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As someone whose business is authorized to take credit cards for purchases, I know that it is a violation of the merchant agreement to require a "minimum purchase." But I didn't know until today that there's a way to fight back.

http://www.mastercard.com/us/personal/en/c...violations.html

This is a web page that you can fill out to narc on businesses that violate their merchant agreement.

I've already used it to file a complaint against the deli I go to because it illegally required a $5.00 minimum purchase to use credit cards.

And I'm about to file a complaint against Apple because its stores require picture ID to use a card (another no-no).

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And I'm about to file a complaint against Apple because its stores require picture ID to use a card (another no-no).

if your card isn't signed, they should ask for another form of identification. i don't sign mine so that they will ask.

Edited by musicman
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Editor, I don't understand the second part, why wouldn't you want someone to verify it is YOU using the card. That is why there is SOOOOOOO much identity theft. I would ask you to rethink persuing the second part.

Edited by TJones
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Editor, I don't understand the second part, why wouldn't you want someone to verify it is YOU using the card. That is why there is SOOOOOOO much identity theft. I would ask you to rethink persuing the second part.

I don't often carry ID with me. I see no reason to, in part because I live in a supposedly free country, and in part because I don't drive (I usually use my passport when I need photo ID). If I walk into a store with my check card, the terms of that store's agreement with the credit card company dictate that they have to take the card, as long as it is signed.

I can understand if a cop pulls you over you need to show him a driver's license (though as a point of interest, New Jersey didn't require photos on licenses until just a couple of years ago). But why should I have to prove who I am to some 16-year-old kid at Wal-Mart when I want to buy a can of nuts? He's not the government. The store should want to sell me things, not make it hard for me to give them my money.

It's bad enough that society is deteriorating so rapidly that the differences between the United States and the old Soviet Union are fading away. We have to present ID to do just about anything these days. Remember when we made fun of the Russians for randomly stopping people in the street and demanding, "Papers, please!" How is that different from the "seatbelt checkpoints" that pop up in many states every weekend?

There was a time when people would trust people. I could say who I am and people would believe it. A man's word was his bond. Did you know that during World War II British prisoners of war being kept in German camps were able to purchase items by mail from stores in other countries and have them shipped to the prison camp? It was because the stores knew the British soldiers were honorable enough that they would pay for the items when the war ended. When the war was over, the stores actually did get their money.

I am not a criminal, and I shouldn't be treated like one when all I want to do is buy something in a neighborhood shop.

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But what if it isn't YOU trying to give Wal-mart money, and some 16 yr. old punk has your card trying to give them YOUR money ? Even Wal-Mart employees have been so blatant as to use other people's credit cards and IDs to obtain ill gotten gains. Also, even if you use public transportation, or if someone else drives you around all day, or even if you walk to work. God forbid you get hit by a bus, and all you have is a credit card on you, how are the cops and EMTs supposed to know that is YOU ! What if it is some other punk who has stolen your credit card, and that is all they have to go by, and they inform your next of kin that you have been killed by a bus. I just feel you should always carry your ID on you, you know, just incase.

Now, I don't know about that whole English POWs buying stuff from stores. I have seen almost all of the Hogan's Heroes episodes, and they never ONCE got anything from Harrod's. :huh:

Edited by TJones
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Technically, you are required to carry identification at all times.

I also would ask that you don't pursue the action against the Apple store. I've personally been the victim of identity theft and I think all such purchases should require an ID or at a minimum a pin number.

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Technically, you are required to carry identification at all times.

I never heard of that law, and I've been in Criminal Law for 20 years. Could you enlighten me on that one? Because, like the editor, I like walking around without ID, too...just because I can (but, I use cash when I do).

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I never heard of that law, and I've been in Criminal Law for 20 years. Could you enlighten me on that one? Because, like the editor, I like walking around without ID, too...just because I can (but, I use cash when I do).

Can't law enforcement officers detain you to determine your identification if you're not carrying any on you? How else can you prove who you are?

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In the times that we're in, quite frankly, I think everyone should carry some form of ID with them. One of the reasons is so there are no misunderstandings if you find yourself in a bad situation and you're not able to prove or worse, they're not able to ID who you are to notify the proper next of kin.

Carrying ID is something that I believe is such a small thing to worry about. I carry it almost all the time. I'm particularly grateful when they ask for it when I use my credit card. Lord knows I don't want some putz using my credit card if I'm lying dead in a gutter, but then again; I might have other problems at the time.

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Editor, I don't understand the second part, why wouldn't you want someone to verify it is YOU using the card. That is why there is SOOOOOOO much identity theft. I would ask you to rethink persuing the second part.

I am thinking it is based off a "no signature" policy.

But either way, I like that, and I encourage them to ask for my ID.

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I'm not sure what times we are in that make it more important to carry ID, but law enforcement must have a valid reason to even ASK for identification. If you do not have official ID, identifying yourself is sufficient. Despite the push of certain members of the government, we have not yet reached the point where ID is required to be produced for no reason, even if some uneducated law enforcement officers think otherwise.

That said, there ARE certain activities that require ID, even if it seems stupid to ask for it. The federal courthouse requires a STATE ID. They will not even accept the passport issued by their own State Department. In contrast, no ID is needed to enter the Harris County Courthouses. I am only occasionally asked for ID for credit card purchases, if the total is over $50 or so at Home Depot. My bank asks for ID if I cash a check there. You may be asked for ID to purchase cigarettes or alcohol, but at my age, I am not so lucky. You are required to present ID to fly, but not to take a bus or subway. You must present ID to reenter the country, unless you avail yourself of one of the unmonitored points of entry spread along the 5,500 mile border.

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i had a recent incident involving credit card misuse. Telwink rejected the card one morning but i really didn't think anything about it til that night. I called VISA and they asked whether i had made certain charges involving bookstores/scrapbooks/etc. while the charges were minimal (some were less than $2), i was glad that VISA stepped in to place a hold on the card. Editor, how do you feel about VISA "watching" you?

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I'm not sure what times we are in that make it more important to carry ID, but law enforcement must have a valid reason to even ASK for identification. If you do not have official ID, identifying yourself is sufficient. Despite the push of certain members of the government, we have not yet reached the point where ID is required to be produced for no reason, even if some uneducated law enforcement officers think otherwise.

Thanks for clarifying the situation, RedScare. Based on some of the posts in this thread, I was beginning to wonder if some law had been passed that I'd missed. I was under the impression that we weren't required to carry ID, but only required to identify ourselves to law enforcement officers if stopped. With that understanding, I never carry ID with me when I am walking around town even though many of my friends carry ID just to avoid any potential conflict with law enforcement officers who think otherwise and advise me to do the same. I had heard that there was move afoot to pass some sort of federal legislation that would require people to carry ID. Is this true?

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Don't file a complaint against the small business owner. Instead, file a complaint with the credit card companies who charge outlandish fees to use their services (ranging from a % of sales to rent for the actual machine).

It costs us around $300 a year just to have the machine and depending upon the card used (AMEX is HIGH), we can lose up to $500 on our larger sales to the credit card companies. It is highway robbery of the worst kind.

We try to encourage our local customers to use checks but we are stuck in our out of town sales.

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Yeah, I think the editor's anger is misplaced. That deli owner is likely paying 2% of the sale PLUS 25 cents per transaction to VISA, in addition to statement fees and machine rental. On a $5 purchase, VISA probably charges about 35 cents. It is ridiculous that part of VISA's contract forces a small business owner to lose money on a sale, but having been in that position (owning a small restaurant), I do not use a card for extremely small purchases.

The anger should be directed at VISA.

Edited by RedScare
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Don't file a complaint against the small business owner. Instead, file a complaint with the credit card companies who charge outlandish fees to use their services (ranging from a % of sales to rent for the actual machine).

It costs us around $300 a year just to have the machine and depending upon the card used (AMEX is HIGH), we can lose up to $500 on our larger sales to the credit card companies. It is highway robbery of the worst kind.

We try to encourage our local customers to use checks but we are stuck in our out of town sales.

I agree, I usually get hit on the average of 5% for all services paid by credit cards. While they're inclined to pay me more with credit (tips), the wait and hassle of credit cards are a major pain to me, but not my clients. I can understand SOME fees involved, but waiting for them to come through with payment and the hoops that I must go through sometimes drives me a bit mad.

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I seldom get ppl asking for id, sometimes I think its good that I don't have to go through that hassle, but sometimes, I do think otherwise. I once saw a guy using a credit card that has a photo id of a lady at Captain Toms. I didn't say anything because I was too chicken to make a scene.

I understand the need to verify, VISA, Mastercard charges big bucks, and chargeback costs from the merchant account provider is even more. Too many of those and they can get a small business owner shut down.

Edited by webdude
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Don't file a complaint against the small business owner. Instead, file a complaint with the credit card companies who charge outlandish fees to use their services (ranging from a % of sales to rent for the actual machine).

It costs us around $300 a year just to have the machine and depending upon the card used (AMEX is HIGH), we can lose up to $500 on our larger sales to the credit card companies. It is highway robbery of the worst kind.

We try to encourage our local customers to use checks but we are stuck in our out of town sales.

What about the cost to the business owner, when customers use debit cards and the money comes directly from a checking account?

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I've beening thinking the same thing about where to point the blame this entire thread, but just too lazy to post. My wife's credit card vendor charges them .30 cents for every transaction plus 3%.

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Technically, you are required to carry identification at all times.

The ACLU disagrees with you and has won more than one lawsuit over this misbelief. As an American citizen I am NOT required to carry ID or prove who I am to anyone, even the police.

From the ACLU web site:

If you are not driving (for example, if you are walking), you are not required to carry any type of identification. If you are asked for identification, you may give it to the officer if you want to, but you do not have to do this. You can't be arrested merely for refusing to identify yourself on the street.

But what if it isn't YOU trying to give Wal-mart money, and some 16 yr. old punk has your card trying to give them YOUR money?

Then under the law, I'm only responsible for up to $50 of the charges. It's a risk I'm willing to take, and my right to decide if I want to take that risk as it puts no other person in harm's way.

Even Wal-Mart employees have been so blatant as to use other people's credit cards and IDs to obtain ill gotten gains.

If a Wal-Mart employee is going to use my card, he's not going to look in a mirror to see if he matches the picture on my driver's license.

Also, even if you use public transportation, or if someone else drives you around all day, or even if you walk to work. God forbid you get hit by a bus, and all you have is a credit card on you, how are the cops and EMTs supposed to know that is YOU ! What if it is some other punk who has stolen your credit card, and that is all they have to go by, and they inform your next of kin that you have been killed by a bus.

It happens to people all the time. In most cases when a loved one files a missing person's report the police will match up the person's known locations with all of the John Doe from that area. It's not that big a deal. Also, for me personally, if the police take my fingerprints from my corpse, I'll pop up in both FBI and state databases.

I just feel you should always carry your ID on you, you know, just incase.

You've been made to feel that way by the slow erosion of freedom in America that's been going on since at least the 70's. Probably longer.

I also would ask that you don't pursue the action against the Apple store. I've personally been the victim of identity theft and I think all such purchases should require an ID or at a minimum a pin number.

Somehow I'm OK with requiring a PIN number, like at gas pumps where you have to punch in the billing ZIP code. I can't explain why I find one method of verification offensive and the other innocuous.

In the times that we're in, quite frankly, I think everyone should carry some form of ID with them. One of the reasons is so there are no misunderstandings if you find yourself in a bad situation and you're not able to prove or worse, they're not able to ID who you are to notify the proper next of kin.

When I go to the beach I carry my towel and nothing else. Why should I? Why should I have to worry about someone stealing my wallet or my ID from my spot the beach while I'm splashing around in the water? The less I carry, the better. If I drown, I have more important things to think about than what happens to my body.

But either way, I like that, and I encourage them to ask for my ID.

People I know who work in retail say that some people actually write "please check ID" on the signature strip of their cards. I think that's a great idea for people who worry about theft. It's a voluntary opt-in system. I'm in favor of that. I don't think the rest of us should be subjected to it.

I choose not to worry about things needlessly. I have enough stresses in my life.

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You are required to present ID to fly

An interesting note here -- at some airports what qualifies as "ID" varies widely because of the people who use the airport.

As recently as two years ago (the last time my mother went through), Newark airport would take a work photo ID as a valid ID to fly. This is because so many people in the New York area don't have a driver's license. There are several members of my extended family, and several people I know of who never learned to drive because they live in New York and always take cabs or public transportation. Thus, they have no driver's license and see no need to get a state photo ID card. As I mentioned earlier, until recently in New Jersey drivers licenses were renewed by mail for people over a certain age and were just pieces of paper with no photographs. Not useful for flying.

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i had a recent incident involving credit card misuse. Telwink rejected the card one morning but i really didn't think anything about it til that night. I called VISA and they asked whether i had made certain charges involving bookstores/scrapbooks/etc. while the charges were minimal (some were less than $2), i was glad that VISA stepped in to place a hold on the card. Editor, how do you feel about VISA "watching" you?

I have mixed feelings about it. I've had both good and bad results, especially since I travel internationally. Three incidents stick out in my mind:

  • Had my Chase Mastercard rejected at the Apple Store in the Houston Galleria. Not because it was over the limit, just because Mastercard decided it was an uncharacteristic purchase. Which makes sense since I hadn't used that credit card in five years and was suddenly trying to put $3,000 on it. This I don't like.
  • Had my Washington Mutual Mastercard rejected at a video store in Hong Kong. Washington Mutual thought it was an unusual purchase, and blocked it even though I called them the week before and asked for my account to be flagged so that purchases in China, Hong Kong, and Japan would go through unimpeded (this is something I have to do with every card before I travel). Instead of letting me use my WaMu card in Asia, WaMu cancelled it entirely and never told me. It took a month of phone calls once I got back home to find out what happened and why. Needless to say, I cancelled that account since WaMu left me stranded in Hong Kong with no access to my money. This I don't like.
  • Citibank called my cell phone one day while I was in an area of Indonesia I can only describe as "the jungle." It seems a transaction went through on my card a couple of hours earlier from Indonesia and they wanted to know if it was OK. I told them it was me paying for ferry tickets and verified the amount of the purchase and everything was OK. I was able to use my Citibank card without restrictions for the rest of the trip. This I like.
  • Frequently when I get home from traveling there is a string of automated messages from Universal Card on my answering machine. They include an 800 number I can call back and go through an automated system to verify that all of my recent purchases are valid. This I like.

I'm OK with Visa and MasterCard "watching me" because I agreed to that when I signed up with their card. If I don't like it, or how it's being done, I can take my business elsewhere as I did with Washington Mutual. This is very different than someone in a store second-guessing my purchases or checking my ID, which is a VIOLATION of that store's agreement with the credit card companies. If the credit card companies allowed this behavior, then I would suck it up and say it's the store's policy and if I don't like it I can shop elsewhere. But card acceptance rules are not up to the store; they're up to the card companies. As long as I am complying with the card policies, so should the stores.

Don't file a complaint against the small business owner. Instead, file a complaint with the credit card companies who charge outlandish fees to use their services (ranging from a % of sales to rent for the actual machine).

It costs us around $300 a year just to have the machine and depending upon the card used (AMEX is HIGH), we can lose up to $500 on our larger sales to the credit card companies. It is highway robbery of the worst kind.

We try to encourage our local customers to use checks but we are stuck in our out of town sales.

I feel your pain. HAIF takes Visa, Mastercard, and American Express for the ad-free subscription.

Remember that sale we had back in April where people could sign up for a month of ad-free HAIF for a dollar? How much of that dollar do you think HAIF got to keep after the credit card transaction fees?

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As someone whose business is authorized to take credit cards for purchases, I know that it is a violation of the merchant agreement to require a "minimum purchase." But I didn't know until today that there's a way to fight back.

http://www.mastercard.com/us/personal/en/c...violations.html

This is a web page that you can fill out to narc on businesses that violate their merchant agreement.

I've already used it to file a complaint against the deli I go to because it illegally required a $5.00 minimum purchase to use credit cards.

And I'm about to file a complaint against Apple because its stores require picture ID to use a card (another no-no).

You mean to say that there's a deli where you can get a sandwich for less than $5?

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When egg salad is the special of the day it's $3.95. I keep a supply of drinks at work.

I do the same thing. I heard that fast food places make most of their money off of drinks. So I get a personal thrill when I pull into the drive-thru and I say "no thank you" when I'm asked if I want something to drink. I keep my water bottle next to me at all times.

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I heard that fast food places make most of their money off of drinks.

True story: (I know I deserve it for going to Jack-in-the-Box, but still...)

My son wanted the chicken strips and is a curly fries freak, but never has been a fan of sodas/cokes. So when I ordered the meal-thing for him, the JITB person asks, "And your drink?" I replied, "Water." JITB person replies, "Uh, you have to get a coke."

Uh. Okay. So I told said person I didn't want a drink, and the genius replied, "You have to get a drink." We debated on this for a few seconds, then the JITB manager made the executive decision to approve the water substitute.

It was just too damn funny... takes all kinds, doesn't it?

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True story: (I know I deserve it for going to Jack-in-the-Box, but still...)

My son wanted the chicken strips and is a curly fries freak, but never has been a fan of sodas/cokes. So when I ordered the meal-thing for him, the JITB person asks, "And your drink?" I replied, "Water." JITB person replies, "Uh, you have to get a coke."

Uh. Okay. So I told said person I didn't want a drink, and the genius replied, "You have to get a drink." We debated on this for a few seconds, then the JITB manager made the executive decision to approve the water substitute.

It was just too damn funny... takes all kinds, doesn't it?

You son is part of a small minority. Most kids have to have a soda when they have fast food. But that's what those combo meals are. The price includes a drink. Whether it's JITB or McDonald's, I make it a point to get only what's on the dollar menu with no drink. Sometimes JITB has their Jumbo Jack for 99 cents, and their taco 2 for 99 cents.

Another glitch? My response is in your box.

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