GreenStreet: Mixed-Use Development At 1201 Fannin St.

[LTAWACS]

Where can I park for free? And please keep in mind that I'm horrible at parallel parking

There are places here and there along the street. You just have to look for them. I go downtown all the time and I have never paid for parking.

[musicman]

ps...not sure if the pic posted of the VIP dining room at HOB is from the Foundation Room but from all the Foundation Rooms i have been lucky enough to visit, it looks like it is and cannot wait to visit this houston one as well dec 3rd!

thanks for the pic!

Everyone must somehow, someway get to experience a Foundation Room event, these spaces are incredible.

it is from the houston hob. here's another.

and here's the music venue with the bottom floor being standing room only.

Edited November 19, 2008 by musicman

[LTAWACS]

Honestly, i think House Of Blues and Lucky Strike will drive business there because HOB has already done so for me and lots of others i know.

And HOB is in this for the long run...why? because, forget the restaurant for now...it is a quality music venue...great lights, sound, stage and ambiance...love the place and it makes me excited to go see shows again...so much so that i am more open to see other new bands in such a great environment. Those reasons alone will keep people coming to the HP and rightfully so. (as for the restaurant and bar, i liked it and while some may have their justified complaints, i will continue to go there, as will my friends.)

Cant wait to have Lucky Strike open as well since Dave and Busters bowling at the Marqe was my only other close option!

and i cant forget the opening of Cork in January 09! Cork is an awesome wine bar, live music venue so that will also bring a new and great addition to HP!

im excited

ps...not sure if the pic posted of the VIP dining room at HOB is from the Foundation Room but from all the Foundation Rooms i have been lucky enough to visit, it looks like it is and cannot wait to visit this houston one as well dec 3rd!

thanks for the pic!

Everyone must somehow, someway get to experience a Foundation Room event, these spaces are incredible.

Yeah I'd go to cork. I dont know about HOB though as I'm not much into Blues... or "rock".

[RedScare]

was downtown sunday evening and couldn't believe how much they were charging for parking pre-madonna. $40 at one place.

People who spend their disposable income on Madonna tickets should be relieved of as much disposable income as possible.

[HtownWxBoy]

People who spend their disposable income on Madonna tickets should be relieved of as much disposable income as possible.

Why is that?

[fewellman]

Yeah I'd go to cork. I dont know about HOB though as I'm not much into Blues... or "rock".

Most of the shows that have been there so far have been Hip Hop concerts......

[TexasVines]

Why is that?

because she is yesterdays has been, looks like tom petty on crack now, and has totally gone off the deep end and needs to be locked up to have her sanity checked

[HtownWxBoy]

because she is yesterdays has been, looks like tom petty on crack now, and has totally gone off the deep end and needs to be locked up to have her sanity checked

Well for a "yesterday's has been" she sure knows how to sell out a concert.

[MetroMogul]

I think the disappointment lies in the fact that so many Houstonians are craving that ONE entertainment/shopping district that will draw world and national renown like so many other cities currently have. Fairly or not, HP was hyped as the realization of these urban fantasies since it's inception and when you look at what it was proposed to be and what it is now, I can understand a fair bit of letdown. HP went from urban hipster fantasy to a curiously designed Park Shops. I seriously doubt that is what many people were expecting when it was announced.

However, to deem HP a failure is very premature and giving it a three month life span is utterly ridiculous. I think HP has a good chance of limping along into something respectable or at the very least an alternative to the Tunnels and the Park Shops.

Edited November 20, 2008 by MetroMogul

[musicman]

I think the disappointment lies in the fact that so many Houstonians are craving that ONE entertainment/shopping district that will draw world and national renown like so many other cities currently have.

who's craving this? it surprises me many have never heard of hp.

[Houston19514]

I think the disappointment lies in the fact that so many Houstonians are craving that ONE entertainment/shopping district that will draw world and national renown like so many other cities currently have. Fairly or not, HP was hyped as the realization of these urban fantasies since it's inception and when you look at what it was proposed to be and what it is now, I can understand a fair bit of letdown. HP went from urban hipster fantasy to a curiously designed Park Shops. I seriously doubt that is what many people were expecting when it was announced.

It must be fun living inside that head of yours. You have a CRAZY wild imagination. ;-)

Edited November 20, 2008 by Houston19514

[MetroMogul]

who's craving this? it surprises me many have never heard of hp.

Well, many people on this forum for starters.

[dalparadise]

Well said.

Strange, I found the discussion of places he would "seldom frequent" and "occasionally frequent" to be very poorly said.

[musicman]

Well, many people on this forum for starters.

that's just a little different that "so many Houstonians" lockmat just bumped up a thread where some place named chocolata that closed and when you bring up the website CRAVE is the first word you see

[MetroMogul]

Well, I personally know of many people off site that would love an entertainment/shopping district that rivals Times Square (it's not going to happen) or the Vegas Strip (also not going to happen). Many thought that HP was going to be the beginning of something like that and looking at the end result they feel letdown in a way. Me personally, I don't mind it too much and I see alot of potential. At the very least it's a new place to use a bathroom downtown.

[memebag]

I think the disappointment lies in the fact that so many Houstonians are craving that ONE entertainment/shopping district that will draw world and national renown like so many other cities currently have.

Eh? HP is disappointing because it's an ugly, empty mall. I've been to lots of malls, all over the world. HP is one of the ugliest, and the only one I've ever seen open with only 4 stores tenants. I'd bet there are fewer than 100 Houstonians craving those words you wrote.

[musicman]

Well, I personally know of many people off site that would love an entertainment/shopping district that rivals Times Square (it's not going to happen) or the Vegas Strip (also not going to happen).

PETER BROWN FOR MAYOR!!

[crunchtastic]

For the record, I never said HP was a failure. I said the retail tenants suck. Mightily.

Seriously suck. And as far as I know, the HP developers have had many, many months to attract suitable retail tenants.

[MetroMogul]

Eh? HP is disappointing because it's an ugly, empty mall. I've been to lots of malls, all over the world. HP is one of the ugliest, and the only one I've ever seen open with only 4 stores tenants. I'd bet there are fewer than 100 Houstonians craving those words you wrote.

Judging from the sentiment of some on this site alone, I'd beg to differ.

[dalparadise]

I think the disappointment lies in the fact that so many Houstonians are craving that ONE entertainment/shopping district that will draw world and national renown like so many other cities currently have. Fairly or not, HP was hyped as the realization of these urban fantasies since it's inception and when you look at what it was proposed to be and what it is now, I can understand a fair bit of letdown. HP went from urban hipster fantasy to a curiously designed Park Shops. I seriously doubt that is what many people were expecting when it was announced.

However, to deem HP a failure is very premature and giving it a three month life span is utterly ridiculous. I think HP has a good chance of limping along into something respectable or at the very least an alternative to the Tunnels and the Park Shops.

The Houstonians craving this are unaware of The Galleria. I think <100 sounds about right.

On a serious note, a comparison to The Galleria is valid, I think. When that mall was introduced into a seemingly illogical setting -- It was considered the middle of nowhere at the time -- it focused on destination retail and the novelty of an ice rink in hot, humid Houston, to draw people who were curious. It also was designed as an enclosed city unto itself, with a nod to "public spaces" (ironically on private property) that had rarely been seen outside much older cities. It invented (or more accurately re-invented) an architectural type, further distinguishing itself and sealing its longevity as a model for others to follow.

I hate to think what "Marq-E on Main" will look like when it turns The Gal's age.

Edited November 20, 2008 by dalparadise

[worldlyman]

Eh? HP is disappointing because it's an ugly, empty mall. I've been to lots of malls, all over the world. HP is one of the ugliest, and the only one I've ever seen open with only 4 stores tenants. I'd bet there are fewer than 100 Houstonians craving those words you wrote.

This place is just like starting, y'know. Houston Pavilions seems like a cool place, interesting OPEN design that is opposite of the Galleria, close to the downtown action.

I've been to some beautiful malls in Asia, been down the Stroget in Copenhagen, and I've appreciated the unique Horton Plaza in San Diego when I lived in that city...but there's nothing all that wrong with HP except the circular rings with their unsafe-height rails. Is it because it's in Houston that it's "an ugly. empty mall," especially when it's NOT EVEN FINISHED yet? I notice that negativity phenomemon...just because something's in Houston, it's ugly or uncool or this or that.

Just the whole set-up of Houston Pavilions to Main Street Square relative to the rest of downtown...that whole thing when I walked there after work last Friday night...seems a lot more edgy, untamed and YET HONESTLY more urbane than doing the Hollywood&Highland (and that Walk of Fame crap), more so than the Century City Shopping Center and quite more so than Beverly Center/Beverly Connection.

Houston Pavilion just adds texture to downtown. The large cultural/performance buildings, the bayou walk, the Main Street action, the skyscrapers...that nouveaux urban vibe in a Sunbelt context, it's here in H-town, not Hollywood.

I love L.A. but it seems played out...the influx of new developments happening in Houston just seems much more delicious.

[MetroMogul]

The Houstonians craving this are unaware of The Galleria. I think <100 sounds about right.

On a serious note, a comparison to The Galleria is valid, I think. When that mall was introduced into a seemingly illogical setting -- It was considered the middle of nowhere at the time -- it focused on destination retail and the novelty of an ice rink in hot, humid Houston, to draw people who were curious. It also was designed as an enclosed city unto itself, with a nod to "public spaces" (ironically on private property) that had rarely been seen outside much older cities. It invented (or more accurately re-invented) an architectural type, further distinguishing itself and sealing its longevity as a model for others to follow.

I hate to think what "Marq-E on Main" will look like when it turns The Gal's age.

HP would not have been developed at all if what you and Meme allude to is true. The original concept of HP was to cater to those that wanted the whole mixed use/entertainment feel. I doubt multi-million dollar projects are conceived on the whims of less than 100 REGULAR people. I suppose we'll just have to agree to disagree on that.

While the comparison to the the Galleria is valid, the lure of HP is that it was supposed to breathe a bit of new life into a somewhat revitalized downtown.

Personally, I don't have a dog in this fight. Whether HP becomes close to what it was envisioned to be at the onset or just another bathroom and bookstop doesn't really matter to me. I will say though that it was incredibly short-sighted to open only four stores in such a hyped project. The opening would have gone over better if they decided to wait until more tenants were ready.

[jgriff]

On a serious note, a comparison to The Galleria is valid, I think. When that mall was introduced into a seemingly illogical setting -- It was considered the middle of nowhere at the time -- it focused on destination retail and the novelty of an ice rink in hot, humid Houston, to draw people who were curious.

Easy access via 610 and the massive free parking garages have helped also. These are two things that HP doesn't have.

[roadrunner]

I wasn't expecting a some extraordinary destination shopping. I was expecting something more like West Ave. I realize that West Ave isn't complete, but I am already impressed just driving by the current structure. Walking by HP gives me the same feeling when I drive by the Marq E on I-10.

Don't get me wrong, I think there is still a chance for HP to succeed in the short term (next 5 years or so). What really worries me is what the place is like in 15-20 years. Restaurant lifespans don't usually last that long, and I can't imagine the retail would either. It's up to the buildings and concept to keep drawing people....and unfortunately I don't think that will be enough. Just look at Bayou Place.

[LTAWACS]

Most of the shows that have been there so far have been Hip Hop concerts......

I dont know if this is good or bad...

[tierwestah]

Why does everyone keep comparing this with bayou place. This thing is way larger than Bayou place and more tennants occupy, plus its location to the rail line.

[lockmat]

From the Downtown Happenings newsletter concerning BAM:

On Monday, November 24 meet presidential hopeful and author Mike Huckabee, who will be signing his latest book Do the Right Thing. Take advantage of their early bird specials on Friday, November 28 from 7-10 a.m. and enjoy an extra 10 percent savings on everything you can fit in their traditional canvas tote bags. Later that day meet popular author Tosca Lee, who will be in the store signing copies of her latest work, Hava: The Story of Eve.

[LTAWACS]

Sounds like it's going to get packed then.

[totheskies]

The Houstonians craving this are unaware of The Galleria. I think <100 sounds about right.

On a serious note, a comparison to The Galleria is valid, I think. When that mall was introduced into a seemingly illogical setting -- It was considered the middle of nowhere at the time -- it focused on destination retail and the novelty of an ice rink in hot, humid Houston, to draw people who were curious. It also was designed as an enclosed city unto itself, with a nod to "public spaces" (ironically on private property) that had rarely been seen outside much older cities. It invented (or more accurately re-invented) an architectural type, further distinguishing itself and sealing its longevity as a model for others to follow.

I hate to think what "Marq-E on Main" will look like when it turns The Gal's age.

Hmm sounds like any critics of the The Galleria back then are probably eating it today (no literally, they're eating at Kona Grill, The Cheesecake Factory...)

You guys sound old and bitter the way that you talk about HP. It's been open one month and four days. There's hardly anything there for us to criticize yet. My personal "first impression" of the project??? Nothin' special, but it works. It's a vast improvement over the three surface parking lots that existed there in 2006. The tourist and convention crowd (yes that's correct, Houston DOES actually have tourists) and convention crowds are loving it, as was apparent during the Latin Grammys. Being located in downtown and on the rail line, Houston Pavilions is providing a much needed outlet for after hours retail and entertainment. And the Marq-E comparison is a compliment to HP, b/c last time I checked, the Marq-E's business was booming.

[Poppahop]

last time I checked, the Marq-E's business was booming.

Then the last time must have been a long time ago.

[tierwestah]

I do wish they could've landed better tennants and hope they do in the future. Some of you all are talking like its over. We still have alot of retail space left in the pavilions, not to mention the remaining retail space on Main Street to fill up.

It just beats the hell out of those ugly surface lots that were there before. I'm reserving my judgement for this place until the Spring when everytihng is finished.

The only thing i'm disapopointed in right now is the lighting on H/P. The developers were talking like it was supposed to be so stunning and extravagent. They were saying that they were going to bring video screens and flashing lights.Now when I call the HP number on the website, the employees basically are unaware of those plans which now don't sound very promising in the future. It currently looks boring at night.

[TexasVines]

Why does everyone keep comparing this with bayou place. This thing is way larger than Bayou place and more tennants occupy, plus its location to the rail line.

because Bayou Place was supposed to be a place with eating in the day for workers, eating at night for those living in the area, eating at night for those coming into the theater district, entertainment for those coming into the theater district for after the show and entertainment for those living in the area, and most importantly to actually DRAW people to it at night for the entertainment venues offered....IE to give a "night life" to that part of Houston...from reading this entire thread it seems to me that many felt HP was going to actually do the same thing....especially draw in the night life and drive business to the other tenants of HP

Last I saw one of the new main tenants at Bayou Place was going to be a server farm....which is about as far from day or night life as one can get

Edited November 20, 2008 by TexasVines

[LTAWACS]

because Bayou Place was supposed to be a place with eating in the day for workers, eating at night for those living in the area, eating at night for those coming into the theater district, entertainment for those coming into the theater district for after the show and entertainment for those living in the area, and most importantly to actually DRAW people to it at night for the entertainment venues offered....IE to give a "night life" to that part of Houston...from reading this entire thread it seems to me that many felt HP was going to actually do the same thing....especially draw in the night life and drive business to the other tenants of HP

Last I saw one of the new main tenants at Bayou Place was going to be a server farm....which is about as far from day or night life as one can get

Yes. The Planet has been there for some time now.

[Jax]

Isn't The Planet office in a section of Bayou place that was intended to be used for office space? Just like HP has a tower section dedicated to office space? Or did they put the Blue Planet office into a space that was originally intended to be used for "night life"?

[MetroMogul]

because Bayou Place was supposed to be a place with eating in the day for workers, eating at night for those living in the area, eating at night for those coming into the theater district, entertainment for those coming into the theater district for after the show and entertainment for those living in the area, and most importantly to actually DRAW people to it at night for the entertainment venues offered....IE to give a "night life" to that part of Houston...from reading this entire thread it seems to me that many felt HP was going to actually do the same thing....especially draw in the night life and drive business to the other tenants of HP

Last I saw one of the new main tenants at Bayou Place was going to be a server farm....which is about as far from day or night life as one can get

Exactly. People did not expect HP to be "just another shopping center." They expected a mixed use development with heavy emphasis on shopping and entertainment with a moderate residential component. To say the demand for that is less than 100 people in the whole of the city is a tad silly. HP was conceived due to that demand.

[memebag]

Exactly. People did not expect HP to be "just another shopping center." They expected a mixed use development with heavy emphasis on shopping and entertainment with a moderate residential component. To say the demand for that is less than 100 people in the whole of the city is a tad silly. HP was conceived due to that demand.

I didn't say that. I said there were less than 100 Houstonians craving what you described ("ONE entertainment/shopping district that will draw world and national renown like so many other cities currently have"), and I stand by it. I doubt there are more than 100 people who care about this issue and also believe that one entertainment and/or shopping district could possibly have that effect.

[Fringe]

Most of the shows that have been there so far have been Hip Hop concerts......

That fits in withmost of the clubs in downtown. That's why downtown is not drawing the white young professional crowd as much as midtown. montrose and the heighths.

[LTAWACS]

That fits in withmost of the clubs in downtown. That's why downtown is not drawing the white young professional crowd as much as midtown. montrose and the heighths.

Is that the developers' target audience?

Edited November 21, 2008 by LTAWACS

[Jax]

The East End of Downtown has a pretty good music scene. Not sure if you can call that downtown though.

[roadrunner]

For what it's worth, as a young professional in Houston that hangs around the trendy crowd, I can tell all of you that HOB is very popular. They draw great acts. Everyone I knew went to the Michael Jackson cover band concert last weekend. A couple of friends and I went late and tried to get in but the line was down the street.

The Foundation Room is also very popular with the 30,000aires of Houston (yep, they're here too). HOB is an excellent tenant and is really the only thing that is keeping my hopes up for this development.

[jayshoota]

For what it's worth, as a young professional in Houston that hangs around the trendy crowd, I can tell all of you that HOB is very popular. They draw great acts. Everyone I knew went to the Michael Jackson cover band concert last weekend. A couple of friends and I went late and tried to get in but the line was down the street.

The Foundation Room is also very popular with the 30,000aires of Houston (yep, they're here too). HOB is an excellent tenant and is really the only thing that is keeping my hopes up for this development.

I agree. As a young professional also, I can say that the HOB is very popular among the demographic. I think if you go and look at the HOB list of performances, you will see most of them are not "hip hop".

It will even get better once Pete's opens. Always a hit with the young professionals.

Edited November 21, 2008 by jayshoota

[Fringe]

I agree. As a young professional also, I can say that the HOB is very popular among the demographic. I think if you go and look at the HOB list of performances, you will see most of them are not "hip hop".

It will even get better once Pete's opens. Always a hit with the young professionals.

I agree. Pete's should be a good draw based on the crowd at the Howling Moon.

Edited November 21, 2008 by LunaticFringe

[swtsig]

I agree. As a young professional also, I can say that the HOB is very popular among the demographic. I think if you go and look at the HOB list of performances, you will see most of them are not "hip hop".

It will even get better once Pete's opens. Always a hit with the young professionals.

yeah, not sure where the notion of the HOB attracting mostly "hip hop" acts came from, i'd say it's been overwhelmingly rock... hell, i was there for the black crowes last night and it was fantastic.

but i stand by my notion that outside of the HOB/luckystrike components, HP is nothing more than a glorified outdoor mall.

[LTAWACS]

What is this Foundation Room?

[jayshoota]

What is this Foundation Room?

VIP room at the HOB. You have to buy a membership and are allowed to bring a limited number of guest with you depending on which level you get.

[gene]

actually that is not the only way you can gain access...

The Foundation Room is also for special events and each time Blue October has played a House Of Blues in the U.S. they have hosted a radio station sponsored event/autograph signing/acoustic show and/or post party in The Foundation Room and let me tell you, these places blow me away...

straight from a movie set with its dark, rich, eclectic decor...all seem to be done by the same designer across the country with tons of dark wood, velvet curtains and buddah statues etc...

The Foundation Room was one of the reasons i was so excited to get a House Of Blues here.

cannot wait to check out the Houston one in a couple of weeks!

Edited November 21, 2008 by gene

[HtownWxBoy]

VIP room at the HOB. You have to buy a membership and are allowed to bring a limited number of guest with you depending on which level you get.

I was wondering what that place was. I was Downtown the other evening and just took a stroll through HP and noticed the Foundation Room... it was set apart from everything else and was basically just a door with someone guarding it... weird... I was wondering if it was part of HOB.

As for HOB, the night I walked by (around sunset) there were a lot of people outside walking in and out... lots of street traffic around that area. That restaurant / bar right across the street from HOB must be thrilled it's finally open.

[BigSky]

Was at Forever 21 again tonight at 6:30 and it was buzzing with activity. It didn't even feel like Houston, felt more like Chicago. I know it is one store, but I think this thing is primed for success.

[HtownWxBoy]

Was at Forever 21 again tonight at 6:30 and it was buzzing with activity. It didn't even feel like Houston, felt more like Chicago. I know it is one store, but I think this thing is primed for success.

I agree... I just wish some retail place that caters to guys would open... Gap, Banana Republic, H&M, American Eagle... something! Oh well.

[smalltownfate]

I was down at HP last night for the first time to see the Black Crowes. The show was great. HOB is great, a very cool place. However side balcony seats suck. You can't see about a 1/3 of the stage. We could never see the lead guitarist. We switched sides of the balcony late in the show so we could see him play. Crazy that a brand new venue has bad seats. Otherwise it is a very cool place. Being outside of it before the show I felt like I was in another city. That corner doesn't feel like Houston to me. Anway the wait for a table at HOB was 50 minutes. The Metallica show helped that. The Italian place across the street is loving HOB, they are getting all of their run of business. We ended up at the Lake House for a burger. HP was unimpressive to me. Maybe it is because it is so empty right now but it looks like a glorified mall. We didn't walk to the front to BOM so maybe I missed some stuff but I was dissapointed. Once it is all leased with Lucky Strike and other hot spots it could be totally different. HOB though is a huge plus for downtown Houston. Can't wait to see another show there. I will probably go with a GA ticket next time.