Baker Hughes Headquarters

[fernz]

I don't believe townships exist in Texas. Perhaps up in the northern or eastern US.

https://www.thewoodlandstownship-tx.gov

[fernz]

https://www.thewoodlandstownship-tx.gov

It's faster to google "woodlands township" than if is to write your post...

[H-Town Man]

I have been reading this site for years and have decided to join so I could share a story with you.

 

Many, many years ago I was at a local play in Katy when a realtor told us how frustrated she was at Exxon. She then told us how she had taken several top level executive wives all over Houston to show them the best neighborhoods. At this time the Woodlands was in its infancy and Kingwood, Clearlake, Memorial and of course River Oaks was the in locations. (Cinco Ranch and most of Sugarland was rice farms)The wives of Exxon were checking out relocation sites from a family (VIP) viewpoint. They were checking out cities across the U.S.. Exxon was still HQ in the NE.

 

What upset the realtor so much was after taking them everywhere, one of the wives asked

"is this it?"

Another says before the realtor can answer. "This must be the armpit of Texas".

 

So, they moved the HQ to Irving?

Why?

Security, convenience and culture. Exxon has a world class security department and anyone who has seen the corporate facilities at Irving with vouch for that. Exxon also seeks out secure (at best as possible) communities for its highest level employees.

 

Just drive through the Woodlands and the Irving, Grapevine, etc. area and you will see similar cultural areas. The drive from Houston airports to DT are neither scenic nor highly safe (from a corporate security viewpoint.)

When they are fully relocated in the Woodlands they can leave Irving to the private or corporate airport (most probably do not use DFW), arrive at Houston Intercontinental and take a very short drive N. to the new facilities.

 

Thus, improved perceived and real security, convenience and neighborhoods/demographics that meet their goals.

 

Oh, and they also are close to that all important International Airports. Or in case of the Exxon Wives, just minutes from Vail, Paris, N.Y. City, etc.

 

 

So they didn't like Memorial or they didn't like the drive in from the airport? Can't imagine someone thinking this is the "armpit of Texas" after seeing Memorial, let alone River Oaks. And can't imagine anyone picking the beige neighborhoods of Dallas over the Memorial area - maybe the Park Cities which is basically a draw, but not Preston Hollow and certainly not anything else.

[Ross]

Ah, so since this is outside of the Woodlands and Houston city limits, then this area does have lower taxes?

 

Let's take a look, shall we. Here's the list of taxing entities for the Southwestern Energy property, plus their 2012 and 2013 rates:

 

024 SPRING ISD Certified: 08/09/2013 1.570000 1.570000 View

040 HARRIS COUNTY Certified: 08/09/2013 0.400210 0.414550 View

041 HARRIS CO FLOOD CNTRL Certified: 08/09/2013 0.028090 0.028270  

042 PORT OF HOUSTON AUTHY Certified: 08/09/2013 0.019520 0.017160  

043 HARRIS CO HOSP DIST Certified: 08/09/2013 0.182160 0.170000  

044 HARRIS CO EDUC DEPT Certified: 08/09/2013 0.006617 0.006358  

045 LONE STAR COLLEGE SYS Certified: 08/09/2013 0.119800 0.116000  

178 HC ID 18 Certified: 08/09/2013 1.500000 1.500000  

550 HC EMERG SRV DIST 7 Certified: 08/09/2013 0.082400 0.080900  

666 HC EMERG SERV DIST 11 Certified: 08/09/2013 0.030000 0.047500

 

Here's the list for a downtown Houston property:

001 HOUSTON ISD Certified: 08/09/2013 1.156700 1.186700 View

040 HARRIS COUNTY Certified: 08/09/2013 0.400210 0.414550 View

041 HARRIS CO FLOOD CNTRL Certified: 08/09/2013 0.028090 0.028270  

042 PORT OF HOUSTON AUTHY Certified: 08/09/2013 0.019520 0.017160  

043 HARRIS CO HOSP DIST Certified: 08/09/2013 0.182160 0.170000  

044 HARRIS CO EDUC DEPT Certified: 08/09/2013 0.006617 0.006358  

048 HOU COMMUNITY COLLEGE Certified: 08/09/2013 0.097173 0.097173  

061 CITY OF HOUSTON Certified: 08/09/2013 0.638750 0.638750  

265 HOUSTON D'TOWN MGMT D Certified: 08/09/2013 0.135000 0.135000  

 

A little math shows the total rate for the campus to be 3.950738, while the City of Houston is 2.693961. The improvement district rate is pretty high, and Spring ISD's rate is almost 40 cents higher. I would say that there's no property tax benefit to moving out there.

 

[LTAWACS]

It's faster to google "woodlands township" than if is to write your post...

You linked us to a page maintained by the wood lands. They will tell u anything to make themselves sound lile they're their own "towne". Anything that borders the benign to get u to move out there.

Anything.

After all... when these companies start laying off (10,000 at a time)... it's not their bottom line that takes the hit.

[livincinco]

Anything.

After all... when these companies start laying off (10,000 at a time)... it's not their bottom line that takes the hit.

The Texas legislature also agrees that The Woodlands is a township. Not sure what your comment about layoffs is relevant to though. Last time I checked, layoffs are not exclusive to companies that are located in The Woodlands.

http://www.lrl.state.tx.us/legis/BillSearch/BillDetails.cfm?billFileID=187388&from=advancedsearch&startrow=1&number=50&IDlist=&unclickList=

[Houston19514]

I have been reading this site for years and have decided to join so I could share a story with you.

 

Many, many years ago I was at a local play in Katy when a realtor told us how frustrated she was at Exxon. She then told us how she had taken several top level executive wives all over Houston to show them the best neighborhoods. At this time the Woodlands was in its infancy and Kingwood, Clearlake, Memorial and of course River Oaks was the in locations. (Cinco Ranch and most of Sugarland was rice farms)The wives of Exxon were checking out relocation sites from a family (VIP) viewpoint. They were checking out cities across the U.S.. Exxon was still HQ in the NE.

 

What upset the realtor so much was after taking them everywhere, one of the wives asked

"is this it?"

Another says before the realtor can answer. "This must be the armpit of Texas".

 

So, they moved the HQ to Irving?

Why?

Security, convenience and culture. Exxon has a world class security department and anyone who has seen the corporate facilities at Irving with vouch for that. Exxon also seeks out secure (at best as possible) communities for its highest level employees.

 

Just drive through the Woodlands and the Irving, Grapevine, etc. area and you will see similar cultural areas. The drive from Houston airports to DT are neither scenic nor highly safe (from a corporate security viewpoint.)

When they are fully relocated in the Woodlands they can leave Irving to the private or corporate airport (most probably do not use DFW), arrive at Houston Intercontinental and take a very short drive N. to the new facilities.

 

Thus, improved perceived and real security, convenience and neighborhoods/demographics that meet their goals.

 

Oh, and they also are close to that all important International Airports. Or in case of the Exxon Wives, just minutes from Vail, Paris, N.Y. City, etc.

 

I think the Katy realtor was spinning her own Houston self-loathing.  At the time of the relocation of the Exxon headquarters to Irving, the people at Friendswood Development (who were in charge of searching for the new HQ location, stated that, much to their chagrin, Houston was never even considered because the #1 criteria for their HQ location was that it not be in a city where Exxon had significant operations.  That obviously left Houston out of the contest.  (Much like Boeing's HQ relocation a few years ago.)

 

Houston was not considered for Exxon's new corporate headquarters because executives decided it should not be in the same location as one of the company's major operating divisions, said John Walsh, president of Friendswood Development Co., the Exxon subsidiary in Houston that handled the site search.

Exxon officials believed the presence of the corporate headquarters could erode the autonomy and independence of the division headquarters if it were located right next door,Walsh said. "They made the decision early on they did not want to locate near one of their operating groups," he said.

http://www.chron.com/CDA/archives/ar...id=1989_659330

[fernz]

The Texas legislature also agrees that The Woodlands is a township. Not sure what your comment about layoffs is relevant to though. Last time I checked, layoffs are not exclusive to companies that are located in The Woodlands.

http://www.lrl.state.tx.us/legis/BillSearch/BillDetails.cfm?billFileID=187388&from=advancedsearch&startrow=1&number=50&IDlist=&unclickList=

You linked us to a page maintained by the texas legis lature. They will tell u anything to make themselves sound like they agree the wood lands is a township

[LTAWACS]

You linked us to a page maintained by the texas legis lature. They will tell u anything to make themselves sound like they agree the wood lands is a township

Funny. I was under the impression that "township " was not a legal entity or legally defined in the state of Texas the way they are in other states.

I checked and was not able to find any concrete legal definition of "township" in Texas. I found lists of townships and census districts and "special zones" but nothing regarding "townships".

Perhaps someone else here knows?

[cocorobert]

That was approximately 30 year ago when the realtor told us that story. She was visibly upset and I find it hard to believe it was fabricated.  I also heard the Friendswood Development story. Many corporate decisions have several options before a path is chosen.

 

Exxon like Fluor and other Dallas based corporations enjoy the demographics on Frisco, Allen, Grapevine, Carrollton, Irving, etc. offer for their CEO's, executive staff, IT and accounting, etc..  While keeping their bulk of employees (engineers, production, refining, exploration, R&D, etc.) in Houston.

 

The Woodlands offers a competitive demographic environment to the above cities and attracts support companies like CB&I and smaller companies corporate HQ's like Anadarko and Southern Gas.

 

Another funny story told to me from a boss whose father was a VP for a Dallas based Oil Company.

A large global oil company was based in Los Angles when the CEO retired and replaced by a CEO who lived in Dallas. The new CEO had a 49 story building built in Dallas and upon completion he worked out of the new building with everyone else moving to Dallas. A few years later the CEO left the company and started his own. The Global company then got a new CEO who was from California and they began construction on a new world HQ in the San Francisco area.  Upon completion they vacated the Dallas building and relocated everyone to the San Francisco area.

 

Moral of story, surprisingly more often than people imagine, corporate HQ's follow CEO's, especially if the space needed is within reason. So, do you really believe that Chevron will leave San Ramon?

If a new CEO is installed and he lives or is from Houston, maybe. If not, no.

[LTAWACS]

Interesting ... was there not a global energy company from Houston (I think) who's CEO relocated to Dubai.

When interviewed I think he mentioned that while he was officing from Dubai - the HQ was still in Houston.

[LTAWACS]

That was approximately 30 year ago when the realtor told us that story. She was visibly upset and I find it hard to believe it was fabricated. I also heard the Friendswood Development story. Many corporate decisions have several options before a path is chose.

I appreciate your insight, unique viewpoint, and what appears to be a great deal of experience, however, realtors are usually not the sharpest tool in the shed - if you know what I mean.

[Marcus Allen]

What I find interesting (to be read appalling), is that for mere whimsy these corporate powerhouses spend millions to relocate only because of the CEOs preference? That's just asinine. Guess who ultimately eats that cost? You and I, the common folk, as usual. Reminds me of when major oil corporate heads were demanded to appear before congress to explain their stellar profiteering during some of the US's dire most economic troubles, and the bastards used private jets to travel to DC. I understand moving to a different location due to economic reasons (lower tax rates, attrition movement, etc), but because the CEO feels more comfortable in his home town. Sheesh!

[Ross]

What I find interesting (to be read appalling), is that for mere whimsy these corporate powerhouses spend millions to relocate only because of the CEOs preference? That's just asinine. Guess who ultimately eats that cost? You and I, the common folk, as usual. Reminds me of when major oil corporate heads were demanded to appear before congress to explain their stellar profiteering during some of the US's dire most economic troubles, and the bastards used private jets to travel to DC. I understand moving to a different location due to economic reasons (lower tax rates, attrition movement, etc), but because the CEO feels more comfortable in his home town. Sheesh!

 

That sounds more like when the CEO's of car companies wanting a bail out flew to DC in private jets. most CEO's from companies of any size use private jets because it maximizes the efficient use of thier time, and provides better security, both personal and corporate.

 

[Marcus Allen]

Was it car companies? Sorry, my mistake. Yes, I definitely understand the efficiency part, BUT, I would think when I am put on the national stage to explain an implied bilking of the system, I would at least have the foreknowledge to give the impression of hat in hand, not corporate superiority. I suppose that was my point.

[Montrose1100]

At nearly 500,000sqft, will this building top 20 or so floors? or will it be spread out like the neighbor to the north?

[DNAguy]

@L

See this:

http://www.thewoodlandstownship-tx.gov/DocumentCenter/Home/View/943

 

If my understanding of the situation is right, the legislature gave The Woodlands a special status back in 1993. That's when they created the Town Center Improvement District of Montgomery County. This has become what we now call The Woodlands Township and is the only community in the state of Texas with such a quasi government status. It was in response to Kingwood's annexation and I think part of the legislation created to make annexation more difficult as a result of the said annexation. As I understand it, this prevented Houston from annexing The Woodlands and put in place some mileposts for The Woodlands city status self determination. The Woodlands gets to levy some taxes for certain things from a board that isn't elected, but also gets to rely on the county for other services like police and fire as an unincorporated are of the county would. Like I said earlier, it can't be annexed by Houston.

That's why most ppl voted last year to keep things the same b/c they get the best of both worlds, taxing authority without having to provide any services. It's cheaper than being a city which would have to tax to provide the services.

I hope this was all correct and helps with some of the confusion. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

[LTAWACS]

So it's not really a "town" but rather a special zone of sorts and they (locals, residents, people who deal with or in this zone, etc) added "township" as part of the name of the zone. Is this correct?

[DNAguy]

So it's not really a "town" but rather a special zone of sorts and they (locals, residents, people who deal with or in this zone, etc) added "township" as part of the name of the zone. Is this correct?

 

From my understanding, I would say you're correct. The state of Texas has carved out a special zone within Montgomery county that has some privileges of a city, but also operates as an unincorporated area.

 

It seems like it kind of operates like a TIRZ in a way, with some large differences of course.

 

Here's some more info that I found from the Woodlands website that you might find interesting:

https://www.thewoodlandstownship-tx.gov/index.aspx?NID=743

http://www.thewoodlandstownship-tx.gov/index.aspx?nid=331

 

Map of the Woodlands Township boundaries:

http://www.thewoodlandstownship-tx.gov/DocumentCenter/Home/View/149

http://www.thewoodlandstownship-tx.gov/DocumentCenter/View/1188

http://tx-thewoodlandstownship2.civicplus.com/DocumentCenter/Home/View/127

[Houston19514]

That was approximately 30 year ago when the realtor told us that story. She was visibly upset and I find it hard to believe it was fabricated.  I also heard the Friendswood Development story. Many corporate decisions have several options before a path is chosen.

 

Exxon like Fluor and other Dallas based corporations enjoy the demographics on Frisco, Allen, Grapevine, Carrollton, Irving, etc. offer for their CEO's, executive staff, IT and accounting, etc..  While keeping their bulk of employees (engineers, production, refining, exploration, R&D, etc.) in Houston.

 

The Woodlands offers a competitive demographic environment to the above cities and attracts support companies like CB&I and smaller companies corporate HQ's like Anadarko and Southern Gas.

 

Another funny story told to me from a boss whose father was a VP for a Dallas based Oil Company.

A large global oil company was based in Los Angles when the CEO retired and replaced by a CEO who lived in Dallas. The new CEO had a 49 story building built in Dallas and upon completion he worked out of the new building with everyone else moving to Dallas. A few years later the CEO left the company and started his own. The Global company then got a new CEO who was from California and they began construction on a new world HQ in the San Francisco area.  Upon completion they vacated the Dallas building and relocated everyone to the San Francisco area.

 

Moral of story, surprisingly more often than people imagine, corporate HQ's follow CEO's, especially if the space needed is within reason. So, do you really believe that Chevron will leave San Ramon?

If a new CEO is installed and he lives or is from Houston, maybe. If not, no.

 

 

What I find interesting (to be read appalling), is that for mere whimsy these corporate powerhouses spend millions to relocate only because of the CEOs preference? That's just asinine. Guess who ultimately eats that cost? You and I, the common folk, as usual. Reminds me of when major oil corporate heads were demanded to appear before congress to explain their stellar profiteering during some of the US's dire most economic troubles, and the bastards used private jets to travel to DC. I understand moving to a different location due to economic reasons (lower tax rates, attrition movement, etc), but because the CEO feels more comfortable in his home town. Sheesh!

 

Before we get any more carried away, it might be time to interject some reality.

 

1.  Exxon.  cocorobert tells that the realtor told him approximately 30 years ago that some Exxon wives whined about being relocated to Houston.  That seems possible, as Exxon was at about that time in the process of reducing their ranks in their Manhattan HQ from 2,000+ to only 300.  Many of those relocated people were relocated to Houston.  It's possible some of the wives whined about the relocation.  That much of the story seems plausible. What is not true, is that it had anything to do with the decision of where to relocation the HQ, which occurred 24 years ago.  (And it seems entirely plausible that some DFW real estate agents have the same sort of stories from relocated Exxon wives.)

 

2. "another funny story"  As with most rumors and "stories related to me by a person I once knew whose father was once upon a time a [fill-in-the-blank] at [fill-in-the-blank]", there might be a kernel of truth in there somewhere.  But the only company this could possibly be describing is Arco. Arco never moved its headquarters to Dallas and Arco never moved its headquarters from Dallas to San Francisco.  Dallas (and the 49-story Arco building) was home to Arco Oil & Gas E&P.  When it left Dallas, it did not move to San Francisco or California.  The largest number of relocated employees came to Houston.

 

Moral of story, surprisingly more often than people imagine, people believe silly rumors and stories even though there is plenty of evidence to the contrary  ;-)

[mollusk]

Having grown up with the spawn of many major oil company employees relocated here from metropolitan NYC by Humble and then Shell, I can personally attest to the amount of whining that went on.  Houston was a much, much different city 30 years ago, having more in common with Tulsa than with any large city on either the east or west coasts - as just one example, Go Texan Day for the Rodeo was a school holiday (so that we could watch the trail riders come in).

[Houston19514]

Having grown up with the spawn of many major oil company employees relocated here from metropolitan NYC by Humble and then Shell, I can personally attest to the amount of whining that went on.  Houston was a much, much different city 30 years ago, having more in common with Tulsa than with any large city on either the east or west coasts - as just one example, Go Texan Day for the Rodeo was a school holiday (so that we could watch the trail riders come in).

 

No doubt.  Quite right about Houston being a much different city; although comparing it to Tulsa might be a little much... 50 years ago, maybe, not so much 30 years ago... but excellent point.

[mollusk]

^ Egad, you're right.  I'm having trouble grasping that 1984 is now 30 years ago.  The place in time I had in mind was really a bit over 40 years ago, now that you've made me do the math.

[mkultra25]

What I find interesting (to be read appalling), is that for mere whimsy these corporate powerhouses spend millions to relocate only because of the CEOs preference? That's just asinine. 

 

Modern corporate life is in many respects very much like high school, but with a lot more money involved. 

[H-Town Man]

That was approximately 30 year ago when the realtor told us that story. She was visibly upset and I find it hard to believe it was fabricated.  I also heard the Friendswood Development story. Many corporate decisions have several options before a path is chosen.

 

Exxon like Fluor and other Dallas based corporations enjoy the demographics on Frisco, Allen, Grapevine, Carrollton, Irving, etc. offer for their CEO's, executive staff, IT and accounting, etc..  While keeping their bulk of employees (engineers, production, refining, exploration, R&D, etc.) in Houston.

 

The Woodlands offers a competitive demographic environment to the above cities and attracts support companies like CB&I and smaller companies corporate HQ's like Anadarko and Southern Gas.

 

Another funny story told to me from a boss whose father was a VP for a Dallas based Oil Company.

A large global oil company was based in Los Angles when the CEO retired and replaced by a CEO who lived in Dallas. The new CEO had a 49 story building built in Dallas and upon completion he worked out of the new building with everyone else moving to Dallas. A few years later the CEO left the company and started his own. The Global company then got a new CEO who was from California and they began construction on a new world HQ in the San Francisco area.  Upon completion they vacated the Dallas building and relocated everyone to the San Francisco area.

 

Moral of story, surprisingly more often than people imagine, corporate HQ's follow CEO's, especially if the space needed is within reason. So, do you really believe that Chevron will leave San Ramon?

If a new CEO is installed and he lives or is from Houston, maybe. If not, no.

 

By "demographic," do you mean white skin?  That's the only way I can make sense out of your second and third paragraphs.  Not accusing you, just wondering what other demographic there is that makes Frisco, Allen, Grapevine, etc. more attractive than Houston's burbs.

 

You make it sound like it's the in thing among Texas corporations to put their workforces in Houston while the execs hang out in Dallas and enjoy its incomparable demographics.  Odd then that Houston has more Fortune 500's than Dallas does.  I wonder why Halliburton took the demographic plunge, as it were, and moved from Dallas to Houston?

[H-Town Man]

Having grown up with the spawn of many major oil company employees relocated here from metropolitan NYC by Humble and then Shell, I can personally attest to the amount of whining that went on.  Houston was a much, much different city 30 years ago, having more in common with Tulsa than with any large city on either the east or west coasts - as just one example, Go Texan Day for the Rodeo was a school holiday (so that we could watch the trail riders come in).

 

If we stopped having Go Texan Day as a school holiday so we could satisfy a bunch of whiny transplanted Yankees, I'm going to be very upset.

[LTAWACS]

If we stopped having Go Texan Day as a school holiday so we could satisfy a bunch of whiny transplanted Yankees, I'm going to be very upset.

I think you're several years too late. Afaik this hasn't been a school holiday for some time now.

[Trae]

By "demographic," do you mean white skin? That's the only way I can make sense out of your second and third paragraphs. Not accusing you, just wondering what other demographic there is that makes Frisco, Allen, Grapevine, etc. more attractive than Houston's burbs.

You make it sound like it's the in thing among Texas corporations to put their workforces in Houston while the execs hang out in Dallas and enjoy its incomparable demographics. Odd then that Houston has more Fortune 500's than Dallas does. I wonder why Halliburton took the demographic plunge, as it were, and moved from Dallas to Houston?

DFW suburbs are pretty well done. In Houston, you have nice ones like The Woodlands, but then the hodge podge nature of unincorporated Spring is just south of the town center. Katy is nice, but even the nicer parts in South Katy, outside of th mastr plannd communities are all random neighborhoods without much planning between them. And Houston has nice suburbs all around it. From downtown Dallas between the tollway and 75 for the next forty miles is nice suburb after nice suburb, for the most part, especially north of 635. Go from Richardson to Plano, to Allen, to McKinney. Then moving west you get to Frisco. North of Frisco there is Prosper. South you are back into Plano. These are like giant Sugar Lands or Cinco Ranches are next to each other. And there are a bunch of smaller suburbs like Murphy and Fairview around there. All of them have better planning than most Houston suburbs. Only sugar land, missour city, and other suburbs that are their own city come close.

[H-Town Man]

I think you're several years too late. Afaik this hasn't been a school holiday for some time now.

 

That's why I wrote it in the past tense. "If we stopped"...i.e., if that was our reason for stopping it when we did.

 

DFW suburbs are pretty well done. In Houston, you have nice ones like The Woodlands, but then the hodge podge nature of unincorporated Spring is just south of the town center. Katy is nice, but even the nicer parts in South Katy, outside of th mastr plannd communities are all random neighborhoods without much planning between them. And Houston has nice suburbs all around it. From downtown Dallas between the tollway and 75 for the next forty miles is nice suburb after nice suburb, for the most part, especially north of 635. Go from Richardson to Plano, to Allen, to McKinney. Then moving west you get to Frisco. North of Frisco there is Prosper. South you are back into Plano. These are like giant Sugar Lands or Cinco Ranches are next to each other. And there are a bunch of smaller suburbs like Murphy and Fairview around there. All of them have better planning than most Houston suburbs. Only sugar land, missour city, and other suburbs that are their own city come close.

 

That's not "demographic," that's planning.  Cocorobert was talking about the demographics of Dallas suburbs.

 

[Trae]

It goes together though because all of that planning keeps certain demographics out. Look at Prosper and their residential lot requirements. there is a lot of wealth concentretated in that far north Dallas county/Collin county area.