fwki

.....I have seen on other real estate message boards where people who got into it over something were told to "take it to HAIF"....

Another s3mh fabrication or have you found another Heights forum on this scale? More likely you wandered into one of those community hen boards with 3 posts per month or one primarliy used by real estate agents with agendas.

EDIT:

Here ya go, this one is perfect for you......http://www.ultimateheights.com/forums

Finally concurrence that this HD argument is not about history at all, it's about architectural preferences and personal metrics on value, that is, how everyone should spend their money on their home. This argument thus will always end up about a citizen's property rights. The strawman here is the historical premise.

Remember when the Conoco night clerk blew away a shoplifter for stealing a case of beer? Shot him dead when he got back into his truck. Ah, the memories....

Here's a link:http://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/article/Houston-clerk-fatally-shoots-alleged-beer-thief-1824938.php

Yes. According to the HAHC's Unwritten Rules of Historical Designation, dueling grounds and locations of judicial combat are to be preserved in their entirety including areas of participation, secondee activity and observation.

Let the Margarita wars begin! I hope it's a traditional Mexican cantina in keeping with the historical knife and gun play at that location. Plus I like the traditional Mexican cantina rules......from Wikipedia:

In rural Mexico, cantina traditionally refers to a kind of bar that is normally frequented only by males for the purpose of imbibing alcohol and partaking of botanas (appetizers). Some cantinas are also known for being places where people gather to play dominoes, cards or other table games. Cantinas can often be distinguished by signs that expressly prohibit entrance to women (mujeres) and children... Also, some cantinas explicitly prohibit entrance to dogs (perros) and men in police or military uniform (uniformados). Some of the traditional restrictions on entry to cantinas are beginning to fade away. However, in many areas it is still viewed as scandalous for proper ladies to be seen visiting a genuine cantina.

.....The bottom line is that whether you can admit it or not - the spec builders and families with children are looking outside of the district to build new construction so they can get what they want...that is driving the values in those areas up disproportionately faster than the areas inside the districts where the prices are much more stable. It does not mean that the HD is losing value - rather it just means that they are worth less than they would have been if it were not for the HD's.

Common sense....and don't forget the special financial burden placed on HD owners. We all have to replace siding and windows, we all pay for power and gas inefficiency, but HD owners must pay a premium for "historical accuracy" and representation at the HAHC. One day you wake up and find you have the financial responsibilities of a museum curator with no compensation from the City. Those new families with children get to walk by your special piece of history and admire the fine pine woodworking skills of depression era carpenters for free on the way back to their new-build.

So, people who support historic districts and the preservation of this cities dwindling history are not proud Texans?

I did not say or infer that, those are your words. I inferred that those who support property rights by posting here are proud Texans.

If anything the people who support preservation care more about Texas heritage than you anti historic district rable rousers. Sorry, but if there are not historic districts with strict guidelines than this cities history will all be gone in 50 years at the rate of tear downs in the Heights before the ordinance was passed.

People who support property rights in Texas can also support Texas heritage at the same time. You infer that those traits are mutually exclusive. I can support historic districts with strict guidelines that do not place the entire financial burden of preserving history on the backs of home owners who didn't make that deal when they invested. Why should an owner of contributing structures pay ANY property tax if the city is gong to treat the structure as if it's owned by all?

And I guess us renters are just lowly scumbags who shouldnt have a say in the neighborhood we live in. I guess we are like 3rd class passengers or something to you.

When it comes to property rights, you have no skin in the game so your opinions may be biased. You don't like a new law, just take your sofa and go, owners are exposed. And why would you call yourself a scumbag for renting? I didn't say that, just don't lecture from the outside.

Guess what? The majority of people who live in the Heights who own historic homes or rent them are in favor of preservation of this historic neighborhood. You do not hold the majority view otherwise the preservation ordinances would not have passed. You would like The Heights to turn into Rice Military if you had it your way.

I am with the majority on that one....I like history so much I bought an old home. You should try it. And stop pretending you know how I feel about Rice Military. You have a weird way of connecting dots, like your linking of supporters of property rights to haters of history, but then again you would have no need to understand property rights.

Case and point. Had the post not been on the mark, the preservation haters would not have gone nuts over it.

1. The idea that you can be for historic preservation, but not for any kind of preservation ordinance is wonderful PR, but falls flat in the face of reality. The facts are that historic houses in the Heights were getting demolished in a wholesale fashion prior to the amendments to the historic ordinance. To say that you are for preservation, but only on a voluntary basis is like saying you are against bullying in schools, but only if the little pipsqueaks can stand up for themselves without having to have the teachers intervene. Without the revision to the ordinance, the historic homes in the Heights would have been lost and every block would have been transformed into some mish mash of lot line faux Vics, "where in the world did that come from" custom homes and "look at me!" oddball moderns. So, saying "I am for preservation, but on a voluntary basis" is just another way of saying "tear down all the old crap and good luck to anyone who wants to out bid a builder for a bungalow sandwiched between two lot line McVics."

2. We had a vote. Anti-preservationists came up way short. Thus, they want a different vote.

3. Renters not on the same level as homeowners? And then an accusation of elitism?

4. HAIF as a representative measure of the Heights? That is rich. Most people in the Heights won't touch this message board with a ten foot pole because of the vitriol launched at anyone who presents an opposing viewpoint. Again, case and point.

5. No, it is your party that I am crashing. I enjoy the sparring and am not going anywhere any time soon. This punching bag is made of kevlar.

6. No elitism. Elitism would be to call them secretaries, which I do not do because they are skilled employees, even though they are not the ones in the office with the degrees. It is simply a fact that they love reality TV shows and will talk day and night about them. I can't stand them. I do have guilty pleasures like Workaholics and South Park. But they don't watch those shows. So, I make use of 60+ wpm by posting here instead of trying to relate to the discussion of Honey Boo whatever that thing is.

You lay down a rant making all sorts of baseless allegations against anti-ordinance posters, I alone take the time to to make a clear, logical rebuttal and you post another thoughtless, coffee break pile of BS that accuses everyone of "going nuts" over your silly post. So here's my coffee break post. You disdain your "coworkers" and anyone else that doesn't fit your world view but you don't have the skills to explain why so. So instead you bash this board in its entirety, darting in and out at 60 wpm but zero thoughts per minute. The Bulletin Board community has a word for your ilk. Now on your next coffee break, report that to Subdude.

I know I shouldn't even respond, but I could not let this rant stand unchallenged lest some ignorant non-reader buys into it.

This message board has been occupied....

The secret Occupy HAIF movement is now exposed to the world, oh my!

by historic preservation haters....

Non-reader alert!

who try to use it as their echo chamber to convince themselves that their hatred for the historic districts is shared by the overwhelming majority of residents in the Heights....

Are you including dog and squirrel votes in your majority too? No doubt you include renters (old, unimproved homes have lower rents), new-build owners (kills the competition for best homes), outside of HD owners (higher comparable re-sale value, see Norhill Addition), and non-contributing structures (HD? What HD?). But for humans with skin in the game, i.e. Texas property owners of land in the HD with a structure burdened by the ordinance, I challenge your unsubstantiated claim of overwhelming majority. And if that is true, why did the city not use a simple up-or-down vote by only impacted owners on a sanctioned election cycle?

Anyone who comes on here and disagrees with their view point will be pilloried until they give in and stop posting, leading the historic preservation haters to think that their hate for the districts has been validated because they have bullied people away from a message board.

TRANSLATED: City Ordinance Lovers can attempt to justify their adulation by posting here, but be aware that BS will be called and responded to by proud Texans with a clear, rational and stinging rebuke.

Of course the reality is that the historic districts are just fine and are even expanding (Germantown HD next to Woodland Heights was just added).

Also known as the I-45 Expansion Defense Historic District.

The predictions of property values diving and the Heights turning into a slum because no one will rennovate (sic) homes turned out to be 180 degrees in the wrong direction.

And your source for these rash predictions are....hearsay? And 180 degrees is....hyperbole?

So, the haters are left to their little internet message board...

You mean those opposed to the ordinance eloquently set forth and defend their position in the most active neighborhood message board in "HAIF - Houston's Leading News Forum".

...to try to validate their irrational hatred for the historic preservation ordinance...

No validation is required when defending one's property rights in Texas from politicians pandering to River Oaks elitists and wannabes (see HAHC Chairman and the Greater Houston Preservation Alliance)

and those who worked so hard to get real protection for historic homes in the Heights. That is why they are so threatened whenever anyone tries to crash their little party.

Now don't get your feelings hurt. I do not hate you, I don't even know you. I think you put a lot of effort into something you support, and I respect that effort, no matter how misguided it may be. And this is your party, like it or not.

Keep posting if you want. It is more entertaining that talking about reality shows with staff in the break room at work.

Do I detect a tad of elitism here? Did staff have a nice holiday or two? Did staff enjoy the pot-luck holiday luncheon management allowed? Sorry, just kidding, don’t call Subdude on me. Oh, and Happy New Year to all the HAIFers, where ever you live whatever you post!

Red's Hypocrisy Detector went off scale last night.

I have no intention of tearing down and building a mc-whatever. I'm not in the historic district. I'm pro preservation, but the historic ordinance is far from anything I could ever support. It was intentionally misleading, unsupported, and overbearing (not to mention it actually supports construction that is not only not historic, but downright ugly).

Who asked for the troll for christmas?

Same here. One can easily pick out the non-readers in this forum, the audio book crowd. They immediately give themselves away by demonstrating an inability to discern between anti-ordinance posters and anti-preservation posters. It is possible to have civil discourse between readers with different opinions, but non-readers are nothing more than oxygen thieves in public forums.

Two consecutive artificial posts with no sign of natural intelligence …I think a bot slipped through while Subdude was off on holiday.

I imagine that without the pictures they would have been stuck with the old patchwork construction that comprises most of the old homes. Or perhaps one would have to hire forensic architects to defend your property rights before the stewards of history. After watching them torch the poor guy trying to add a column to his porch, you'd better have a good case with hard evidence. All I have is hearsay, but I'm going in with just the mailbox.

It is disappointing that you are moving to the Heights and folks start right out telling you to look at anything but our neighborhood schools. You should call Hogg Middle School and ask Dr. Schnitta (the principal) to give you a tour of the campus and tell you what Hogg has to offer.

HouHts has a point. My commentary (and likely all) about Hogg/Hamilton is based on hearsay since I do not have kids there. I based my opinion on conversations with various Hogg/Hamilton parents over the last 11 years at Heights Norhill Little League Baseball. Definitely do your due diligence and talk to the principals because schools in the neighborhood are certainly on the swing up. Reagan High School is a fine example of what a good principal and involved parents/alumni can do for a school. One of my sons took a summer course there and we thought the facilities and teaching staff for the science course surpassed that of the private school he attends full time.

Definitely attempt magnet/vanguard over Hogg/Hamilton. As an alternative my three went to St Anne Catholic School with the caboose still there, highly recommended but there's a waiting list if they don't start in K/PK.

HoustonMidtown, you haven't seen anything yet....by reading much of this thread (heck, the entire forum) you will realize the talents and omniscience this person possesses are astounding. Accordingly one must only refer to S3mh in the royal plural or third person.

......But, I am not blinded by right wing land use ideology.

When one is blinded by narcissism, no other blindness matters....it's the best.

David Addickes, that's the place...try that cut through....I understand that the CoH will extend Summer all the way, but they will have to condemn that RoW and the very back of a truck parking lot to link to the western part (across Oliver). If you are already on Oliver you will see the little makeshift bridge over the ditch on the east.

Actually I forgot which name I liked from earlier posts. KJ, have you biked the Summer Street back route to the Kroger? Hike-Bike Trail to the Target parking lot (or go behind Target) and cut across to (soon to be extended) Summer St. and go west on the Summer St Right of Way.....you have to go through an open gate by new loft construction and across a lot and a little make shift bridge....Sounds bad, but it's rather easy and a lot safer than Stude.

I don't know about architecture, but I definitely like the measures Montrose HEB took to integrate with the neighborhood. The landscaping is a nice touch, and I love the awesome bike rack.

I like that HEB also, just wish it was closer. That store is in the heart of a long-time residential area, similar to our soon-to-be-gone Fiesta on Studewood, so at least it has something with which to integrate. On the other hand, Party Kay Roger has to integrate with existing industrial and Wally World has to integrate with endless townhomage (once and future ghetto), brownfield conversion retail and Fred Flintstone's job site.

1.Denial —"This can't be happening, not to me. That’s actually a mixed-use old folks’ home on Yale"

2.Anger — "Why me? It's not fair! Who is to blame?; It’s the dang City, er, dang Airbinger, er, dang 420 agreement, um, dang people with cars….”

3.Bargaining — "If Walmart will just admit they broke the bridge and fix it, just exactly how we want it, with caliper trees and all, then we’ll move on to Eme’s Place, eventually.

4.Depression — "I'm so sad, why bother driving on Yale for anything?"; "I'm going to die soon so what's the point?"; "I miss that ole steel mill."

5.Acceptance — "It's going to be okay."; "I can't fight it, I may as well go get that 2$ waffle iron."

You say that they say, but you won't quote where they say it. I checked your links and none of them have the engineers saying the bridge is safe and will remain safe for 5 years.

Ok, I was referring to Houston Public Works said "A Houston public works spokesman said load limits on the bridge exist to extend its life. He also said there is no cause for alarm as long as drivers follow the rules."

They cannot give specifics due to federal law, so fill in the blanks, ergo the mind game. Play semantics all you wish, but you seem unable play the game because you choose to believe RUDH instead of the city...pick your poison. Throw-in with the whiners and see if you can cause a political closure to really cement RUDH's rep around here.

No, I don't think your evidence says what you think it says. I think the authorities have said they intend to do periodic inspections to ensure continued safety of usage of the bridge. They're not making any warranty on it lasting the full five years and none of the evidence says otherwise.

Maybe it will and maybe it won't. That's the point of the ongoing inspections.

Who's talking about evidence? The Feds took care of that option. Who's talking guarantees and warranties besides you? I hate to quote myself but...."Play a mind game and believe the engineers and believe that the City's efforts to limit heavy traffic are mostly effective. " The point of the ongoing inspections is multifold, but what is the point of RUDH's bellyaching? To denigrate the good citizens of our neighborhood? That's all they are accomplishing.

Engineers said that the bridge will last 5 years under current usage patterns? Can you provide your source, please? This 5 year guarantee is news to me.

Ok kj, playing mind games is difficult for some, but I will try to explain. The City gives us this http://www.houstontx.gov/citizensnet/YaleBridgeFurtherReduced092712.html and the Feds give us this http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/PLAW-107publ56/pdf/PLAW-107publ56.pdf . The reason we get generalizations only from the City Public Works is because our gift from the Feds (Patriot Act) makes it AGAINST FEDERAL LAW for public servant engineers to give specifics on the conditon of any infrastructure. Don't believe me? Try and get Texas DoT inspection results on anything......then prepare for the knock on the door. KHOU gives us this http://www.khou.com/news/School-bus-trucks-crossing-Yale-St-bridge-illegally-176675061.html and I quote "A Houston public works spokesman said load limits on the bridge exist to extend its life. He also said there is no cause for alarm as long as drivers follow the rules."

Fill in the blanks with the mind game, but the gaps are no leap of faith, just watch what they do....the plan is to replace the bridge in late 2016 and keep an eye on it until then, no reason to panic, no reason to harass the City, leave that to the professional whiners in RUDH.

Play a mind game and believe the engineers and believe that the City's efforts to limit heavy traffic are mostly effective. In that situation, the bridge will remaIn open safely until the funds are available 4 or 5 years from now. The engineers say that the bridge is safe and will remain safe for that time under current usage patterns. Without limiting heavy vehicles the bridge was more likely to become unsafe prior to funding possibly leading to an early shut down. The City is avoiding that outcome by downgrading and policing the bridge.

Now back to the real world. RUDH is harassing city officials about miscreant drivers, and officials respond by making dumass public statements about school buses full of kids plunging into the ravine. Earth to two-letter Bradford, over, Red's sketch was just a joke! The bridge will not collapse under the weight of a school bus! RUDH is playing politics and you! Stop taking their calls and reading their email! RUDH thinks they can play ball with WalMart, but they cannot! All they can do is make the majority of Heights residents miserable by turning you into Chicken Little! Do not let them! Save us from these people and tell RUDH to STFU about the bridge!