86 replies to this topic

[jwphillips2]

I went to Johnston the first year it was built. When I first got there, I was a little shy about the nude swimming for boys and girls at the indoor pool. I think the girls went three days and the guys two days, and then it was switched the next week. A friend who went there after I did said that he couldn't remember when it was discontinued or why. Does anyone know the story? Can you imagine the outrage if this were to happen today?

[Alpha]

I was there from 60 to 63 and took swimming lessons during pe class in 1960. We wore bathing suits.

ETA: I just remembered this. We not only did not swim nude, but we didn't want to strip down in front of each other to put on our bathing suits. In those days, girls still wore full petticoats. We would move the petticoat to our necks so that way we could put on our suits without anyone else seeing us.

Edited by Alpha, Monday, October 15, 2007 at 11:01 AM.

[marmer]

With all due respect, that sounds like an urban legend.

[Vertigo58]

The very idea is absurd.

[jwphillips2]

The very idea is absurd.

Sorry guys, it DID happen and it was during the day as part of gym. We played dodge ball when it was raining and basketball otherwise. I'd like to hear from the students who went there and know the truth. I can't verify the same happened for the girls.

Edited by jwphillips2, Monday, October 15, 2007 at 11:14 AM.

[houwest]

With even more due respect, nude swimming in PE was the way it was for boys at F.M. Black Jr. High School during the same time period, 1960-1963. Don't know about the girls. They may have kept that bit of info secret from us boys.

[jwphillips2]

With even more due respect, nude swimming in PE was the way it was for boys at F.M. Black Jr. High School during the same time period, 1960-1963. Don't know about the girls. They may have kept that bit of info secret from us boys.

That's just scandalous!

[marmer]

Well, OK, I can buy the idea that it was males only, sorta. Certainly at that age a bunch of boys skinny-dipping would have been considered wholesome, manly, etc. And there would have been the advantage that you didn't have to transport or store a wet bathing suit. But a bunch of girls skinny-dipping? Scandalous! My daughter is 12 and if anyone suggested that she and her friends swim naked, you'd hear the EWWWWW! in San Antonio.

I can't imagine that if the girls did swim in the buff, the entire male student population wouldn't know that, and constantly be trying to sneak a peek.

[Vertigo58]

It really makes the mind wonder what kind of coach this school had? With all the stories we hear now-a-days of Boy Scout Leaders being arrested, etc. Scary thoughts.

In those days they kept stuff like that hushed up. This is very creepy. Glad I wasn't around then. I really wonder if HISD administration approved of this then? I'm sorry it's just too creepy to take in.

[jwphillips2]

In those days they kept stuff like that hushed up. This is very creepy. Glad I wasn't around then. I really wonder if HISD administration approved of this then? I'm sorry it's just too creepy to take in.

I concur, utterly. I remember being told that this was a way to make the whole swimming experience "cleaner".
While waiting for a definition of voluntary and involuntary (forced) participation.....

"Yes, Son, I know you think you have it bad now, but I remember when we didn't even have enough money for a swimsuit...."

[VicMan]

Do records of this exist? Someone should find some documents that could reveal this...

[memebag]

Do records of this exist? Someone should find some documents that could reveal this...

Not surprisingly, it's difficult to find web pages containing the words "nude", "swimming" and "school" that aren't porn sites.

[VicMan]

Not surprisingly, it's difficult to find web pages containing the words "nude", "swimming" and "school" that aren't porn sites.

No, I'm meaning physical documents that may be kept in an archive somewhere. I doubt that such records exist on the internet. Also, it is easy to introduce specifics in internet searches with quotation marks and added phrases.

[FilioScotia]

No, I'm meaning physical documents that may be kept in an archive somewhere. I doubt that such records exist on the internet. Also, it is easy to introduce specifics in internet searches with quotation marks and added phrases.

Hey people get a grip. In the 50s, it was HISD policy at Junior Highs and Senior Highs with swimming pools for students to swim nude. That''s how it was when I went to 7th and 8th grade at Burbank Jr High in the mid 50s.

The reason given was that ragged swim trunks and threads from torn and ragged trunks clogged up the drains, so they eliminated the problem by doing away with the trunks.

Also, swim classes were not for recreational swimming. They were strictly supervised and they taught swimming skills. One day a week, we went to the pool for PE class instead of the gym. Boys on one day, girls on another.

And FYI, the gender segregation was total. Boys' PE coaches supervised the boys, and girls' PE coaches supervised the girls.

And -- Vertigo58 -- there was nothing creepy or scandalous about it. It wasn't a big secret and it really wasn't a big deal. Nobody thought anything about it. Countless thousands of current baby boomer adults -- including me -- learned to swim in those swim classes.

I have no idea when the policy changed, or why it changed.

Edited by FilioScotia, Monday, October 15, 2007 at 7:25 PM.

[ssullivan]

Nude, single-sex, supervised swimming was the norm at YMCAs as well during that time period. And a lot of it was due to the type of natural fibers available for making swim suits back then (as opposed to the more modern synthetics available today) and the problems they caused with filter and pump systems.

The US is rather hyper these days about any form of nudity, automatically equating it with sex or abuse. That was not always the case, and in general, I think the US was less uptight about same sex nudity in non-sexual situations (such as locker rooms, swimming pools, public restrooms) a few decades ago than it is now.

[TJones]

And NOW...........Gov. Terminator has outlawed the use of the words Mother and Father in schools, and allowing transexual or gender-confused and homosexual students use the lockeroom or bathroom of their choosing in California ? How the hell is THAT gonna fly with the parents ? This might be the norm in Austria, and sexual tensions might not have been so volatile in the 60's, but there has GOT to be a line SOMEWHERE ?

Edited by TJones, Monday, October 15, 2007 at 10:07 PM.

[Jax]

outlawed the use of the words Mother and Father in schools

Huh?

[silverartfox]

Hey people get a grip. In the 50s, it was HISD policy at Junior Highs and Senior Highs with swimming pools for students to swim nude. That''s how it was when I went to 7th and 8th grade at Burbank Jr High in the mid 50s.

The reason given was that ragged swim trunks and threads from torn and ragged trunks clogged up the drains, so they eliminated the problem by doing away with the trunks.

Also, swim classes were not for recreational swimming. They were strictly supervised and they taught swimming skills. One day a week, we went to the pool for PE class instead of the gym. Boys on one day, girls on another.

And FYI, the gender segregation was total. Boys' PE coaches supervised the boys, and girls' PE coaches supervised the girls.

And -- Vertigo58 -- there was nothing creepy or scandalous about it. It wasn't a big secret and it really wasn't a big deal. Nobody thought anything about it. Countless thousands of current baby boomer adults -- including me -- learned to swim in those swim classes.

I have no idea when the policy changed, or why it changed.

FilioScotia, you are correct. However, we girls did wear swimsuits and rubber swim caps. I attended Jackson JHS and Austin HS in the '50's and the women PE coaches were quite strict. If you didn't learn to swim, you flunked PE. Drying off and changing back into school clothes was awful as we were given only two tiny towels. Most girls in those days had an exaggerated sense of modesty, a cultural standard that faded away in the '60's.

[Subdude]

Nude, single-sex, supervised swimming was the norm at YMCAs as well during that time period. And a lot of it was due to the type of natural fibers available for making swim suits back then (as opposed to the more modern synthetics available today) and the problems they caused with filter and pump systems.

The US is rather hyper these days about any form of nudity, automatically equating it with sex or abuse. That was not always the case, and in general, I think the US was less uptight about same sex nudity in non-sexual situations (such as locker rooms, swimming pools, public restrooms) a few decades ago than it is now.

I hadn't thought of it in years, but swimming was nude at the local YMCA when I was a kid, and apparently nobody gave it a second thought. Of course, this was before everyone started assuming the world was full of creepy maniacs everywhere, or that it automatically led to abuse of children.

[TJones]

Huh?

Figuratively speaking Jax. Traditional Family roles apparently will not be taught anymore, as they will be a taboo subject, as NOT to cause anymore confusion for the minority that this bill is intended for.

I hadn't thought of it in years, but swimming was nude at the local YMCA when I was a kid, and apparently nobody gave it a second thought. Of course, this was before everyone started assuming the world was full of creepy maniacs everywhere, or that it automatically led to abuse of children.

.........OR, abuse of other men in front of children, accidently ? More so when children are NOT present though. I recall going to the YMCA several times in the 70's, and EVERYONE had swimtrunks on, so the practice must have ended in the mid to late 60's. Subdude, don't tell me you NEVER heard of THIS song ?

Edited by TJones, Tuesday, October 16, 2007 at 12:07 AM.

[Subdude]

This would have been in early 1970s, but I grew up in a very small town. Cheesy pop songs aside, people just didn't assume the worst about the world. The world is what it is, and no doubt unfortunate things happened on occasion, but on the balance people assumed it was an innocent pastime and left it at that for a long time. You have to keep some sense of proportionality about the world.

[JLWM8609]

I went to Johnston from 1998 to 2001. It just shows you how much has changed. There was most likely a male gym teacher in those late 50's/early 60's swimming sessions, we had a woman swimming instructor when I was there. I just can't imagine such a thing occuring in this time and day. If it did, I could see many a modern male student objecting to skinny dipping and happily accepting an "F" for fears that they may become effeminate as a result. Then again, the male student body at Johnston during my time there had a few who would probably welcome the nude swimming classes with open arms! And some of the girls would too. The exaggerated sense of modesty among young girls was LONG gone by the time I got to Johnston. I caught sight of some girls peeking thru a door from the girls locker room into the pool facility while some of us guys were drying off at the side of the pool. If it was a nude swimming class, they probably would've busted that door down! (yeah, right!)

[FilioScotia]

FilioScotia, you are correct. However, we girls did wear swimsuits and rubber swim caps.

Thanks for clarifying something I've wondered about since 7th grade. We boys swam nude, and we just assumed the girls did too.

We never knew for sure, but I can tell you we fantasized out loud about that -- a lot. I never could muster the nerve to ask any girl I knew if they also went nekkid in the pool.

And, oh yes, the pool at Burbank JH was indoors in a large room with no windows and completely sealed off from prying eyes.

It's just amazing how things have changed. In the 50s -- those dull, puritanical and sexually repressed FIFTIES -- nude PE swim classes weren't a big deal and nobody gave it a second thought.

Today, it would be a giant scandal, and any teacher or school administrator who would even suggest it would be locked up and branded a sex offender for life. He or she would be on CNN and You-Tube within 30 minutes.

Edited by FilioScotia, Tuesday, October 16, 2007 at 7:57 AM.

[Vertigo58]

JWphillips,

I am sorry if I came off a bit surprised. I apologize. I started school in the late 60's so this was surprising to hear. I don't think I am the only one (modern times) that feels this way. Just seems like such a dated practice. I mean real dated. Peace on Earth all!

[jwphillips2]

JWphillips,

I am sorry if I came off a bit surprised. I apologize. I started school in the late 60's so this was surprising to hear. I don't think I am the only one (modern times) that feels this way. Just seems like such a dated practice. I mean real dated. Peace on Earth all!

No apologies necessary! I'm really amused with the responses. I spent 2 years in Europe in the 70s and went on vacation there many times. I discovered how different our cultures were. Nudity on broadcast tv, men and women changing into and out of their bathing suits at the lakes and beaches, nude beaches including children, etc. They always told me how uptight the Americans were about almost everything. "If everyone does it, it's normal." Someone here at work jogged my memories about Redd Elementary and Johnston and it looks as if nude swimming was a widely accepted HISD practice and definitely part of Houston's history. I'm wondering if the parents knew. I was just wondering what started it and why/when it was abandoned.

[Jax]

Figuratively speaking Jax. Traditional Family roles apparently will not be taught anymore, as they will be a taboo subject, as NOT to cause anymore confusion for the minority that this bill is intended for.

That seems like an exaggeration to me.

[Fringe]

I went to Johnston from 62-65 and honestly can't remember what we wore if anything while swimming. The only thing I can remember is getting a lot of "pops" (swats from a paddle) from the coaches. I guess I was a very bad boy.

[Vertigo58]

The only thing I can remember is getting a lot of "pops" (swats from a paddle) from the coaches. I guess I was a very bad boy.

It's been known that most Haif members were paddled as kids (I hope)

[jwphillips2]

It's been known that most Haif members were paddled as kids (I hope)

Some still are....

[musicman]

Some still are....