The Rep Issue

[Random]

There’s an article on Chron.com this morning called “Stop Hating On Houston”

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/life/main/6563392.html

First off, I want to mention that the article is a thin skinned response to a legitimate criticism (we are a flat, sprawling and hot and not exactly an “out doorsy” city). But most importantly I want to comment on Houston’s national rep, which I know is a discussion that has been done to death. But I’m a relatively recent transplant (4 years) and haven’t had the chance to really discuss this anyone.

If there’s one thing I’ve noticed since living here is that Houstonians only have themselves to blame for the city’s bad reputation. They are positively the WORST ambassadors any city has ever had. You have a diverse, cosmopolitan, laid back and in many areas, hip city. But are most Houstonians even aware? Do many Houstonians even care? When I first moved to this city from Austin I lived in midtown/Montrose and worked out near Harwin and the Beltway. I was struck with how interesting and eclectic the city was. There is always a new neighborhood to discover, a new restaurant to eat at and an interesting person to talk to. I had fun exploring my new city and enjoyed showing it off to friends from Austin, Boston, San Fran, LA – all of whom were struck by how “cool” this town actually could be.

But as the years went on I was shocked at how little many Houstonians knew about their own city. I had a coworker tell me he wanted to live in another town because Houston wasn’t that interesting to him. This coworker lives, like many Houstonians do, on the outer fringes of the city (which I don’t consider Houston, but that’s beside the point). I mentioned that I found Montrose to be a very vibrant area and asked how often he explored that part of town. And his response was, and I still have trouble coming to grips with this, “Montrose? What’s that?” - and therein lies Houston’s problem.

When these people move, or visit other cities, they describe Houston as boring and soulless. When a relative visits from out of town, or when a coworker is here on business they may take them down a bland freeway to the Galleria or a sporting event (both things I love, but nothing unique), but otherwise it’s back to the suburbs by dinner. How do you expect to establish a great reputation if you’re showing people the same crap they could find anywhere.

Bottom line, I think Houston needs to work on improving its reputation with its own citizens before it starts trying to impress the world.

[crunchtastic]

If there’s one thing I’ve noticed since living here is that Houstonians only have themselves to blame for the city’s bad reputation. They are positively the WORST ambassadors any city has ever had. You have a diverse, cosmopolitan, laid back and in many areas, hip city. But are most Houstonians even aware? Do many Houstonians even care?

That's an awfully broad brushstroke. The "WORST," based on a few anecdotes? I doubt it's any different here than any other large American city. There are the people who love it, and love showing off their town, and then there's the vast majority of folks who are just living their lives. No, most probably don't care if an Austin or California or New York transplant thinks Montrose is cool. But I think most do care about their town and their quality of life. That's not same thing as wanting to be popular, though. Me personally, I love my hometown in all its sweaty, sprawly glory, but I don't give a rat's ass what anyone else thinks. Some people see a disconnect in that attitude, but I don't.

[musicman]

I mentioned that I found Montrose to be a very vibrant area and asked how often he explored that part of town. And his response was, and I still have trouble coming to grips with this, “Montrose? What’s that?” - and therein lies Houston’s problem.

Luckily the natives know there are gems all over Houston, including the burbs.

[Random]

Luckily the natives know there are gems all over Houston, including the burbs.

Sorry, I meant to mention - he was a native. Cypress to be exact.

Every city has those just trying to live, not concerned with which town is better than the other - but in many other cities the average person is at least aware of the positives their town has to offer.

[RedScare]

But as the years went on I was shocked at how little many Houstonians knew about their own city. I had a coworker tell me he wanted to live in another town because Houston wasn’t that interesting to him.

Wow. One co-worker speaks for 5.8 million people. If you can't or won't find a broader sample than one apparently annoying co-worker, I do not feel compelled to refute your findings...make that 'finding'.

[Random]

Wow. One co-worker speaks for 5.8 million people. If you can't or won't find a broader sample than one apparently annoying co-worker, I do not feel compelled to refute your findings...make that 'finding'.

It was merely meant to illustrate a point - Namely that unlike most world class cities, Houston's own citizens are painfully unaware of what their city has to offer. And as a result, are unable to articulate what makes this city special to outsiders.

I know we like to say we don't care what people think of us, but c'mon - we do. We want people to see this city as the special place that we know it is. Particularly if you've seen people's reactions when you tell them you're from Houston - if it illicits any sorts of reaction, it's more likely to be negative than positive.

The average citizen of Austin can tell you what makes Austin special or why they are proud of the city. Even if they never truly experience what the city offers (see: average Arboretum resident). Can we really say that about the average Houstonian?

[RedScare]

It was merely meant to illustrate a point - Namely that unlike most world class cities, Houston's own citizens are painfully unaware of what their city has to offer. And as a result, are unable to articulate what makes this city special to outsiders.

I know we like to say we don't care what people think of us, but c'mon - we do. We want people to see this city as the special place that we know it is. Particularly if you've seen people's reactions when you tell them you're from Houston - if it illicits any sorts of reaction, it's more likely to be negative than positive.

The average citizen of Austin can tell you what makes Austin special or why they are proud of the city. Even if they never truly experience what the city offers (see: average Arboretum resident). Can we really say that about the average Houstonian?

Prove it.

BTW, the average citizen of Austin makes me hate that city. HTH.

[Gary]

I think your wrong regarding Houstonians not knowing about their city, and for a native of the area not to know where or what Montrose is is just plain silly. Also, keep in mind that this place is so huge that it can be difficult for outsiders to find the "cool" places like they can in the smaller cities you mentioned.

If I had to pick the one thing that made me settle down in Houston, and I've mentioned it before, is the people. Houstonians are a different breed from most and they generally don't give a flip what outsiders think. In fact, (not to be reduntant) I've always found it very charming and hope that it never changes.

Edit: I think it was Musicman who said... Keep the bad press coming as it'll keep out the undesirables.

[musicman]

Sorry, I meant to mention - he was a native. Cypress to be exact.

Every city has those just trying to live, not concerned with which town is better than the other - but in many other cities the average person is at least aware of the positives their town has to offer.

there are just too many unknowns in each person's life which determines why they like to do certain things. some prefer to live in an area where schools are superior, some prefer to live closer to work, some prefer to live in areas where they don't have to deal with club patrons urinating in their yard, some prefer to live where they can be assured they won't come home to a homeless person lying on their porch, etc. ultimately and most importantly, what one person considers hip, isn't hip to another. I could go on a rant about the food in Austin but i'll try and keep it civilized.

so we're different colors and we're different creeds and different people have different needs Martin Gore

[Random]

Prove it.

How would you suggest I do that?

I'm sharing my observations as someone that's lived here 4 years or so and still somewhat has an "outsider's" perspective. And are you really suggesting that this city views itself as being on par with other large American cities in terms of culture, diversity, etc? I mean, sure, on HAIF we do, but the city as a whole? Do you really think our citizens show the same pride in their city as places like Austin, SF, NYC or Chicago? Or appreciate it as much?

[musicman]

The average citizen of Austin can tell you what makes Austin special or why they are proud of the city.

no Trudy's stories please.

[kylejack]

I think your wrong regarding Houstonians not knowing about their city, and for a native of the area not to know where or what Montrose is is just plain silly.

Average Houston suburbanite refers to anything inside the Loop as "downtown." Example, I was talking to a woman on a dating site who lived in Katy and told her I live "downtown". She said oh, I love to go to downtown and see the museums and for football games.

[Random]

Edit: I think it was Musicman who said... Keep the bad press coming as it'll keep out the undesirables.

Unfortunately that same bad press has influenced way too many of our fellow citizens. Montrose and the Heights are artsy hip and cool, but because they're in Houston, many Houstonians think they're somehow not worthy of the same respect as similar neighborhoods in other cities.

[RedScare]

Unfortunately that same bad press has influenced way too many of our fellow citizens. Montrose and the Heights are artsy hip and cool, but because they're in Houston, many Houstonians think they're somehow not worthy of the same respect as similar neighborhoods in other cities.

Correction: way too many of your friends. Not mine. Seriously, this entire thread has the feel of someone whose self-worth previously was tied to being able to say, "I'm from Austin, therefore I'm cool", and being afraid to say that now that you live in Houston. I really do not know of a polite way to say that anyone who bases the worth of a city or hometown on what "hip", "cool" and "artsy" people on television or on the internet say is simply a prisoner of his own failed expectations. If you worry that others may not see your city as "hip" or "cool" you ought to be concerned that you even care, or at least be concerned that your friends use terms like "hip" ans "cool" in serious conversation.

And finally, a Cypress resident is not a Houstonian. He may glom onto us because no one has heard of his burb, but that does not make him a Houstonian. The whole reason he lives there is because he doesn't like inner loop Houston. Why should anyone take what that person says about Houston as meaning anything at all?

You still haven't proven your thread point, except that you have projected one person's opinion onto 5.8 million people, or one non-resident's opinion onto 2.25 million residents.

[august948]

The average citizen of Austin can tell you what makes Austin special or why they are proud of the city. Even if they never truly experience what the city offers (see: average Arboretum resident). Can we really say that about the average Houstonian?

Lol...I know people in Austin who live in suburban McMansions and only go into "the city" for their jobs. They spend their time watching t.v. and doing things in the suburbs and rarely venture beyond that. As Red pointed out, maybe it's your sample that's faulty.

[Gary]

Average Houston suburbanite refers to anything inside the Loop as "downtown." Example, I was talking to a woman on a dating site who lived in Katy and told her I live "downtown". She said oh, I love to go to downtown and see the museums and for football games.

So once again someone is using the "I have a friend" analogy? That's not exactly great statistical info. I live in the burbs and have never encountered anyone who thinks Reliant is downtown. I guess you might get that from a new resident, but not from someone that's been here for a year or two, and that doesn't have an IQ of a shoebox.

[Gary]

Unfortunately that same bad press has influenced way too many of our fellow citizens. Montrose and the Heights are artsy hip and cool, but because they're in Houston, many Houstonians think they're somehow not worthy of the same respect as similar neighborhoods in other cities.

Not to be a jerk, but where do you get your info from? I've been here for years and have never heard anyone make those type of statements regarding the hip Houston places.

[Random]

I think I struck a nerve with some people and I'm not sure why.

For one, this has never been about projecting a cool image based on the city I lived in. It's about being proud and appreciative of what your city has to offer.

My entire point has been that many Houstonians don't appreciate the great city that they have. For all of its faults, it's a great, even world class city. And it is a shame that more people aren't aware of that. And if they were, it would do a lot for the city - not only in terms of supporting creativity and all things Houston, but for our rep around the world.

Maybe it's my demographic - Late 20's to early 30's professionals with a mixture natives and transplants. Not to mention extended family around the metro area. But I really, really, cannot fathom how someone can honestly say that Houstonians appreciate all their city has to offer to the same extent that people in other major American cities do. Or that most Houstonians would be willing to hold themselves up with Chicago, LA, New York.

[musicman]

Montrose and the Heights are artsy hip and cool

are they?

[crunchtastic]

are they?

of course they are--they have a Buffalo Exchange. I'm pretty sure it's all spelled out in chapter 4 of the Modern Urban Neighborhood Rulebook.

[musicman]

of course they are--they have a Buffalo Exchange. I'm pretty sure it's all spelled out in chapter 4 of the Modern Urban Neighborhood Rulebook.

somebody once told me that cool places end in CREEK. i know that's a fallacy.

[crunchtastic]

I think I struck a nerve with some people and I'm not sure why.

I know why: it's because from post 1 you have persisted in a passive-aggressive, backhanded way of inferring that Houstonians (particularly suburban Houstonians) are too provincial and small-minded to know any better.

[totheskies]

It was merely meant to illustrate a point - Namely that unlike most world class cities, Houston's own citizens are painfully unaware of what their city has to offer. And as a result, are unable to articulate what makes this city special to outsiders.

I know we like to say we don't care what people think of us, but c'mon - we do. We want people to see this city as the special place that we know it is. Particularly if you've seen people's reactions when you tell them you're from Houston - if it illicits any sorts of reaction, it's more likely to be negative than positive.

The average citizen of Austin can tell you what makes Austin special or why they are proud of the city. Even if they never truly experience what the city offers (see: average Arboretum resident). Can we really say that about the average Houstonian?

So you're only one guy... here's two. I've lived in Houston for exactly four years today (weird isn't it) and I can say that the reputation of this city is completely and utterly useless. Growing up in Arkansas, I hardly even knew that Houston existed until I was in junior high school. Of course I knew the phrase "Houston, we have a problem" and I had heard of NASA being in Texas, but I had no clue that NASA was in Houston or that that is where the phrase was referring to.

The first time I ever remember seeing images of Houston?? Reality Bites. That movie was some of the best press that Houston has ever gotten... great skyline shots, talking about different parts of the city, showing "real Houstonians" living "real Houston lives". But guess what movie also came out in that very same year?? Jason's Lyric. It served to brand the city as a place that was just as dangerous as South Central LA. Not exactly good for the rep.

And of course the only times that Houston ever gets national attention??? Disasters. Take the last ten years just for fun. Houston has been associated with such highlights as Tropical Storm Allison, Superbowl '04 (now forever known as Janet Jackson's nipplegate), Hurricane Katrina evacuees, the Rita traffic jam of Death, and our dear friend Hurricane Ike. If it hadn't been for the Recession and the Latin Grammys, Houston would have probably one an award for most disatrous image of the Aughts.

Seems to me that all of the "good stuff" about Houston gets grossly underemphasized and even swept under the rug, even by Texans. I especially love when people in this state (more specifically in the Texas urban triangle) talk about "Houston heat" and how it's so much worse than "Texas heat". How?? I'm up in Dallas right now, and if I go outside and try to walk across this parking lot, my clothes are going to be wet by the time I get back. Sound familiar? Last time I checked, just as many people suffer heat stroke in D/FW as they do in Houston.

Of course I agree, the image change starts with us. I know most Houstonians don't care about the city's image to outsiders, but there is something that we all care about: money. Because Houston doesn't spend time promoting itself, Houstonians lose out on the money that other cities are able to generate. NYC, Chicago, LA and Atlanta are cities that live or die by their public/media image. So as bad as that can be sometimes, the also get to reap the benefits of being first in line for government funding, hosting more national/ international events, and enjoying some world popularity. As a relatively new Houstonian, I'm proud to live in a great city, and I'm not ashamed to tell people that it's great every once in a while, especially if it helps us all in the long run.

[Random]

I know why: it's because from post 1 you have persisted in a passive-aggressive, backhanded way of inferring that Houstonians (particularly suburban Houstonians) are too provincial and small-minded to know any better.

It was never my intention to imply people were small minded. My intention was to explain that the effort to know their city better just isn't there for a huge chunk of the population.

[Heights2Bastrop]

Namely that unlike most world class cities, Houston's own citizens are painfully unaware of what their city has to offer. And as a result, are unable to articulate what makes this city special to outsiders.

When you have to make an effort to “articulate” what makes a city special to me suggests there is an ulterior motive to convince someone of its “specialness”. Those who truly understand and appreciate Houston and Houstonians may not feel the need to have to prove to others how special Houston is.

The motto down the road a ways is “Keep Austin Weird”. A Geek in its truest meaning – one who bites the heads off chickens - is “weird”, but I certainly don’t see anything “special” about that.

[RedScare]

So you're only one guy... here's two. I've lived in Houston for exactly four years today (weird isn't it) and I can say that the reputation of this city is completely and utterly useless. Growing up in Arkansas, I hardly even knew that Houston existed until I was in junior high school. Of course I knew the phrase "Houston, we have a problem" and I had heard of NASA being in Texas, but I had no clue that NASA was in Houston or that that is where the phrase was referring to.

Pointing out the deficiencies of Arkansas education, as well as your own lack of logic skills and intellectual curiosity does not convince me that Houstonians do not know their own city. Seriously? You grew up in a state that borders ours and did not know the name of Texas' largest city? And that's OUR FAULT?

Holy carp?

[Ethanra]

Maybe it's my demographic - Late 20's to early 30's professionals with a mixture natives and transplants. Not to mention extended family around the metro area. But I really, really, cannot fathom how someone can honestly say that Houstonians appreciate all their city has to offer to the same extent that people in other major American cities do. Or that most Houstonians would be willing to hold themselves up with Chicago, LA, New York.

You don't have a clue, pal! I know of plenty of people in that age group that absolutely love it here. There are also plenty of people who appreciate this city. I am one of them. I think you are gathering info from individuals who have moved here and straight to the burbs. Individuals who do not explore and embrace the great things of this city.

As far as Austin...

it is place where people try to hard to be "cool" or "wierd". It is a city of posers. Austin had wanna-be hippies and UT. The only plus it has is the surrounding hills.

As far as the article...

What sprawling city can you see a professional football, basketball, baseball, soccer and minor league hockey game. A year round professional symphony, theater, opera. Five universities (two have division 1 sports), Perhaps the best health-care in terms of quality in the world. Up-scale boutiques of hedwig village, rice village to antiques and "Austin type stuff" of lower westheimer. Two 18-hole golf courses, zoo, Herman Park, Memorial Park, Discovery Green. A dozen museums. All within 30 or so square miles connected by a rail line.and busses. This city has its faults but it is great! Who cares what the "cool" austin posers think or the ignorant surbanites.

[Random]

You people need to pull your heads out of your asses. I love this city, but If you don't think Houston has image issues, you're living a fantasy world.

I realized HAIF was full boosters and homers, but Christ.

[august948]

You people need to pull your heads out of your asses. I love this city, but If you don't think Houston has image issues, you're living a fantasy world.

I realized HAIF was full boosters and homers, but Christ.

Nobody denies that Houston has some image problems, but the consensus opinion seems to be "so what?". We can live with the disapproval of others... it's a badge of honor.

[IronTiger]

Now, coming from the point of view from a non-Houstonian, I think the initial argument of "Austin is hip and cool while Houston is generic on the surface" is terrible reasoning skills. Hello? Has anyone driven through Austin's freeways without experiencing "the city"? It's generic, too! But without helping convert this thread to a "Houston vs. Austin" article (or a "Houston vs. Dallas" article, shudder), Houston does have image issues. But we can't convert it to "Texas' Miami" or "Texas' LA" or "Texas' Seattle" or whatever. Houston doesn't have a huge light rail system, but that's least of concerns in terms of "image". And an amusement park? It HAD one, but the fact that it's gone now was some a**hole CEO's fault rather than "Houston"'s fault.