason I went to Dallas, wasn't because of me or my girlfriend it was because of our kid he's 7 months old and I wasn't gonna risk stayin here I live in SW Houston and I know it wasn't mandatory to leave but when you go to a store and see that there running low on basic nescesities water,food and gas, BS MAN I'm gone even though notting bad happen where I live I still don't regret leavin yeah it took 14 hours but hey atleast we were safe so if that's what you call being "puppy" I guess we should not care about our families safety?........

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Chill, JJ. Read the entire thread. I was talking mostly about northern and western suburbs. Southwest Houston is probably no more than 45 miles from the coast, and a 7 month old does change things. But, I doubt there are 1 million parents of 7 month olds out there, and that still doesn't justify taking TWO SUVs. Those are the ones I'm talking about.

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Something needs to be fixed...

lavstx9un.jpg

Interesting. Galveston is run by Democrats and has been for over a hundred years, yet you claim them as Republicans?

Now, TxDOT, who decided to run the contra-flow at 7:00 AM on Thursday, 24 hours after the traffic jams started, and did not get them in place until Thursday afternoon, and who DID NOT follow it's own plan to have gasoline at rest stops for the inevitable stalled vehicles, now that group is part of the State of Texas, which doesn't have a single statewide elected Democrat.

Our Democratic mayor, Galveston's Democratic mayor and our Republican County Judge did a great job. Our Republican run state government stunk up the place. I see no political winners or losers.

Local guys and gals=Good

State guys=Bad

FEMA=Still missing in action.

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Something needs to be fixed...

lavstx9un.jpg

Why you have to bring in your politics into this Coog?

Besides Louisiana has always had a bad reputation with Government leadership. No matter if it was democrat, republican, or independent.

What does the Galveston evacuation have to do with Republican leadership? Nowhere could I find Lyda Ann Thomas' party affiliation. Isn't mayor of Galveston a non-partison position?

I believe that in Texas local governments, i.e. mayors, are supposed to be nonpartisan.

Interesting. Galveston is run by Democrats and has been for over a hundred years, yet you claim them as Republicans?

Local guys and gals=Good

State guys=Bad

FEMA=Still missing in action.

I think Coog is having delusions because Tom Delay was indicted today.

Read the following from the NY Times:

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/national/A...estigation.html

Edited by eelimon

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Politics started at Post #25 in this thread. Read closely.

Mayor White is a Dem. How dense are y'all?

And who cares about Cockroach Delay?

Well, we all should, becuase this is another log in the Enron/Cheerleader Mom/Run Over Your Husband/Andrea Yates/Halliburton fire that IS Houston.

Do we really need another black eye already?

Did y'all see Lynn Ashby's column three weeks ago on evacuation plans?

I bet he feels like psychic.

Edited by MidtownCoog

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Politics started at Post #25 in this thread. Read closely.

Mayor White is a Dem. How dense are y'all?

And who cares about Cockroach Delay?

Well, we all should, becuase this is another log in the Enron/Cheerleader Mom/Run Over Your Husband/Andrea Yates/Halliburton fire that IS Houston.

Do we really need another black eye already?

Did y'all see Lynn Ashby's column three weeks ago on evacuation plans?

I bet he feels like psychic.

Still wondering why you think the Galveston evacuation had anything to do with Republican leadership. I guess it is the Gov. Perry syndrome. Do nothing but take credit for what gets done.

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