The Alamo City

[kingwilliam]

For the record, I have 'heard' of the South side of LA ... not sure if the city refers to it that way or the media, but I have heard of it.

I was born in LA and lived there until I was 17. I think I can count on one hand the number of times I heard "south side" used to describe South LA/South Central and it was also a new transplant or someone visiting.

[houstonmacbro]

Maybe I was thinking "South Central" as I thought about how LA 'south side' is referred to.

I have heard South Central a LOT of times. Far too many to count.

[northbeaumont]

The City of San Antonio has more square mileage than the City of Dallas.

Here's the land area (not including water) of the three big Texas cities:

Houston--579.4 square miles

San Antonio--407.56 square miles

Dallas--342.5 square miles

This really surprises me. I thought Dallas would always be the second biggest. You may be right about most people up there living in its suburbs being the reason why its population hasn't grown as fast as Houston's and San Antonio.

Population:

Houston--2.1 million

San Antonio--1,296,682 (2006 estimate)

Dallas--1.2 million (2006 estimate)

[mojeaux131]

Here's the land area (not including water) of the three big Texas cities:

Houston--579.4 square miles

San Antonio--407.56 square miles

Dallas--342.5 square miles

This really surprises me. I thought Dallas would always be the second biggest. You may be right about most people up there living in its suburbs being the reason why its population hasn't grown as fast as Houston's and San Antonio.

Population:

Houston--2.1 million

San Antonio--1,296,682 (2006 estimate)

Dallas--1.2 million (2006 estimate)

I'm not surprised at all by either the land area or population rankings. Dallas is totally surrounded by smaller satellite cities--Garland, Richardson, Plano, Irving, Arlington. Of course their presence would limit Dallas' land area and population growth when compared to cities like Houston and SA which lack such clusters of suburbs. That being said, Dallas' metropolitan area is still the most populated in Texas and fifth in the nation, I think.

Edit: fourth-largest MSA in the nation. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas-Fort_Worth

[Trae]

^^That will change in a few years when DC-Baltimore become an MSA (are a CSA now) and the Bay Area becomes a MSA (CSA now, too). Everyone will move down two notches.

[northbeaumont]

^^That will change in a few years when DC-Baltimore become an MSA (are a CSA now) and the Bay Area becomes a MSA (CSA now, too). Everyone will move down two notches.

I know what an MSA is, but what does CSA stand for?

[Trae]

Combined Statistical Area. It covers a little more area than an MSA. For example, Huntsville is included in Houston's CSA, but not MSA.

[C2H]

I would like to know where some of you guys have been? SA overtook Dallas in population about 3 years ago and has been talked about to death many times on this forum and others, news, etc.

I still consider Dallas to be the larger city than S/A because Dallas has a larger skyline, larger density, larger metro, and more amentities. It just feels bigger to me. The only hope for Dallas regaining the 2nd largest Texas title is the implementation of the Port in south Dallas. That should bring more jobs to that area.

[TheNiche]

I would like to know where some of you guys have been? SA overtook Dallas in population about 3 years ago and has been talked about to death many times on this forum and others, news, etc.

I still consider Dallas to be the larger city than S/A because Dallas has a larger skyline, larger density, larger metro, and more amentities. It just feels bigger to me. The only hope for Dallas regaining the 2nd largest Texas title is the implementation of the Port in south Dallas. That should bring more jobs to that area.

Employment is not population. If they were, then Dallas would almost certainly be #2.

[northbeaumont]

I would like to know where some of you guys have been? SA overtook Dallas in population about 3 years ago and has been talked about to death many times on this forum and others, news, etc.

I still consider Dallas to be the larger city than S/A because Dallas has a larger skyline, larger density, larger metro, and more amentities. It just feels bigger to me. The only hope for Dallas regaining the 2nd largest Texas title is the implementation of the Port in south Dallas. That should bring more jobs to that area.

Yes, TexasFreeway.com said that the 2004 census count showed San Antonio with 26,000 more people than Dallas. I've always thought that "biggest city" or "biggest state" meant geographical size, not population, so I looked up the land area size of each city and San Antonio (as I listed in another thread in this topic) is also larger in area than Dallas.

For example, Texas is the second-biggest state in the U.S. geographically. Population-wise, California is the largest.

[northbeaumont]

Dallas is surrounded by ever expanding incorporated municipalities. People are rapidly moving to the brand spanking new (soulless) 'burbs.

Yes, you're right. I looked at the road maps of San Antonio, Houston, and Dallas. Dallas is surrounded by suburbs on all sides, so it can't grow geographically. San Antonio and Houston have plenty of unincorporated land around them so that they would be able to expand their respective cities. If like you said, Big D is experiencing "white flight," then its population would also shrink. Who knows? Maybe in due time Austin will become the third largest city in Texas.

[houstonmacbro]

Yes, you're right. I looked at the road maps of San Antonio, Houston, and Dallas. Dallas is surrounded by suburbs on all sides, so it can't grow geographically. San Antonio and Houston have plenty of unincorporated land around them so that they would be able to expand their respective cities. If like you said, Big D is experiencing "white flight," then its population would also shrink. Who knows? Maybe in due time Austin will become the third largest city in Texas.

What prevents Dallas from annexing like Houston has done? Can't Big D annex like Houston did with Kingwood (and from what I'm hearing) soon to also be Atascocita.

[Trae]

Kingwood was never a city.

[northbeaumont]

Wow. You just continue to amaze. Firstly, whether the "south sides" of any city/metro are "undesirable" is simply a matter of coincidence, please don't assert it as some type of consonant.

Your comment wasn't about total growth numbers since 2000. You said x metro was growing faster than San Antonio. I simply clarified it by saying both metros have been going by switching positions in terms of growth (for the last few years). Nothing to "disagree" with when it's clearly simply facts.e

Well, Bad, Bad Leroy Brown lived on the south side of Chicago, didn't he?

What prevents Dallas from annexing like Houston has done? Can't Big D annex like Houston did with Kingwood (and from what I'm hearing) soon to also be Atascocita.

Someone else on this forum said that a city cannot annex an incorporated area. I wonder if The Woodlands will someday be part of Houston?

Kingwood was never a city.

That's probably why it was annexed. A city is incorporated with a charter.

[Trae]

The Woodlands will never be a part of Houston. This was already said a while ago on this forum. The Woodlands will become its own city in ten years.

[northbeaumont]

The Woodlands will never be a part of Houston. This was already said a while ago on this forum. The Woodlands will become its own city in ten years.

What are those rich snobs waiting for?

[houstonmacbro]

Hey!

I know several people that live in TW and they are not all rich! ... although many of them ARE snobs.

[northbeaumont]

Hey!

I know several people that live in TW and they are not all rich! ... although many of them ARE snobs.

My income is below the poverty level. I don't think I could act like a snob even if I tried to. I couldn't live in a place like The Woodlands unless I won a lottery. And they wouldn't want me there because I would be nouveau riche.

[houstonmacbro]

Well, I know that not everyone in The Woodlands makes six figures and lives in a MacMansion. There are regular earners there as well (probably their dirty little secret, but there .. .it's out in the open now).

Also if you do a search for properties there, there are many house in the $150,000 or less range (certainly attainable by many). In fact, I just checked HAR and there are 20 pages worth of those kinds of homes.

Don't let TW folks sell you on that luxury lifestyle.

[northbeaumont]

Well, I know that not everyone in The Woodlands makes six figures and lives in a MacMansion. There are regular earners there as well (probably their dirty little secret, but there .. .it's out in the open now).

Also if you do a search for properties there, there are many house in the $150,000 or less range (certainly attainable by many). In fact, I just checked HAR and there are 20 pages worth of those kinds of homes.

Don't let TW folks sell you on that luxury lifestyle.

Does San Antonio have a suburb city equivalent to Houston's The Woodlands?

[kingwilliam]

Does San Antonio have a suburb city equivalent to Houston's The Woodlands?

I'd say Stone Oak. Stone Oak isn't as far though (15 miles), but fits many of the same characteristics as The Woodlands. They're both master planned communities that have grown to be 50,000 plus populated areas. Though the Woodlands was developed probably 10 or fifteen years before Stone Oak. Actually, Stone Oak didn't really begin to take off until the mid 1990's from what I've been told. In 1995 there was a mega church (Cornerstone), a few subdivisions, hardly any retail or office and no medical space. But now there's so much medical space in Stone Oak, it's dubbed the Second Medical Center of San Antonio. There's tons of office construction going on and much more office buildings now than ever. As for retail, boy does Stone Oak have it. From the boutique shops to the retail shopping centers. There's one development that will feature an Emeril Lagasse restaurant, 3,000 seat event center, 18-lane underground bowling alley and 3 story aquarium planned for Stone Oak.

[kingwilliam]

Some more Stone Oak:

These were posted by another poster on another forum a year ago.

This is Stone Oak Parkway. Traffic is heading south towards Loop 1604. Downtown skyline can be seen.

A little further down Stone Oak Parkway. Still driving south towards Loop 1604. Stone Oak Medical Center can be seen to the left.

Here's a comparison of the southern portion of Stone Oak:

1995

2006

[kingwilliam]

FYI... the large construction site at the far right of the 2006 aerial is the construction of the 250 million Methodist Stone Oak Hospital.

[ProHouston]

Does San Antonio have a suburb city equivalent to Houston's The Woodlands?

There really isn't an area in SA comparable to either The Woodlands, First Colony, or Kingwood. Stone Oak is currently the closest but not nearly as planned, upscale, or large as the 3 mentioned in Houston. I hear there may be others on the way in far west SA though, Alamo Ranch etc. that might work out.

[Spades]

^^That will change in a few years when DC-Baltimore become an MSA (are a CSA now) and the Bay Area becomes a MSA (CSA now, too). Everyone will move down two notches.

The time the DC-Baltimore area becomes a MSA is the same time that Austin-San Antonio will become a MSA. Meaning, it will be a very very long time before that happens. DC-Baltimore will have to live with being a CSA for now.

[Rammer]

MSA(Metropolitan Statistical Areas) population list July, 2008 (Texas cities).

4th largest in nation) Dallas/Fort Worth/Arlington - 6,300,006

6th largest in nation) Houston/Sugarland/Baytown - 5,728,143

28th largest in nation)San Antonio 1,990,675

37th largest in nation)Austin/Round Rock 1,598,161

*S.A. & Austin estimates are from 7/2007

San Antonio is like Aaron Brooks standing next to Yao and Shaq.