hilti Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 I am currently looking at a house in Shepherd Park Plaza. There was previously a contract on the house that fell through because it was an out-of-state buyer that wanted a relatively clean inspection and quick close. I was provided the inspection report. I've never seen an inspection report before, so it was a little daunting to see all the things on it. The most notable issue related to the slab foundation (of course). It was noted in the report that there was a stair crack in the exterier brick veneer and sloping floors in the master bedroom and living room...and recommended review by a qualified foundation technician. I'm a first time home buyer...so, I don't know if this is standard for houses in that neighborhood (built in the 60s) or if I should run away from this house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flipper Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 I am currently looking at a house in Shepherd Park Plaza. There was previously a contract on the house that fell through because it was an out-of-state buyer that wanted a relatively clean inspection and quick close. I was provided the inspection report. I've never seen an inspection report before, so it was a little daunting to see all the things on it. The most notable issue related to the slab foundation (of course). It was noted in the report that there was a stair crack in the exterier brick veneer and sloping floors in the master bedroom and living room...and recommended review by a qualified foundation technician. I'm a first time home buyer...so, I don't know if this is standard for houses in that neighborhood (built in the 60s) or if I should run away from this house.Standard issue. In Houston there are 3 kinds of houses. Houses that currently have an unaddressed foundation problem.Houses that currently have an addressed foundation problem.Houses that are going to have a foundation problem.Once the foundation is leveled and stablilized with piers, the brick can be fixed.flipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston19514 Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 Standard issue. In Houston there are 3 kinds of houses. Houses that currently have an unaddressed foundation problem.Houses that currently have an addressed foundation problem.Houses that are going to have a foundation problem.Once the foundation is leveled and stablilized with piers, the brick can be fixed.flipperIsn't there a fourth kind of house in Houston, to-wit: houses that were built with piers (rather than just a slab)? Or does that not take care of the problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hilti Posted November 29, 2007 Author Share Posted November 29, 2007 Thanks for the response. Will leveling the foundation damage any of the flooring or walls? Also, approximately how much does this cost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 Thanks for the response. Will leveling the foundation damage any of the flooring or walls? Also, approximately how much does this cost?depending on what needs to be done the damage can be extensive. it can get pricey as well. make sure and get an actual structural engineer to see what needs to be done to correct the issue. most foundation companies don't use them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flipper Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 Isn't there a fourth kind of house in Houston, to-wit: houses that were built with piers (rather than just a slab)? Or does that not take care of the problem?Even houses with "builder's piers" can sink. In fact, it's more expensive to level a house with builder's piers because they must be broken free of the slab before you can lift the slab.flipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston19514 Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 Even houses with "builder's piers" can sink. In fact, it's more expensive to level a house with builder's piers because they must be broken free of the slab before you can lift the slab.flipperWow. That's kind of scary. Acknowledging that builder's piers can sink; is that at all common? In short, is it worth looking for a home with builder's piers (and possibly paying more for them?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flipper Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Wow. That's kind of scary. Acknowledging that builder's piers can sink; is that at all common? In short, is it worth looking for a home with builder's piers (and possibly paying more for them?)I deal with ~50 year old houses, so it doesn't really scare me. I know that nothing in the building world lasts forever (except the dirt), and stuff has to get fixed eventually. I'd just find a house in a good neighborhood with solid demand and values and pay a good inspector to check it out during your option period.flipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1fd Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Thanks for the response. Will leveling the foundation damage any of the flooring or walls? Also, approximately how much does this cost?The walls will probably be cracked up a bit from the leveling. The flooring...depends on how flexible it is. If it is tile, there will probably be issues. If it is carpet then it'll probably be fine.I suggest that you have the seller repair the slab, then re-inspect the house for any issues with the walls/floors/roof/doors/windows....yes, all of those things can be screwed up when the foundation goes south and is subsequently repaired.Have a hydrostatic leak test done on the plumbing after the slab is fixed. Moving the slab around could have caused problems with the under slab plumbing, or it could've just rusted through. Really and truly a hydrostatic test is a good idea for any house on a slab whether or not the slab needs repair. Underslab repairs are EXPENSIVE (they have to tunnel under the house by hand)....better the seller pay for them than you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flipper Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Have a hydrostatic leak test done on the plumbing after the slab is fixed. Moving the slab around could have caused problems with the under slab plumbing, or it could've just rusted through. Really and truly a hydrostatic test is a good idea for any house on a slab whether or not the slab needs repair. Underslab repairs are EXPENSIVE (they have to tunnel under the house by hand)....better the seller pay for them than you.IMO, hydrostatic tests are the biggest scam in Real Estate inspections going right now. A company (hired by the buyer) comes out to your house, digs in your yard, finds your sewer line (concrete in most cases where I work) and breaks the line open with a hammer. They then put an inflatable ball into the sewer line and push it toward the house until it is in the cast iron part of your plumbing (usually just outside the house). Then they go inside the house and remove a toilet. They fill the sewer line under the house until they can see the water back up to the toilet drain. They wait and see if the water goes down.Here are the problems I have with the test.1. They break your previously unbroken sewer line to put in the test ball. I've never heard of a company repairing this break the right way by cutting out the affected section of pipe and replacing it with pvc with fernco's on either side. More likely they will either lay a piece of lead over the break they made or just fill it in and let dirt go in the hole. 2. I've never seen a company doing a hydrostatic test have a guy stand at the hole in the sewer line to make sure NO water was getting past the test ball. If any water is getting past the test ball undetected, they are going to say you have a leak under your house.3. They have no way of knowing how your plumbing is arranged under your slab without doing tests that they do not do. Therefore, they don't know how long it should take for your plumbing under your house to fill with water. Case in point. We are selling a house tommorow where the buyer did a hydro test. Herdon and Muncey did the test and deemed that the Master Bath had a catastrophic leak under it because they couldn't even get the system to fill with water after 7 minutes. I went to the expense of tunnelling under the house to investigate. It turns out that the way the drains were configured, it would have probably taken another 10 minutes of water running to fill all of the lines. We ran water through all of the lines with them exposed in the tunnel. Guess what, no leaks.4. Who's to say that any damage to your sewer line wasn't caused by inflating the rubber test ball inside? The last time I checked, old sewer systems were designed to work on Gravity and not stand up to internal pressure.5. When the company re-installs your toilet, and it leaks, who's going to pay for the damage?6. When you have a written report of a damaged sewer system that may or may not be accurate, but you have to disclose it to all potential buyers, who is responsible for the decrease in your property value?In my case, it turned out that the kitchen side of the house did have a problem and we gladly made it right for the buyers. The funny part was, the drain was so jacked up that there was no possible way the company could have even test it. They didn't have any problem preparing a damning report, along with their $13,000 repair estimate though.If someone wants to check out your sewer lines, let them drop a camera down a drain, or down a vent, but don't let them do a hydrostatic test. If they break something, you are on the hook and if they give you a damning report, it might not even be accurate.steps off soapbox,flipperp.s. but to jm1fd's point. If you are buying a house go for it! You have nothing to lose! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1fd Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 IMO, hydrostatic tests are the biggest scam in Real Estate inspections going right now.Alrighty then...let me rephrase that. Make DAMN GOOD AND SURE there aren't any leaks in the sewer lines under the slab or in places which are difficult to get access to. I don't care if they use a TurdCam 4000, or a hydrostatic test, or what, but make sure there ain't any leaks under the slab. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flipper Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Alrighty then...let me rephrase that. That's what I thought! I keed I keed flipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hilti Posted November 30, 2007 Author Share Posted November 30, 2007 so, apparantly the buyer is going to have an engineer come in and make the recommended changes. Point taken about the plumbing under the slab...I never would have thought of that. I'll have to do some research and see what is the best and most cost effective option. thanks for the responses. it is pretty overwhelming to go through all this the first time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flipper Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 so, apparantly the buyer is going to have an engineer come in and make the recommended changes. Point taken about the plumbing under the slab...I never would have thought of that. I'll have to do some research and see what is the best and most cost effective option. thanks for the responses. it is pretty overwhelming to go through all this the first time.Michael Busch with Professional Drain Inspectors is great for camera'ing sewer lines - 713-304-5150flipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mumbles Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 According to the US Army Corps of Engineers publication Foundations in Expansive Soils, the fact that a foundation is not performing "adequately" does not mean that foundation repair is either necessary or desirable. Nor does it mean that foundation repair will actually improve the performance of the foundation. http://www.houston-slab-foundations.info/ Good slab info at this site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1fd Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 so, apparantly the buyer is going to have an engineer come in and make the recommended changes. Point taken about the plumbing under the slab...I never would have thought of that. I'll have to do some research and see what is the best and most cost effective option. thanks for the responses. it is pretty overwhelming to go through all this the first time.Two other things I forgot to mention....check all the shutoff valves in the house to make sure they don't leak when shutoff. Nothing worse than having a toilet explode, cranking the shutoff valve shut to stop the water, and then having the shutoff valve leak. Also make VERY sure there isn't any aluminum wiring in the house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hilti Posted December 12, 2007 Author Share Posted December 12, 2007 The seller had an engineer come in and evaluate the slab. I also had the person (Michael Gray) from the above website come in for a second opinion. They both said the slab was fine and didn't need any work done to it. Thanks for all the help!Michael Busch with Professional Drain Inspectors is great for camera'ing sewer lines - 713-304-5150flipperI had Michael come in and camera the sewer line...he did a great job. Thanks for the recommendation. I noticed that you mentioned in a different thread to mention your name, so I let him know you recommended him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flipper Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 I had Michael come in and camera the sewer line...he did a great job. Thanks for the recommendation. I noticed that you mentioned in a different thread to mention your name, so I let him know you recommended him.Glad it worked out. Michael is a good guy and knows what he's doing.flipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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