maggie Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 This property (directly behind Someburger), and its 2 adjacent properties to the west, have been vacant since I moved to Norhill 6 years ago. I queried PPNA about what they might know was planned for the property some time last year and the last post indicated the property was contaminated due to a dry cleaner occupying it some time ago. I recently contacted Harris County and the City to obtain any information they might have about the alleged contamination and received letters from both indicating there was no record in their files about contamination. So who determines if a property is contaminated? Why would the City and County not know if it were? How can I find out how contaminated the property is and what that means to me as a nearby homeowner? The property was sold to Natchez Properties LLC during this 6 year period and I have done a little research to try to find out what is planned there. This company, among many others (Airline Investments, Buffet, Inc., Pacemaker Homes, San Saba, Corp., L.P. Investments, Inc.), is connected to Joe F. Wheat. Anyone have an idea about how I should approach finding out about the contamination and the plans for the property? Thanks, I am a new poster but have visited this forum many times and appreciate all of the information and opinions offered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNiche Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 This property (directly behind Someburger), and its 2 adjacent properties to the west, have been vacant since I moved to Norhill 6 years ago. I queried PPNA about what they might know was planned for the property some time last year and the last post indicated the property was contaminated due to a dry cleaner occupying it some time ago.I recently contacted Harris County and the City to obtain any information they might have about the alleged contamination and received letters from both indicating there was no record in their files about contamination.So who determines if a property is contaminated? Why would the City and County not know if it were?How can I find out how contaminated the property is and what that means to me as a nearby homeowner?The property was sold to Natchez Properties LLC during this 6 year period and I have done a little research to try to find out what is planned there. This company, among many others (Airline Investments, Buffet, Inc., Pacemaker Homes, San Saba, Corp., L.P. Investments, Inc.), is connected to Joe F. Wheat.Anyone have an idea about how I should approach finding out about the contamination and the plans for the property?Thanks, I am a new poster but have visited this forum many times and appreciate all of the information and opinions offered.There are way too many entities competing over environmental causes IMO. Between the City of Houston, the Texas Commission on Environmental Quality (TCEQ), and the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), collecting information gets to be quite a chore. And they don't make it easy either--their websites are not laid out in a way that makes obtaining data easy unless you know exactly what you're looking for or are a knowledgable environmental consultant. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJudge Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 The property is contaminated. It was a drycleaners years ago, and to get building permits the top 24" has to come off. Wheat has told me he is holding to sell to highest bidder. In addition, the neighborhood in the area is extremely vigorous, and active, and has successfully affected the commercial development in the area. As such, I don't anticipate anything with a "less than extremely friendly" attitude about building in the Heights will be met with a warm reception at that location. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J008 Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Anyone know what is being built on the big open lot between 11 1/2 and Someburger on Studemont? A black perimeter fence appears to have been put up today that I think says "cain construction" or something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heights_yankee Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 I just blogged about this today, as well. I have no idea but I emailed a pic to Swamplot so maybe we'll have answers soon... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOpens Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Interesting timing - Because of the 11th Street road construction, the course for the Houston Marathon on Sunday has been altered from past years. The "normal course" takes runners north on Michaux, west on 11th, and south on Studewood. This year, the course goes north on Michaux, west on Key, and south on Studewood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverJK Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 I heard it was going to be townhomes several months ago from someone, but probably just hearsay. We'll see. I've seen several cars destroy themselves on the entrance to that lot (its like a 2ft drop off). This is going to hurt the parking situation for Decapos and The Brazlian Arts Foundation (several of us Capoeiristas parked in that lot). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J008 Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Interesting timing - Because of the 11th Street road construction, the course for the Houston Marathon on Sunday has been altered from past years. The "normal course" takes runners north on Michaux, west on 11th, and south on Studewood. This year, the course goes north on Michaux, west on Key, and south on Studewood.Your explanation makes the most since to me. Come Monday it will go back to being the quasi waste dump big rig hangout that heights yankee more eloquently describes on her blog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heights_yankee Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Your explanation makes the most since to me. Come Monday it will go back to being the quasi waste dump big rig hangout that heights yankee more eloquently describes on her blog.Well, someone on my FB page pulled the permit and looks like it is going to be mixed use. Someone on the blog commented that they heard six stories. I wonder if the Heights Assoc is going to address that like they did on White Oak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J008 Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Well, someone on my FB page pulled the permit and looks like it is going to be mixed use. Someone on the blog commented that they heard six stories. I wonder if the Heights Assoc is going to address that like they did on White Oak.wow. I just looked it up and seems there will be ~$3 Million of construction there they got there permit on the 20th so the timing is only coincidence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverJK Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Yeah, looks like its a mixed use development. The property is owned by these guys. http://vitanuovallc.com/index.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J008 Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Yeah, looks like its a mixed use development. The property is owned by these guys. http://vitanuovallc.com/index.htmlyes their website is very strange, whole bunch of extremely non-specific hype. "Novemeber 2010. Purchased land for development" "December 2010. Completed design for latest development concept" Picture of downtown Houston.Thats it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pschawe Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 the only description I have found is "shell/retail, residential and parking garage". It has also been registered as LEED on US Green Construction website Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 http://swamplot.com/studewood-place-some-new-building-behind-the-11th-st-someburger/2011-01-25/From Swamplot's article:"They’re planning a cast-in-place concrete structure with an all- or mostly masonry exterior, containing apartments or condos and “some retail.” Also included: some multi-level parking and some “really cool green space.” Car entrances will be on both Studewood and 11th 1/2. The architect is from San Antonio; a local historical consultant is working to make sure the design is what the developer considers “period appropriate.” The long-vacant site is the former home of the Globe Laundry; the new project is registered under TCEQ’s Dry Cleaner Remediation Program, which the developer says doesn’t appear to require any solvent cleanup on the site. Vita Nuova plans to put a sign up soon announcing more details in the next 30 days." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
callisthenes Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 I live about 1/2 a block away from the development, my neighbor (who is three houses closer) said he talked to the foremen on site the other day. The foreman described it as an 8 story project, we surmise two stories for the ground floor retail and six stories for whatever else. Have to monitor site to see how big the excavation for the piers are. It seems pretty big from my vantage point, but I'd like to see drawings; wonder if they'll match colors with Someburger?Another thought about the "new developer", wondering if it could be a front/spinoff for an established company, since I imagine a start up design firm might have a hard time getting the financial backing for a project this size right off the bat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heights_yankee Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I live about 1/2 a block away from the development, my neighbor (who is three houses closer) said he talked to the foremen on site the other day. The foreman described it as an 8 story project, we surmise two stories for the ground floor retail and six stories for whatever else. Have to monitor site to see how big the excavation for the piers are. It seems pretty big from my vantage point, but I'd like to see drawings; wonder if they'll match colors with Someburger?Another thought about the "new developer", wondering if it could be a front/spinoff for an established company, since I imagine a start up design firm might have a hard time getting the financial backing for a project this size right off the bat.I heard it's the same guys who did 2727 Kirby. However, I am surprised if those guys have the capital considering I heard that high rise was kind of a flop??? On the other hand, there is another "developer" out of CT with the same name and it seems like this is a spin off of that group. Either that or these guys are 100% ripping off someone else's ideas.http://www.vitanuova.net/index.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fwki Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 On the other hand, there is another "developer" out of CT with the same name and it seems like this is a spin off of that group. Either that or these guys are 100% ripping off someone else's ideas.http://www.vitanuova.net/index.phpI see the similarities in the published profiles to "economically rehabilitate environmentally distraught land". The CT company looks like the parent which provides services to remediate, handle stakeholder engagement and market on behalf of owners of tainted properties. The plan here may be to remediate the dry cleaner contamination and handle the NIMBY's to a point where the property can be flipped for a profit or developed by the client. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFB Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Anyone know whats happening with the SE corner of the street? It looks like there's some work being done on the abandoned building there (stone work and paint on the exterior). I thought I remembered reading about plans for a restaurant there a while ago, but haven't heard anything since... any scoop?And, it looks like plans are moving full-steam ahead and quickly with the project on the NW corner behind Some Burger... they've already dug a gigantic hole that takes up much of the property. Looks like it will be used for underground parking or a deep foundation... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angostura Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Anyone know whats happening with the SE corner of the street? It looks like there's some work being done on the abandoned building there (stone work and paint on the exterior). I thought I remembered reading about plans for a restaurant there a while ago, but haven't heard anything since... any scoop?Restaurant. Same owners as BRC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonic0boom Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Restaurant. Same owners as BRC.Liberty Kitchen, if the name stays ....Were they able to work around the issues with serving alcohol near the school? I thought i heard something about the building being grandfathered in since it was there before the school, but i'm not sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCR Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Liberty Kitchen, if the name stays ....Were they able to work around the issues with serving alcohol near the school? I thought i heard something about the building being grandfathered in since it was there before the school, but i'm not sure.Still gonna be Liberty Kitchen. If there were issues about selling alcohol, they would have never gone ahead with the project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonic0boom Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Well, i heard that there were issues, but they obviously got them figured out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJudge Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Its within 1000 feet of Middle School property line. No way to work around. Can't sell liquor. If it going in, its going in without liquor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Its within 1000 feet of Middle School property line. No way to work around. Can't sell liquor. If it going in, its going in without liquor.Actually, there is a possibility to get around it if the premise derives less than 50% of its revenue from the sale of alcoholic beverages, and it has a food and beverage permit from TABC. See TABC Sec. 109.33 (f). However, the 300 foot rule still applies. This property appears to lie within 300 feet of a public school. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J008 Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Actually, there is a possibility to get around it if the premise derives less than 50% of its revenue from the sale of alcoholic beverages, and it has a food and beverage permit from TABC. See TABC Sec. 109.33 (f). However, the 300 foot rule still applies. This property appears to lie within 300 feet of a public school.Maybe they will get around it however Paulie's and Lanier Middle do (I think they are a "club" or something). There is no way they are 300 ft apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonic0boom Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 BRC does not sell hard alcohol -- just beer and wine -- so it is likely this place will be the same. If that is, indeed, the case, how would it factor in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J008 Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 they have really done a lot of work in the past month and I am just curious if anyone has any updated info (their website has nothing of value). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricco67 Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 Just drive by a bit ago and was surprised by how deep that hole is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fwki Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 Just drive by a bit ago and was surprised by how deep that hole is.Maybe the perc contamination from the former dry cleaner is really bad. The site was listed in the top 5 priority of Texas contamination sites, and the remediation effort is underway. To quote cleantechnica.com " TCE and perc contamination is notoriously difficult to remediate. Unlike oil, which floats, TCE and perc are more dense than water. In an aquifer, they sink to the bottom. Further complicating the problem is their solubility, of which they have very little. Instead of diluting evenly through an area, they form plumes that contain a relatively small core of concentrated contaminants. The core is often difficult if not impossible to find, and it can continue to leach contaminants into the aquifer, polluting the fresh water that enters for an indefinite period of time. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samagon Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 Wow, if that's the case about the cleanup, it's a wonder anyone decided to buy the property, since as I understand it, if the company that did the dumping isn't around to clean it up, the next person to use the land gets the honor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fwki Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 IMO, that's why they selected Vita Nuova as the front man for this Project; remediation of complex sites is their speciality. Check it out. http://www.vitanuova.net/index.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcook2002 Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 I think the hole is deep so they correctly support the structure they are building - might also be underground parking! I don't think this is remediation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 I don't think it is remediation, either, since there are already some support columns being poured in the hole. Remediation is generally conducted prior to any construction. I am not an expert, but it looks to be simply the foundation and lower level being built.For those who have not seen the hole, it is a square hole taking up most of the lot, and about 12 to 15 feet deep. There are what appear to be several columns under construction within the depression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fwki Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 I don't think it is remediation, either...The site had to be assessed at a minimum and remediated pending results prior to construction...it's actually number 6 on the priority list of 100+ sites. http://www.tceq.texas.gov/assets/public/remediation/dry_cleaners/priorlist_current.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcook2002 Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 Don't disagree...but the construction is well past remediation now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heights_yankee Posted April 3, 2011 Share Posted April 3, 2011 Don't disagree...but the construction is well past remediation nowForgive my ignorance on the process, but wouldn't removing all the contaminated soil be at least partial remediation? I mean, what ground was there is certainly not there any more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted April 3, 2011 Share Posted April 3, 2011 The net result would be that the site is remediated, but that is not the way it is normally done. The reason is that the contaminated soil must be disposed of properly, and it would be very expensive to dispose of an entire block 12 feet deep if it didn't all need to be remediated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heights_yankee Posted April 3, 2011 Share Posted April 3, 2011 The net result would be that the site is remediated, but that is not the way it is normally done. The reason is that the contaminated soil must be disposed of properly, and it would be very expensive to dispose of an entire block 12 feet deep if it didn't all need to be remediated.So they dug all the dirt out, technically making the site itself remediated but there is doubt that they disposed of it properly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted April 3, 2011 Share Posted April 3, 2011 No, I'm not suggesting that anything was done improperly. Imagine a lot that is 50,000 square feet in size. Now, imagine that the previous dry cleaner used to dispose of its toxic chemicals out the back door. The chemicals drained outward, taking up an area of 100 square feet. They also seeped downward for 10 feet. The other 49,900 square feet of the lot is not contaminated. Therefore, remediation is only required on the 100 square feet of contaminated soil, down to a depth of 10 feet. So, 1000 cubic feet of soil must be removed and taken to a toxic disposal site. This would be much less expensive than taking 500,000 cubic feet to a toxic disposal site. The other 499,000 cubic feet of soil can be taken anywhere. It could even be sold to someone who needs dirt to fill in a low spot on their land. Since it is not contaminated, it is far less expensive to dispose of that soil than the contaminated soil.When remediation is done, the soil is tested, and only the contaminated soil is removed, plus a little extra for good measure. Then the soil is retested to make sure the contamination is gone. Then the site is declared remediated, or clean. Once it is clean, no more testing or supervision is required. This is all done prior to any construction or dirt removal. In fact, I do not believe construction permits can even be issued on a site that requires remediation. It is very unlikely that the entire site had to be remediated to a depth of 12-15 feet, the size of that hole. It is also unlikely that they would be pouring support columns if the site was undergoing remediation. Since actual construction appears to be occurring, it appears to me that either remediation has already occurred, or testing showed remediation was not required.Iam basing this on what I know in general about remediation, not any specific knowledge of this site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heights_yankee Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 I see what you're saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fwki Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 ... and it would be very expensive to dispose of an entire block 12 feet deep if it didn't all need to be remediated.It's only expensive if you have to pay for it. The DCRP provides up to $5mm from the state to dig your foundation, er, I mean remediate your site.....not that a developer would take undue advantage of free money or anything. In any case, from the looks of it we don't have to worry about perc anymore, or that nasty lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samagon Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 is it possible that they took core samples at the beginning to better understand what needed to be disposed of appropriately or not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fwki Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 is it possible that they took core samples at the beginning to better understand what needed to be disposed of appropriately or not?I believe there is a $5,000 fee to register your site with the DCRP which is deductible against assessment costs. I would think coring is mandatory to asses perc contamination since perc tends to head for the water table instead of leach to surface. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcook2002 Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 is it possible that they took core samples at the beginning to better understand what needed to be disposed of appropriately or not? almost 100% possible - most likely before they even bought the site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
native_Houstonian Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 I haven't driven by lately..is it out of the ground yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcook2002 Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 not yet. still working on the below ground walls and pilings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J008 Posted May 26, 2011 Share Posted May 26, 2011 just curious if anyone has any update on this site. They are making huge progress. The big hole they dug is all walled with concrete, a visible paring garage ramp in the back, a big crane, and several pillars sticking out.Really curious what this thing will wind up being. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiko Posted May 26, 2011 Share Posted May 26, 2011 Express Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J008 Posted May 26, 2011 Share Posted May 26, 2011 ExpressPlease say it isnt' so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J008 Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 (edited) Swamplot has something on the design for this spot. Looks pretty cool, hope they keep the rooftop pool.http://swamplot.com/...-03/#more-29399 Edited June 3, 2011 by J008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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