The Heights Historic Districts

[fwki]

I imagine that without the pictures they would have been stuck with the old patchwork construction that comprises most of the old homes. Or perhaps one would have to hire forensic architects to defend your property rights before the stewards of history. After watching them torch the poor guy trying to add a column to his porch, you'd better have a good case with hard evidence. All I have is hearsay, but I'm going in with just the mailbox.

[RedScare]

I just spent lunch and part of the afternoon with an architect who does a lot of work at HAHC. You wouldn't believe his stories. No one with a substantial remodel gets through the HAHC on the first try, even with professionals who know the statue. And, pity the fool who goes by himself. There are far too many people on the board who know nothing about architecture or historic homes. They are still obsessed with the idea that renovations should be done in a manner that future homeowners might tear them down to go back to the original house,,,as if someone would buy a house for $500,000, then tear down the 1,500 square foot addition, turning a $200 per square foot house into a $500 per square foot house. Pure delusion.

Yet, there are a few people who actually agree with them. Not a majority by any stretch, but a few nonetheless. Unfortunately, one of them is mayor...for a few more years.

[photolitherland]

I seriously cant believe all you people are against preservation. You want The Heights to turn into Montrose. I moved to The Heights because large parts of it are now preserved. If you dont like preservation, than move to Kingwood or Bellaire.

[RedScare]

I seriously cant believe all you people are against preservation. You want The Heights to turn into Montrose. I moved to The Heights because large parts of it are now preserved. If you dont like preservation, than move to Kingwood or Bellaire.

I was here before you "preservationists". It is because of people like me that you thought the Heights was worth moving to. If I were to tell you to go f yourself, would you find that offensive? Because moving into my hood and telling me to leave certainly is.

[ISMDAVID]

If you dont like preservation, than move to Kingwood or Bellaire.

You have stepped in an anthill with that comment...and on Christmas Eve no less. Ill refrain from my true feelings and let you enjoy the holidays with your holier than thou friends and family.

[photolitherland]

How can you seriously be against preservation? Do you want all of the Heights to be eventually torn down and replaced with giant faux historic McMansions?

[ISMDAVID]

You must be new to these historic discussions. Now i see two steps in that anthill that had gone months without being disturbed.

[JJxvi]

How can you seriously be against preservation? Do you want all of the Heights to be eventually torn down and replaced with giant faux historic McMansions?

Yes.

[RedScare]

How can you seriously be against preservation? Do you want all of the Heights to be eventually torn down and replaced with giant faux historic McMansions?

If you are too lazy to read the first 29 pages of this thread, why should I waste my time explaining myself AGAIN? If you are too lazy to read and too in love with government interference with my right to preserve my property in a way that suits my needs and tastes, perhaps you should leave the Heights and move to Kingwood or Bellaire. We prefer intelligent neighbors.

[fwki]

Two consecutive artificial posts with no sign of natural intelligence …I think a bot slipped through while Subdude was off on holiday.

[photolitherland]

Youre right, Im sorry, lets just forgo Houstons history and let it all dissapear, who cares I guess anyways.

[TGM]

Youre right, Im sorry, lets just forgo Houstons history and let it all dissapear, who cares I guess anyways.

Which era of history do you wish to preserve, and which one do you wish to see fall by the wayside?

Architecture and music have much in common. Your parents hated what you listened to and you feel this generations music is hollow and contrived. In 50 years some overbearing group will be protesting the destruction of McMansions for the purpose of building the latest faux-neo-classic-Victorian-revival-du jour. I hope you hold true to your word and protest this outrageous destruction of historic Houston architecture.

Edited December 28, 2012 by TGM

[JJxvi]

Youre right, Im sorry, lets just forgo Houstons history and let it all dissapear, who cares I guess anyways.

Agreed.

[s3mh]

Youre right, Im sorry, lets just forgo Houstons history and let it all dissapear, who cares I guess anyways.

This message board has been occupied by historic preservation haters who try to use it as their echo chamber to convince themselves that their hatred for the historic districts is shared by the overwhelming majority of residents in the Heights. Anyone who comes on here and disagrees with their view point will be pilloried until they give in and stop posting, leading the historic preservation haters to think that their hate for the districts has been validated because they have bullied people away from a message board.

Of course the reality is that the historic districts are just fine and are even expanding (Germantown HD next to Woodland Heights was just added). The predictions of property values diving and the Heights turning into a slum because no one will rennovate homes turned out to be 180 degrees in the wrong direction. So, the haters are left to their little internet message board to try to validate their irrational hatred for the historic preservation ordinance and those who worked so hard to get real protection for historic homes in the Heights. That is why they are so threatened whenever anyone tries to crash their little party. Keep posting if you want. It is more entertaining that talking about reality shows with staff in the break room at work.

[RedScare]

They will need all of your luck to navigate the minefields. Im sure everyone in favor of the ordinance will be comforted knowing that they are living in a Historic Home-(all 500 square feet of it)

This is the "historic preservation" that s3mh and photolitherland support. This is what s3mh thinks is "just fine". Take your intellectual dishonesty to Kingwood or Bellaire. Your claim to preservation is a fraud.

[Ross]

I don't have a problem with preservation. What I have a problem with is people who come in after I purchase a property and try to impose new rules on what I can do with that property, especially when the rules they impose are to enforce their sense of esthetics. I would have had no real objection to the historic district ordinances if there was an opt out for current owners.

[SilverJK]

I have no intention of tearing down and building a mc-whatever. I'm not in the historic district. I'm pro preservation, but the historic ordinance is far from anything I could ever support. It was intentionally misleading, unsupported, and overbearing (not to mention it actually supports construction that is not only not historic, but downright ugly).

Who asked for the troll for christmas?

[photolitherland]

Unsupported? I talk to tons of people in The Heights and everyone Ive talked to hates seeing historic houses torn down and are in support of the historic preservation ordinances. I dont know where you anti preservation people are hiding out but you make up the minority. What is happening in the Montrose is a travesty. I remember a couple months ago there were 4 beautiful Queen Anne styled homes back near the gay clubs that were in just fine shape and I drove past the block yesterday and they were all destroyed and crap 3 story condos are now rising in their place. Its disgusting and pisses me off to no end. This city doesnt have much history and as much of it that still exists needs to be fully protected from tear downs or renovations that rip off the back 2/3rds of the house to be replaced by a new 2 story addition. Every other progressive city in the nation has fully protected historic districts. Hell, even Little Rock has fully protected historic districts. What would have happened if the French Quarter in New Orleans wasnt protected? Do you think the people living there would want to see New Orleans torn down and replaced with 3 story tin sided condos? Vast areas of NYC are fully protected in historic districts and you dont see the people of that city bitching about preservation ordinances. Hell, even Galveston has better preservation ordinances than Houston. This cities small amount of history needs to be protected and restored, not torn down. You anti preservation people kind of remind me of NRA members. The western part of The Heights has been largely plowed over and replaced with faux historic houses and that part of The Heights seems so desolate and ugly, while the eastern section of The Heights still is largely intact and its so lovely to walk around the streets with the old bungalows and late Victorian architecture dominating the area. I live on Beverly St. and even in the last year Ive seen dozens upon dozens of beautiful bungalows get torn down and replaced by gigantic homes that dont at all fit in with their surroundings.

Edited December 29, 2012 by photolitherland

[fwki]

I have no intention of tearing down and building a mc-whatever. I'm not in the historic district. I'm pro preservation, but the historic ordinance is far from anything I could ever support. It was intentionally misleading, unsupported, and overbearing (not to mention it actually supports construction that is not only not historic, but downright ugly).

Who asked for the troll for christmas?

Same here. One can easily pick out the non-readers in this forum, the audio book crowd. They immediately give themselves away by demonstrating an inability to discern between anti-ordinance posters and anti-preservation posters. It is possible to have civil discourse between readers with different opinions, but non-readers are nothing more than oxygen thieves in public forums.

[Subdude]

This is the "historic preservation" that s3mh and photolitherland support. This is what s3mh thinks is "just fine". Take your intellectual dishonesty to Kingwood or Bellaire. Your claim to preservation is a fraud.

Warning: Keep it civil. No more flaming or name-calling is going to be allowed.

[RedScare]

So, photolitherland claims he moved to the Heights because it is historic district protected, but then notes that he lives on Beverly Street, which is NOT in a historic district. That figures. He doesn't want HIS house encumbered by restrictions, but supports restricting mine. Typical.

At least he doesn't live on my street. We have 100% opposition on my block (I know. I collected the signatures.), and we'd like to keep it that way as we await the day that we return our block to the way Beverly Street is.

[fwki]

Red's Hypocrisy Detector went off scale last night.

[RedScare]

Red's Hypocrisy Detector went off scale last night.

It did. And then Subdude ran over to slap my hand for it. Anyone notice that I got warned for using the identical language in my post that photlitherland used, yet Subdude only saw fit to slap me for it?

My arguments must be effective if the refs only throw flags on me and no one else for the same conduct.

(actually, in fairness to Subdude, he likely only looked at my post because s3mh complained about it without mentioning litherland's post that started it. Besides, my skin is thick. I've taken worse hits.)

[RedScare]

Same here. One can easily pick out the non-readers in this forum, the audio book crowd. They immediately give themselves away by demonstrating an inability to discern between anti-ordinance posters and anti-preservation posters. It is possible to have civil discourse between readers with different opinions, but non-readers are nothing more than oxygen thieves in public forums.

I've been tempted numerous times to dare the so-called "preservation supporters" to compare their "pro-preservation" dwellings against our "anti-preservation" dwellings. I am quite confident that the improvements made to our homes would blow the preservation pretenders out of the water. I only hold back from doing so because I am not at all interested in letting these people know where I live. They are, after all, the ones who take pictures of old houses in order to snitch us out to the city. I am not going to make their snitching easier by telling them where to find me.

[photolitherland]

So, photolitherland claims he moved to the Heights because it is historic district protected, but then notes that he lives on Beverly Street, which is NOT in a historic district. That figures. He doesn't want HIS house encumbered by restrictions, but supports restricting mine. Typical.

At least he doesn't live on my street. We have 100% opposition on my block (I know. I collected the signatures.), and we'd like to keep it that way as we await the day that we return our block to the way Beverly Street is.

I dont own a home, I rent so I have no say in what the owner does to this house. He told me he plans on tearing it down eventually and replacing it with a crap 3 story condo. If I owned a house I would restore it to the way it looked in the 20s. I wish this house were in the historic district. If you dont want historic districts than slowly but surely all of the Heights and all of the cities other historic structures will be replaced with shit new buildings. If you want to own a home and do whatever you please with it than get out of the Heights and move to the burbs where life is boring and generic.

[RedScare]

Renter. Troll. I'm done. I owned my house before there was a historic district. I'll own it after you're gone. And one day I will succeed in getting rid o the historic district. When that happens, I invite you back to weep for the old homes.

Now, like I said, I'm done. I will not waste my time debating renters who have no skin invested in the game. Your opinions are worthless to homeowners.

[little frau]

I just wish some would learn the difference between anti ordinance & anti preservation when posting here.

That and the difference between "then" and "than".

[s3mh]

It did. And then Subdude ran over to slap my hand for it. Anyone notice that I got warned for using the identical language in my post that photlitherland used, yet Subdude only saw fit to slap me for it?

My arguments must be effective if the refs only throw flags on me and no one else for the same conduct.

(actually, in fairness to Subdude, he likely only looked at my post because s3mh complained about it without mentioning litherland's post that started it. Besides, my skin is thick. I've taken worse hits.)

I've never complained about any of your posts. I like it when you start with your childish name calling. It is a sure sign that I am right and you are wrong. Also, given the ideological slant of the majority of those posting on this message board, I have the definition of thick skin to be posting on here.

[s3mh]

I've been tempted numerous times to dare the so-called "preservation supporters" to compare their "pro-preservation" dwellings against our "anti-preservation" dwellings. I am quite confident that the improvements made to our homes would blow the preservation pretenders out of the water. I only hold back from doing so because I am not at all interested in letting these people know where I live. They are, after all, the ones who take pictures of old houses in order to snitch us out to the city. I am not going to make their snitching easier by telling them where to find me.

Yeah, taking pictures of strangers' homes and using them to advance your political agenda is something that only those awful preservationists would do.

Oops:

http://blogs.har.com/774/12571/Renovations-we-won-t-see-anymore-in-the-Houston-Heights--Examples-from-the-East-Historic-District/

[fwki]

I know I shouldn't even respond, but I could not let this rant stand unchallenged lest some ignorant non-reader buys into it.

This message board has been occupied....

The secret Occupy HAIF movement is now exposed to the world, oh my!

by historic preservation haters....

Non-reader alert!

who try to use it as their echo chamber to convince themselves that their hatred for the historic districts is shared by the overwhelming majority of residents in the Heights....

Are you including dog and squirrel votes in your majority too? No doubt you include renters (old, unimproved homes have lower rents), new-build owners (kills the competition for best homes), outside of HD owners (higher comparable re-sale value, see Norhill Addition), and non-contributing structures (HD? What HD?). But for humans with skin in the game, i.e. Texas property owners of land in the HD with a structure burdened by the ordinance, I challenge your unsubstantiated claim of overwhelming majority. And if that is true, why did the city not use a simple up-or-down vote by only impacted owners on a sanctioned election cycle?

Anyone who comes on here and disagrees with their view point will be pilloried until they give in and stop posting, leading the historic preservation haters to think that their hate for the districts has been validated because they have bullied people away from a message board.

TRANSLATED: City Ordinance Lovers can attempt to justify their adulation by posting here, but be aware that BS will be called and responded to by proud Texans with a clear, rational and stinging rebuke.

Of course the reality is that the historic districts are just fine and are even expanding (Germantown HD next to Woodland Heights was just added).

Also known as the I-45 Expansion Defense Historic District.

The predictions of property values diving and the Heights turning into a slum because no one will rennovate (sic) homes turned out to be 180 degrees in the wrong direction.

And your source for these rash predictions are....hearsay? And 180 degrees is....hyperbole?

So, the haters are left to their little internet message board...

You mean those opposed to the ordinance eloquently set forth and defend their position in the most active neighborhood message board in "HAIF - Houston's Leading News Forum".

...to try to validate their irrational hatred for the historic preservation ordinance...

No validation is required when defending one's property rights in Texas from politicians pandering to River Oaks elitists and wannabes (see HAHC Chairman and the Greater Houston Preservation Alliance)

and those who worked so hard to get real protection for historic homes in the Heights. That is why they are so threatened whenever anyone tries to crash their little party.

Now don't get your feelings hurt. I do not hate you, I don't even know you. I think you put a lot of effort into something you support, and I respect that effort, no matter how misguided it may be. And this is your party, like it or not.

Keep posting if you want. It is more entertaining that talking about reality shows with staff in the break room at work.

Do I detect a tad of elitism here? Did staff have a nice holiday or two? Did staff enjoy the pot-luck holiday luncheon management allowed? Sorry, just kidding, don’t call Subdude on me. Oh, and Happy New Year to all the HAIFers, where ever you live whatever you post!