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Houston19514

Hardy Yards Development

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Freeways are being torn down, removed, and buried in many cities that we aspire to be more like. Cities we compete with for jobs, corporate home and regional offices, and more. It's a quality of life and HEALTH issue. Expanding freeways is a last century solution. Texas needs to learn that expanding freeways does nothing for the people who live adjacent to them in the city. But I suspect the people that run the state don't really care about people who choose to live IN cities. Their constituents are the companies that get the contracts followed by the folks in the burbs.

Edited by KinkaidAlum
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2 hours ago, KinkaidAlum said:

Freeways are being torn down, removed, and buried in many cities that we aspire to be more like. Cities we compete with for jobs, corporate home and regional offices, and more. It's a quality of life and HEALTH issue. Expanding freeways is a last century solution. Texas needs to learn that expanding freeways does nothing for the people who live adjacent to them in the city. But I suspect the people that run the state don't really care about people who choose to live IN cities. Their constituents are the companies that get the contracts followed by the folks in the burbs.

Couldn’t agree more! Although, Dallas and Austin are fighting and seemingly beating TxDoT in similar battles. Houston has a weird way of being soooo backwards on this stuff. It’s like we are still living in 1972 sometimes..

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8 hours ago, TOMIKA! said:

This realignment is terrible for the area

 

 

Change "the area" for Houston and you're 100% correct. 

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Houston will have its 'big dig' when TXDoT digs down the entire East side. It will be a terrible process, but it will be good for the area... in fact, it will be trans-formative. We are lucky they are going to sink the highway instead of have it above ground. Just think our downtown will not be surrounded by above ground freeway lanes. I can't wait.

Edited by Avossos
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37 minutes ago, Avossos said:

Houston will have its 'big dig' when TXDoT digs down the entire East side. It will be a terrible process, but it will be good for the area... in fact, it will be trans-formative. We are lucky they are going to sink the highway instead of have it above ground. Just think our downtown will not be surrounded by above ground freeway lanes. I can't wait.

 

Um, did you miss my comment just a bit earlier about this new I-10/I-45 being way up in the air along the southern edge of Hardy Yards? I was wrong about the 120 feet. That's I-45 where it crosses Hogan. It's "only" 100 feet in the air right behind the new apartments that are supposed to go up next to the light rail line. You can't see the numbers in the attached cross-section, but you can see the crossing relative to the already-elevated light rail.

 

Edit: I may be reading the fine print wrong. It may only be about 50 feet. I think the 100 feet is MSL, not AGL.

 

Capture.JPG

Edited by Kinglyam
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2 minutes ago, Kinglyam said:

 

Um, did you miss my comment just a bit earlier about this new I-10/I-45 being way up in the air along the southern edge of Hardy Yards? I was wrong about the 120 feet. That's I-45 where it crosses Hogan. It's "only" 100 feet in the air right behind the new apartments that are supposed to go up next to the light rail line. You can't see the numbers in the attached cross-section, but you can see the crossing relative to the already-elevated light rail.

 

 

Hi Kinglyam. My comment was about the realignment as a whole, not directly to your comment. Sorry for the confusion.

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9 hours ago, TOMIKA! said:

Couldn’t agree more! Although, Dallas and Austin are fighting and seemingly beating TxDoT in similar battles. Houston has a weird way of being soooo backwards on this stuff. It’s like we are still living in 1972 sometimes..

 

Where and in what way have either Dallas or Austin been "fighting and seemingly beating TxDoT in similar battles" in any way different from what Houston is doing?

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12 hours ago, KinkaidAlum said:

Freeways are being torn down, removed, and buried in many cities that we aspire to be more like. Cities we compete with for jobs, corporate home and regional offices, and more. It's a quality of life and HEALTH issue. Expanding freeways is a last century solution.

 

We often see this claim being made, but when one looks into it, one finds scant evidence of any cities that are experiencing growth anything like Houston's who are not expanding freeways.   And, for what it's worth, this plan includes tearing down, removing and burying freeways.  Win Win.

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2 hours ago, Houston19514 said:

 

Where and in what way have either Dallas or Austin been "fighting and seemingly beating TxDoT in similar battles" in any way different from what Houston is doing?


A couple of articles on how Dallas is pushing back: 

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/2019/01/28/dallas-city-hall-beats-back-txdot-s-early-plans-for-i-30-s-1-3-billion-makeover/

 

https://www.dmagazine.com/frontburner/2019/01/city-finds-its-voice-pushes-back-on-txdots-awful-i-30-redesign/

 

 

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5 hours ago, Avossos said:

Houston will have its 'big dig' when TXDoT digs down the entire East side. It will be a terrible process, but it will be good for the area... in fact, it will be trans-formative. We are lucky they are going to sink the highway instead of have it above ground. Just think our downtown will not be surrounded by above ground freeway lanes. I can't wait.


It will certainly be transformative . . . it will have a significant negative impact on the ongoing development of EaDo. Something on the order of 20 blocks wiped out, including many bars/restaurants that have been there forever like Huynh’s and Kim Son, as well as new spots like Neil’s Bahr. The places that aren’t taken by eminent domain will likely still be affected by traffic and parking issues from the ongoing construction, which will take years to complete for that section.

 

This represents about 10% of the total land area of the EaDo triangle—gone.

 

All of this to help commuters from the suburbs and those traveling through the city—even though thru traffic should be taking the 610 loop, as was originally intended when the interstate system was developed and expanded. And there is no meaningful increase in the number of lanes, just two additional HOV lanes.
 

The only “good” thing about this project is the proposed cap park to connect what’s left of EaDo to GRB, Discovery Green, etc. But, the funding to develop that park is not accounted for in the TXDoT budget and the funding must come from a private source. And, even if the park gets built, there can be no significant construction on top of the cap. 


I fail to see how this is good for the area.

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17 hours ago, TOMIKA! said:


I’m not sure that’s significantly different from the process the Houston project has gone through.  TxDOT has made many changes in response to city and community push back.

Edited by Houston19514
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3 hours ago, Houston19514 said:


I’m not sure that’s significantly different from the process the Houston project has gone through.  TxDOT has made many changes hi tiff in response to city and community push back.

It is, actually. City council in Houston has done nothing to push back against TxDOT. No leadership on that front. Karla Cisneros and Amanda Edwards have been the only ones that even ask questions of TxDOT in the public setting. The groundswell opposition in Houston has been mainly citizen groups like Stop TxDOT I-45 and the Make I-45 Better Coalition. Really hoping Isabel Longoria, Letitia Plummer, and some of the other candidates who have spoken out against TxDOT during the campaign trail get elected and speak up against TxDOT on behalf of their constituents. 

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10 hours ago, TOMIKA! said:

It is, actually. City council in Houston has done nothing to push back against TxDOT. No leadership on that front. Karla Cisneros and Amanda Edwards have been the only ones that even ask questions of TxDOT in the public setting. The groundswell opposition in Houston has been mainly citizen groups like Stop TxDOT I-45 and the Make I-45 Better Coalition. Really hoping Isabel Longoria, Letitia Plummer, and some of the other candidates who have spoken out against TxDOT during the campaign trail get elected and speak up against TxDOT on behalf of their constituents. 

 

I don't care what letterhead was used. The fact is, the City of Houston has indeed "pushed back" on the design in very similar ways.  Note that Dallas City Council has not attempted to stop the I-30 project, only to modify the design.

Edited by Houston19514
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15 hours ago, thedistrict84 said:


It will certainly be transformative . . . it will have a significant negative impact on the ongoing development of EaDo. Something on the order of 20 blocks wiped out, including many bars/restaurants that have been there forever like Huynh’s and Kim Son, as well as new spots like Neil’s Bahr. 

 

 

I think it's more like 16 blocks, half of which are surface parking.

 

Funny thing:  freeway opponents often tell us that nothing worthwhile can be developed adjacent to an elevated freeway.  Here, freeway opponents tell us we must not replace an elevated freeway because it would destroy all of the wonderful development adjacent to the elevated freeway.

Edited by Houston19514
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2 hours ago, Houston19514 said:

 

I think it's more like 16 blocks, half of which are surface parking.

 

Funny thing:  freeway opponents often tell us that nothing worthwhile can be developed adjacent to an elevated freeway.  Here, freeway opponents tell us we must not replace an elevated freeway because it would destroy all of the wonderful development adjacent to the elevated freeway.


It’s about 19 or 20 blocks total, all the way to the historic Ford dealership where Tout Suite is. The entire area of EaDo is around 270 blocks, so it’s about 7% of the total land area. My estimate was a bit high, but the blocks being taken are either developed or more prime for future development due to the proximity to downtown. There are only about three or four blocks of surface parking near MMP—certainly not half of the total lots though. 

2 hours ago, Houston19514 said:

 

False.


I believe there are only two HOV-type lanes being added to I-45 as an increase from current capacity. One of the main reasons for the reroute given by those that have developed the plans is not the addition of outright capacity but to streamline the exits and other ramps and have traffic flow more smoothly and require less lane changes through that section.

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52 minutes ago, thedistrict84 said:


It’s about 19 or 20 blocks total, all the way to the historic Ford dealership where Tout Suite is. The entire area of EaDo is around 270 blocks, so it’s about 7% of the total land area. My estimate was a bit high, but the blocks being taken are either developed or more prime for future development due to the proximity to downtown. There are only about three or four blocks of surface parking near MMP—certainly not half of the total lots though. 


I believe there are only two HOV-type lanes being added to I-45 as an increase from current capacity. One of the main reasons for the reroute given by those that have developed the plans is not the addition of outright capacity but to streamline the exits and other ramps and have traffic flow more smoothly and require less lane changes through that section.

 

There are four blocks that are entirely surface parking (or just vacant).  There is only one block that is completely built up.  

All other blocks have substantial amounts of surface parking, most at or above 50% of the block.

 

Your belief about the  project only adding two HOV lanes is just incorrect.  www.ih45northandmore.com

Edited by Houston19514
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17 hours ago, Houston19514 said:

 

I don't care what letterhead was used. The fact is, the City of Houston has indeed "pushed back" on the design in very similar ways.  Note that Dallas City Council has not attempted to stop the I-30 project, only to modify the design.

Tell me who in the “City of Houston” has “pushed back”.

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10 hours ago, TOMIKA! said:

Tell me who in the “City of Houston” has “pushed back”.

 

The Mayor, the staff.  All have been working closely with TxDOT on this project for years and have caused many changes to the plan.  The City has also led the public outreach/feedback efforts which have also led to many changes to the plan.

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Lots of civil dirt work going on west of the apartments, anyone know what is next?

dWidVtW.jpg

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On 12/15/2019 at 12:22 PM, Triton said:

Yup. I've attended all of the TXDOT meetings and the city has been quite vocal about where they stand. As 19514 said, the city has been the main driving force behind a lot of the improved changes to the plan over what was originally shown by TXDOT. In fact, after more community feedback and with the city's guidance, we're about to get new schematics in the coming days. 

I’ve attended those meetings as well. This mayor has and continues to back TXDoT’s plan as it is, which is disgraceful, in my opinion, especially to black and Latino communities north of downtown. I’m thrilled we have a new crop of city council members like Letitia Plummer, though, that may actually push TXDoT to make changes that don’t just benefit those wealthier communities in and around downtown. The new schematics published by TXDoT a few weeks ago are a prime example that they are not listening to communities that they will hurt the worst. Almost no changes to the plans that will wipe out hundreds of businesses, displace more than a thousand people, and locate freeways adjacent to close to a dozen schools. All in predominantly black and Latino neighborhoods, go figure. 

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On 1/2/2020 at 2:36 AM, j_cuevas713 said:

Did anyone notice that some moron wrote on the Hardy Yards sign? Any way to get this fixed? 

Ugh, thanks for the notice. If they don’t fix it right away, I’d alert Rebecca Reyna with the Greater Northside Management District. They maintain those improvements. 

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On 1/1/2020 at 4:00 PM, hindesky said:

Lots of civil dirt work going on west of the apartments, anyone know what is next?

 

 

See a page or so earlier, before the I-45 debate. It's the first of the actual Hardy Yards CV developments, a wrap apartment like the Residences.

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First quarter 2021 move-in? Dang, that's ambitious. It was more than 2 years for the Residences, I believe.

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42 minutes ago, Kinglyam said:

First quarter 2021 move-in? Dang, that's ambitious. It was more than 2 years for the Residences, I believe.

 

I think a lot of that was designated to the stand-alone parking garage. If this is a podium or wrap structure, it should go up a lot quicker.

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On 1/14/2020 at 12:54 PM, wilcal said:

https://www.houstonchronicle.com/business/article/Mixed-income-housing-project-breaks-ground-near-14973901.php

 

Looks like another apartment called "The Exchange" will be starting soon. 

 

Went to investigate myself. Didn't know if it was the lot that @hindesky photographed a couple weeks ago. Indeed it is that lot.

 

MBGoT03.jpg

 

z2crcIX.jpg

Edited by Luminare
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2 hours ago, Luminare said:

 

Went to investigate myself. Didn't know if it was the lot that @hindesky photographed a couple weeks ago. Indeed it is that lot.

 

MBGoT03.jpg

 

z2crcIX.jpg

Same lot, my pic was from the northeast corner.

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Local Group Brewing appears really close to opening and it is right across the street. 

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9 minutes ago, crock said:

Local Group Brewing appears really close to opening and it is right across the street. 

 

Saw that as well. Its looking really nice.

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14 hours ago, TOMIKA! said:

Some intense soil sampling? This is a different site than the apt building construction. 

42AEE69F-4923-4095-A41C-2BE9FDD53393.jpeg

 

That's one of the interior lots on Burnett, isn't it? Were they digging with the excavator? Maybe they're prepping the site to use as a laydown yard for the apartment construction. 

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38 minutes ago, Kinglyam said:

 

That's one of the interior lots on Burnett, isn't it? Were they digging with the excavator? Maybe they're prepping the site to use as a laydown yard for the apartment construction. 


Yes, this is the lot on Burnett between Chapman and Hardy. They dug several holes and then covered them up. 

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5 minutes ago, TOMIKA! said:


Yes, this is the lot on Burnett between Chapman and Hardy. They dug several holes and then covered them up. 

 

That's too shallow for any real structural geotech, but would be a sufficient depth to check surface soil to see if it can handle heavy equipment like cranes. It's also what you'd do if you suspected petroleum contamination in the near subsurface, but since this place is a brownfields, it's been poked and prodded enough that there shouldn't be any risk of that. I don't know what other reasons there would be, unless someone found a treasure map.

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Theyre digging on the other fields this morning as well. Thats almost all of them save for the one adjancent to the abandoned parking lot?with the fence around it. But walking on the field about a week ago next to the fenced off area i notice they had fresh stakes in the ground and utilities had sprayed the lines. 

 

Does anyone know if the rest of the sites are going to start building out/breaking ground soon or are they just early surveying phase to see whats possible? 

 

As for I45 thing, its a collosal waste of money but dont expect the city to put up any real fight, downtown finally gets pierce elevated a gaint noose around its neck taken off and the otherside, while getting destroyed in the nearterm, will be buried. This means much of downtown is reconnected to its surrounding - this is great for downtown. Its without a doubt part of the built in political back scratching of this project. The north side definitely gets the short end of the stick, well have to wait and see how ugly it really is and how much of the adjancent park is destroyed. But its not getting significantly changed, too much in it the city has wanted for decades now. 

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On 1/21/2020 at 9:53 AM, Two said:

Theyre digging on the other fields this morning as well. Thats almost all of them save for the one adjancent to the abandoned parking lot?with the fence around it. But walking on the field about a week ago next to the fenced off area i notice they had fresh stakes in the ground and utilities had sprayed the lines. 

 

Does anyone know if the rest of the sites are going to start building out/breaking ground soon or are they just early surveying phase to see whats possible? 

 

As for I45 thing, its a collosal waste of money but dont expect the city to put up any real fight, downtown finally gets pierce elevated a gaint noose around its neck taken off and the otherside, while getting destroyed in the nearterm, will be buried. This means much of downtown is reconnected to its surrounding - this is great for downtown. Its without a doubt part of the built in political back scratching of this project. The north side definitely gets the short end of the stick, well have to wait and see how ugly it really is and how much of the adjancent park is destroyed. But its not getting significantly changed, too much in it the city has wanted for decades now. 

 

Honestly don't see what anyone is complaining about. That bend in I-10 always felt unnecessary and dangerous to me and the freeway construction is taking out nothing important or anywhere anyone is living in. Win-win as far as I can see it.

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11 hours ago, Big E said:

 

Honestly don't see what anyone is complaining about. That bend in I-10 always felt unnecessary and dangerous to me and the freeway construction is taking out nothing important or anywhere anyone is living in. Win-win as far as I can see it.

 

Big E, because it's going to have a multi-lane freeway jacked up 80 or so feet in the air, right next to all this new development? Have you heard how loud those freeways are? These won't have anything to buffer the noise except summer humidity. The bend in I-10, to my knowledge, has had no impact on accidents, so I question how dangerous it is.

 

Two, they're probably going to start the Red Line Apartments (I think someone here called them) soon as well, so they may be needing laydown areas for both. Maybe even do a bit of site prep for the future promised mixed-use stuff. But none of us have heard anything about that part of the project getting underway.

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7 hours ago, Kinglyam said:

 

 

Big E, because it's going to have a multi-lane freeway jacked up 80 or so feet in the air, right next to all this new development? Have you heard how loud those freeways are? These won't have anything to buffer the noise except summer humidity. The bend in I-10, to my knowledge, has had no impact on accidents, so I question how dangerous it is.

 

Two, they're probably going to start the Red Line Apartments (I think someone here called them) soon as well, so they may be needing laydown areas for both. Maybe even do a bit of site prep for the future promised mixed-use stuff. But none of us have heard anything about that part of the project getting underway.

 

While I'm sure a high freeway is not optimal for the apartment views, they've been talking about this freeway project for what, half a decade? Its not like anyone should be going into this blindfolded. I mean, the freeway isn't that faraway now, and the apartments are already right next to a rail yard; not sure the people living there are worried about sound. Trust me; I'm from a rail town with a large rail yard; you can hear those trains a coming at night miles away. You just get used to it and don't even notice it after awhile. And Houston already has a crap ton of apartments literally right next to the freeways. Doubt this will be any different.

Edited by Big E
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On 1/26/2020 at 1:40 AM, Big E said:

 

Honestly don't see what anyone is complaining about. That bend in I-10 always felt unnecessary and dangerous to me and the freeway construction is taking out nothing important or anywhere anyone is living in. Win-win as far as I can see it.

How about the apartments and businesses on the other side of the GRB? What would you consider important?

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14 hours ago, Big E said:

 

While I'm sure a high freeway is not optimal for the apartment views, they've been talking about this freeway project for what, half a decade? Its not like anyone should be going into this blindfolded. I mean, the freeway isn't that faraway now, and the apartments are already right next to a rail yard; not sure the people living there are worried about sound. Trust me; I'm from a rail town with a large rail yard; you can hear those trains a coming at night miles away. You just get used to it and don't even notice it after awhile. And Houston already has a crap ton of apartments literally right next to the freeways. Doubt this will be any different.

 

It's not just the apartments. The residences across Burnett that have "only" dealt with the train will now get that monstrosity cutting across their skyline view and adding noise. Why should they need to get used to it? Poor Local Group has been advertising their skyline views. Of course, those will be gone long before this boondoggle of a freeway is built, once the rest of the Hardy Yards goes up.  Also, just because you "get used to it" doesn't mean it's not there, and health studies are beginning to show evidence that noise like that can have negative health impacts (beyond hearing loss, which this won't be loud enough to cause).

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2 hours ago, Montrose1100 said:

How about the apartments and businesses on the other side of the GRB? What would you consider important?

 

I would consider redeveloping the bayou frontage and helping downtown to be a much bigger priority, and I'm sure the city sees it the same way. It simply makes more economic sense, and going by the Downtown District's plans, that's exactly what they're thinking. Moving the Freeway north would open up that entire area to extensive redevelopment, which is the plan. The Freeway should never have come that far south to begin with, as far as I'm concerned. Now, I would have, at the least, had I-49 tunnel under the rail yards, to limit the ROW that would be needed. Ideally, I would have tunneled 49 and 10, but I understand the level of expense would probably be too much. But even above ground, I would have moved the freeway north and had it cover the yards themselves. They could build something like this development on the other side of the freeway, closer to downtown.

 

2 hours ago, Kinglyam said:

 

It's not just the apartments. The residences across Burnett that have "only" dealt with the train will now get that monstrosity cutting across their skyline view and adding noise. Why should they need to get used to it? Poor Local Group has been advertising their skyline views. Of course, those will be gone long before this boondoggle of a freeway is built, once the rest of the Hardy Yards goes up.  Also, just because you "get used to it" doesn't mean it's not there, and health studies are beginning to show evidence that noise like that can have negative health impacts (beyond hearing loss, which this won't be loud enough to cause).

 

Because somebody will "have to get used to it" in some fashion. The area around the freeway had to get used to its existence in its current configuration for decades. Once again, North Freeway, 1-10, and Eastex Freeway have already been there for decades, as have the rail yards themselves, and they aren't going anywhere. People have already "gotten used to" their existence long ago. The city will priority region considerations over the considerations of one neighborhood.

Edited by Big E
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Just saw this blurb from last week on a RealtyNews. Looks like the other one is coming pretty soon, too.

 

"PGIM Real Estate Finance has arranged a $48 million Freddie Mac unfunded forward commitment to provide permanent financing for Red Line Station,a planned 300-unit mixed-income apartment complex in Houston. PGIM is the commercial mortgage finance arm of PGIM Inc., the $1 trillion global investment management business of Prudential Financial, Inc. Red Line Station is in the Near Northside neighborhood. The site is part of the proposed 43-acre Hardy Yards master-planned mixed-use community."

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On 1/26/2020 at 1:40 AM, Big E said:

 

Honestly don't see what anyone is complaining about. That bend in I-10 always felt unnecessary and dangerous to me and the freeway construction is taking out nothing important or anywhere anyone is living in. Win-win as far as I can see it.

 

It's a giant ugly eye sore in it's new ROW, basically. That sums it up. If you walk out there and actually measure out where the road will be it's going to block what is now a really awesome view and turn it into a really trashy one. That does suck. I've seen no data to support the claim that it's currently 'dangerous' (I've been to meetings wherein Txdots made the claim, but again - a salesman's concern trolling bare assertion), but I have that it's simply to cut a couple seconds off travel, and it will probably turn a big swath of nice park into the next hobo encampment, other than that  -  no, the furniture warehouse or whatever that is won't be much of a loss and the road wouldn't be all that bad except for how raised it'll be to go over main and the light rail, without a single doubt detracts from the major appeal (or what could be) of that area outside it's proximity to DT.

 

The new connectors to and from Near North into DT will be really nice, that's the only win for the northside. In the long-term if other projects are handled correctly, like the 140-180 million now dedicated to the north channel dig and construction, then even the top half of Jail house island could be a neat feature for the area.

 

Overall I think the area has a lot of promise regardless.

Edited by Two
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