The Driscoll High-Rise & River Oaks Shopping Center Developments

[H-Town Man]

1 hour ago, Subdude said:

 

Normally I would be very sympathetic to this kind of concern, but in this case the architectural integrity of the shopping center was compromised back when the Barnes & Noble was built.  At this point I'm not convinced it is a battle worth fighting.

 

 

This is well down the street from that. Go on Google Earth streetview and look at the existing building (1964 West Gray), then picture all of it knocked away right up to the central portion and replaced with a giant hulking garage and high rise. Tell me that is not worth fighting.

 

[jgriff]

21 hours ago, bobruss said:

CI just received this email notice a few minutes ago. So I guess there will be a fight for this project getting off the ground.

After rereading this I think they should have re read it also because they really botched the last couple of sentences.. 

 

NMCA Members and Friends of the Montrose Community Weingarten's Realty is planning on doing some major construction and renovation to parts of the historic River Oaks Shopping Center. They will be submitting their request before the Houston Archaeological and Historical Commission at a June 15th meeting. THE HAHC meeting is open to the public and begins at 3 p.m. in council chambers on the ground floor of City Hall Annex, 900 Bagby Street. Anyone wishing to address HAHC must sign in before 3 p.m. If you are concerned about the preserving this neighborhood landmark that features of one of the few remaining examples art deco style architecture in Houston, please considering attending this meeting. You may also want to express your concerns to city Councilman Ellen Cohen, and Councilman-at-Large David Robinson. This is the link to additional information published on the Houston Preservation website http://mailchi.mp/preservationhouston/discover-rice-universitys-distinctive-architecture-this-sunday-evening-721053?e=0836c09fb4

I live very close to this site. I walk to the midnight showings at River Oaks Theatre and Braissire 19. I'm all for them demolishing all of it, RO Theatre included, just to piss of people who try to tell property owners what they can do with their property. Anyone want to start a protest to call for RO theatre to be demolished? I'll picket out front with you.

[Twinsanity02]

What is causing the hostility toward this high rise? Is there no street level retail? I can not tell from the drawings.  Or is this some sort of Ashby highrise based hostility?  It is not near the River Oaks theater so how did that get into the discussion? It just seems to occupy a corner near Krogers. 

[jgriff]

2 minutes ago, Twinsanity02 said:

What is causing the hostility toward this high rise? Is there no street level retail? I can not tell from the drawings.  Or is this some sort of Ashby highrise based hostility?  It is not near the River Oaks theater so how did that get into the discussion? It just seems to occupy a corner near Krogers. 

If I was in control of RO shopping center I would consider demolishing all of it now to preempt any political interference with their control of the property and their right to decide what the best use of their property is.

[KinkaidAlum]

 

"I'ma gonna destroy something I like cuz I don't like people telling property owners nothing."

 

 

 

[jgriff]

2 minutes ago, KinkaidAlum said:

 

"I'ma gonna destroy something I like cuz I don't like people telling property owners nothing."

 

 

 

No, destroy it to preserve the value of the property. 

[Fortune]

This is just the first high rise to go up. That land is to valuable to continue to be a one story shopping center. Before its over the entire center will be multi-level. 

[Montrose1100]

The real atrocity is limestone. Could have kept it black and white to blend in with the Art Deco awning & store facades. When will the obsession of beige be a thing of the past?

[ajgallion]

I agree with Subdude. This shopping center lost its architectural integrity when B&N was built. I do want to keep the art deco look, but it is a strip mall that has already been altered multiple times. Why don't we focus on the benefits to the area versus the integrity of a strip mall's architecture that has already been destroyed? My question is why didn't they just build on the parking lot facing Kroger? It has enough room to house a parking garage for Kroger with opportunity to bring the Kroger to the streetside.

[H-Town Man]

11 hours ago, ajgallion said:

I agree with Subdude. This shopping center lost its architectural integrity when B&N was built. I do want to keep the art deco look, but it is a strip mall that has already been altered multiple times. Why don't we focus on the benefits to the area versus the integrity of a strip mall's architecture that has already been destroyed? My question is why didn't they just build on the parking lot facing Kroger? It has enough room to house a parking garage for Kroger with opportunity to bring the Kroger to the streetside.

 

This is two buildings down from the building that was replaced with B&N. It seems a stretch to say that the whole center's integrity was destroyed. Go stand between 1964 and 1973 West Gray, or go on Google Streetview, and look to either side of the street and tell me there's not some architectural integrity worth saving. Which has nothing to do with the B&N peeking out off in the distance.

 

I imagine that they are not moving the Kroger up to the street for two reasons. One, they do not think that a zero-setback grocery store will work with the local clientele, who are an older, more conservative bunch than the folks in Midtown or Washington Avenue, and who would rather park in a big parking lot than in a garage. Two, the cost of tearing down a large format grocery store with plenty of remaining economic life and replacing it with another grocery store, as well as building garage parking for all of the grocery shoppers, significantly broadens the scope of the Driscoll project in a way that they don't desire.

[Urbannizer]

http://weingartenrealty.propertycapsule.com/properties/thedriscollatriveroaks/#overview

 

 

The Driscoll at River Oaks is a 30-story residentail luxury high rise offering over 300 luxury living spaces for lease with spectacular panoramic views of Houston’s skylines. Residents of the tower will have the rare opportunity to live within walking distance of excellent shops, restaurants and a top-performing Kroger in River Oaks Shopping Center. The tower will also be home to an estimated 10,000 square feet of ground floor retail. Tentatively, ground breaking is scheduled for 2018 with an estimated delivery date in 2021.

 

 

[lockmat]

Lovely in a vacuum. Not so much in this context.

[Reporter]

Do you ever stop bitching?

[H-Town Man]

13 minutes ago, Reporter said:

Do you ever stop bitching?

 

Just observing... he has 9,708 posts, you have 42 posts. People on an architecture forum are going to say both positive and negative things about architecture. Why don't you rack up about a thousand posts or so before you start complaining about the style of other members?

 

[tangledwoods]

Quote

Lovely in a vacuum. Not so much in this context.

 Like this

 

Couldnt have said it better, this is a uptown style design... doesnt exactly translate.  I look at what has gone up recently in Montrose / Med Center as much more responsive to the surrounding environment.  its hard to tell in the rendering but it looks mostly metal panel and glass.  If they went with cast stone or UHPC panels they could probably get closer to the neighborhood vibe...

[houstontexasjack]

The rooftop looks as though it has light-up feature potential.  I don't think the rendering above provides enough detail to make a determination as to whether or not the ground floor shops won't blend in with the structures around it.  

[Reporter]

8 hours ago, H-Town Man said:

 

Just observing... he has 9,708 posts, you have 42 posts. People on an architecture forum are going to say both positive and negative things about architecture. Why don't you rack up about a thousand posts or so before you start complaining about the style of other members?

 

 9,708 posts? Wow, that's a lot of bitching! 

Edited August 2, 2017 by Reporter

[Montrose1100]

Play nicely kids.

 

I'm not impressed but also not disappointed. It's kind of, blah. It's a great filler.

[ajgallion]

I like the building design for my own aesthetics. I honestly love what they are trying to accomplish and hope it can help to create a more vertical area. My only concern is who will want to spend that kind of money to overlook a Kroger parking lot? Not that appealing.

[Urbannizer]

 

 

 

[UtterlyUrban]

I like it.

[monarch]

^^^ is it just me, or is there a SEXY L.A. feel to this project?  especially with the abundance of palm trees.......

[jgriff]

8 hours ago, CrockpotandGravel said:

More on The Driscoll at River Oaks Shopping Center from Houston Chronicle yesterday:

 

Documents filed with the city planning department reveal new details of the 30-story tower planned for part of the River Oaks Shopping Center. 
 

The developer, Weingarten Realty, is seeking city approval to build up to the property line on Driscoll Street, a dead end, instead of the required 10-foot setback. As part of the application, it submitted  renderings depicting the corner of West Gray and Driscoll after the high-density residential project brings hundreds of residents and a new suite of shops. 

"Although legally a public street, Driscoll Street will continue to be a non-through public street and will function as a drive aisle and pedestrian way for patrons and residents."
http://www.houstonchronicle.com/business/bizfeed/article/river-oaks-driscoll-shopping-center-historic-11739378.php

Nice. This appears to significantly reduce surface parking and add trees.

[Dakota79]

On ‎8‎/‎5‎/‎2017 at 5:06 PM, Urbannizer said:

 

 

 

 WOW.  I didn't realize it would be so close to W Gray.  It will look massive there.  Very nice building, IMHO.

[Twinsanity02]

Reminds somewhat of the Hanover Post Oak in Uptown

[thatguysly]

I like that the base tries to blend in a little with the area

[Naviguessor]

I hate how the beige that Weinhgarten added to the color pallet of the art deco elements a few years back, doesn't blend in the area. 

[Angostura]

Doesn't solve the key problem with this block: it's 200-ft from façade to façade, 120 feet of which are dedicated to machinery storage, and there are only palm trees for shade. Palm trees don't really provide any shade.

 

Here's what they COULD do: The middle 80 feet of right-of way belongs to the city. Trade that middle 80 feet for two 40-ft ROW's along the facades on either side of the street. Take the middle 120-ft and build new retail (in the same art-deco style). Convert the two 40-ft strips of what is now parking into two one-way streets: 2 x 11-ft traffic lanes, with an 8-ft sidewalk on either side. You now have 66,000 s.f. of new retail space, a more human-scaled pedestrian environment, and a real amenity for the new residents in your apartment tower.

 

Structured parking in the new tower (and maybe additional structured parking behind Brasserie 19) can compensate for the lost strip-center parking and the parking requirements for the new retail.

 

(Yes, I realize this is completely impractical.)

[cspwal]

Impractical? or a great idea?

[Angostura]

22 hours ago, cspwal said:

Impractical? or a great idea?

 

Well, it would require the entire street to be dug up so the drainage system could be relocated. Also, it would require variances to a number of the requirements in Chapter 42 with respect to development along major thoroughfares, including building setbacks (zero feet instead of 25), right-of-way width (40 ft instead of 100),  curve radius (major thoroughfares require a curve radius of 2000-ft, with 100 ft between reverse curves.

 

Center roadway infill might be more (physically) practical on low-traffic residential streets, especially ones that have open drainage ditches. For example, here's a street in the Heights with 90+ ft from façade to façade, and maybe gets an average of a car or two per minute, if that. The block face is almost continuous on both sides, with minimal lateral setbacks.

 

Take the 20 feet closest to the facades on either side and make two one-way woonerf-style streets. Maybe eliminate on-street parking, because people in the Heights hate on-street parking of cars that aren't theirs. That gives you space to lay out townhouses down the center of the RoW, say, 25x50, oriented parallel with the street, in 4-packs so the garages don't take access from the street. Each TH has two external walls, one of which faces a pedestrian-scaled street, and two off-street parking spaces. That's twenty new 3000-sf townhouses: something like $12M of new tax base. On one block. On space that's pretty much going un-used.

 

All you have to do is convince people that front yards are stupid and a waste of space and not really worth having in the first place.