IronTiger Posted April 16, 2015 Share Posted April 16, 2015 We're not getting into an argument over highways, and if we're arguing that the HSR should be taxpayer subsidized, then congratulations, you just gave the opposition a valid reason to fight back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 Well this was interesting... http://www.dallasnews.com/news/metro/20150417-dart-lobbyist-drops-anti-high-speed-rail-work-after-questions-are-raised.ece Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADCS Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 Well this was interesting... http://www.dallasnews.com/news/metro/20150417-dart-lobbyist-drops-anti-high-speed-rail-work-after-questions-are-raised.ece Now that's a fun game of connect-the-dots - go back the past couple of weeks and see where all the anti-rail articles and noise were coming from, and there you will have a list of Graydon's media contacts. The anti-rail side did get a lot of press relative to numbers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 Now that's a fun game of connect-the-dots - go back the past couple of weeks and see where all the anti-rail articles and noise were coming from, and there you will have a list of Graydon's media contacts. The anti-rail side did get a lot of press relative to numbers. I was wondering why their "movement" grew so quickly. They had a direct link to City government officials with this lobbying firm and I have no doubt that with their status in Austin were able to persuade some in the leadership to introduce this latest series of bills. I can't really blame the Anti-Rail group for utilizing this tool. It was a smart move on their part. No matter what the president of the Anti-Rail organization thinks this is a pretty significant blow. I have no doubt they will find another way into the conversation, but when they start analyzing the genesis of these new bills I think this firm will be the first in many conflicts of interest. Once again as long as they remain a entirely private company TCR is bullet proof. I'm very interested in how this moves forward and will definitely bring a question about this in the Cypress meeting this Thursday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADCS Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 I was wondering why their "movement" grew so quickly. They had a direct link to City government officials with this lobbying firm and I have no doubt that with their status in Austin were able to persuade some in the leadership to introduce this latest series of bills. I can't really blame the Anti-Rail group for utilizing this tool. It was a smart move on their part. No matter what the president of the Anti-Rail organization thinks this is a pretty significant blow. I have no doubt they will find another way into the conversation, but when they start analyzing the genesis of these new bills I think this firm will be the first in many conflicts of interest. Once again as long as they remain a entirely private company TCR is bullet proof. I'm very interested in how this moves forward and will definitely bring a question about this in the Cypress meeting this Thursday. Here's another interesting editorial from the DMN: http://www.dallasnews.com/news/columnists/steve-blow/20150418-blow-high-speed-train-foes-on-wrong-track.ece Hope to be there on Thursday too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 Here's another interesting editorial from the DMN: http://www.dallasnews.com/news/columnists/steve-blow/20150418-blow-high-speed-train-foes-on-wrong-track.ece Hope to be there on Thursday too. Wow. Thats probably the first article I have read yet that has gotten the issue correct! Very well done! More of this is greatly needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADCS Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 Wow. Thats probably the first article I have read yet that has gotten the issue correct! Very well done! More of this is greatly needed. Ask and you shall receive: http://www.citylab.com/politics/2015/04/debunking-5-myths-about-texas-high-speed-rail/390903/ TCR apparently sees its moment with the Graydon thing, and is starting its PR blitz. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Seems the Dallas Morning News is hitting this with full force. Another editorial I found: http://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/editorials/20150420-editorial-senate-dont-block-texas-bullet-train.ece Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxConcrete Posted April 21, 2015 Author Share Posted April 21, 2015 BusinessWeek posted an article about the next generation of Japanese bullet trains using MagLev tecnology, currently under construction between Tokyo and Nagoya scheduled for operation in 2027 http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-04-21/world-s-fastest-train-records-speed-of-603-kilometers-per-hour "Japan is looking for an overseas customer for maglev technology as the country works toward opening its first major line. Prime Minister Shinzo Abe has said the government may provide financing to support Central Japan Railway Co.’s bid to provide trains for a Washington-Baltimore line." The article says the 286-kilometer (179 mile) Tokyo-Nagoya route has a cost of $47 billion to build. That cost is probably easily justified by the huge customer base for that route. Trains will run at 500 km/h (313 mph). The conventional train proposed for Houston-Dallas is reported to run at 200 mph.Scaling the Tokyo-Nagoya cost to the Houston-Dallas distance, it is around $63 billion. Surely that cost is vastly more than the Houston-Dallas corridor could support. But if Houston-Dallas moves forward, it would be a bummer to some other place in the U.S. get maglev. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie21love Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 BusinessWeek posted an article about the next generation of Japanese bullet trains using MagLev tecnology, currently under construction between Tokyo and Nagoya scheduled for operation in 2027 http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-04-21/world-s-fastest-train-records-speed-of-603-kilometers-per-hour "Japan is looking for an overseas customer for maglev technology as the country works toward opening its first major line. Prime Minister Shinzo Abe has said the government may provide financing to support Central Japan Railway Co.’s bid to provide trains for a Washington-Baltimore line." The article says the 286-kilometer (179 mile) Tokyo-Nagoya route has a cost of $47 billion to build. That cost is probably easily justified by the huge customer base for that route. Trains will run at 500 km/h (313 mph). The conventional train proposed for Houston-Dallas is reported to run at 200 mph.Scaling the Tokyo-Nagoya cost to the Houston-Dallas distance, it is around $63 billion. Surely that cost is vastly more than the Houston-Dallas corridor could support. But if Houston-Dallas moves forward, it would be a bummer to some other place in the U.S. get maglev. I agree High Speed Maglev is way too much expensive. I think currently the only operating High Speed Maglev is a 20 miles airport connector in Shanghai. Many new proposals have been made in the past decade but the huge cost is surely a big issue, especially a line connecting two cities. If we could have it by any chance I think the cost should be lower considering the easy construction in the corridor... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DNAguy Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Saw this:http://blog.chron.com/primeproperty/2015/04/northwest-mall-trading-hands/ Had thought:"Could this secret buyer be TCR buying the site for their Houston rail station?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cspwal Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Hope not. It would be much better if they get the downtown post office site 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADCS Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Saw this:http://blog.chron.com/primeproperty/2015/04/northwest-mall-trading-hands/ Had thought:"Could this secret buyer be TCR buying the site for their Houston rail station?" Perhaps it's kept secret to be held as a hedge in case the Grand Central/Post Office site falls through. It would strengthen the position of those opposed to that site to know that TCR already has holdings at the NW Mall site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Why does it have to be TCR? Why can't it be a developer that they are going to work with or some sort of real estate firm they will work with and not TCR outright? Thats a possibility too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie21love Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Why does it have to be TCR? Why can't it be a developer that they are going to work with or some sort of real estate firm they will work with and not TCR outright? Thats a possibility too.Good point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston19514 Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 BusinessWeek posted an article about the next generation of Japanese bullet trains using MagLev tecnology, currently under construction between Tokyo and Nagoya scheduled for operation in 2027 http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-04-21/world-s-fastest-train-records-speed-of-603-kilometers-per-hour "Japan is looking for an overseas customer for maglev technology as the country works toward opening its first major line. Prime Minister Shinzo Abe has said the government may provide financing to support Central Japan Railway Co.’s bid to provide trains for a Washington-Baltimore line." The article says the 286-kilometer (179 mile) Tokyo-Nagoya route has a cost of $47 billion to build. That cost is probably easily justified by the huge customer base for that route. Trains will run at 500 km/h (313 mph). The conventional train proposed for Houston-Dallas is reported to run at 200 mph.Scaling the Tokyo-Nagoya cost to the Houston-Dallas distance, it is around $63 billion. Surely that cost is vastly more than the Houston-Dallas corridor could support. But if Houston-Dallas moves forward, it would be a bummer to some other place in the U.S. get maglev. The linked article does not say that the Tokyo-Nagoya maglev is currently under construction. It only says that Japan "has plans to build" maglev from Tokyo to Nagoya and Osaka (and given the 2027 completion date, one hopes it is not actually already under construction). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 So I went to the meeting and......nothing much going on. It was open house format with TCR reps at various stations answering questions. I'll post some very very poor pics from my phone of some close ups of the line approaching Harris County. Not a lot of new information that I found, but for the people that were there it will be helpful I will say. Speaking of the people who were there, I was probably the youngest person there by 20 years! Not even joking lol. Did ask one of the reps, who BigSocks, Mollusk, and myself meet a couple months ago, about the current legislation being brought up. While he couldn't really discuss anything. He said that they were pretty confident that they will get through it all. Anyway, that was about it. Wish I had a lot of new info to tell, but really it was the same stuff we have been talking about and have known about for a bit. So it was mostly for people who don't really hangout on the internet a lot Oh well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADCS Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 I was there too, and I got some good information, but mostly based on what went unsaid. Also, I don't think I'm 20 years older than you, unless you're 10 For one, I'm fully expecting the station to be at the NW Mall site, even though I've been, and still remain a big Downtown station supporter. Secondly, even if the eminent domain bill goes through, it's not the end of the world, and that's all I'll say about that. Third, there are a lot of people who are extremely unfamiliar with trains, and immediately expect the worst. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxConcrete Posted April 24, 2015 Author Share Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) Here's one more report from the meeting yesterday at Tin Hall in Cypress. There were many handouts available titled "Reality: ..." which presented information to dispel myths which appear to be common or rampant in rural areas, perhaps due to misinformation spread by project opponents. These myths included: the train is extremely loud, an myth fostered by online videos which jack up the volumes; that the project is seeking government funds; that TCP (Texas Central Partners) supports a national high speed rail network (they are interested only in Dallas-Houston); that the project will require a massive rights-of-way (reality is that it is 100 feet wide or less); that private landowners will get screwed; that the train will reduce or eliminate local access; and that TCP is a foreign-controlled effort. There were some anti-project individuals who had some attitude and took a disproportionate share of the representatives time. I'm thinking that situation is typical and much worse in the rural areas. Robert Eckels was there and was willing/eager to talk to anyone and everyone, including project opponents. I did not speak to him. I spoke to two reps and eavesdropped on conversations with a third rep. Some reps may be more "in-the-know" than others, and you don't always get exactly the same response for an issue. Station location:One rep said they expect/hope to have a decision by the end of the year. Another rep who seemed more in-the-know said there is no timetable for a decision and a decision will be made when they have all the information needed. That rep said most likely the draft EIS will need to be complete because the EIS will outline the measures and mitigations needed to bring the route downtown, and then the cost will be assessed. Going downtown will be a business decision, not a political decision, he said. I mentioned to the rep that readily-available information suggests it will cost at least $750 million to go from Northwest Mall to downtown, and the rep then became very animated and said something like "Oh yeah, it will cost WAY more than that." But when I asked him about the estimated cost, he would not give a number. I overheard another rep who said there is currently a full-blown engineering study of running the route along Interstate 10 and they are spending "a lot of money" on engineering/consultants. Officially, there will be one Houston station. Unofficially, a station in the Grand Parkway area is being looked at. I overheard one woman complain that a downtown station is very inconvenient and unattractive to everyone in the north and northwest suburbs. She said something like "If I'm going to drive a long way to catch a plane or train, I would rather drive to Bush Airport". The rep responded that they have studied the issue and are aware that customer bases will be minimized or lost depending on the station location, and that's why a suburban station is being looked at. My take: A decision on the Houston station location is not imminent. The section from Northwest Mall to downtown will be very expensive and potentially controversial, and that makes the business case more difficult. A downtown station is not a "sure thing". The possibility of a suburban station is in the preliminary consideration stage. Edited April 24, 2015 by MaxConcrete 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morrchr1 Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 I was a big supporter of the downtown route before seeing some of the numbers associated with it, but now why not go to the NW mall site and put pressure on the city to make good on its own 2040 plan to have rail out to that area to come to downtown? See Pg. 15 on the link below, it would have a light rail service going from that area to downtown. The biggest upheaval in what could really be a very mobile Houston in my eyes is the blocking of the University line in the Galleria/Afton Oaks area. With this line and the line shown on the 2040 plan map (first I had seen of this Washington/NW mall line) you could reasonably get from that train to any business district in Houston excluding the Energy Corridor. http://www.h-gac.com/taq/plan/2040/docs/Appendix%20A%20Map%20Book.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cspwal Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 With the ever more expanding galleria and west loop area, I could see the NW mall site actually being harder to get to for most in the SW and southern suburbs to get to. A downtown site + a grand parkway site would be much better - mainly because initially, when it opens, the NW mall site train wouldn't be near anything what so ever, while a downtown site it would be on top of everything. The question will be whether they could make back that $40 million extra by being in the more prime location. And would a new light rail line or a city built train station be more? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigFootsSocks Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Less than a month in this session and neither the ED bill nor Metcalf's asinine bill have made it to either the House or Senate. The "Texans Against High Speed Rail" founder is quoted saying "this is a 3 year fight"http://www.texastribune.org/2015/05/05/rural-critics-bullet-train-get-organized/Who the hell is going to put up with this, especially when these landowners along the route will be payed much more than they deserve? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADCS Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 http://www.citylab.com/commute/2015/05/southwest-airlines-hasnt-decided-whether-or-not-to-oppose-texas-high-speed-rail/392462/ Apparently the opposition was talking like it was a fait accompli that SWA would oppose the rail line. There is so much weirdness going on with the opposition. What's really going on there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxConcrete Posted May 10, 2015 Author Share Posted May 10, 2015 (edited) More trouble at the State Capitol http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/politics/2015/05/10/high-speed-rail-at-risk-now-in-state-budget-bill/27083037/ If you watch the video with Dallas Mayor Rawlings on this page http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/politics/elections/2015/05/10/inside-texas-politics-51015/27083251/it appears this is a very serious threat and North Texas political leaders are in the crisis mode. DALLAS – Dallas Mayor Mike Rawlings blasted a last minute addition to the state budget bill that would kill a private plan to build high speed rail between North Texas and Houston."This enterprise has a chance to bring $10-$15 billion to Texas of private money. We're supposed to be about growth in this state; we're supposed to be about private enterprise, and here we are putting something in in the dark of night, which troubles me," Rawlings said in an interview Sunday morning on WFAA's Inside Texas Politics.The rider was quietly added to the budget bill over the weekend, News 8 has learned.As written, the rider limits the involvement of the Texas Department of Transportation in the project after an environmental impact study, which — insiders told News 8 — would essentially kill the Texas Central Railway's plan to build its own private tracks between the state's two largest population centers. "I know it wasn't publicly debated," Rawlings said. "It was kind of put in in the dark of night." (more at the official report) Edited May 10, 2015 by MaxConcrete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted May 10, 2015 Share Posted May 10, 2015 More trouble at the State Capitol http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/politics/2015/05/10/high-speed-rail-at-risk-now-in-state-budget-bill/27083037/ If you watch the video with Dallas Mayor Rawlings on this page http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/politics/elections/2015/05/10/inside-texas-politics-51015/27083251/it appears this is a very serious threat and North Texas political leaders are in the crisis mode. DALLAS – Dallas Mayor Mike Rawlings blasted a last minute addition to the state budget bill that would kill a private plan to build high speed rail between North Texas and Houston."This enterprise has a chance to bring $10-$15 billion to Texas of private money. We're supposed to be about growth in this state; we're supposed to be about private enterprise, and here we are putting something in in the dark of night, which troubles me," Rawlings said in an interview Sunday morning on WFAA's Inside Texas Politics.The rider was quietly added to the budget bill over the weekend, News 8 has learned.As written, the rider limits the involvement of the Texas Department of Transportation in the project after an environmental impact study, which — insiders told News 8 — would essentially kill the Texas Central Railway's plan to build its own private tracks between the state's two largest population centers. "I know it wasn't publicly debated," Rawlings said. "It was kind of put in in the dark of night." (more at the official report) This definitely needs more attention because just even a little more notice and that part in the budget will not leave committee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cspwal Posted May 10, 2015 Share Posted May 10, 2015 It was unclear in the article what the budget rider would do - would it disallow TxDot from giving TCR a train permit? Or what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mollusk Posted May 10, 2015 Share Posted May 10, 2015 If I'm reading the Senate conference committee substitute bill correctly, it's this provision: "48. Limitation on Expenditures for High-speed Rail. None of the funds appropriated above to the Department of Transportation from state funds may be used for the purposes of subsidizing or assisting in the construction of high-speed passenger rail. For the purposes of this section, highspeed rail means intercity passenger rail service that is reasonably expected to reach speeds of at least 110 miles per hour." The troubling thing about that language is that TxDoT would have to sign off on each place where a railroad passes over or under a state road. This arguably strips the funding that would allow that to occur. I'll happily defer to someone with more expertise in interpreting Texas budget statutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronTiger Posted May 10, 2015 Share Posted May 10, 2015 If I'm reading the Senate conference committee substitute bill correctly, it's this provision: "48. Limitation on Expenditures for High-speed Rail. None of the funds appropriated above to the Department of Transportation from state funds may be used for the purposes of subsidizing or assisting in the construction of high-speed passenger rail. For the purposes of this section, highspeed rail means intercity passenger rail service that is reasonably expected to reach speeds of at least 110 miles per hour." The troubling thing about that language is that TxDoT would have to sign off on each place where a railroad passes over or under a state road. This arguably strips the funding that would allow that to occur. I'll happily defer to someone with more expertise in interpreting Texas budget statutes. Wait, wasn't the original idea? I thought that Texas Central would build overpasses or underpasses as necessary. When you expect the state (i.e. taxpayers) to do all that work (that's a lot of overpasses and underpasses), you undermine the whole "it's a private enterprise, those folks don't have much to worry about" platform and just give the opposition more leverage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 Wait, wasn't the original idea? I thought that Texas Central would build overpasses or underpasses as necessary. When you expect the state (i.e. taxpayers) to do all that work (that's a lot of overpasses and underpasses), you undermine the whole "it's a private enterprise, those folks don't have much to worry about" platform and just give the opposition more leverage. My thinking is that you have some politicians who are scared that TxDOT will put the ~ $3 Billion that was recently allocated to them from the state government into infrastructure to help assist TCR. That funding would not be in construction by TxDOT themselves, but would be paid to TCR to do the building themselves. I'm assuming that TCR would finance most grade separations themselves until they have to cross State highways, US highways, or Interstates. At that point they would have to collaborate with TxDOT in order to pass over those hurdles. At that point TxDOT might use its own funding to improve infrastructure meaning it might take away funding from other potential projects that could have used this $3 Billion. While it was a good move imo to move additional funds to better fix infrastructure...lets not be naive here. This money will definitely help those districts of Reps who helped to get it through. Thats simple politics. Thats not even conspiracy theories either. Thats just how deals get made and things move along. This is just my speculation btw. I have no evidence of anything nefarious going on to stop this. But these actions to stop TCR and any other high speed rail completely goes against party ideology and what the state has been promoting both in the US and abroad and could start to send mixed messages later on. It makes Texas look very hostile to startups. Makes us look very down on the little guy. Here in Texas we only want Fortune 500 companies....but you little guy over there, no you will have to stay away. If this stands I hope TCR takes this to court where the language of the bill will go to die, but of course that might delay the project another 5-10 years. They are delaying the inevitable and they see the writing on the wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADCS Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 Wait, wasn't the original idea? I thought that Texas Central would build overpasses or underpasses as necessary. When you expect the state (i.e. taxpayers) to do all that work (that's a lot of overpasses and underpasses), you undermine the whole "it's a private enterprise, those folks don't have much to worry about" platform and just give the opposition more leverage. It's stripping them of the funding to review the over and underpasses, not to construct them. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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