Set Love Free?

[RedScare]

Some of our Houston posters may not be too familiar with the Wright Amendment. It restricts flights out of Love Field to Texas and surrounding states. It was originally intended to help DFW Airport grow.

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/business/3271612

Southwest is pushing to lift the restriction. DFW Airport opposes, saying it will cost them 21 million passengers a year. I think that is a ridiculously inflated figure, but this restriction keeps ticket prices artificially high in Dallas.

[The Great Hizzy!]

SW has also hinted a threat at moving out of Dallas altogether if they don't get what they want. No idea where they would move to *if* they did. Hobby and SAT (San Antonio) are options but they could just as easily choose another location in the sunbelt, like Phoenix.

[MidtownCoog]

My first job out of college was at Southwest's HQ. There are two sides to this argument.

Some old timers at Southwest also counter that the Wright Amendment helped to create their success. At first it looked silly to want to continue to fly out of DAL when D/FW opened.

If it wern't for the free booze and go-go boots, they may have never made it.

That being said, say buh-bye to the WA. It served two purposes and it's time to go the way of the Do-do.

[RedScare]

True. Just because it worked so well in DFW's infancy, does not mean it is useful today. I assume FtW is still against the repeal (DFW is in FW city limits)?

[Kirzania]

DFW Airport opposes, saying it will cost them 21 million passengers a year.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Even if that's not inflated, what gives? Aren't we supposed to be promoting airlines and getting more people to fly? Especially since 9/11 and with all the airlines in the red. This doesn't make any sort of sense. It seems to me that Southwest would profit. Besides, the people who are closer to DFW wouldn't drive across the city to fly out of Love (flight permitting.)

No one said Love couldn't set their prices at the exact same thing as SW flights in DFW, either. Then it's not so much a question of competition, just about where people live.

[RedScare]

I don't think SW flies out of DFW anymore. Besides, why should we support inefficient business models artificially? If those airlines run a crummy operation, let the market dictate what happens to them.

Tickets in Dallas are up to 100% more expensive than Houston, mostly due to this rule. Dallas travellers (and that includes Houstonians who fly through there) should not have to subsidize bad business models through restrictive government regulation, when it is not regulated elsewhere.

[Kirzania]

Tickets in Dallas are up to 100% more expensive than Houston, mostly due to this rule.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Isn't it cheaper to fly into DFW than any airport Houston? Or are those just for tickets out of DFW?

[MidtownCoog]

Maybe on AA, but who wants to connect in DFW?

[Willy1]

The Wright Amendment was put in place by Jim Wright when DFW was built... It protected FW's intrest in DFW Airport since Dallas and FW agreed to build the world's largest airport (at that time) as a joint venture. Love Field was already in Dallas, serving as a regional airport. DFW was build to be an international airport serving all of DFW and North Texas. Dallas agreed to the Wright amendment. People seem to forget that Dallas willingly entered into the agreement. Today, DFW Airport is the largest economic engine in all of DFW and is home to American Airlines - the World's Largest Airline, which offically calls FW home. Can you really blame the city of FW for wanting to uphold the agreement they had with Dallas and to protect one of their largest employers from even more financial difficulty? If DFW does suffer from the repeal of the Wright Amendment so does the city of Fort Worth - and it's Dallas' lack of honoring their word that is potentially going to cause that problem. It is Southwest Airlines that is at the root of everything. They have been offered gates at DFW airport - which would allow them to fly to any state in the nation - or wherever they want to go. But, they're refusing that offer. Southwest Airlines is the trouble-maker here - not FW, not DFW.... If Southwest were to stay at love and fly regionally out of Love and fly to other states out of DFW it would have the same price lowering affect while still allowing them to fly whereever they want. By repealing the Wright Amendment, they are targeting DFW Airport and American Airlines - and indirectly the city of Fort Worth. SWA posted a $159 million profit for the quarter - you can't tell me they can't afford to to open a few gates at DFW to "move about the country". The former Delta gates are being offered to anyone who wants them at a huge discount from their normal rates.... SWA could pick up 10 gates at DFW (I think Love Field has less than 20 gates) and increase their footprint in the market, increase they places they fly, lower ticket prices at DFW and solve all the problems. SWA has the ability to solve the whole mess - they're just being a snotty, little, corporate brat by kicking and screaming because they're not getting their way.

On a side note - it's not a bad business model that is hurting American Airlines... It's high fuel cost. They are back to pre-911 numbers in terms of the number of people flying... but the cost of fuel is what is keeping them in the red.

[Kirzania]

Maybe on AA, but who wants to connect in DFW?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

'Tis better to connect in DFW from Louisville than connect in Memphis from Lexington via prop.

[MidtownCoog]

Why would SWA want to fly out of D/FW?

SWA's business model is based upon on-time performance and 20 mintue turns at the gates. You can't do that at D/FW.

It all boils down to revenue management and how to get the most money out of your existing fleet of aircraft.

Just a couple of examples that the managment team at AA fails to grasp. The high-dollar MBAs at AA need to resign.

[MidtownCoog]

it's not a bad business model that is hurting American Airlines... It's high fuel cost

There are ways to get around this. Hedging your fuel like SWA, keeping costs low, etc.

"The world's largest airline!" Starting to wonder if that's really something to be proud of if you can't be profitable.

[Willy1]

Why would SWA want to fly out of D/FW?

SWA's business model is based upon on-time performance and 20 mintue turns at the gates.  You can't do that at D/FW.

It all boils down to revenue management and how to get the most money out of your existing fleet of aircraft.

Just a couple of examples that the managment team at AA fails to grasp.  The high-dollar MBAs at AA need to resign.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree that AA could do some things to be more competitive. However, that doesn't change the facts surrounding the Wright Amendment - and how Dallas is trying to backout of their agreement with FW. Hey, I'm all for free enterprise. But whatever happened to having to uphold the legal obligations that a party willingly enters into? What good is a contract if you don't have to hold up your end of the bargain?

SWA should fly out of DFW to enable them to fly anywhere they want... They could do that tomorrow if their REAL interest was to increase their number of domestic destinations. They could keep their business model in place at DFW too... They may have a little trouble with the 20 minute turn around due to traffic at DFW at first, but they could adjust the way they do business to compensate for any unforeseen issues at a larger airport. But, the late flights aren't universally the problem of DFW airport... Delays at other airports, weather, traffic in and out of other airports... all those factors contribute to delays at DFW - not because it's DFW, but because of the nature of being a large international airport with world-wide destinations. SWA could fly out of DFW, see if they can keep their business model working at DFW and THEN try to repeal the amendment - if it wasn't working or their business was hurting for some reason. SWA just needs to be careful because if the Wright Amendment is repealed - just watch how fast AA opens gates at Love and drops ticket prices..... What will SWA do when AA is flying out of Love Field and they're suddenly in a price war with the World's Largest Airline in their own backyard? It's not a given that SWA will profit from the repeal of the Wright Amendment. In fact, all that will do is put them in the boxing ring with a much bigger opponent. AA may not be as profitable, but it's a lot larger and has much larger holdings to leverage if needed. They didn't become the world's largest airline by being polite.

[The Great Hizzy!]

^^^^ Heh. It's almost like SWA is pulling a corporate strike. "We won't work until you meet our demands!"

"But you have a contract!"

"Shove it! We're on strike! Down with the man!!"

[MidtownCoog]

Don't pretend that other airlines would not want to fly out of Love.

Midwest Express wants to start routes to Madison from Love. They don't want to mess with D/FW, either.

I am glad Houston does not have to enter agreements with other cities a la Dallas/Ft. Worth.

Houston may be big and ugly, but Houston is Houston, and we don't have to worry about squabbles with Sugar Land, The Woodlands, etc.

[RedScare]

I don't blame FW, or DFW for that matter, for trying to protect their turf. And I agree with Willy that SWA is using their local influence to try to beat the hub-and-spoke airlines even further.

I still hate Herb "Mr. Free Enterprise" Kelleher for his antics in the 80s to weight the bullet train proposal down with so many needless restrictions that it was financially impossible to build the high speed rail in Texas. So, if SWA gets slapped here, it will be a dose of his own medicine. SWA is all for free enterprise until it has to compete...then they cry just as loudly as the "big" airlines do when their hub-and-spoke system costs too much to run efficiently.

[MidtownCoog]

SWA will win this battle. And they are in no rush. The longer the better.

They'll keep making money, and AA will continue deeper into the red.

That's a pretty good strategy IMHO.

Just keep squeaking!

And don't forget the original intent of the act: The intent was to help growth at then-new Dallas-Fort Worth International Airport.

Also, groth at Love is limited, and even with the restrictions removed it can never offer the frequency of flights at D/FW.

What's D/FW afraid of?

[RedScare]

"What's D/FW afraid of?"

Lost revenue from decreased takeoff/landing fees...and they are in the same competition that everyone else is, biggest, busiest and assorted other "firsts".

[MidtownCoog]

The "you can't use that airport, you must use this one" is a little Red China IMHO.

[Willy1]

The "you can't use that airport, you must use this one" is a little Red China IMHO.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Uh - only one problem with that theory.... China didn't sign a contract with it's residents. DALLAS signed a contract - they agreed to uphold the Wright Amendment. Point still stands that Dallas is trying to back out of a contract that they willingly entered. And, the reason they're trying to get out of it is because they're afraid SWA will leave Dallas.

And, Hizzy is right.... SWA is basically on strike.... I don't know if SWA is going to win this or not. It's something they've been battling for decades to no avail so far. I hope it's never repealed because it screws over the city of FW and American Airlines - which is a MUCH larger employer in this area than SWA will ever be. I also agree with the whole Herb "Killatrain" comments. I don't like him because he whined and whined to kill the bullet trains because of what it was going to do to his precious SWA.... But, now that it's happening to him, he's pissed. I like SWA, but not the cattle call system they use. Sure, they're on time, but whoopy. I couldn't care less about that. I'd rather have good service, an assigned seat, and the service that AA offerse.

Personally, I think the Cattle Call seating on SWA is a security threat.... With AA or any other airline the flight crew knows not only who is on board, but what seat they're in. On SWA, if a terrorist were to make it on board, they could never look at the manifest and tell who was in what seat. That seems risky to me...

[MidtownCoog]

The WA is outdated and only serves to protect AA's stronghold on D/FW and higher fares for the region. Southwest has remained neutral on the WA until the last couple of years.

All I can say is "only in Dallas/Ft. Worth would you see a silly battle like this".

The entire Metroplex needs to take sensitivty training.

As far as the cattle call seating being a security threat, the TSA and FAA would disagree. You can't get past security checkpoint without a boarding pass and positive ID match.

AA's woes are nothing new. In the mid-90s Crandell talked about AA going out of business if it could not be profitable.

FYI - Herb retired. Gary Kelly is CEO.

As far as the "super trains" go, don't forget, someone was planning to get rich on that scheme as well. It's all about the Benjamins no matter what mode of transportation you take.

[Subdude]

I can't blame SWA for wanting to preserve their business model, which includes using smaller airports when available. You have to give them credit for figuring out the business model to run an airline profitably - something that has escaped the traditional carriers. I don't care about assigned seats. It's still worth it to have the additional flexibility to change flights and not get socked with a $100 charge.

I think the idea of high speed trains was a non-starter to begin with for a number of reasons, not just SWA opposition.

Btw, it always seemed that DFW was a lot cheaper than IAH, at least based on comparisons with co-workers. My assumption was that it was due to competition between Delta and American, while IAH is dominated only by Continental. Of course, with Delta closing its hub, that may no longer be the case.

[skwatra]

i always found AA and CO to be about the same price for domestic, but would opt for the direct flight. but SW is cheaper, more flexible, and hobby is much closer for me.

if i'm flying international i would take continental, delta, or NW or one of their affiliates like Air France or KLM to keep my miles together. for this, AA was never cheaper then my other options, nor are there as many flights.

someday i'm going to take advantage of one of continental's last minute weekend deals to mexico...

[713 To 214]

Uh - only one problem with that theory.... China didn't sign a contract with it's residents. DALLAS signed a contract - they agreed to uphold the Wright Amendment. Point still stands that Dallas is trying to back out of a contract that they willingly entered. And, the reason they're trying to get out of it is because they're afraid SWA will leave Dallas.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You keep saying that. I thought someone more knowledgable would have corrected you by now. OR, at the very least, I thought you would have attempted to visit another website to research the issue yourself. But, as usual, you spew out inaccurate statements, and try to pass them off as truth. You are ABSOLUTELY WRONG!

Let me break it down in simple terms for you.

Dallas is a municipality. Southwest Airlines is a Publically traded Corporation. One has nothing to do with the other. Dallas (city council/mayor) is not trying to break its agreement with Fort Worth. To the contrary, Dallas' Mayor (a member of DFW Airport's Board of Directors) has publically sided with DFW Airport to date. Southwest Airlines is spearheading the repeal effort and currently has no support from the City of Dallas in its efforts. Southwest Airlines is not a party to the the agreement between Dallas and Fort Worth. Thus, Southwest has no obligation to uphold its terms. Dallas is not trying to back out of anything. Do some research!

[Willy1]

You keep saying that.

[RedScare]

Willy,

Very thorough post. And, I might add, very accurate. Even though some on this board believe no one else has ever lived in both cities, I haved lived in west Houston, Spring and The Woodlands, as WELL AS Duncanville, Las Colinas, Fort Worth and North Dallas, before currently settling in the Heights.

The dust up over the Wright Amendment got rather ugly in the late 80s and early 90s...threats of lawsuits and such...but, as usual, it died down again. Back then, Dallas was trying to get greedy and Ft Worth slapped them down. This time, it appears to be more of a SWA instigated flare up.

I think Mayor Kirk is correct. And this time FtW could do something about it. It is no longer the stepchild that it used to be. A family feud between Dallas and Ft Worth would hurt the entire Metroplex.

One thing that often gets left out of this is that Love is very hemmed in. Allowing airlines to fly to far away cities will bring in bigger jets, to the detriment of the neighborhood. Let's hope they get things worked out, preferably by telling SWA to butt out.

[713 To 214]

For those of you interested in finding out for yourself about Wright, Southwest, DFW Airport and the histories of Dallas and Fort Worth in the whole deal:

http://setlovefree.com/index.html

http://www.fightwright.org/index.html

[Willy1]

Thanks... the article that I quoted was actually from 1997. It also talked about the other factor in the Wright Amendment - Noise Pollution. The people around Love have been effective so far in keeping large aircraft out of Love due to the noise issue.... Fort Worth has nearly doubled in size since the late 80's and, you're right, FW is no longer easily pushed around by Dallas since it is now the fastest growing large city in DFW... The growth is focused in the Tarrant Co. side now.... It has stopped being about the cities and started being a SWA vs. AA thing. But, FW is not going to let their interest in DFW go lightly. They'll fight to the death over it, as will AA and the other carriers at DFW. SWA has been unsuccessful so far and I don't think they will ever get it over turned.... It's just too big of a battle on too many fronts.... BUT THAT'S JUST MY OPINION SO DON'T ATTACK ME FOR IT... FOR THE RECORD - THAT IS NOT ME SPEWING FALSE FACTS. LOL

[713 To 214]

Willy,

Very thorough post.  And, I might add, very accurate.  Even though some on this board believe no one else has ever lived in both cities, I haved lived in west Houston, Spring and The Woodlands, as WELL AS Duncanville, Las Colinas, Fort Worth and North Dallas, before currently settling in the Heights.

The dust up over the Wright Amendment got rather ugly in the late 80s and early 90s...threats of lawsuits and such...but, as usual, it died down again.  Back then, Dallas was trying to get greedy and Ft Worth slapped them down.  This time, it appears to be more of a SWA instigated flare up.

I think Mayor Kirk is correct.  And this time FtW could do something about it.  It is no longer the stepchild that it used to be.  A family feud between Dallas and Ft Worth would hurt the entire Metroplex. 

One thing that often gets left out of this is that Love is very hemmed in.  Allowing airlines to fly to far away cities will bring in bigger jets, to the detriment of the neighborhood.  Let's hope they get things worked out, preferably by telling SWA to butt out.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Love Field Airport has a master plan approved by all affected neighborhood associations, the City of Dallas, and the FAA, that limits the type/size of aircraft that can fly in and out of the airport. So, that's a non-issue! From your extensive experience in the Metroplex, I thought you whould have picked up on that one.

[713 To 214]

SWA has been unsuccessful so far and I don't think they will ever get it over turned.... It's just too big of a battle on too many fronts.... BUT THAT'S JUST MY OPINION SO DON'T ATTACK ME FOR IT... FOR THE RECORD - THAT IS NOT ME SPEWING FALSE FACTS. LOL

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Maybe this will change your opinion:

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dw...ht.307d64f.html