Jump to content

Recommended Posts

One Park Place has an enclosed mechanical mansard roof design whereas this one looks flat. 

 

Have to compare the number of garage floors in each building.

 

Ground floor of One Park Place was built with luring a grocery store in mind whereas this one wont be as grand (almost certain).

 

As for comparisons to The Huntingdon, you just can't compare the two. The Huntingdon was built with multi-million dollar buyers in mind while this one will be a rental.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree. Hopefully the downtown incentives are enough to encourage them to build something downtown.

If not that, then the occupancy rates north of 90% should be a good lure.

 

Houston is going to need new 21,000 apartments a year for the next 5 to 10 years. Some of them are going to have to go downtown.

Edited by toxtethogrady
Link to comment
Share on other sites

just thinking "out loud":  if houston can produce 21,000 apartments in one year (last year 15,000, this year around 18,000), let's consider how we can quantify it.

 

5 200 unit apartment complexes (say the alexan midtown or the hanover southampton at rice village) per 1000; multiply 21 x 5 and you have 105 similar sized projects in and around the city.

 

or

 

3 333 unit apartment complexes per 1000; multiply by 21 and you have 63 projects.

 

if houston builds 18,000 as expected this year (or was it 2015? i don't remember....whenever)  a VERY inexact guess would be 50-90 decent sized multi-family projects would be required to bring 18000 units to market.

empty lots will continue to disappear as will substandard housing and single family homes in the high demand areas.  i wonder if there are any houston based reits we should be invested (do people still do reits?) i digress.

it's a little sad to see poor little delicious beck's prime left all by its lonesome.  the smell will be nice for residents.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I had heard there were 28,000 units under construction at the moment - including some in buildings like 2929 Weslayan that have been underway for almost two years. And the pace of construction of 4-, 5- and 6-story midrises appears to be accelerating, if anything.

 

But if one of those 30-story highrises has 300 units, it would take 60 of them to provide 18,000 units in a year. Imagine 300 new apartment towers in Houston by 2020. :blink:  Now imagine it's not enough to meet demand.  :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm sure Beck's is delicious (ive actually never ate at one before), but to me it's just another drive thru in an ocean of them in this town....I have zero sympathy lol.

 

Btw, when did it matter how tall this building was? I might get some flak for this, but seriously that's a little arbitrary guys and gals. I could care less whether it is 39 floors or 40 floors blah blah. It's a pretty good building. I mean I love to be a critic, but that's getting a bit nit picky!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

i wonder if there are any houston based reits we should be invested (do people still do reits?) i digress.

Nancy Sarnoff at the Chron asked a similar question and came up with:

 

AmREIT

Camden Property Trust

Weingarten

LGI Homes

Whitestone REIT

 

http://blog.chron.com/primeproperty/2014/08/stock-snapshot-houstons-publicly-traded-real-estate-companies/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I had heard there were 28,000 units under construction at the moment - including some in buildings like 2929 Weslayan that have been underway for almost two years. And the pace of construction of 4-, 5- and 6-story midrises appears to be accelerating, if anything.

 

But if one of those 30-story highrises has 300 units, it would take 60 of them to provide 18,000 units in a year. Imagine 300 new apartment towers in Houston by 2020. :blink:  Now imagine it's not enough to meet demand.  :)

 

according to the folks who document these things, houston will have constructed 18,000 new units this year.  if there are 10,000 more i'm sure the CRBE would like to know.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/houston/news/2014/08/22/demand-for-houston-apartments-is-at-an-all-time.html?page=2

i share your enthusiasm, however. whatever the number are, the building frenzy will not soon diminish.   i am curious as to how middle income people are supposed to live in the city.  not everyone can afford kirby or galleria highrises. all of this increased density is great, but if all of the low to middle income workers have to commute, density is for the well-off and traffic will continue to be an issue.  it will be an issue regardless, but middle income folks not having to commute helps, but that discussion is for another thread.

i hope the hanover river oaks makes pedestrian connectivity a priority.  if you simply drive in to your home and have little access to the street on foot, you reduce the possibility that developments like west avenue will succeed.  

i really like this tower.  i hope it CONNECTS well with its neighborhood.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

i am curious as to how middle income people are supposed to live in the city. 

It's becoming more and more of a problem, as highlighted by recent articles in various publications stating that Houston is getting more expensive and less affordable overall. That's quite a reversal from ten years ago, when Houston's attraction was its affordability.

 

And it's going to spread. The wards that used to have some of the cheapest real estate in town are now starting to attract a lot of gentrification (just ask the folks on the Northside, where Pegstar plans to put its new concert venue). The reaction of the middle and lower income population has been to move farther and farther out. The word is they can't develop lots fast enough to meet the demand for housing, and the demand for apartments absorbed 21,000 units in the past year. Houston is turning into New York.  

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's becoming more and more of a problem, as highlighted by recent articles in various publications stating that Houston is getting more expensive and less affordable overall. That's quite a reversal from ten years ago, when Houston's attraction was its affordability.

And it's going to spread. The wards that used to have some of the cheapest real estate in town are now starting to attract a lot of gentrification (just ask the folks on the Northside, where Pegstar plans to put its new concert venue). The reaction of the middle and lower income population has been to move farther and farther out. The word is they can't develop lots fast enough to meet the demand for housing, and the demand for apartments absorbed 21,000 units in the past year. Houston is turning into New York.

It does seem to be true nationwide.....

There is a shift going on. In the 1950s, the middle class and wealth parents of baby boomers left the city and the poor stayed behind. Baby boomers stayed in the burbs to raise their kids. Now, every boomer I know wants to live "in close" and, many of their their adult kids do too. Now, the poor are having to move further out.

In my opinion, the next two decades will tell the tale. This inward wealth migration may be a fad or may be a true shift. 20 years from now we will know.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It does seem to be true nationwide.....

There is a shift going on. In the 1950s, the middle class and wealth parents of baby boomers left the city and the poor stayed behind. Baby boomers stayed in the burbs to raise their kids. Now, every boomer I know wants to live "in close" and, many of their their adult kids do too. Now, the poor are having to move further out.

In my opinion, the next two decades will tell the tale. This inward wealth migration may be a fad or may be a true shift. 20 years from now we will know.

The shift would follow the pattern in some of the major European cities (e.g. London, Paris) where a wealthy core is surrounded by poorer suburbs.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Houston is way too big and has way too much empty space in the core to be getting this expensive. My biggest gripe is the loss of character in the near downtown neighborhoods. Wish there was someway to balance progress and history

Interesting point. But, do keep in mind that What is "expensive" in Houston remains, albeit less so, inexpensive compared to a number of other cities.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Houston is way too big and has way too much empty space in the core to be getting this expensive. My biggest gripe is the loss of character in the near downtown neighborhoods. Wish there was someway to balance progress and history

It seems it would also be too expensive to be running out of developable lots. But that seems to be the chief lament of the developers from Downtown to Conroe.

 

Not only that, but land and materials are getting expensive, and labor is in short supply.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It seems it would also be too expensive to be running out of developable lots. But that seems to be the chief lament of the developers from Downtown to Conroe.

Not only that, but land and materials are getting expensive, and labor is in short supply.

I can understand the slim pickings in labor and materials, but land???

There are so many undeveloped or underdeveloped land all over the place.

I can understand that speculators sit on land for ages, but this is the time to build. If they still don't sell when prices are so strong they are never going to sell

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can understand the slim pickings in labor and materials, but land???

There are so many undeveloped or underdeveloped land all over the place.

I can understand that speculators sit on land for ages, but this is the time to build. If they still don't sell when prices are so strong they are never going to sell

I agree, there is plenty of land, from downtown to the inner loop an beyond, undeveloped land is everywhere.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

One would think, but not everything out there is suitable. I see empty auto showrooms on the North Freeway, but nobody's in a hurry to redevelop them.

But that could change.

Actually a lot of the rundown spots on 45n are seeing new action. Its just that they are not concentrated so it doesn't really seem like anything is going on.

But I was mainly talking about the inner city. Downtown and the five or six miles to the south, east and north. Hmmm, that made me just think of something else, but I have derailed the thread enough.

I will get back to Hanover River Oaks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

according to the folks who document these things, houston will have constructed 18,000 new units this year.  if there are 10,000 more i'm sure the CRBE would like to know.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/houston/news/2014/08/22/demand-for-houston-apartments-is-at-an-all-time.html?page=2

i share your enthusiasm, however. whatever the number are, the building frenzy will not soon diminish.   i am curious as to how middle income people are supposed to live in the city.  not everyone can afford kirby or galleria highrises. all of this increased density is great, but if all of the low to middle income workers have to commute, density is for the well-off and traffic will continue to be an issue.  it will be an issue regardless, but middle income folks not having to commute helps, but that discussion is for another thread.

i hope the hanover river oaks makes pedestrian connectivity a priority.  if you simply drive in to your home and have little access to the street on foot, you reduce the possibility that developments like west avenue will succeed.  

i really like this tower.  i hope it CONNECTS well with its neighborhood.

 

There are still affordable places, they are just shifting. I think Westheimer, if nurtured properly, could become populated and offer an alternative to inside the loop. I have quite a few friends that live alongside or very close to Westheimer, there are lots of apartments especially at interesections like Fondren, HIllcroft, Gesnner, Wilcirest, Diary Ashford that were once lower income and now being refurbished for under 1000k per month for a 1 BR. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My biggest gripe is the loss of character in the near downtown neighborhoods. Wish there was someway to balance progress and history

 

Either deed restricted boundaries or a proactive and responsive local gov't entity (such as a particular arm of the City of Portland, OR) seem to be the only methods to grant neighborhoods the wherewithal to guide their own destiny.  Otherwise, citizens are at the mercy of private interests.  The stigma of government bloat and/or intrusion is palpable until the lack of gov't advocacy personally impacts the individual who previously accepts that tenet. 

Edited by nonenadazilch
Link to comment
Share on other sites

according to the folks who document these things, houston will have constructed 18,000 new units this year.  if there are 10,000 more i'm sure the CRBE would like to know.

 

Here's an update:

 

...Data from the Greater Houston Partnership also shows the the city of Houston hit another record in July for building permits issued. This includes a 27 percent increase for residential permits.

Under construction (red dots on map):

Projects: 85

Total units:23,781

Recently opened (Green on map):

Projects: 72

Total units: 19,923

Proposed Construction (yellow on map):

Projects: 61

Total units: 18,065...

 

http://blog.chron.com/primeproperty/2014/08/multifamily-construction-projects-spread-over-houston-region/#26279101=0

 

Edited by toxtethogrady
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

I think Hanover just got financing for their 3400 Montrose project. I'd expect lenders would want data about occupancy in their Post Oak project as well occupancy at some of the other highrises scheduled for delivery in the not-too-distant future before going ahead with this project. I am hopeful this will move forward in the coming years (given the quality of what Hanover has built in Rice Village)--once oil prices start to rise again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Ashley Rug Story closing sign, yes. The Interiors place on W. Alabama I have no clue why it is closing, but it might have to do with the recent announcement that the rest of those apartments on Steel street were to close by the end of the year. Is this that mystical phase 3 west ave? or is Hanover planning something else along with this tower??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Frankly, this city can't build residences fast enough. Unless oil prices are starting to take a dent out of demand, there are 22,000 rental units being absorbed a year, and 7,000 single family homes a quarter are disappearing. It takes a lot of homes and apartments to support 100,000 new jobs a year.

Edited by toxtethogrady
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree the city has need for new housing. However, I do wonder how much more luxury highrise development it can absorb.

 

many "luxury" apartments arent going to be counted as "luxury" after a decade. I know of quite a few buildings that were built in the past five years that are borderline nice now... And new construction inside the loop would be silly if they didnt go "luxury"... It just makes business sense to me that within the loop, more luxury units are built. There is a range. a 1,500 a month unit and a 3,5000 a month unit are likely both considered high end.

 

I still think we wont see a slow down...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Luxury is a very loosely used term now a days. Every new project going up is considered "Luxury" by the developers. It has become more of a standard term then a actuality. The true luxury properties will stay nice while the others will be low income or middle class. It's a cycle nothing new here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This project is almost definitely happening. All of the stores on the property have big red and yellow signs that say "CLOSING" or "GOING OUT OF BUSINESS" an d there's a fence around the back side of the property.

 

How many times in Houston have we seen apartments, houses, buildings and retail centers torn down in anticipation of a nice new highrise or mixed use development only to see nothing happen? I can think of pently off the top of my head.

 

With that being said, I hope that is not the case with this one and the Kirby Collection.

Edited by citykid09
Link to comment
Share on other sites

many "luxury" apartments arent going to be counted as "luxury" after a decade. I know of quite a few buildings that were built in the past five years that are borderline nice now... And new construction inside the loop would be silly if they didnt go "luxury"... It just makes business sense to me that within the loop, more luxury units are built. There is a range. a 1,500 a month unit and a 3,5000 a month unit are likely both considered high end.

 

I still think we wont see a slow down...

Luxury or not, $1,500/month for a one or two-bedroom apartment is a lot of money for most people.

 

Our living standards in the US are so high. Luxury is very common these days. Everyone has granite counter tops these days, anyone can get hardwood or laminate flooring. Luxury has almost become the norm.

 

Twenty years ago, all these luxury apartments that people don't like to consider luxurious now would have been back then. 

 

I understand there is still another level luxury, but these "so called" luxury places people are trying to downplay are still very very nice.

 

Plus, I think the locations themselves are propping them up to luxurious status - that's part of it.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

How many times in Houston have we seen apartments, houses, buildings and retail centers torn down in anticipation of a nice new highrise or mixed use development only to see nothing happen? I can think of pently off the top of my head.

With that being said, I hope that is not the case with this one and the Kirby Collection.

At least it wouldn't be as bad as what Crescent did to downtown in anticipation of building "Houston Center".

What a massive kick in the balls THAT was, a travesty really.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...