Houston Ranked as World's 2nd Most Boring City to Visit

[AtticaFlinch]

I would say that tourist see Dallas as notch better then Houston.

You would? Really, you? How would Atlanta rank in your comparison?

Dallas has the History of the TV Show Dallas,

Which mattered in 1985. We live in the time of Back to the Future II, not the first Back to the Future. We have hoverboards and Jaws 10 now; the TV show Dallas couldn't be less important.

The Second most valuable sports team in the WORLD! (Dallas Cowboys)

Who gives a squirt? Even when they won championships, they were one of the most boring teams to watch. I'll take the run and shoot anyday over the flawless yet utilitarian performances of Aikman and Smith.

and possibly the most popular, the original Six Flags,

I really don't think that's as big a draw as you think it is. Six Flags isn't a destination theme park, like Disney or Seaworld. Six Flags is one of those places you say, "Yeesh, I'm in Dallas and bored out of my skull. There ain't naught to do in this town but piddly around in some microscopic arts district and ride some trains out to the 'burbs. I guess I'll go to Six Flags since it's not as if I can go to the beach or do anything else worthwhile."

transit oriented development, a sort of Time Square area,

Where? What is this Times Square in Dallas? Who visits Dallas' Time Square? What are you even talking about?

Fort Worth,

This is a positive?

The JFK Museum (Or what ever its called),

So impressive is this place, the name totally slips my mind.

their new Arts District, etc.

The sixteen square blocks that houses all the theaters and museums in Dallas? That Arts District? The one that's roughly 1/10 the size of Houston's two combined arts and museum concentrations? That one?

I also want to add that the youth in Dallas are known as trend setters to many around the country. Many of the dance styles you see on BET and MTV lately come from Dallas youth along with bringing back the old high top haircuts with a futuristic twist.

Youth in Dallas are known as trendsetters? This just gives me another reason to dislike teenagers.

Believe it or not, Houston is a very popular city for nightlife, especially in the urban community.

I don't think a single person who posts here won't believe it. We all know Houston is the epicenter of dirrty south - or whatever the kids these days are calling it.

Many people come from other States just to go clubbing in Houston.

People are lame.

[C2H]

I would say that tourist see Dallas as notch better then Houston. Dallas has the History of the TV Show Dallas, The Second most valuable sports team in the WORLD! (Dallas Cowboys) and possibly the most popular, the original Six Flags, transit oriented development, a sort of Time Square area, Fort Worth, The JFK Museum (Or what ever its called), their new Arts District, etc. I also want to add that the youth in Dallas are known as trend setters to many around the country. Many of the dance styles you see on BET and MTV lately come from Dallas youth along with bringing back the old high top haircuts with a futuristic twist.

Believe it or not, Houston is a very popular city for nightlife, especially in the urban community. Many people come from other States just to go clubbing in Houston.

ciykid, i usualy agree with alot of what you say regarding Houston tourism and agree it could be stepped up a few notches but the statements you made about Dallas's tourism are false. The only thing that gave Dallas the tourism edge was Westend, and since Westend Market place closed, the area hasn't been the same and has been struggling. Meanwhile, Houston's began to catch up and get on par with the development of Discovery Green, opening up of new restaurants on Main Street, and the Houston Pavilions. You mention all these crazy things about Dallas for tourism, but you also failed to mention the Washngton Avenue corridor, which is showing signs of becoming the next 6th Street. You mention a JFK museum, but what about Houston's museum district, Theater District, Buffalo Bayou restoration, etc.

I like Dallas and all but it has more of a neighborhood "structured" feel than a city regardless of their transit oriented areas. The light rail doesn't go through dense, urban clusters like in Houston, although I do like the fact that they have a 2.5 mile subway segment from Mockingbird Station to downtown. I wish Houston would do more grade separations with rail, but maybe in the future.

It just seems like you're giving Dallas a little too much credit. The Niche was right, it's a cool looking city but very sterile in terms of feel.

[sidegate]

Dallas has more brand recognition than Houston as far as Texas goes. When I told people I was going to live here they asked if it was near Dallas. That said, neither features very highly on the list of visitable cities in the US, at least where I hail from. My decision was 100% work.

But I suppose this is sort of veering into that other thread about whether we love the city or are just passing through.....

[sidegate]

Osaka is not a mecca for tourists and it has (really cool) rail transport. I'll agree that transportation is important, but let's dispense with the argument that it has to conform to some particular physical form.

I'd actually really like to visit Osaka and the fact that it has rail transport is not a negative for me.

[sidegate]

Washngton Avenue corridor, which is showing signs of becoming the next 6th Street.

Potentially, but there are fundamental differences.

Sixth Street = Relatively narrow pavement, 0 ft setback period buildings, sidewalks that don't resemble anorexic caterpillars, university culture

Washington = Stucco stripmalls set back from the street behind parking lots, wide, fast street that is difficult to cross on foot (tried it many times), and narrow poorly maintained footpaths that often necessitate walking in single file. Not to mention a highly vocal residential community that isn't down with the bar/club scene at all.

Washington's got a long way to go.

[AtticaFlinch]

Sixth Street = Relatively narrow pavement, 0 ft setback period buildings, sidewalks that don't resemble anorexic caterpillars, university culture

Washington = Stucco stripmalls set back from the street behind parking lots, wide, fast street that is difficult to cross on foot (tried it many times), and narrow poorly maintained footpaths that often necessitate walking in single file. Not to mention a highly vocal residential community that isn't down with the bar/club scene at all.

It'll never truly be Washington, at least not in the Sixth Street, Bourbon Street or Beale Street sense of urban, pedestrian-only scenes. Houston's best bet for something like that is the Island in Midtown or the northen parts of Main in Downtown, not Washington.

[citykid09]

Dallas has more brand recognition than Houston as far as Texas goes. When I told people I was going to live here they asked if it was near Dallas. That said, neither features very highly on the list of visitable cities in the US, at least where I hail from. My decision was 100% work.

But I suppose this is sort of veering into that other thread about whether we love the city or are just passing through.....

Thats what I was trying to get at with my last post. people know more about Dallas Attractions, Houston's attractions are mostly local.

Pretty much anytime I see something advertising Houston this is the same old generic information I get out of it:

• 4th largest city
  
• More theater seats then any other city besides NYC
  
• Fist word spoken on the moon
  
• and maybe something about the Astrodome
  

Come on City of Houston, you wear the hell out of those 1st two. Its the little things that matter the most and the city just doesn't get it. I believe that I am the one that got the city to change the name of their seasonal travel guide from I think OVG to HOUSTON after I did some complaining. Why would you name you visitors guide OVG? A major problem I think with the cities tourism also has to do with the over all state of mind in Houston. Its more of a every man for himself kind of place. The city refuses to interfere with zoning and its like more like anything goes. It does the bare minimum on pretty much everything. Nothing can be lavish in Houston because the citizens complain about their taxes being taken. Overall Its the state of mind of the city oh Houston. Many of the citizens who speak out (The Debbie Downers) want the city to be an anything goes just don't take from me kind of city. The people who would like order (The Progressives) such as zoning, rail transit, attractions brought in and a walkable city don't speak out. I see both of those personalities here on HAIF.

[20thStDad]

Thats what I was trying to get at with my last post. people know more about Dallas Attractions, Houston's attractions are mostly local.

Pretty much anytime I see something advertising Houston this is the same old generic information I get out of it:

• 4th largest city
• More theater seats then any other city besides NYC
• Fist word spoken on the moon
• and maybe something about the Astrodome

Come on City of Houston, you wear the hell out of those 1st two. Its the little things that matter the most and the city just doesn't get it. I believe that I am the one that got the city to change the name of their seasonal travel guide from I think OVG to HOUSTON after I did some complaining. Why would you name you visitors guide OVG? A major problem I think with the cities tourism also has to do with the over all state of mind in Houston. Its more of a every man for himself kind of place. The city refuses to interfere with zoning and its like more like anything goes. It does the bare minimum on pretty much everything. Nothing can be lavish in Houston because the citizens complain about their taxes being taken. Overall Its the state of mind of the city oh Houston. Many of the citizens who speak out (The Debbie Downers) want the city to be an anything goes just don't take from me kind of city. The people who would like order (The Progressives) such as zoning, rail transit, attractions brought in and a walkable city don't speak out. I see both of those personalities here on HAIF.

I'm not wearing any of those out. I don't like tourists, they can stay in Florida and Mexico or wherever. If they showed up here we would just have more traffic and slower drivers, and more crappy theme restaurants. I just don't see the point of what you keep whining about. Do you want Houston to suck more, or do you just dream of living in Orlando or some other place that has no soul?

[ricco67]

While I pretty much disagree with quite a bit of what CityKid says, I agree with a few, but it has to do with more of keeping the locals, business people, convention business, and Patients from the TMC entertained than for bringing in tourists.

Major Concerts, Conventions, and TMC has a tendency to bring in PLENTY of people to the city who drop money in our local economy. It's those people that we need to focus on and not the "casual tourist". If a conventioneer, Patient, traveling businessman, or a visiting concert goer enjoys their experience here, then that alone would be advertising on what there IS to do here. If they don't like it here, well, there are other cities and we don't need their snotty attitude.

Bring in more (Major) Concerts, more conventions, Expand TMC's Rep, advertise the Live music scene. Give them a reason to be here, the rest will take care of itself.

I would love for the city to maybe "zone" an entertainment/bar district. The problem with this is that NIMBY's would go nuts. so this isn't a realistic option, so throw that "Times square" thing out the window.

It ain't going to happen.

[sidegate]

Throw this entire thread out the window. It is all based on some nobody's blog and acerbated by a bunch of know-nothing imbeciles who live in a dream and think that a few postings at HAIF are going to magically turn Houston into New York, Atlanta or some other town their parents took them to.

I'll assume for the sake of argument you mean exacerbated. Proceeding on that assumption, you and your kindred posters are one of the reasons many threads at HAIF are doomed to degenerate into little more than megaphone-strewn battlefields that not only discourage meaningful, informed discourse, they nourish and ensure the promulgation of ignorance.

[citykid09]

I'll assume for the sake of argument you mean exacerbated. Proceeding on that assumption, you and your kindred posters are one of the reasons many threads at HAIF are doomed to degenerate into little more than megaphone-strewn battlefields that not only discourage meaningful, informed discourse, they nourish and ensure the promulgation of ignorance.

Exactly. +1

So many people here have the attitude of who cares which is why I think Houston is how it is. One other thing I do want to mention though is the summer heat. It seems like it has gotten worst lately, I don't remember it being this hot in past summers. I think the heat is also a deterrent for potential tourist. By the way is Houston the only city in the US with heat and humidity like this? How do other cities compare? Don't you wish the water in the Gulf was cool like the Pacific? Imagine how comfortable it would be here in the summers.

[C2H]

Exactly. +1

So many people here have the attitude of who cares which is why I think Houston is how it is. One other thing I do want to mention though is the summer heat. It seems like it has gotten worst lately, I don't remember it being this hot in past summers. I think the heat is also a deterrent for potential tourist. By the way is Houston the only city in the US with heat and humidity like this? How do other cities compare? Don't you wish the water in the Gulf was cool like the Pacific? Imagine how comfortable it would be here in the summers.

Actually Citykid, the entre East Coast I hear is burning hot and humid this summer in the tripple digits. This summer has been bad everywhere. From Wisconsin, Minneapolis and northwest, people been dropping like flies (dying) from the heat. Houston will never be able to do anything about the heat factor here, unfortunately.

No hard feelings though, I share alot of your frustrations with Houston too. It seems like Dallas is more proactive on doing things to asthetically enhance their city without actually building the city. They do things more to "look" cool rather than "feel" cool and I think that's one thing Houston may be doing better right now. Dallas feels no more urban than Houston and really has nothing noteworthy of more tourism. That's where my disagreements were in your previous post.

[AtticaFlinch]

I don't like tourists, they can stay in Florida and Mexico or wherever.

I don't even like tourists when I'm traveling. Whenever I'm abroad and asked "You speak English?" by some fannypack-wearing, overweight Midwesterner, my answer is always, "Nein."

Never assume, it make an Ass out of YOU.

I assume we've met in real life because you stole my line. I totally invented dropping the "and me".

[TheNiche]

By the way is Houston the only city in the US with heat and humidity like this? How do other cities compare? Don't you wish the water in the Gulf was cool like the Pacific? Imagine how comfortable it would be here in the summers.

If my grandmother had a ____, she'd be my grandfather.

[20thStDad]

I don't even like tourists when I'm traveling. Whenever I'm abroad and asked "You speak English?" by some fannypack-wearing, overweight Midwesterner, my answer is always, "Nein."

Just be careful if they are wearing a fanny pack along with socks and sandals. Then they'll get mega excited thinking they found another weird German to talk to.

[Subdude]

I'm not wearing any of those out. I don't like tourists, they can stay in Florida and Mexico or wherever. If they showed up here we would just have more traffic and slower drivers, and more crappy theme restaurants...Do you want Houston to suck more, or do you just dream of living in Orlando or some other place that has no soul?

I don't think Houston can realistically ever be much of a tourist destination, but there's certainly nothing wrong with tourism. It is a clean industry that can support a lot of jobs. After having lived in tourist destination I don't think the locals look at tourists as any particular inconvenience.

[Subdude]

I would love for the city to maybe "zone" an entertainment/bar district. The problem with this is that NIMBY's would go nuts. so this isn't a realistic option, so throw that "Times square" thing out the window.

It ain't going to happen.

At one point it looked like that would have been downtown, which always made sense to me, but the "scene" has since moved on.

[Subdude]

Do you want Houston to suck more, or do you just dream of living in Orlando or some other place that has no soul?

Which brings us back to the original topic: Does Houston really have "soul"?

I don't want those people drawn here, ruining the off-beat experience that we have.

Is Houston truly "off-beat"?

Houston's a quirky and irreverent city.

Is Houston particularly "quirky and irreverent"?

Or is this really a boring city to visit?

Maybe it's just me, but boring doesn't seem the worst thing when it comes to places to live. I just have a hard time seeing Houston as this wacky, irreverent, off-beat place (except that now we have a "hip" neighborhood called "EaDo". If that isn't soulful, I don't know what is! ).

[AtticaFlinch]

Is Houston particularly "quirky and irreverent"?

Ok, quirky is a no. Quirky is lame. Quirky is Austin. Quirky can be commoditized and advertised and sold to the highest bidder. Quirky is on sale at a tourist trap kiosk in a mall near you. Houston isn't that.

Irreverent though? Absolutely. But you won't find it on a scavenger hunt or in the Galleria or the Woodlands or Sugarland. It's in the people here, the people who care about this place. It's in the people who want to stay true to our irreverent roots and not force some plastic Mickey Mouse identity on a city it doesn't fit. Houston isn't seeking an identity. It has one.

[20thStDad]

I don't think Houston can realistically ever be much of a tourist destination, but there's certainly nothing wrong with tourism. It is a clean industry that can support a lot of jobs. After having lived in tourist destination I don't think the locals look at tourists as any particular inconvenience.

I'm saying I'm ok with that. I don't mind being a tourist in a tourist destination, I just wouldn't want to live in a tourist destination surrounded by tourists all the time. Maybe if I ran a restaurant or some public business I would look at it differently.

Which brings us back to the original topic: Does Houston really have "soul"?

Maybe, but on the soul scale it definitely ranks way ahead of the manufactured theme-park-parking-lot-ness of Orlando is all I'm saying. That's the bottom of the ladder.

Is Houston truly "off-beat"?

I don't think so. It's pretty "normal" here.

Is Houston particularly "quirky and irreverent"?

Definitely not.

Or is this really a boring city to visit?

Yes! Which is fine.

It's a nice place to live. I hope citykid never succeeds at his goal to change that.

[TheNiche]

Which brings us back to the original topic: Does Houston really have "soul"?

Is Houston truly "off-beat"?

Is Houston particularly "quirky and irreverent"?

Or is this really a boring city to visit?

Maybe it's just me, but boring doesn't seem the worst thing when it comes to places to live. I just have a hard time seeing Houston as this wacky, irreverent, off-beat place (except that now we have a "hip" neighborhood called "EaDo". If that isn't soulful, I don't know what is! ).

I think that there's a communication problem, here. Allow me to define a place like Austin as lacking a soul, being the "on-beat", conforming to expectations, and being a really exciting city for really boring people (hill country aesthetics notwithstanding).

Houston encompasses a lot of genuinely "off beat" "quirky" neighborhoods. And I'm not talking about Montrose or the Heights. Those places are utterly boring. The ones I'm talking about will never be marketable to the masses (in part because the masses fear cancer). Most people will never know about them. This was something that I really put together when I was censusing. Think: deer skulls in the trees, glaring down at you. Think: a prostitute with fourteen male roommates, unhesitantly welcoming you into their abode. Think about a small town where seemingly everybody knows each other...embedded within the City.

[crunchtastic]

You can build attractions, resorts, shopping malls, casinos, and any combination thereof, you can create a hip music scene, give away incentives like mad to bring convention and cruise business, but creating 'Tourism' doesn't define a place in any sense other than dollars. Most people visit places to relax and consume (art, music, food, booze, young Thai boys, etc). But it's the seekers who latch onto something beyond the buildings or the landscape. I think it's only when people have something missing in their lives and find it in a destination, who collectivley, over time, turn a place into something special. And in that regard, no, Houston doesn't and will never offer that special something for visitors. Doesn't mean we can't build a succesful tourist destination for travel consumers, but it does mean we can't be Paris or Manhattan or whatever.

'Quirky', 'hip', 'irreverant' 'off-beat' 'soul', are all marketing words (some co-opted more recently than others) meant to separate someone from their money regarldess of whether you're buying an evening's entertainment or a place to live. They're not measures of actual human value. More people should put on their critical thinking hats and not conflate the two. (not a reference to Niche above, btw)

[citykid09]

Houston encompasses a lot of genuinely "off beat" "quirky" neighborhoods. And I'm not talking about Montrose or the Heights. Those places are utterly boring.

Good to see I am not the only one who thinks the Heights is boring. I don't see the appeal of streets with ditches in the middle of a city.

[20thStDad]

Good to see I am not the only one who thinks the Heights is boring. I don't see the appeal of streets with ditches in the middle of a city.

It's a freaking neighborhood. People live there. The appeal is that you can buy a house there, live in it, and when you want to go somewhere in Houston you're already close to it. And, you can get drunk and argue about Wal-Mart lots. If it was a place you said "hot damn, I want to go there!!", I wouldn't want to live anywhere near it. I'm still not understanding what you expect can or should be done. Can you just get your mom to go buy a sim-city game to scratch that itch?

[rsb320]

And I'm not talking about Montrose or the Heights. Those places are utterly boring.

Come on over to Montrose, Niche. I'll show you a good time.

[AtticaFlinch]

Can you just get your mom to go buy a sim-city game to scratch that itch?

Back when SimCity had 4-bit graphics, the most successful city I'd built had no roads, but had rail everywhere. Would tearing up all our roads and replacing them with tracks make our city more tourist friendly? It would certainly be unique. Maybe we can tear out our roads and replace them with canals. It would be very European. That's what we're trying to achieve, right?

[KinkaidAlum]

Houston should stop trying to follow NYC. Instead of cracking down on sexually oriented businesses, we should embrace them. We can become a tourist mecca for titty bars, Asian massage parlors, glory holes, and gay bathhouses. My out of town friends get a kick out of sitting outside at the West Alabama Ice House while wondering what's going on across the street at the Hollywood Spa.

[ricco67]

Houston should stop trying to follow NYC. Instead of cracking down on sexually oriented businesses, we should embrace them. We can become a tourist mecca for titty bars, Asian massage parlors, glory holes, and gay bathhouses. My out of town friends get a kick out of sitting outside at the West Alabama Ice House while wondering what's going on across the street at the Hollywood Spa.

I agree. Leave the T-bars alone. You wouldn't believe how well Houston is known for them. The gay bath houses is another thing that makes the regular rounds. Apparently, Houston is considered quite gay friendly.

[TheNiche]

Good to see I am not the only one who thinks the Heights is boring. I don't see the appeal of streets with ditches in the middle of a city.

I do. But does anybody ever bother to go crawdadding in the Heights? Kind of negates the benefit if they don't use it.

[TheNiche]

Come on over to Montrose, Niche. I'll show you a good time.