World's Tallest Skyscraper Proposed for Houston?

[Simbha]

For my taste, I'd rather see Houston build some greater density, at least inside the loop. If the guy wants to build an ultratall, I can't stop him but I'd rather see someone like that build an entire midrise district. We can even name it after him.

[Mister X]

Are there no height restrictions anymore?

[TheNiche]

Oh my God, you are tiresome.

If you want to think that a 3,000 foot tower is human scaled compared to say something like the Mosaic with ground floor retail, public spaces, and a focus on Hermann Park, more power to ya!

Are you in a neck brace? If not, all it takes is a tilt of the head and voila! Even from street level, you have scale.

Hop in the elevator and you can be on any level of the tower in minutes. If sufficiently convenient for use, then it is to scale.

For whatever reason you may be tired, I haven't a clue.

I usually think that nay sayers are just losers with no vision, but this idea is really off the charts wacko. I want Houston to have nice tall skyscrapers as much as anybody, hopefully some higher than what we have now, but a 3000 ft. tower would look like a joke in this or any city. It sounds so completely pointless, not to mention the fact that it would throw our beautiful downtown skyline all out of balance forever. There would never be another nicely composed photo taken of downtown again.

If it were built in Houston, it would be very unlikely that it were built downtown. Our city blocks are too small to accomodate a base of such a tower, and that we are prone to hurricanes would either require that the building have setbacks that taper as they approach the top (like the Burj) or that it be conical in shape. The same concept would work in Los Angeles to make it earthquake-resistant. The key is keeping it from being top-heavy and to allow the greatest degree of aerodynamic stability.

[Jax]

For my taste, I'd rather see Houston build some greater density, at least inside the loop. If the guy wants to build an ultratall, I can't stop him but I'd rather see someone like that build an entire midrise district. We can even name it after him.

That's what I was thinking. I wonder how many 8 story structures you could build for that price? Could you fill up all of the surface lots downtown and in midtown?

[WesternGulf]

For whatever reason you may be tired, I haven't a clue.

If it were built in Houston, it would be very unlikely that it were built downtown. Our city blocks are too small to accomodate a base of such a tower

All there would need to be is a disruption of the grid in downtown or a dead end to make something like this happen. With that said, I can not think of any design that would fit our skyline with something that tall. I don't know how they did it, but as tall as the Burj is in Dubai, it seems to fit with what is planned for the area. I feel kind of stupid debating this building anyway.

I echo Simbha's sentiments.

[TheNiche]

Let's not forget people that the silly $500 million Astrodome conversion project seemed like a white elephant and unfeasible to the "all-knowing" Houstonians but Deutsche Bank (of all entities) saw fit to finance this thing that most everyone just knew would fail.

I wasn't among that group of people. In fact, I was the one that pointed out (based upon numbers reported in the Chronicle) that in the long run, it was more fiscally responsible for Harris County to mothball it in perpetuity than it was to incur the expense of tearing down. With that in mind, they *could* have just given it away to someone that promised to do just about anything with it that was compatible with Reliant Park, and it would've made sense...even something as grotesque as a massive self-storage facility, if feasible.

Maybe you're not, but it's not really for you to say whether he can or not. Do you know his porfolio? Do you know his level of wealth?

If the article is correct, he'll need financing, and even if he allocated his entire net worth into such a project, nobody would give him any more than what the building would ultimately be worth at market value (i.e. the net collateralized value from foreclosure). The only way he can make it work is if he gets an equity partner...but then he'd have to share in the glory, and that is not a concept that sits well with egoists.

Is the idea outlandish? Yes. Is it crazy? Yes. Is it unreasonable? Yes. However it begs the question as to why? Is it because we can't imagine something that big and expensive being built in Houston? Is it because we can't wrap our minds around it? If this was Shanghai or Hong Kong or Seoul or especially Dubai, this would be a ho-hum development that would not surprise them as much as it surprises us.

This has nothing to do with our ability to comprehend something like this in Houston. He may want to build it and I may want it built, but if he can't afford it, we won't get it.

It is a simple reality.

I wonder how many 8 story structures you could build for that price? Could you fill up all of the surface lots downtown and in midtown?

Easily.

[Deut28Thirteen]

Cartoonish is the perfect word. Your talking about a building that would more than TRIPLE the height of Williams. Not to mention, did anybody forget we have hurricanes here? A tower like that could only be built in certain cities. LA is to earthquake prone along with San Diego, San Francisco, and Seattle. We get hurricanes along with Miami, N.O., NYC, Tampa and any other city on the coast. That leaves San Antonio, Atlanta and Chicago and possibly Denver. However you'd probably need oxygen masks at the top in Denver.

LOL! Ok, if that doesn't make a mochery of our skyline, I don't know what does. I'm officially against this project. I mean that is obscene. Our skyline has forever popped a boner.

We all have diffrent views but why do you think it makes a mochery of our skyline? To me it is perfect. As the city grows and moves into the future The skyline will do the same. When JPMC was built it was among the top ten tallest in the world. It is not even in the top 30 now . Time and Houston has changed drastically, and why the skyline has grown nicely, it has not changed greatly. This could be the Williams Tower of the Downtown skyline out of place but somhow it fits perfectly into the city. 1st we have to be picked but if I could choose I will put in in Greenway Plaza or Greenspoint or like some else said create its own district and put like a 1,500-2,200 footer in downtown with some other smaller towers around that one to fill in downtown a little more.

[JLWM8609]

I don't see this being built in downtown. I remember reading somewhere that the Chase Tower couldn't be built much taller because of some sort of FAA restrictions. Because the approach path for runway 12R at HOU comes near downtown (sometimes they'll turn over downtown while lining up) and most planes are pretty close to 1,000 feet give or take around that distance from the airport. And on some days when you have heavy winds from the north, traffic lining up for runways 33L and 33R at IAH will come right over downtown at some relatively low altitudes.

[RedScare]

if I could choose I will put in in Greenway Plaza or Greenspoint or like some else said create its own district and put like a 1,500-2,200 footer in downtown with some other smaller towers around that one to fill in downtown a little more.

Is it just me or does this post remind you of this guy?

I am a shrubber. My name is Roger the Shrubber. I arrange, design, and sell shrubberies.

[wxman]

We all have diffrent views but why do you think it makes a mochery of our skyline? To me it is perfect. As the city grows and moves into the future The skyline will do the same. When JPMC was built it was among the top ten tallest in the world. It is not even in the top 30 now . Time and Houston has changed drastically, and why the skyline has grown nicely, it has not changed greatly. This could be the Williams Tower of the Downtown skyline out of place but somhow it fits perfectly into the city. 1st we have to be picked but if I could choose I will put in in Greenway Plaza or Greenspoint or like some else said create its own district and put like a 1,500-2,200 footer in downtown with some other smaller towers around that one to fill in downtown a little more.

It would make a mochery because it would make our other skyscrapers look like low rises. If we had a density to the likes of NY, Miami, or Chicago, it would not be a bad fit. But we don't. Look how bad the Southwest Bank Tower would have stood out if it were built. It was only like 1,400 ft I believe. Your talking about more than doubleing that even. I don't know, IF** it were built, I'd say uptown. That's just me.

[pm91]

i think it would be awesome to have this in houston... but, people are right, we need more density to make look even decent. besides, if this was built, the vacancy percent would rise to..well, i cant even imagine. and if the vacancy percent went up that just mean less building because of lower demand. id rather have 25+ story buildings in houston than one big one that would take forever to fill up... im just sayin'...

[KinkaidAlum]

I'll give you New York and Chicago, but Miami?

Since when has Miami had a dense skyline? Miami's skyline has a cluster in downtown proper but the rest of the growth is very linear along the Biscayne Bay waterfront.

[Captain Impossible]

Huntsville? Yeah right. Maybe Conroe.

Actually, at that height, it's entirely possible. To back that up, it has been reported that Burj Dubai will be visible for sixty miles. Something even taller could, then, be seen from seventy or more, and where I live, northeast of Huntsville, is something like 72 miles straight line from downtown Houston.

[CDeb]

Actually, at that height, it's entirely possible. To back that up, it has been reported that Burj Dubai will be visible for sixty miles. Something even taller could, then, be seen from seventy or more, and where I live, northeast of Huntsville, is something like 72 miles straight line from downtown Houston.

I don't think air quality would allow that to happen. It would have to be an exceptionally clear day.

When I used to drive in a lot from College Station on 290, I could sometimes see the Williams Tower from the Katy-Hockley Road overpass, but it is very, very faint. That is 28.5 miles in a straight line according to Google Earth.

[ToryGattis]

I agree that the economics are not there in unregulated Houston to support a building like this. This is also the kind of building that pretty much has to be fed by massive amounts of commuter rail transit, because you simply can't park enough cars to fill it with people. That means Chicago. So I'm guessing that this guy knows Chicago is insecure about being a first tier world city, and unhappy since the Sears tower fell off its #1 perch. So he throws out LA and Houston as reasonable competitors (as Boeing did with Denver and Dallas) to win the maximum possible concession from Chicago. And of course Chicago is salivating at the possibility of opening this thing in time for the 2016 Olympics they're going after. The tacit, unofficial concession with high profile projects like these is that the Chicago powers-that-be (like all-powerful Mayor Daley) will agree to suppress new competitive buildings downtown - probably for a decade or more - until this building fills up. Nobody wants a white elephant joke - it reflects badly on the developer and the city.

Even with all that, I give this thing very long odds of ever being built, much less economically viable.

[wxman]

I'll give you New York and Chicago, but Miami?

Since when has Miami had a dense skyline? Miami's skyline has a cluster in downtown proper but the rest of the growth is very linear along the Biscayne Bay waterfront.

Well the only other city in the world that is putting up more highrises right now is Dubai. Miami is undergoing Manhattenization right now. Their skyline is becoming VERY dense and in a hurry. I know that recently they announced plans to put up two 110 story condo towers making them the tallest residences in the world. Now putting up a structure that is more than twice as tall as even a 110 story building is still cartoonish, but not nearly what it would be if it were built here.

[Captain Impossible]

I don't think air quality would allow that to happen. It would have to be an exceptionally clear day.

Good call. This occurred to me some time later, when I was talking about this with someone.

[Trae]

There are a couple of people at SSP from Dallas who are wondering why he wouldn't consider Dallas, but instead chose Houston.

[pm91]

how much bigger would this be than burj dubai and al burj? because if he is trying to blow away those two from being the highest in the world by building a 3000 foot building, he must have a huge ego that he wants the world to know about. besides, i wont belive this guy is telling the truth until i see a rendering and with that i'll decide for myself on whether i'd like to see it in houston or not..

[editor]

You'd be able to see it in Huntsville.

Better. You'd be able to see it from the Gulf. Now THERE's a postcard for Houston.

[editor]

Also, I thought in the states, the taste for super-talls had kinda wanned after 9/11 ...?

I wouldn't say that. There are currently four 80+ story buildings going up in Chicago (an 82, a 90, a 92, and a 150). Three of them are over 1,000 feet. If you count spires, there are six buildings nationwide currently under construction that are going to be over 1,000 feet.

[editor]

Based on many of the replies in this topic, all I can say is that it's a shame that the pioneering can-do attitude of Texas is dead. Texas is last-century's frontier. The pioneering spirit has been inherited by the Arabs. Then when someone wants to bring it back to the Lone Star State, the city with no zoning starts talking about aesthetics and how it will fit in with the other buildings.

And money? Who cares how it gets financed? If the guy wants to bankrupt his company on his way out, that's his business. You can study any large plan to an early grave. The only people who get anything done, especially these days, are the egos and the visionaries. It's not the accounting firms who build the world's tallest skyscrapers. It's the guys with the bad hair and something to prove.

[TJones]

There are a couple of people at SSP from Dallas who are wondering why he wouldn't consider Dallas, but instead chose Houston.

Probably because of the whole Tornado Alley thing.

[TheNiche]

And money? Who cares how it gets financed? If the guy wants to bankrupt his company on his way out, that's his business. You can study any large plan to an early grave. The only people who get anything done, especially these days, are the egos and the visionaries. It's not the accounting firms who build the world's tallest skyscrapers. It's the guys with the bad hair and something to prove.

It is the developer's job to float ideas and it is the financial advisor's job to sort the good ones from the bad. Unless Younan can find another several wealthy equity partners willing to throw away their money--and to be clear, I'm stating unequivocably that this project is a financial loss, not a gamble--he can't afford it. It would be no different than if I were to try to walk into a Ferrari dealership and told them I wanted an FXX. Not happening.

[RedScare]

There are a couple of people at SSP from Dallas who are wondering why he wouldn't consider Dallas, but instead chose Houston.

Gee, I don't know. I doubt the 23% CBD vacancy rate has anything to do with it. Just a guess on my part, but I would imagine someone itching to spend $4 Billion on a massive tower would at least want a fighting chance at getting tenants to rent in it. I don't have a clue how much square footage a 150 floor tower would have, but guessing at 2 million usable square feet would take Dallas' vacancy from 23% to 31% overnight. Chicago's vacancy rate isn't stellar either, but Chicago is Chicago. Supertalls are at home there. Houston and LA are 2 of the better markets right now, so a developer looking to flood a market with a lot of new office space likely wants a market that has a shot at absorbing it. With several more years of a good energy market left, Houston is a safe pick.

As for Texas or Houston losing its can-do attitude, I haven't seen any civic leaders or movers and shakers talking against it, just the usual anonymous internet suspects. It would be interesting to see the uproar if he actually came out and said "Houston".

[TJones]

I would be excited for Houston if he did decide to build here. I just believe that even WITH all his money and "hook ups" in the industry, that this building would bankrupt him. But HEY, it's HIS money, bring it to Houston, we could use the building and the work.

[Mister X]

I reallly don't know how I'd feel if this thing actually came to fruition in Houston. On one hand the whole idea seems kind of gaudy and ridiculous, but on the other hand, my inner childish bastard would love to be able to permanently stick it to our Dallas buddies when they come poking around looking for trouble. You know - since all us Texans have size issues and all. But the single best thing about a 3000 foot weiner in Houston would be that they would probably be able to see the Houston skyline from Dallas. How's that for a 4 billion dollar "screw you"?

Sure, it would ruin the downtown Houston skyline, but at the same time it would put Houston on a whole new level of international recognition. Whether all that new attention would be good or bad is debatable.

If this thing were built in Dallas, I would probably be a little jealous but at the same time glad our skyline was more visually appealing. (just like it has been for the last 35 years).

But at this point, we might as well be talking about Captain Janeway vs. the Borg because this proposal sounds more like entertaining science fiction and fantasy than a discussion about architecture.

[wxman]

I reallly don't know how I'd feel if this thing actually came to fruition in Houston. On one hand the whole idea seems kind of gaudy and ridiculous, but on the other hand, my inner childish bastard would love to be able to permanently stick it to our Dallas buddies when they come poking around looking for trouble. You know - since all us Texans have size issues and all. But the single best thing about a 3000 foot weiner in Houston would be that they would probably be able to see the Houston skyline from Dallas. How's that for a 4 billion dollar "screw you"?

Sure, it would ruin the downtown Houston skyline, but at the same time it would put Houston on a whole new level of international recognition. Whether all that new attention would be good or bad is debatable.

If this thing were built in Dallas, I would probably be a little jealous but at the same time glad our skyline was more visually appealing. (just like it has been for the last 35 years).

But at this point, we might as well be talking about Captain Janeway vs. the Borg because this proposal sounds more like entertaining science fiction and fantasy than a discussion about architecture.

They should be jealous anyway. We were concidered and they weren't. I expect plenty of Houston bashing in the near term because jealousy is a terrible thing!

[pm91]

i hate dallas too, the people and the roadways are horrible. and im the same way, my inner child would just be ecstatic if this was to be built in houston. and kinda off topic but not really, whay does emporis have so many buildings that say never built when the companys website says otherwise?

[102IAHexpress]

Maybe if you could convince one of the big oil/energy companies to consolidate their offices into this massive tower then that should fill up the entire building. But that would go against their trend of building campuses of smaller buildings.

Is there any significant premium you could charge your tenants in a building like this? I