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Wal-Mart to invade the Heights

Walmart at Yale & I-10: For or Against  

160 members have voted

This poll is closed to new votes
  1. 1. Q1: Regarding the proposed WalMart at Yale and I-10:

    • I live within a 3 mile radius (as the crow flies) and am FOR this Walmart
      41
    • I live within a 3 mile radius (as the crow flies) and am AGAINST this Walmart
      54
    • I live outside a 3 mile radius (as the crow flies) and am FOR this Walmart
      30
    • I live outside a 3 mile radius (as the crow flies) and am AGAINST this Walmart
      26
    • Undecided
      9
  2. 2. Q2: If/when this proposed WalMart is built at Yale & I-10

    • I am FOR this WalMart and will shop at this WalMart
      45
    • I am FOR this WalMart but will not shop at this WalMart
      23
    • I am AGAINST this WalMart but will shop at this WalMart
      7
    • I am AGAINST this WalMart and will not shop at this WalMart
      72
    • Undecided
      13
  3. 3. Q3: WalMart in general

    • I am Pro-Walmart
      16
    • I am Anti-Walmart
      63
    • I don't care either way
      72
    • Undecided
      9


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Was Wal-Mart approached by the owner of the property on Yale between I-10 and Washington to buy the land? This is the same property H-E-B was looking at to build a new store along the lines of the one on Bunker Hill. Is the deal done with Wal-Mart? I've heard yes. What does this mean to the likes of our Heights Mom and Pops? What will that do to the traffic patterns on Yale and Washington? Google "Wal Mart parking lot crime" and let us know our thoughts!

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Was Wal-Mart approached by the owner of the property on Yale between I-10 and Washington to buy the land? This is the same property H-E-B was looking at to build a new store along the lines of the one on Bunker Hill. Is the deal done with Wal-Mart? I've heard yes. What does this mean to the likes of our Heights Mom and Pops? What will that do to the traffic patterns on Yale and Washington? Google "Wal Mart parking lot crime" and let us know our thoughts!

That made me throw up in my mouth a little

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Was Wal-Mart approached by the owner of the property on Yale between I-10 and Washington to buy the land? This is the same property H-E-B was looking at to build a new store along the lines of the one on Bunker Hill. Is the deal done with Wal-Mart? I've heard yes. What does this mean to the likes of our Heights Mom and Pops? What will that do to the traffic patterns on Yale and Washington? Google "Wal Mart parking lot crime" and let us know our thoughts!

I certainly hope that the rumor is true. It'd be an enormous convenience for low-income families living in the inner loop. But I doubt it.

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Oh I hope this does not happen. What a sad day indeed if this is the case. Wal-Mart killing the beauty of the mom-and-pop feel of the Heights with their corporate greed and ugliness.

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No.

Yes, it's gross. That said, the pork chops I bought at Walmart on the way home from work tonight were delicious. (The chorizo pizza will have to wait till the weekend. I don't want to subject my coworkers to the next day madness.)

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Oh I hope this does not happen. What a sad day indeed if this is the case. Wal-Mart killing the beauty of the mom-and-pop feel of the Heights with their corporate greed and ugliness.

Perfect! A central wal-mart not in my neighborhood is exactly what I've been hoping for....j/k. Well, sort of

But seriously, it does seem like a pretty good place for one, and it's not like it's smack dab in the middle of the Heights. I also don't see how this would kill the mom-and-pops when Target hasn't

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Perfect! A central wal-mart not in my neighborhood is exactly what I've been hoping for....j/k. Well, sort of

But seriously, it does seem like a pretty good place for one, and it's not like it's smack dab in the middle of the Heights. I also don't see how this would kill the mom-and-pops when Target hasn't

Well, most likely, if it's going on a lot sized for an HEB similar to the one on Buffalo Speedway, this lot will only be able to contain one of Walmart's high-end grocery concept stores. I doubt it'll bring in all the riff-raff associated with normal Walmarts.

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Perfect! A central wal-mart not in my neighborhood is exactly what I've been hoping for....j/k. Well, sort of

But seriously, it does seem like a pretty good place for one, and it's not like it's smack dab in the middle of the Heights. I also don't see how this would kill the mom-and-pops when Target hasn't

I do think this is a pretty good point. I mean people who are going to shop our local stores are going to shop them regardless of what big box discounter opens near by. Walmart did ruin/close most small businesses in my hometown but that is because it's a small, low income community that doesn't realize more money filters in to your own economy when you buy local.

I don't dislike the idea of Walmart simply for it's potential effects on small business. I dislike them because they pay poorly, are well known for discriminatory (gender and race) practices, send money and manufacturing jobs to China, don't pay their employees enough to pay for their corporate health care plan and often refuse to hire people above 30 hours a week so they can't even qualify for that plan, plus other business practices that I feel harm American workers and companies trying to stay competitive while keeping as much work as they can made in the US.

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For a while there, Northline Commons was supposed to be getting a WalMart. Wonder if thats still the case. If so, this spot wouldn't make any sense at all.

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Well, most likely, if it's going on a lot sized for an HEB similar to the one on Buffalo Speedway, this lot will only be able to contain one of Walmart's high-end grocery concept stores. I doubt it'll bring in all the riff-raff associated with normal Walmarts.

are you saying all the people from www.peopleofwalmart.com are hiding at home?....just waiting for a walmart to be built near them so they can display all of their gloriousness?

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See page 2 of this document

Granted the dates are wrong, but it does suggest a lease has been signed....

Perhaps, perhaps not. Notice the faded orange capital letters that read "NOT A |...". I'm almost positive that the last word is "PART". Which is to say, not only is the date wrong; it's a different property. We must be weary of broker flyers and gossip from authoritative sources.

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Having shopped at Walmart and recently at Ikea, I can safely say there is no difference in clientele. In fact, the Walmart that I stopped at in the Woodlands had far better clientele. Besides, now, that the City is sneaking an historic district in on me without letting me vote on it, and forcing me to hire an architect ever time I work on my house, I'll need the low prices that Walmart promises. I can't wait for them to start.

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Was Wal-Mart approached by the owner of the property on Yale between I-10 and Washington to buy the land? This is the same property H-E-B was looking at to build a new store along the lines of the one on Bunker Hill. Is the deal done with Wal-Mart? I've heard yes. What does this mean to the likes of our Heights Mom and Pops? What will that do to the traffic patterns on Yale and Washington? Google "Wal Mart parking lot crime" and let us know our thoughts!

Oh no, an empty area near some railroad tracks might turn into a Wal-Mart! Why is this bad? The same people who live around here will shop around here. If you don't like the people you live around, you might be in danger of seeing them at Wal-Mart. As for parking lot crime, that is much more about location than anything else so it would happen whether you put an HEB there or Wal-Mart.

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Was Wal-Mart approached by the owner of the property on Yale between I-10 and Washington to buy the land? This is the same property H-E-B was looking at to build a new store along the lines of the one on Bunker Hill. Is the deal done with Wal-Mart? I've heard yes. What does this mean to the likes of our Heights Mom and Pops? What will that do to the traffic patterns on Yale and Washington? Google "Wal Mart parking lot crime" and let us know our thoughts!

If this is true, I would have to guess that it won't be a regular "blue-label" Wal-Mart store. WM has been testing neighborhood grocery stores in Arizona named "Marketside". It's a little swankier than WM Neighborhood Market (like the one off of Hillcroft in Westbury).

This Marketside concept actually sounds exactly like what Heights residents have been wanting.

I would agree that lot is not nearly large enough for a typical WM big box store.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marketside

Supposedly they put their Marketside concepts on hold during the recession in 2009, but who knows, things may have changed since then.

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I don't think there is enough square footage at this location for a Wal-Mart parking lot; much less the Wal-Mart. Anyone know?

The typical suburban Wal-Mart Supercenter requires 20 to 25 acres for the store, parking, drainage and stormwater retention, landscaping, and loading docks. That's part of why I'm skeptical about this rumor, is that inner loop real estate is just too fragmented and expensive to accommodate that kind of footprint for a store that caters to the lower end of the market.

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The typical suburban Wal-Mart Supercenter requires 20 to 25 acres for the store, parking, drainage and stormwater retention, landscaping, and loading docks. That's part of why I'm skeptical about this rumor, is that inner loop real estate is just too fragmented and expensive to accommodate that kind of footprint for a store that caters to the lower end of the market.

Maybe they could do it like the Wal-mart and Sam's Club in downtown Honolulu -- Full-sized Wal-mart on the first floor, Full-sized Sam's club on the 2nd floor and an attached parking garage about 3 floors as I recall. I think the whole thing would fit on that lot.

Yes, from Google Earth measurements, the lot for the Honolulu Super Walmart / Sams Club is about 860ft x 820ft and the lot on Yale is about 900ft x 1000ft (if we're talking about the one where the old steel/iron works was on the west side of Yale).

post-5429-017142200 1277273392_thumb.jpg

Edited by heights

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That would help explain the urgency in which the unneccessary I-10 exits are being built. Wal-Mart almost always has some government assistance when they build a store.

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Ooh maybe it'll be 5 stories high too! LOL.

I kind of have a hard time believing this... if Starbucks had so much trouble coming into the area (and had to settle for the 610 feeder location), you'd think Walmart would too. You'd hope, at least.

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Maybe they could do it like the Wal-mart and Sam's Club in downtown Honolulu -- Full-sized Wal-mart on the first floor, Full-sized Sam's club on the 2nd floor and an attached parking garage about 3 floors as I recall. I think the whole thing would fit on that lot.

Yes, from Google Earth measurements, the lot for the Honolulu Super Walmart / Sams Club is about 860ft x 820ft and the lot on Yale is about 900ft x 1000ft (if we're talking about the one where the old steel/iron works was on the west side of Yale).

I can assure you, the Heights is not in any way shape or form comparable to Honolulu. That's not what we're getting.

If the parcel is about 21 acres, then they could squeeze a typical Supercenter onto it. It's physically feasible, and no doubt they'd be interested in at least evaluating the opportunity. Wal-Mart is in a very strong cash position, and this would be a good time for them to be acquiring and developing irreplaceable infill sites in core markets.

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Maybe it's just going to be one of their Neighborhood Markets like they have around town.  Honestly I don't know how you people in the Heights have survived this long without a Walmart. 

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Honestly I don't know how you people in the Heights have survived this long without a Walmart.

Quite nicely, thank you :rolleyes:

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Quite nicely, thank you :rolleyes:

You say that...but I gather that you've been indoctrinated to a subculture propagated by over-educated white people that features class-based shame and douchey shame-avoidance behavior as a central tenet.

If you were a low-earning Mexican that had called the Heights home all your life, you'd have likely lamented in 2005 that the Target on Sawyer Street was not a Wal-Mart Supercenter and would be thrilled at these rumors because you were tired of packing several generations of family into a car for a day trip to a distant suburban Wal-Mart.

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Ooh maybe it'll be 5 stories high too! LOL.

I kind of have a hard time believing this... if Starbucks had so much trouble coming into the area (and had to settle for the 610 feeder location), you'd think Walmart would too. You'd hope, at least.

Yep...the Honolulu store is the result of high land prices and limited availability as well as limited competition in their market space. I doubt that cost-conscience Walmart would find it economically feasible to build a similar store in a city like Houston.

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Hah, is Target just not good enough all of a sudden?

Edited by N Judah

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You say that...but I gather that you've been indoctrinated to a subculture propagated by over-educated white people that features class-based shame and douchey shame-avoidance behavior as a central tenet.

If you were a low-earning Mexican that had called the Heights home all your life, you'd have likely lamented in 2005 that the Target on Sawyer Street was not a Wal-Mart Supercenter and would be thrilled at these rumors because you were tired of packing several generations of family into a car for a day trip to a distant suburban Wal-Mart.

Hey Niche, back up a bit. Perhaps you ought to take a look in to the indoctrination mirror, especially from the "douchey" angle. Not everyone who lives in the Heights is a low-earning Mexican. There are quite a few high-earning Mexicans, as well as low-earning families from all the other categories you seem to be preinclined to reference, living in the Heights. Citing a stereotypical image of several generations of a Mexican family being packed in to a car is, dare I say it, douchey? Can I be just as tired of packing several generations of my anglo family in to a car to drive basically the same distance as the closest Wal-Mart to hit an H-E-B?

IMHO H-E-B has better quality products, wider selection, better customer service, and much better employee morale (due to Charles Butt actually caring about his employees)than Wal-Mart. H-E-B is a better neighbor than Wal-Mart. They care much more about the local community. Check out what they invest annually back in to the communities, not to mention their support of public schools. Don't believe me? Then you try to help out your local public school's annual Fall Festival, Spring Picnic or whatever. Ask your local H-E-B for a donation of food, water, gift cards, whatever, and you will be pleasantly surprised. Ask WalMart and you're lucky if you get a small, and I do mean small as in buy a couple of candy bars, gift card.

All I am saying is that I would much rather have someone who is vested in the prosperity of the local community, as H-E-B is, than a company like WalMart who is constantly in the press for all the new ways they have come up with to screw the little guys.

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Hah, is Target just not good enough all of a sudden?

It isn't. It is over-hyped, is over-priced, has a more limited selection, and does not operate 24 hours.

Let's be clear on this. If I want to buy a package of white t-shirts, three dozen cans of cat food, and blank CDs in one trip, I have a choice between Wal-Mart and Target; Wal-Mart is less expensive and more straightforward. If I'm shopping fairly late at night, as I'm prone to do, then Wal-Mart is my only choice. And if I need to buy a water meter key at 3:30 AM because a pipe burst, a nearby Wal-Mart is an absolute godsend.

And as for home fashion or work clothes, I'm not going to shop at a big box discounter, no matter how many thin, sexy 17-year-olds they have sporting their wares to energetic pop music. All that gimmickry is just lipstick on a pig. Some people respond to it; that's their problem, not mine.

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Hey Niche, back up a bit. Perhaps you ought to take a look in to the indoctrination mirror, especially from the "douchey" angle. Not everyone who lives in the Heights is a low-earning Mexican. There are quite a few high-earning Mexicans, as well as low-earning families from all the other categories you seem to be preinclined to reference, living in the Heights. Citing a stereotypical image of several generations of a Mexican family being packed in to a car is, dare I say it, douchey?

Believe it or not, that's actually a very specific story I got from a focus group that targeted Mexican families in your area. Take it for the anecdotal evidence it is, but many people live that life. And stereotypes are all to often rooted in truth.

Can I be just as tired of packing several generations of my anglo family in to a car to drive basically the same distance as the closest Wal-Mart to hit an H-E-B?

No, because you don't do that.

IMHO H-E-B has better quality products, wider selection, better customer service, and much better employee morale (due to Charles Butt actually caring about his employees)than Wal-Mart. H-E-B is a better neighbor than Wal-Mart. They care much more about the local community. Check out what they invest annually back in to the communities, not to mention their support of public schools. Don't believe me? Then you try to help out your local public school's annual Fall Festival, Spring Picnic or whatever. Ask your local H-E-B for a donation of food, water, gift cards, whatever, and you will be pleasantly surprised. Ask WalMart and you're lucky if you get a small, and I do mean small as in buy a couple of candy bars, gift card.

All I am saying is that I would much rather have someone who is vested in the prosperity of the local community, as H-E-B is, than a company like WalMart who is constantly in the press for all the new ways they have come up with to screw the little guys.

HEB doesn't compete with Wal-Mart in very many categories at all beyond grocery, pharmacy, and a limited assortment of household items. It's apples and oranges. HEB also brands itself to suit the local character, as they have using the Mi Tienda or Joe V's store concepts. I certainly won't dispute that they're more philanthropic than Wal-Mart, and if I had to live practically across the street from the one or the other, I'd prefer it be an HEB. Even then, I would appreciate having a Wal-Mart close by. Both stores are a community amenity, particularly when there are still low-earning families living there.

As for the little guys...what little guys in the Heights are going to compete with Wal-Mart? Are you that concerned that revenues at your local CVS might drop 20%? Please note that the Heights cannot be monopolized by Wal-Mart; as much as the "new Heights" wishes it were it's own distinct city separated from Houston and connected only by a streetcar line...it isn't. Get with the times.

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Ah well, if someone can't manage their time effectively, then maybe they should have to drive the extra few miles to find a Wal-Mart.

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No, because you don't do that.

Actually I do, so let's not argue facts.

As for the little guys...what little guys in the Heights are going to compete with Wal-Mart? Are you that concerned that revenues at your local CVS might drop 20%? Please note that the Heights cannot be monopolized by Wal-Mart; as much as the "new Heights" wishes it were it's own distinct city separated from Houston and connected only by a streetcar line...it isn't. Get with the times.

Get with the times? Really? My times are very reality based, juggling work and a family with young kids, trying to keep the neighborhood safe from the undue influence and influx of snarky pastafarians. :D

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Ah well, if someone can't manage their time effectively, then maybe they should have to drive the extra few miles to find a Wal-Mart.

Getting lots of different sorts of ho-hum generic items in a single trip and at a time of my choosing allows me to optimize productivity and do PT outdoors during scarce daylight hours and optimize my leisure time during the evening. Why should effective time management be deserving of a punitive reaction?

I think you're just jealous of the ease with which I reject the douchey mass-marketed sense of shame that I'm supposed to feel over shopping at Wal-Mart.

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What mom & pops? This is Houston - the 4th largest city in the nation and the 6th largest metro (soon to be 5th) area in the nation. This is one of the most interior neighborhoods of the city as well.

So what exactly is going to be preserved that as mentioned above hasn't already been closed down by Target, CVS, Walgreens, or Kroger if a Walmart isn't built there?

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Getting lots of different sorts of ho-hum generic items in a single trip and at a time of my choosing allows me to optimize productivity and do PT outdoors during scarce daylight hours and optimize my leisure time during the evening. Why should effective time management be deserving of a punitive reaction?

Punitive? We're building a Wal-Mart, not tearing one down. To put it another way: we certainly shouldn't bring traffic 24/7 into somebody else's neighborhood just to indulge your sense of entitlement, should we?

I think you're just jealous of the ease with which I reject the douchey mass-marketed sense of shame that I'm supposed to feel over shopping at Wal-Mart.

LoL. When I saw you say something similar above, I thought "project much?" but didn't say anything because I didn't want to incur a tantrum :)

Edited by N Judah

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Punitive? We're building a Wal-Mart, not tearing one down. To put it another way: we certainly shouldn't bring traffic 24/7 into somebody else's neighborhood just to indulge your sense of entitlement, should we?

A Wal-Mart should be brought into the community when people will shop there. And they will! I will. And I'll shop at Wal-Mart with much greater frequency when it isn't a 30-minute round trip.

What would you rather see there, an HEB with strip centers? Sooner or later, that land will be developed by something that will generate traffic...and that's too much land for merely another apartment project.

LoL. When I saw you say something similar above, I thought "project much?" but didn't say anything because I didn't want to incur a tantrum :)

I drank Lone Star before it was popular. And when it was adopted for the sake of irony and the price increased by $0.50 per six pack to reflect something more tasty than horse piss, I switched to 40oz King Cobras. And I openly admit it. You can call me lots of things that are derogatory (i.e. unsophisticated, redneck, cheapskate, asshole, et al.); I'm not thinking that "pretentious" or "douche" would be among them.

Edited by TheNiche

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A Wal-Mart should be brought into the community when people will shop there. And they will! I will. And I'll shop at Wal-Mart with much greater frequency when it isn't a 30-minute round trip.

What would you rather see there, an HEB with strip centers? Sooner or later, that land will be developed by something that will generate traffic...and that's too much land for merely another apartment project.

I drank Lone Star before it was popular. And when it was adopted for the sake of irony and the price increased by $0.50 per six pack to reflect something more tasty than horse piss, I switched to 40oz King Cobras. And I openly admit it. You can call me lots of things that are derogatory (i.e. unsophisticated, redneck, cheapskate, asshole, et al.); I'm not thinking that "pretentious" or "douche" would be among them.

The fact is that you call any opinions outside of your own "pretentious" or "douchey" or "brainwashed" or "classist." People are only entitled to their own opinions if those opinions mirror yours. God forbid anyone be born white and worked their tail off against great odds to educate themselves. Me and my stupid, educated husband. I never should have defied all the statistics of being the child of a single mother on welfare. If we don't like WalMart, we're apparently anti-working class. I saw Walmart decimate the economy of my very poor hometown and ruin what working class there was left. For years after, it was just abject poverty. As a company, they actually keep the people who work for them below the poverty line. Even their "American made" items are actually made made in sweatshops in Saipan, a U.S. territory not subject to labor laws. I don't like them and it's not because I am afriad of brown or black or poor people.

I mean, what do you want from people? To acknowledge that you are the be all, end all? You honestly think you are the authority on what everyone is thinking and feeling about every issue? That you know people's motivations better than they themselves? Get over yourself.

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For a while there, Northline Commons was supposed to be getting a WalMart. Wonder if thats still the case. If so, this spot wouldn't make any sense at all.

A guy I work with said his wife already applied to work there.

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The fact is that you call any opinions outside of your own "pretentious" or "douchey" or "brainwashed" or "classist." People are only entitled to their own opinions if those opinions mirror yours. God forbid anyone be born white and worked their tail off against great odds to educate themselves. Me and my stupid, educated husband. I never should have defied all the statistics of being the child of a single mother on welfare. If we don't like WalMart, we're apparently anti-working class.

As an over-educated white male that held a full-time job and developed a career during his college years which was rendered a liability by the financial crisis...and that responded by investing my life's savings in an ill-conceived partnership that has ultimately voided those savings...and having found myself being the lowest earner of my two college student roommates... with no employment prospects other than the Army...I find that I'm positioned well below the working class Mexican households that I've been Censusing in terms of buying power (and earning power).

Consider yourself lucky, as I would if I had easier access to a Wal-Mart.

I saw Walmart decimate the economy of my very poor hometown and ruin what working class there was left. For years after, it was just abject poverty. As a company, they actually keep the people who work for them below the poverty line. Even their "American made" items are actually made made in sweatshops in Saipan, a U.S. territory not subject to labor laws. I don't like them and it's not because I am afriad of brown or black or poor people.

As for your hometown...clearly it wasn't a big city. Houston is not a small town. Attempting to compare the two is a fallacy of composition. Since you have embraced the name "Yankee", I'm gathering that you're probably from the northeast or the rust belt. And yeah, with or without Wal-Mart, those places are withering. High taxes and a strict regulatory environment there are how you make a living here.

I mean, what do you want from people? To acknowledge that you are the be all, end all? You honestly think you are the authority on what everyone is thinking and feeling about every issue? That you know people's motivations better than they themselves? Get over yourself.

I have an academic background in economics and professional backgrounds in market research, economic development, and commercial real estate development. Who better to provide input on the matter? Really.

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As an over-educated white male that held a full-time job and developed a career during his college years which was rendered a liability by the financial crisis...and that responded by investing my life's savings in an ill-conceived partnership that has ultimately voided those savings...and having found myself being the lowest earner of my two college student roommates... with no employment prospects other than the Army...I find that I'm positioned well below the working class Mexican households that I've been Censusing in terms of buying power (and earning power).

Consider yourself lucky, as I would if I had easier access to a Wal-Mart.

Oh, so it's a chip on your shoulder that makes you act like this. Makes more sense now.

As for your hometown...clearly it wasn't a big city. Houston is not a small town. Attempting to compare the two is a fallacy of composition. Since you have embraced the name "Yankee", I'm gathering that you're probably from the northeast or the rust belt. And yeah, with or without Wal-Mart, those places are withering. High taxes and a strict regulatory environment there are how you make a living here.

Whether or not it was inevitable doesn't invalidate my feelings about it.

And I don't believe it was inevitable as the only other Walmart in Western Ma is in Pittesfield, population roughly 100,000, and many of the other clusters of small towns around there which have kept Walmart out continue to thrive. Even now that they have opened the largest contemporary art museum in the country in an old factory, the town can't recover and many locals will point to Walmarts destruction of the local economy as part of it.

And, again, I also dislike Walmart as a company due to their employment policies which keep thousands of people on their "payroll" below the poverty line. They use sweatshop labor. They discriminate against women in their power structure. They even dictate the size of home their corp staff can purchase (i.e. regardless of the size of his family, an inhouse lawyer for Walmart was told that he could not buy anything larger than a 3/2- in Arkansas, mind you- because they didn't want it too look like they pay their lawyers too much). I don't like them as a company and I don't have to support or be happy about them moving so close to me (maybe, this is all just rumor at this point no matter how much HeyHatch hears it's a done deal). And I don't have to change my mind just because you are excited about the prospect of having cheap, Chinese made products made so much more accessible to you...

I have an academic background in economics and professional backgrounds in market research, economic development, and commercial real estate development. Who better to provide input on the matter? Really.

See, you miss the point. This is, for many people, an emotional issue. We like or dislike Walmart for our own personal reasons, e.g. corp policies, sweatshop labor, discrimination, aesthetics, parking lot safety, etc. So no one really cares that you have anointed yourself the supreme expert on what we should all want. Your education and hodge podge of professional backgrounds isn't going to make HeyHatch feel safe in a Walmart parking lot at night and it's not going to make me go back and say "yeah, I'm sure glad there's a Walmart scarring the face of my quaint New England hometown." Frankly, we don't have to want it and, like you said, this is Houston. It's not like Walmart is the only option and we'd be silly for turning it away. If not Walmart, there are a lot of other ways that land could be developed that would benefit the area as much, if not more, than a Walmart. I'm sure you're aware that there are more options but you pull so hard for this one because it benefits you. Fine. That is your emotional reaction as well, but don't play it off as if everyone else is stupid for having a differing opinion.

I said earlier in the conversation that I don't believe Walmart will close the locally owned businesses in the Heights and surrounding neighborhoods. C&D survives with Home Depot and Lowe's a 5 minute drive away. People who are buying baby gifts at Tulips & Tutus aren't going to switch to Walmart. People who want handcrafted items aren't going to stop going to The Artful COrner and 18 Hands Gallery b/c Wallyworld moved below I10.

And here is a great tip for you: there are also 2 Fiestas, the nice one on Studewood and the giant Fiesta on Shepherd, where you can get all the inexpensive food you want, probably cheaper than Walmart will be anyway.

Edited by heights_yankee
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Hey Niche, back up a bit. Perhaps you ought to take a look in to the indoctrination mirror, especially from the "douchey" angle. Not everyone who lives in the Heights is a low-earning Mexican. There are quite a few high-earning Mexicans, as well as low-earning families from all the other categories you seem to be preinclined to reference, living in the Heights. Citing a stereotypical image of several generations of a Mexican family being packed in to a car is, dare I say it, douchey? Can I be just as tired of packing several generations of my anglo family in to a car to drive basically the same distance as the closest Wal-Mart to hit an H-E-B?

IMHO H-E-B has better quality products, wider selection, better customer service, and much better employee morale (due to Charles Butt actually caring about his employees)than Wal-Mart. H-E-B is a better neighbor than Wal-Mart. They care much more about the local community. Check out what they invest annually back in to the communities, not to mention their support of public schools. Don't believe me? Then you try to help out your local public school's annual Fall Festival, Spring Picnic or whatever. Ask your local H-E-B for a donation of food, water, gift cards, whatever, and you will be pleasantly surprised. Ask WalMart and you're lucky if you get a small, and I do mean small as in buy a couple of candy bars, gift card.

All I am saying is that I would much rather have someone who is vested in the prosperity of the local community, as H-E-B is, than a company like WalMart who is constantly in the press for all the new ways they have come up with to screw the little guys.

Thank you. Well said.

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Oh, so it's a chip on your shoulder that makes you act like this. Makes more sense now.

Whether or not it was inevitable doesn't invalidate my feelings about it.

And I don't believe it was inevitable as the only other Walmart in Western Ma is in Pittesfield, population roughly 100,000, and many of the other clusters of small towns around there which have kept Walmart out continue to thrive. Even now that they have opened the largest contemporary art museum in the country in an old factory, the town can't recover and many locals will point to Walmarts destruction of the local economy as part of it.

And, again, I also dislike Walmart as a company due to their employment policies which keep thousands of people on their "payroll" below the poverty line. They use sweatshop labor. They discriminate against women in their power structure. They even dictate the size of home their corp staff can purchase (i.e. regardless of the size of his family, an inhouse lawyer for Walmart was told that he could not buy anything larger than a 3/2- in Arkansas, mind you- because they didn't want it too look like they pay their lawyers too much). I don't like them as a company and I don't have to support or be happy about them moving so close to me (maybe, this is all just rumor at this point no matter how much HeyHatch hears it's a done deal). And I don't have to change my mind just because you are excited about the prospect of having cheap, Chinese made products made so much more accessible to you...

See, you miss the point. This is, for many people, an emotional issue. We like or dislike Walmart for our own personal reasons, e.g. corp policies, sweatshop labor, discrimination, aesthetics, parking lot safety, etc. So no one really cares that you have anointed yourself the supreme expert on what we should all want. Your education and hodge podge of professional backgrounds isn't going to make HeyHatch feel safe in a Walmart parking lot at night and it's not going to make me go back and say "yeah, I'm sure glad there's a Walmart scarring the face of my quaint New England hometown." Frankly, we don't have to want it and, like you said, this is Houston. It's not like Walmart is the only option and we'd be silly for turning it away. If not Walmart, there are a lot of other ways that land could be developed that would benefit the area as much, if not more, than a Walmart. I'm sure you're aware that there are more options but you pull so hard for this one because it benefits you. Fine. That is your emotional reaction as well, but don't play it off as if everyone else is stupid for having a differing opinion.

I said earlier in the conversation that I don't believe Walmart will close the locally owned businesses in the Heights and surrounding neighborhoods. C&D survives with Home Depot and Lowe's a 5 minute drive away. People who are buying baby gifts at Tulips & Tutus aren't going to switch to Walmart. People who want handcrafted items aren't going to stop going to The Artful COrner and 18 Hands Gallery b/c Wallyworld moved below I10.

And here is a great tip for you: there are also 2 Fiestas, the nice one on Studewood and the giant Fiesta on Shepherd, where you can get all the inexpensive food you want, probably cheaper than Walmart will be anyway.

I dont disagree with most of what you have said here, except that Walmart will take market share from the small mom and pop stores, even from the people who despise the store. There are too many instances, where you need something cheap, fast, and now. Mom & Pop stores often are not open when you need those things....WalMart fills that void, even for people who despise it.

I despise Walmart - I hate going in them...but if you need a fishing license at 3am, and a few snacks, and some gas, and you want to do that fast and in all in one stop....well your SOL anywhere but Walmart.

Walmart is about cheap convenience....nothing more. They treat their employees the way they do, because if they did not, their products would cost more. I am a huge fan of shopping local, and avoiding large chain stores that dont care or support our community, but there are instances when you have to break your own rules because you actually need something they have.

That said, while I have succesfully avoided Walmart for at least the past 3 years, I support their right to build whatever they want wherever they want to. If a community does not like a walmart, then by god dont shop there. Opinionated people should not have any say whatsoever about what gets built....money talks. If you dont like it, dont shop there, or buy the area yourself....they will go out of business if nobody shops there.

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If it is a Wal-Mart it will just be one more business in the Washington Corridor area I won't shop at since I never go to Wal-Mart.

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I dont disagree with most of what you have said here, except that Walmart will take market share from the small mom and pop stores, even from the people who despise the store. There are too many instances, where you need something cheap, fast, and now. Mom & Pop stores often are not open when you need those things....WalMart fills that void, even for people who despise it.

I despise Walmart - I hate going in them...but if you need a fishing license at 3am, and a few snacks, and some gas, and you want to do that fast and in all in one stop....well your SOL anywhere but Walmart.

Walmart is about cheap convenience....nothing more. They treat their employees the way they do, because if they did not, their products would cost more. I am a huge fan of shopping local, and avoiding large chain stores that dont care or support our community, but there are instances when you have to break your own rules because you actually need something they have.

I guess my argument is more that there is nothing you can get at 99% of the stores in the Heights that you otherwise need in a cheap, fast and instant manner. If you look at the retailers in the Heights, they are all specialty retailers, not general "needs" retailers.

As far as a "they can build it and then no one shop there and let it close" mentality, well a) we know a Walmart would probably stay open anywhere inside the loop but if it did fail then B) you are left with a big, ugly hulking shell of a big box store visible from space. It will take years to find someone willing to occupy or subdivide or tear down. This is a problem cities are seeing all across the country (mostly with empty, old Kmarts). In the time it takes to redevelop an old big box store, the vacant space can also have a hugely detrimental effect on a neighborhood. IMO, we are already at risk of Rice Military becoming a ghetto if development isn't done in a wise and careful manner. All business owners around that area should be invested in what goes up around them and for the long term health of the area, they should not want it to be a Walmart.

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As an over-educated white male that held a full-time job and developed a career during his college years which was rendered a liability by the financial crisis...and that responded by investing my life's savings in an ill-conceived partnership that has ultimately voided those savings...and having found myself being the lowest earner of my two college student roommates... with no employment prospects other than the Army...I find that I'm positioned well below the working class Mexican households that I've been Censusing in terms of buying power (and earning power).

Consider yourself lucky, as I would if I had easier access to a Wal-Mart.

As for your hometown...clearly it wasn't a big city. Houston is not a small town. Attempting to compare the two is a fallacy of composition. Since you have embraced the name "Yankee", I'm gathering that you're probably from the northeast or the rust belt. And yeah, with or without Wal-Mart, those places are withering. High taxes and a strict regulatory environment there are how you make a living here.

I have an academic background in economics and professional backgrounds in market research, economic development, and commercial real estate development. Who better to provide input on the matter? Really.

Really.... Since you've already disclosed how unsuccessful you are then I would interpret that your background as mentioned above was not very successful/knowledgeable and may be a low level employee(?), therefore it seems that you may not the better (or only) person to give input in the matter You also previously mentioned a focus group study...how many people were in the study - 12 to about 25...? Usually modeling research to project up to a population should be over 1,000 people at least. Were they studying first generation Mexican-Americans (not Hispanics since you mentioned Mexican Families) , 2nd or 3rd generation or new arrivals...? There are vast differences between the groups.

The Heights has changed dramatically in the last 10 years and lots of companies (including commercial real estate) are just using the 2000 census with annual adjustments made on average/projected population growth. What can drastically change demographics in a short time in a zip code (or block group) are new apartment complexes due to their high number of households in a limited space. That I am aware of - there have not been many new apartment complexes built - except for the two on I-10 (Target & near Heights blvd) and the one on Yale (at 22nd) and it doesn't look to me that they are marketing and housing "Mexican families" (as you put it). If they are building a store at Northline Commons, not too far from there that will service Walmart's typical (repeat) customer (demographics), I would be very surprised if WalMart put a store in the Heights on Yale at I-10.

If you look at Walmart's actual statistics about their parking lot crime - then naturally the Heights store (if there is to be one) will probably have the same stats, especially if it is right off of I-10. Does anyone know what the stats are for Target parking lot crime as a whole and the Target off Sawyer parking lot crime as compared to their average? The percentage up or down of the Sawyer store compared to their average crime rate would be good to estimate the parking lot crime of the proposed Walmart on I-10 at Yale.

Edited by CleaningLadyinCleveland
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The Heights has changed dramatically in the last 10 years and lots of companies (including commercial real estate) are just using the 2000 census with annual adjustments made on average/projected population growth. What can drastically change demographics in a short time in a zip code (or block group) are new apartment complexes due to their high number of households in a limited space. That I am aware of - there have not been many new apartment complexes built - except for the two on I-10 (Target & near Heights blvd) and the one on Yale (at 22nd) and it doesn't look to me that they are marketing and housing "Mexican families" (as you put it). If they are building a store at Northline Commons, not too far from there that will service Walmart's typical (repeat) customer (demographics), I would be very surprised if WalMart put a store in the Heights on Yale at I-10.

We were just talking about this at dinner last night.

The widespread and sustained rumor is that Target used these older stats in development of the Sawyer Heights store and now greatly regret it. They believed that the area would only sustain a small store and now the SH store is one of the highest grossing in metro Houston. Since they dropped the ball and didn't make it a Super Target (like a lot of the people around here had hoped), they are now sticking random produce on aisle end caps and adding food/wine wherever possible to make up for the bad stats they were forced to use...

Which brings up another point- if Walmart has a target demographic of people under a certain income level, but this area has transitioned so much that it's now mostly the educated, upper middle class that The Niche hates so much (because apparently he had a taste of the lifestyle and then lost it, so the rest of us are to blame and we should all be ashamed of our own successes) why should the area be forced to accept a store that caters to the smaller percentage of the area population?

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if Walmart has a target demographic of people under a certain income level, but this area has transitioned so much that it's now mostly the educated, upper middle class ... why should the area be forced to accept a store that caters to the smaller percentage of the area population?

Because you'll use it too. People always do. And not just you either. As the only inner loop Walmart location, people of all sorts of income brackets will drive in or ride a bus to use it. The Heights is centrally located and not a dangerous neighborhood. It's a pretty obvious choice for any major retailer to set up shop. Plus, it has the added benefit of having the Target in close proximity increasing consumer choice and competition.

And don't get me wrong. I hate Walmart. I can't stand the place. I always feel like I need a shower after I leave one. It's obvious the employees hate their jobs. It's obvious the company promotes unethical business practices to keep their prices low. I hate that in their first foray into Mexico, they built a store practically atop the archaeologically priceless site of Teotihuacan. I lived in Austin when they built on the environmentally sensitive Barton Springs watershed despite thousands of protests from residents. I hate that all new Walmarts are built with a McDonald's in them as there's one company I like less than Walmart, and it's McDonald's. Yet, I can't not shop at Walmart from time to time. When you're on a budget or pressed for time, it's the best shopping option, even if it leaves you feeling unclean.

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The Heights is upper middle class??

Does that include all the elderly property owners who are likely living on retirement in the same little homes they've lived in for over 40 years? Those are some of the residents who will probably shop at Walmart.

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it will certainly draw folks from well beyond the heights, which is the problem. i suspect it will draw on residents from the 5th ward, 3rd ward, and others from east of 45. they will all be getting off I-10 at heights/yale.

i rarely go north of allen parkway, so not really my fight to pick, but if i lived in washington heights or even the heights proper, then i would be concerned.

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