POST: 401 Franklin Post Office Site Redevelopment

[cloud713]

forgive my ignorance but it seems like i recall people talking in the past about a potential redevelopment of the Post Office site? is there a thread on this? i tried searching but couldnt find anything on it. are there plans for the post office site to be redeveloped? if so what are the plans?

i came across this site somehow and thought it was kind of interesting. i never knew the Post Office site sits on top of what used to be Central Station and Hotel for the rail road and the city of Houston back in the day. it makes me wonder if the site could be redeveloped into an Intermodal Terminal type site with mixed use Transit Oriended Development.

http://www.epperts.com/lfa/BB67.html

[cloud713]

actually nevermind. i wish i could delete the post. lol, i was just storming up ideas after i read that link without really giving to consideration where the post office site is. although it is on the rail line that runs out along hempstead hwy/290 which could make for a good high speed rail link toward Austin/SA to complete the texas triangle high speed rail network, its not really near any of the light rail lines and is kind of isolated in the north west corner of downtown, across the bayou. it would make for a great site for a large mixed use development though. if only it had a street car system that linked it up with the light rail system and rest of downtown.
after pondering the idea, i think the Hardy Rail Yards are still the best location for the Intermodal Terminal/grand central station/mixed use development.. i was imagining bringing back the grand central station in Houston with a hotel/residential tower and TODs around it. i just didnt realize the rail lines at the post office site dont connect with the lines that run north down the Hardy Toll Road which would make most sense for the Houston-Dallas high speed rail line.

Edited September 15, 2013 by cloud713

[musicman]

yes please delete the bytes

[cloud713]

Bytes? Why did you bump this drunken ramble? Lol

[cloud713]

looks like Hines and ULI were doing some studies/trying to get some ideas on what to do with the site last year.. is the site for sale/projected to be for sale in the near future or why have there been so many proposals for what to do with the site?

[Houston19514]

The site was officially for sale back around 2008'ish.  I think they pulled it from the market after the financial crash in late 2008.  Presumably, if someone came along with a good offer, it would be for sale...  I keep hoping Hines is working a deal behind the scenes.

[cloud713]

What is the old awning looking thing along one of the tracks just north of the post office site, running under 45? Surely it wasn't an old passenger terminal or something. I know their used to be a "grand central station" at that site but thought that was like a century ago and everything was long gone.

[little frau]

The Post Office sits on the old Southern Pacific Grand Central Station, not to be confused with the old passenger station where Minute Maid is now.

 

The current Amtrak Station is still right off Washington Ave., very near I-45. 

 

Don't know about the awning you're seeing.

[Ross]

That's the Amtrak station platform awning behind the Post Office. It runs West under the freeway. https://maps.google.com/?ll=29.76721,-95.366591&spn=0.00325,0.004471&t=h&z=19

[cloud713]

wow.. that is still being used? Houston severely needs to step it up in the rail department... we should have a nice (not necessarily $180 million nice, or w/e) intramodal transit center or some central station type thing instead of that rickety old awning under an overpass.

[IronTiger]

I read somewhere that the post office was designed to BE a train station. Would've been pretty sweet when they did the Red Line to make that a transit terminal (bus/METRORail/Amtrak) but alas...

[Moore713]

You know who should by it that company trying to creaete high speed rail to Houston and dallas

[cloud713]

For sure. That or commuter rail. It would be cool to bring back the idea of a grand central station but I always envisioned the hsr station being at the hardy yards site/Burnett station, but apparently they may run the line down 290/highway 6 through college station instead of down the hardy toll road and 45N. Either way rail lines from both 45 and 290 can go through both sites so either one would work, the hardy site just has direct access to the light rail. This site would need a spur over to UHD or something, unless the basement of UHD turned into the main rail station/transfer hub.

[bachanon]

in response to a thread about the police department building on the post office site: "the post office site needs to be treated as the "gateway" (for lack of a better term) to the city of houston.  the last thing we want is a quickly aging police headquarters fronting downtown with 24 hour activity surrounding law enforcement; let them build under the elevated section of 59 by the elysian viaduct or north of u of h on the bayou side.

 

i want.....yes, i'm stomping my feet like a two year old....i want a monumental structure on the post office site that implies "welcome to oz (not the prison reference, the over the rainbow reference)/space city/the city of possibility/the city where dreams come true/the most diverse up and coming city in the country".  while i'm on my soapbox in dreamland......i want a frank gehry or a morphosis or a renzo piano...i want something that is bold yet restrained; it doesn't turn it's back to the freeway or the bayou; it is beautiful from 360 degrees; it is mixed use, pedestrian friendly and connected to mass transit......

 

i know i'm not asking much......i just watched the secret life of walter mitty and feel like i need to go jump out of a helicopter and just freakin' go for it!!  sorry...i digress.

 

NO!  XENOS!!! (channeling toula's father in "my big fat greek wedding"...possibly incorrectly) XENOS to more police structures on the bayou or in desirable locations!"

 

big, i'm sayin' BIG!  for instance:

 

 

 

 

 

 

i understand it's easy to google for cool images and tack them onto a thread, but this is an important location; if it isn't a monumental development then it should be something completely public.

[bachanon]

 

this concept from herzog & de meuron for miami's art museum has an understated design; an example such as this, when thinking of the post office site, shows how a structure might reference the underside ugliness of the nearby freeways and redefine the area continuing the efforts of the buffalo bayou project.  looking at this pavilion type structure immediately reminds me of the structural pillars holding up the freeways on either side of the post office site.  blowing out the space underneath the post office site and opening it to the other side of the freeways would reduce the claustrophobic feeling of this area and add pedestrian connections to underutilized greenspace (at least on the elder street artists lofts side).  i need to check google earth and the renderings for the proposed projects for this site, i think everything designed stops at the freeways.

i think there are so many opportunities for something truly amazing here, and not just the outward appearance but more options for pedestrian/bike/transit connectivity, mixed use, public spaces, etc. etc....

[monarch]

bachanon, my pal, please allow me the opportunity to start out by articulating.. i openly applaud your direct enthusiasm as per opposing any incorrect usage, of such a vital, as well as all important property of downtown houston.. the old post office site.  please relax a moment, take a deep breath, and allow yourself to reminisce about the big macy's department store, located downtown, directly upon main street.  this particular edifice, was centered upon one of the most highly regarded blocks in the entire state of texas.  macy's is now long and gone.  and now currently arising upon this most anticipated sites...  the phantom menace.  a building that is so very non inspiring, that we all really still cannot believe that it is actually being established upon what i consider the most holistic site in all of texas.  nonetheless, we are all just happy to see something actually ARISE upon main street...  am i correct?

 

houston, imo, is now fast becoming one of the most magnificent, diverse, as well as highly regarded world class cities in all of these united states.  houston, is BIG, BODACIOUS, and just not afraid of anything!  however, our fair city has all but one main drawback..  we are cursed with far too many conservative mindsets, located throughout our city government, county wide government, and even city wide representatives located upon austin, tx.  WE JUST CANNOT GET THINGS DONE.  need an early example..  the astrodome!  i felt absolutely disgusted, to learn later after the official vote had taken place, that thousands of citizens as per fort bend county, actually voted to defeat the dome amendment.  get that, fort bend county....

 

i for one, may assure anyone that reads this posting, that i have become so very sick and tired of reading from others upon this great forum, the same old worn out excuse vs crutch, that "houston is now arising as per it's depression of the 80's energy burst".  well, imo, the entire state of texas has certain segments that are still suffering to some degree or another, and yet they were still able to meet their area's demand and grow.  let us take a quick visit to san antonio.  they are always held upon very high regard nationally, they are always building and growing their city's infrastructure, they don't make silly excuses, they plan very well.. and they make things happen.  let us now visit austin.  need i say anything more?  austin, tx., has now become just one of the very fastest growing metropolis's in all of america.  vitality, gentrified, musical, and just basic fun times.  austin, received the XGAMES so very fast.. that i'm actually a little afraid that they may not be ready lodging wise in time.  now let us arrive in dallas, tx.  are you now nervous?  we really do not like to refer to dallas to much now do we?  we love to pick out certain aspects of the metroplex, to pick on, as well as try and play the oneupmanship game with..  simply because we no within our heart of hearts, that although houston, tx., is officially listed as the "fourth largest city within the confines of the united states"..  dallas, tx., for no unknown reasons, seem to constantly outshine us, upon many regards.  (glamour, espn, bigger and far better stadiums, gleaming victory plaza, neiman marcus located downtown, ritz carlton, w hotel, barney's new york) get the picture.  you name it, they have it.  if they don't yet have it..  they will soon devise a plan to get it..  and trust me, it will be well done.  i for one, would never ever say that dallas does not make mistakes.. they do indeed.  but god only knows that houston does as well.

 

now bachanon, let us revisit your gracious illustrations below:  

 

1.  this particular illustration is soft and graciously beautiful.  one main drawback, it just reek's of the san francisco landmark pyramid edifice.  houston, certainly shall become the "laughing stock of the nation" should we construct an edifice that closely resembles another town's landmark building.

 

2.  what in god's name is that?  whatever it is, let us keep it there, and not let it loose.

 

3.  beautiful, and yet quite fun.  but this particular attraction, belongs upon abu dhabi, dubai, or maybe even doha, qatar.  simply brilliant design, and yet mucho costly.

 

4.  far too boring, non original.

 

5. ghastly!

 

6.  illustration miami, an instant classic.  a modernistic landmark design, that simply reek's of miami's very liberal minded momentum.

 

to date, what houston really requires at this point in it's history bachanon, is more citizens like yourself.  citizens, that not only love and appreciate our fair city, but citizens that are openly striving as per this city's overall well being, as well as excellence.  once we are able to achieve this all important aspect.. LOOKOUT NEW YORK! 

 

 

in response to a thread about the police department building on the post office site: "the post office site needs to be treated as the "gateway" (for lack of a better term) to the city of houston.  the last thing we want is a quickly aging police headquarters fronting downtown with 24 hour activity surrounding law enforcement; let them build under the elevated section of 59 by the elysian viaduct or north of u of h on the bayou side.

 

i want.....yes, i'm stomping my feet like a two year old....i want a monumental structure on the post office site that implies "welcome to oz (not the prison reference, the over the rainbow reference)/space city/the city of possibility/the city where dreams come true/the most diverse up and coming city in the country".  while i'm on my soapbox in dreamland......i want a frank gehry or a morphosis or a renzo piano...i want something that is bold yet restrained; it doesn't turn it's back to the freeway or the bayou; it is beautiful from 360 degrees; it is mixed use, pedestrian friendly and connected to mass transit......

 

i know i'm not asking much......i just watched the secret life of walter mitty and feel like i need to go jump out of a helicopter and just freakin' go for it!!  sorry...i digress.

 

NO!  XENOS!!! (channeling toula's father in "my big fat greek wedding"...possibly incorrectly) XENOS to more police structures on the bayou or in desirable locations!"

 

big, i'm sayin' BIG!  for instance:

 

 

 

 

 

 

i understand it's easy to google for cool images and tack them onto a thread, but this is an important location; if it isn't a monumental development then it should be something completely public.

 

 

 

Edited May 3, 2014 by monarch

[cloud713]

I dig this station. Imagine it overlooking the bayou.

http://www.mymodernmet.com/profiles/blogs/zaha-hadid-melbourne-transportation-center

This sounds like a really cool project similar in scope to what the post office site could be

http://www.dezeen.com/2012/10/17/high-speed-train-station-in-logrono-by-abalossentkiewicz-arquitectos/

And I agree, there should be something tall and architecturally striking from all directions at that site, a la the shard, maybe around 5-600' tall.

[cloud713]

i was going to sketch out a new proposal/fantasy utilizing a new Washington Ave configuration and getting rid of Franklin, but it looks like this proposal hits that along with most of the other ideas i had (like converting the odd offshoot "Smith St" bridge to the northwest, over the bayou, to pedestrian only, for better access from the site to the rest of downtown, and building tall along the back and keeping the bayou frontage low rise/park space). it just needs a taller signature skyscraper that stands out. and im not sure how well i like the fact they left the existing road/pier structure above the bayou on the north side and built the pedestrian promenade along that instead of creating a fluid bank down to the bayou level. those are the only things i would do differently. other then that.. BUILD IT!!!
 

looks like Hines and ULI were doing some studies/trying to get some ideas on what to do with the site last year.. is the site for sale/projected to be for sale in the near future or why have there been so many proposals for what to do with the site?

 

Edited May 6, 2014 by cloud713

[arche_757]

^Yeah, I thought that was interesting Hines sponsored that; though I believe they may have sponsored other similar competitions?

 

Free conceptual design.  I think the one image you posted is about as "grand" of a project that one could expect in this town for that site.  In fact I would be beyond thrilled if that's all it ended up being.  I wish we had visonaries that would produce something truly fantastic - like some of the images Bachanon posted - but I just don't see it.  To be honest if we ended up with something 1/2 as good as the above image cloud713 posted on the 13th of October 2013 then I'll be happy.

[Houston19514]

^Yeah, I thought that was interesting Hines sponsored that; though I believe they may have sponsored other similar competitions?

 

Free conceptual design.

 

Yes, it's an annual Urban Land Institute competition sponsored by the Hines organization.

 

This year's competition was to propose a development vision that promotes healthy living for the residents of Nashville’s Sulphur Dell neighborhood.

 

2013 was to create a practical and workable scheme for a section of the Downtown East neighborhood in Minneapolis.

 

In 2012, of course, the competition focused on creating a practical and workable scheme for the best use of approximately 16.3 acres owned by the United States Postal Service (USPS). The competition focused on the USPS property since it is considered by many stakeholders to be a key site to reconnect the theater district, the historic district, and the greater downtown to the Buffalo Bayou.

 

It's not some nefarious scheme to provide Gerald Hines with free conceptual design.

 

[arche_757]

Never said it was nefarious.  Developers ought to attend/schedule these sort of competitions more often.  It would at least spur on more adventurous thinking for large - catalyst projects like this (or similar).

 

Still a sort of "free" conceptual design idea that proposes things developers may have thought about (not just Hines) yet been too cost conscious to inquire about.

[Subdude]

i was going to sketch out a new proposal/fantasy utilizing a new Washington Ave configuration and getting rid of Franklin, but it looks like this proposal hits that along with most of the other ideas i had (like converting the odd offshoot "Smith St" bridge to the northwest, over the bayou, to pedestrian only, for better access from the site to the rest of downtown, and building tall along the back and keeping the bayou frontage low rise/park space). it just needs a taller signature skyscraper that stands out. and im not sure how well i like the fact they left the existing road/pier structure above the bayou on the north side and built the pedestrian promenade along that instead of creating a fluid bank down to the bayou level. those are the only things i would do differently. other then that.. BUILD IT!!!

 

 

Interesting about removing Franklin along the stretch.  It makes perfect sense to free up space along the bayou and have the main connector street more central to the site.  Not having a taller skyscraper is fine by me - there might well be enough of a backlog of skyscrapers to preclude the idea of building one here.  If anything, I would go in the opposite direction of looking for commercial development and leave as much as the site green as possible.  Plant trees along the north, west and east perimeters, maybe build a baseball field or soccer pitch on the north segment, build a giant central fountain, and leave the rest as Houston's Central Park.  As I've said before it is the perfect location for a centralized fairgrounds, and a big green space would be a great gateway to downtown.  

 

Future generations would thank us much more for a big bayou park than they ever will for another "mixed-use" development.  If only the city had the vision....

[mollusk]

Future generations would thank us much more for a big bayou park than they ever will for another "mixed-use" development.  If only the city had the vision....

 

"That vision thing" is quite the question, particularly in the context of the Bush the Elder statute across the street.

[Subdude]

I know, but a huge plot of land right along the bayou by downtown is really a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity (and you know I'm normally not one to get caught up in grandiose development dreams).  The idea of using the site for more jails makes me a little nauseous. 

 

 

[trymahjong]

I heard Michael Kubosh speak last week- He mentioned the "conversations" on city council about that piece of land and the idea of putting a new municipal court there-- He told us he voiced his opinion to not buy the land and use the money to repair streets and sidewalks.

[Metro West]

How often do ideas that are presented in design competitions actually get built? Are there any examples? 

[IronTiger]

Looking at the Post Office site, Washington looks to be currently closed and converted to parking under the Interstate. Is this because of a low clearance from the descending HOV lane ramp?

 

 

[UtterlyUrban]

Closing Franklin and converting this area into a park along BB is a terrific idea. That would be a game changer for downtown.

[Tumbleweed_Tx]

Metro West.. the Bank of the Southwest Tower was a design contest winner.

 

Of course, it wasn't built in Houston, it was shortened by a few hundred feet and built in Philadelphia.

[arche_757]

I've thought some on the park idea....  I don't think it would be as great as we think.  Discovery Green works because there is stuff around it.  Imagine a park with a Freeway on 2 sides, a railroad bisecting it, and a bayou separating it from everything else nearby.  Add to that the lack of residential that's close and I just don't see this being the "grand" park others think it may be.

 

Add a little residential and make 6-7 acres the park and you'll have a successful area with a "grand lawn" facing town that people are talking (wishing) about.

[ClutchCity]

http://realtynewsreport.com/2014/05/07/misplaying-houstons-finest-redevelopment-site/

I would much rather have a company like Midway have the Post Office site and let them do something visionary with it rather then let the city squander a great opportunity. I don't see why the police station has to be in such a prime spot. Sure it's a central location but having it a half mile north, south, or east of downtown would still give them a central location on (probably) cheaper land, no?

[Subdude]

I've thought some on the park idea....  I don't think it would be as great as we think.  Discovery Green works because there is stuff around it.  Imagine a park with a Freeway on 2 sides, a railroad bisecting it, and a bayou separating it from everything else nearby.  Add to that the lack of residential that's close and I just don't see this being the "grand" park others think it may be.

 

Add a little residential and make 6-7 acres the park and you'll have a successful area with a "grand lawn" facing town that people are talking (wishing) about.

 

Maybe not as grand as Discovery Green in terms of siting, but my preferred use is for permanent fairgrounds, so I still think it could work great for that.  The surrounding freeways and railroad don't diminish its utility for that.  This is just dreaming though.  

 

If the land is auctioned off, and the city isn't interested in park, fairgrounds or other use, then who is likely to be the highest bidder?  If the basis of sale is financial only, and not the development plan, this could as easily end up as surface parking as anything else.  

[Montrose1100]

Metro West.. the Bank of the Southwest Tower was a design contest winner.

 

Of course, it wasn't built in Houston, it was shortened by a few hundred feet and built in Philadelphia.

The design element was used for Liberty 1 & 2, not just shortened by a few hundred feet. It's design was also recycled into the Messeturm in Frankfurt.

[IronTiger]

I think the post office site would be a great site for an expanded aquarium, or some sort of mixed-use commercial site. A collection of restaurants and stores, all along the bayou? Sounds great.

 

Another idea would be to expand the bayou and build a permanently-moored (like, a boat-shaped building that is surrounded by water but resembles a boat) boat of some sort, preferably one of a past design (1800s river steamer?) with a restaurant or something on it. 

 

Nah...

[arche_757]

Another idea would be to expand the bayou and build a permanently-moored (like, a boat-shaped building that is surrounded by water but resembles a boat) boat of some sort, preferably one of a past design (1800s river steamer?) with a restaurant or something on it. 

 

NO!

 

And to Subdudes idea of a permanent fairgrounds... I'm not following why you would want something like that?  I'm envisioning something tacky - can you elaborate?

 

 

I think the best idea is to let a "Midway Cos" type of developer turn it into something.  They could work in apartments, condos, retail and office space and leave plenty of room for park-scape facing town and the Bayou.

 

Is it weird if I don't really consider this a part of downtown?  Downtown to me is the area surrounded by I-45 and 59 and the Bayou.  This is some other part of town, some other "district" if you will.

 

[Subdude]

I'm dubious about the prospects of mixed-use developments in that area, especially with a lot of housing units coming online soon downtown.  

 

Love the idea though of turning the site into a lake!

[arche_757]

I should add I was saying "NO!" to the idea of building a "boat-like structure"  NEVER build a fake boat.  NEVER!  How sad would it be for one of the worlds largest ports and port cities to build a fake boat?

 

And why turn it into a lake?  It would merely be a shallow basin in a part of the bayou.  Too small for real boats, it would just be a wide part of the bayou.

[cloud713]

I've thought some on the park idea....  I don't think it would be as great as we think.  Discovery Green works because there is stuff around it.  Imagine a park with a Freeway on 2 sides, a railroad bisecting it, and a bayou separating it from everything else nearby.  Add to that the lack of residential that's close and I just don't see this being the "grand" park others think it may be.

 

Add a little residential and make 6-7 acres the park and you'll have a successful area with a "grand lawn" facing town that people are talking (wishing) about.

agreed.. all your reasoning for why a park wouldnt do very well in that area is exactly why i figured a mixed use development wouldnt be as successful there as other locations, like the Hardy Yards or the new Buffalo Island. if HPD is about to take over the site (doubtful), then why not move the jails to that site too? (thats my only logic with putting the jails at the post office site. if HPD doesnt get the property then obviously it would be (kind of) pointless to move the jails. how many people frequent BBP along that stretch of the bayou by the post office site? im not in the area much but when i am i dont see many/if any people along that part. like you said, there needs to be a decent residential component to the post office development if people want this area to be successful. also preferably some form of entertainment and amenities that the rest of downtown doesnt have yet, like a full fledged movie theater, a roof top TopGolf, or a full scale grocery store. and converting the Smith Street offshoot bridge northwest across the bayou into a pedestrian promenade, to better connect the two areas.

as far as connectivity to Buffalo Island, you have North San Jacinto (San Jac/Fannin) connecting the island with downtown to the south, and i10 to the north. you could even extend Navigation/Runnels St. west of McKee, along the Heights Bike Trail, onto the island, ending at N San Jacinto, so the island would be accessible by vehicle on 3 sides, and currently is accessible by pedestrian bridges on two sides (more pedestrian bridges could/would be installed for even better connectivity to the island). if they built stairs/an elevator off of the MKT Trail at UH-D, on the west side of the bayou from the island, that MKT Trail pedestrian connection could even be used to connect the developments on Buffalo Island to the light rail station at UH-D on Main.

idk, i just think Buffalo Island would have much more potential than the Post Office site if we could do something about the jails.

[Avossos]

I think the post office site would be a great site for an expanded aquarium, or some sort of mixed-use commercial site. A collection of restaurants and stores, all along the bayou? Sounds great.

 

NO!

 

The current court site would be the only realistic spot because it is already there! Take a look at google Earth or something dude...

[IronTiger]

NO!

 

The current court site would be the only realistic spot because it is already there! Take a look at google Earth or something dude...

I'm looking at the Post Office site and some of the project renderings...if Franklin (a road AT THE WATERFRONT) was closed and traffic was rerouted to Washington (which would be reopened) and Franklin was turned into a pedestrian walkway, that could be linked in with Sesquicentennial Park, and, well, at least an expanded aquarium could go there.

 

Fake boat idea was just tossing around an idea...clearly some of you missed the "Nah..." added at the end...

Edited May 7, 2014 by IronTiger

[Subdude]

agreed.. all your reasoning for why a park wouldnt do very well in that area is exactly why i figured a mixed use development wouldnt be as successful there as other locations, like the Hardy Yards or the new Buffalo Island. if HPD is about to take over the site (doubtful), then why not move the jails to that site too? (thats my only logic with putting the jails at the post office site. if HPD doesnt get the property then obviously it would be (kind of) pointless to move the jails. how many people frequent BBP along that stretch of the bayou by the post office site? im not in the area much but when i am i dont see many/if any people along that part. like you said, there needs to be a decent residential component to the post office development if people want this area to be successful. also preferably some form of entertainment and amenities that the rest of downtown doesnt have yet, like a full fledged movie theater, a roof top TopGolf, or a full scale grocery store. and converting the Smith Street offshoot bridge northwest across the bayou into a pedestrian promenade, to better connect the two areas.

as far as connectivity to Buffalo Island, you have North San Jacinto (San Jac/Fannin) connecting the island with downtown to the south, and i10 to the north. you could even extend Navigation/Runnels St. west of McKee, along the Heights Bike Trail, onto the island, ending at N San Jacinto, so the island would be accessible by vehicle on 3 sides, and currently is accessible by pedestrian bridges on two sides (more pedestrian bridges could/would be installed for even better connectivity to the island). if they built stairs/an elevator off of the MKT Trail at UH-D, on the west side of the bayou from the island, that MKT Trail pedestrian connection could even be used to connect the developments on Buffalo Island to the light rail station at UH-D on Main.

idk, i just think Buffalo Island would have much more potential than the Post Office site if we could do something about the jails.

I assume that "Buffalo Island" refers to the new island that will be created by the North Canal project.  Referring to it as "Little Alcatraz" might be clearer.  I think it is unrealistic to assume anything but jails on the island for the immediate future, so I wouldn't expect much for that part of the bayou.  The post office site isn't perfect for any number of reasons, but to me the island site is just going to be a non-starter for any development other than detention facilities. 

[arche_757]

Fake boat idea was just tossing around an idea...clearly some of you missed the "Nah..." added at the end...

 

I read that.  However, I'm so against using a "fake" anything for any site - when you can find an actual working boat (or just build a cool building over the water without making it look like a giant Captain Benny's Seafood that I responded that way.

 

 

North Canal (and South Canal - there are two remember) are probably a decade+ from happening.  In fact I would go so far to say they're the next big "boom" cycle in Houston development away.

 

This is presently an option for a great mixed-use development.  Throw in the potential to tie-into rail/transit in the future and this is a massively important site that is FAR more valuable than being the HQ of HPD (do they really need 12 acres?) and booking facilities for the city jail.

 

I agree with Subdude that it will be a long time before the big county jails are relocated.

[Subdude]

 

 

North Canal (and South Canal - there are two remember) are probably a decade+ from happening.  In fact I would go so far to say they're the next big "boom" cycle in Houston development away.

 

I'm not sure what the South Canal is, but on the Downtown Development Timeline graphic that was posted on HAIF North Canal construction is plotted from approx Q3 2015 through the end of 2016.  

 

 

[HoustonIsHome]

I'm looking at the Post Office site and some of the project renderings...if Franklin (a road AT THE WATERFRONT) was closed and traffic was rerouted to Washington (which would be reopened) and Franklin was turned into a pedestrian walkway, that could be linked in with Sesquicentennial Park, and, well, at least an expanded aquarium could go there.

Fake boat idea was just tossing around an idea...clearly some of you missed the "Nah..." added at the end...

I think you missed his point that the pace to expand is around its current location. There are parking lots just past the highway up to the court houses.

I am not a big fan if the location of the aquarium though. I always thought it should have gone near the stadiums. And with discovery green that area is even more perfect for an aquarium.

I hate the fair grounds idea for the Post office site. It won't be much to look at and it will be empty for large stretches of time.

I don't like the lake idea. Same reason, not impressive enough.

It may be unrealistic but I like the posts with grand ideas for the site. Even if it is a group of buildings surrounding a 600 ft statue of George W painting cats

[arche_757]

I'm not sure what the South Canal is, but on the Downtown Development Timeline graphic that was posted on HAIF North Canal construction is plotted from approx Q3 2015 through the end of 2016.  

Look close you can see it just above the bottom of the page

 

On the second page of BBP Masterplan "eastern sector" is the map with the South Canal clearly labeled.  I thought this was common knowledge?  Hence why its called the North Canal and not just "the canal" ...unless I mistakenly read your post incorrectly?

 

Edited May 7, 2014 by arche_757

[cloud713]

the north canal actually serves a purpose for preventing downtown from flooding during freak storms. that one is moving forward. the south canal was just a fancy pie in the sky riverwalk to spur development. it would be amazing if they ever came close to seeing that vision, but as of now there are a few relatively new buildings directly in the way of the proposed South Canal.

[Subdude]

Look close you can see it just above the bottom of the page

 

On the second page of BBP Masterplan "eastern sector" is the map with the South Canal clearly labeled.  I thought this was common knowledge?  Hence why its called the North Canal and not just "the canal" ...unless I mistakenly read your post incorrectly?

 

That's interesting, thanks.  I can see the point - it would provide additional capacity for floodwater to be moved further  downstream.  Never seen anything about it being developed however.  Of course the North Canal was I believed proposed back in the 1930s, so who knows how long these things can take.

[urban909]

The city of Houston has withdrawn from bidding on the downtown post office, Mayor Annise Parker wrote in a letter to City Council members Tuesday.

City officials said they wanted to keep their options open in bidding on the site, saying it could have a number of uses, chief among them as a location for the city's planned police and courts complex. Parker's letter also notes the site could give commuter rail an entry point to downtown.

 

 

 

http://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/houston/article/City-drops-out-of-bidding-for-downtown-post-office-5475691.php

[Subdude]

How does the city withdrawing on bidding on the site keep their options open in bidding on the site? Doesn't withdrawing from bidding preclude bidding on the site? 

 

 

[IronTiger]

How does the city withdrawing on bidding on the site keep their options open in bidding on the site? Doesn't withdrawing from bidding preclude bidding on the site? 

Well, the city still has a lot of power, and I imagine it has the power to squash (or at least, temper) any development that is too far outside the rim of what they'd like to see there.