SP+ Parking Garage At 114 Travis St.

[Avossos]

1 hour ago, kbates2 said:

While it will be an unattractive garage, I was excited about the GFR.  Now that is off the table.

wait wait wait. when did ground floor retail get axed??

[Elseed]

No GFR?

[H-Town Man]

On 6/10/2016 at 9:58 AM, kbates2 said:

While it will be an unattractive garage, I was excited about the GFR.  Now that is off the table.

 

Unbelievable... yet believable.

 

[Nole23]

Wait, no GFR?? Don't even build the damn thing then....

[Avossos]

This annoys me. No one has said it doesn't except that dumb post that insinuated it.

 

for all we know nothing's changed. If something has, that's what should have been communicated.

[kbates2]

41 minutes ago, Avossos said:

This annoys me. No one has said it doesn't except that dumb post that insinuated it.

 

for all we know nothing's changed. If something has, that's what should have been communicated.

 

Dumb post?  Alright pal.

 

This garage is of particular interest to me as it will be directly in my view at my home.  I have heard from a couple of people that the retail portion is no longer included.  I do not have any certified documents from the developer representing as such.  I would tend to believe the people who told me this.

[Avossos]

25 minutes ago, kbates2 said:

 

Dumb post?  Alright pal.

 

This garage is of particular interest to me as it will be directly in my view at my home.  I have heard from a couple of people that the retail portion is no longer included.  I do not have any certified documents from the developer representing as such.  I would tend to believe the people who told me this.

 

Thanks for sharing your source. Hopefully the retail manages to make it in.

[Houston19514]

For what it's worth, the developer's website still shows the same rendering and says it consists of ground floor retail space and 9 stories of covered parking.  (Under status, it says:  "Pre-development Underway")

[adr]

Heh.

[Texasota]

well, once the documents are posted we should know whether retail is still planned.

[Urbannizer]

10 floors, GFR scratched, work beings Aug. 1st (if approved)

 

http://www.houstontx.gov/planning/Commissions/docs_pdfs/hahc/Application_Materials/July_MATERIALS/805_Franklin_NewCon_Garage_App_Materials.pdf

[KinkaidAlum]

Wildly disappointing. Looks like a massive hulking garage built with cheap materials. Sure, it's prettier than the Kim Son Garage but that's not saying much. 

[Nole23]

[bobruss]

This is a shame. I hope they don't get approved. 

[Avossos]

So there are two different renderings... Which one is it?

[kbates2]

Would love for this to get denied.

[cspwal]

Is this area in the historic district?  If it is, what restrictions are there on new construction?

[The Pragmatist]

So they're going to be using a brick facade in place of the grey-on-grey motif?

[nativehoustonion]

They need to tear down that empty jail, what a eyesore.

[kbates2]

Without the retail portion, this is a miserable development for the historic district.  They can pretend like their changes make the streetscape better all they want but this is just lazy development.

[Moore713]

See this is what I hate about so of thes3 companies,  I think they never intended to build certain things, but they release certain  works to get pass, then switch it up and go with designs they know would never had gotten approved in it intital stage..now they can scream about how much money they have already invested

[bobruss]

This is the kind of situation that frustrates the hell out of me. Any property built in the historic district should be required to have GFR. For that matter anything built downtown should be required to have more GFR. The CBD will remain a wasteland most of the day and all nights, unless there's retail and service GFR, to take care of all the errands you run everyday, things within close, safe, walking distance. Thats why people choose to live in downtown environments.

Some one in planning needs to wake up and realize that every block that developers get away without including GFR,  is one more down the drain. It hurts the neighborhood, since walking past blocks of ugly parking garages to get to the drug store isn't very stimulating and makes it much more likely that people won't go the extra three block passed nondescript walls and garages to get there, much less it detracts from the urban experience which usually includes more street presence by it's residents.

You can say what you want about controls, but if  you want a smart enjoyable experience living in the new residences in this neighborhood or one of many downtown neighborhoods that are now being built, your going to need lots of GFR, and if it takes more controls and requirements, to attain this goal, it needs to be done. It should be required.

Where's the downtown or historic district leadership, on this important integral part of developing a great and complete environment. Like the one they hoped for when they first gave out all that money to developers to produce the apartments and hotels, so people would come downtown and live. We need  someone to take charge  and take this project by the horns and finish strong. Finish this dream of having a living breathing neighborhood downtown. One thats there 24- 7.  Not  parking garages full of people you hardly ever see on the streets except when they're waiting for their buses all qued up in neat little rows or sliding out of the parking garages, covering their eyes due to the bright object in the sky, they've forgotten was there.  Now add all of those hotels that are either newly opened or going to open in the next year.  You think those people won't like places to walk to for things they might need or want. 

Real Estate developers might argue the reasoning, but I'm of the opinion, that, if you want it to really become a neighborhood, its got to have lots of convenient retail and service GFR. How about a Mediclinic somewhere in the neighborhood or a florist, doctor, dentist, barber, beauty salon, spa, galleries, bookstores, to name a few, and on and on and on. You get the picture. Someday they'll want the convenience of walking down the street instead of going to the parking garage, getting in their car, going down six levels and hopefully not get stuck in a line at crunch time, to merge into traffic

and  drive 10 blocks to midtown or Montrose to do anything like buy a lightbulb or get some hardware and then repeat the process.

Just remember that once its built, its there for a while. Like decades or centuries, so lets slow down and get it right this time.  It's kind of hard to retrofit a garage, if its not designed for GFR from the get go.............................................,................................................................................................................

 

 

Sorry, but I feel better now.

 

[KinkaidAlum]

I've typed and erased about 10 different rants for this thread. 

 

At the end of the day, I had hoped that at the very least, in downtown, we had matured as a city. Seems as if our collective priority is still to the private automobile over a livable city and for developers to make a quick buck at the expense of the public good. 

[intencity77]

6 minutes ago, KinkaidAlum said:

At the end of the day, I had hoped that at the very least, in downtown, we had matured as a city. Seems as if our collective priority is still to the private automobile over a livable city and for developers to make a quick buck at the expense of the public good. 

 

^^^This, this, this all the way! As usual Kinkaid I agree with you 110%! I had also hoped for that at the beginning of this growth spurt we just finished. I thought maybe Houston is finally going to "grow up" and start taking pedestrian oriented development and how it affects quality of life, seriously. But I was mistaken because alot of the projects this past cycle either stuck to the same old tired development patterns or played the relentless "bait and switch" routine. I'm now doubting that this inner city car-centric mentality will ever change in my lifetime. 

[H-Town Man]

20 hours ago, bobruss said:

This is the kind of situation that frustrates the hell out of me. Any property built in the historic district should be required to have GFR. For that matter anything built downtown should be required to have more GFR. The CBD will remain a wasteland most of the day and all nights, unless there's retail and service GFR, to take care of all the errands you run everyday, things within close, safe, walking distance. Thats why people choose to live in downtown environments.

Some one in planning needs to wake up and realize that every block that developers get away without including GFR,  is one more down the drain. It hurts the neighborhood, since walking past blocks of ugly parking garages to get to the drug store isn't very stimulating and makes it much more likely that people won't go the extra three block passed nondescript walls and garages to get there, much less it detracts from the urban experience which usually includes more street presence by it's residents.

You can say what you want about controls, but if  you want a smart enjoyable experience living in the new residences in this neighborhood or one of many downtown neighborhoods that are now being built, your going to need lots of GFR, and if it takes more controls and requirements, to attain this goal, it needs to be done. It should be required.

Where's the downtown or historic district leadership, on this important integral part of developing a great and complete environment. Like the one they hoped for when they first gave out all that money to developers to produce the apartments and hotels, so people would come downtown and live. We need  someone to take charge  and take this project by the horns and finish strong. Finish this dream of having a living breathing neighborhood downtown. One thats there 24- 7.  Not  parking garages full of people you hardly ever see on the streets except when they're waiting for their buses all qued up in neat little rows or sliding out of the parking garages, covering their eyes due to the bright object in the sky, they've forgotten was there.  Now add all of those hotels that are either newly opened or going to open in the next year.  You think those people won't like places to walk to for things they might need or want. 

Real Estate developers might argue the reasoning, but I'm of the opinion, that, if you want it to really become a neighborhood, its got to have lots of convenient retail and service GFR. How about a Mediclinic somewhere in the neighborhood or a florist, doctor, dentist, barber, beauty salon, spa, galleries, bookstores, to name a few, and on and on and on. You get the picture. Someday they'll want the convenience of walking down the street instead of going to the parking garage, getting in their car, going down six levels and hopefully not get stuck in a line at crunch time, to merge into traffic

and  drive 10 blocks to midtown or Montrose to do anything like buy a lightbulb or get some hardware and then repeat the process.

Just remember that once its built, its there for a while. Like decades or centuries, so lets slow down and get it right this time.  It's kind of hard to retrofit a garage, if its not designed for GFR from the get go.............................................,................................................................................................................

 

 

Sorry, but I feel better now.

 

 

We could require GFR if we had zoning. Since we don't, we can't.

 

There is an easy way to guarantee GFR in every new development - make the GFR we have more profitable. Go out and spend your money. There is a lot of retail in the historic district sitting empty. If vacancy starts declining and rents start going up, future developments will include it.

 

[Sunstar]

On 7/14/2016 at 0:07 AM, bobruss said:

Not  parking garages full of people you hardly ever see on the streets except when they're waiting for their buses all qued up in neat little rows or sliding out of the parking garages, covering their eyes due to the bright object in the sky, they've forgotten was there.  

 

Good post. Not to be picky, but are they parking their cars in garages or taking the bus? 

[BeerNut]

12 hours ago, H-Town Man said:

 

We could require GFR if we had zoning. Since we don't, we can't.

 

There is an easy way to guarantee GFR in every new development - make the GFR we have more profitable. Go out and spend your money. There is a lot of retail in the historic district sitting empty. If vacancy starts declining and rents start going up, future developments will include it.

 

This is true but couldn't the city use property tax abatement and reductions to control GFR development.

[bobruss]

Sunstar, I know what your saying and I saw that after I had submitted but what can I say. It was late, I had pokemon people converging on my Menil neighborhood walking around like zombies with their iPhones lighting up the park and on my sidewalk until 12:00, and I was angry about the garage. I got my sentences confused and by the time I saw what I had done I said somehow the Haifers will understand my point. They all leave downtown without most of them ever poking their heads out of the tunnels or the buildings until they leave for the long drive home or on the bus.

[bobruss]

HTownman, I understand the dilemma, and I realize that there is vacant space available but I'm speaking to the future, and if people don't think ahead they will be behind. My point is that if they don't build out GFR in all of the new development where will people go to run errands, or shop or casually walk around the neighborhood with friends and window shop. You remember when people used to walk around town and window shop. Maybe your too young. People who want to live in a neighborhood downtown think they are going to have conveniences within walking distance. Thats the whole point of work, live, play environments, which I thought was the goal. To get people out of their cars. Look I know what Houston is and how it's developed around the car, but I thought we were trying to create a new urban downtown. That involves change and if the leasable spaces aren't available for hundreds of retail and service oriented businesses that will be attracted downtown in the future due to the demand when all of these projects start filling they won't have any place to put their shoe stores or Gaps or UPS or Verizon stores or the many many others. I've grown up here since 1954 and I know window-shopping in downtown. I know all about the no zoning issues and I understand  what your saying about zoning. What I'm saying is we need to change the system, fix it. They should have made it a requirement that every developer who got the TIRZ incentive $15,000.00 per unit break have GFR, and they didn't. Shame on them. Like I said in my rant. If you want to drive everywhere you can live in Sharpstown or Spring Branch but if you want downtown to really become what I thought was the goal a livable neighborhood your going to need the spaces. 

[cspwal]

21 minutes ago, bobruss said:

They should have made it a requirement that every developer who got the TIRZ incentive $15,000.00 per unit break have GFR, and they didn't.

 

I thought that there was a requirement that the building had to be built to at least accommodate it in the future - and the only ones I can think of that don't have GFR are Block 334 and the Hamilton, both of which look like they have a spot that could be converted to GFR.

 

If they didn't make it a requirement that was horribly short sighted.